The Cuban Defectors Thread

[Tryptamine]

His defense is supposed to be awful, right (IIRC, it was mentioned in the piece that he was so bad defensively that he broke in as a DH)?

 

The gap in value between he and freshly turned 24 year old Rizzo might not be as much as people think.

 

Maybe their value is similar, but I'd rather have Abreu and a piece to acquire an elite talent then just Rizzo.

[Guest]

His defense is supposed to be awful, right (IIRC, it was mentioned in the piece that he was so bad defensively that he broke in as a DH)?

 

The gap in value between he and freshly turned 24 year old Rizzo might not be as much as people think.

 

Maybe their value is similar, but I'd rather have Abreu and a piece to acquire an elite talent then just Rizzo.

 

Sure, I have no problem with trying to acquire more assets if it can be worked out from a practical standpoint.

[Guest]

BA ranked him the fourth best prospect at the WBC, behind Japanese RHP Masahiro Tanaka and Cubans Jose Fernandez and Yulieski Gourriel. His status has diminished a bit.

 

4. Jose Abreu, 1b, Cuba

 

Abreu has put up cartoonish numbers in Serie Nacional. After hitting .394/.542/.837 with 35 home runs, 75 walks and 40 strikeouts in 71 games last year, Abreu is leading Cuba in OBP and slugging with a .382/.535/.735 line in 42 games this season. So how many MVP awards would Abreu win if he came to the big leagues? Well, not everyone is even convinced he’d be able to handle major league pitching.

 

Abreu, 26, has outstanding power to all fields. He’s a smart hitter, his hands work well at the plate and he doesn’t have much effort in his righthanded swing. When he gets a mistake, he makes pitchers pay. The question scouts have is whether he’s more than just a mistake hitter. Abreu has picked up bad habits in Cuba, including an unorthodox setup with a double toe tap in his stride. He cuts himself off and has only fair bat speed, leaving him vulnerable to even average velocity inside. He can handle curveballs in the strike zone but he also showed he was susceptible to chasing hard breaking stuff away, swinging through several sliders at the tournament. With his marginal athleticism, scouts wonder whether the 6-foot-2, 258-pounder would be able to make adjustments against big league pitching, which is why some scouts aren’t wild about him despite his performance record in Cuba and international competition.

[Sammy Sofa]

It seems like some of you guys are way too willing to cast Rizzo aside and aren't aware of how good he actually is.

 

Why do you assume that? Most of this board are aware of the value that Rizzo brings defensively (even though defensive metrics are still the wild west of advanced stats). Nobody would be "casting him aside;" so far the options are either trying to keep him on the team or trading him as the extremely valuable asset that he is. How is that just dismissing him? That's either hoping to keep his bat in the lineup or to dramatically help the team in a killer trade.

[Tangled Up in Plaid]

Scouts also thought Puig was terrible.

[Guest]

It seems like some of you guys are way too willing to cast Rizzo aside and aren't aware of how good he actually is.

 

Why do you assume that? Most of this board are aware of the value that Rizzo brings defensively (even though defensive metrics are still the wild west of advanced stats). Nobody would be "casting him aside;" so far the options are either trying to keep him on the team or trading him as the extremely valuable asset that he is. How is that just dismissing him? That's either hoping to keep his bat in the lineup or to dramatically help the team in a killer trade.

 

It's not just his defense. It's his walk and K rates too. I really expect a lot from him offensively as he develops going forward. Add his defense to that as a baseline and, to me, he's immensely valuable.

 

If you can get fair value in a trade for him (and his awesome contract) and figure out how to get more assets in here, then, sure, it's something you look at. You're right, though, I probably overstated things in that regard.

[Sammy Sofa]

Anyone who undervalues Rizzo is a fool, but in no sane world does he have a real chance of becoming a once in a generation/lifetime/whatever hitter. Abreu does. Am I saying it's even likely? No, probably not, but I'd love to see the Cubs take the chance.

[Tracer Bullet]

I hope his D is so bad that he can't even catch. Like throws from short would literally hit him in the face.

[Sammy Sofa]

Could Rizzo play 3B? I know people [expletive] on Aramis ridiculously his whole time here, but if he could do it, couldn't Rizzo? Or is he even slower/less mobile?

 

Oh, right, dur, the whole LH thing. Stupid question.

[bukie]

Scouts also thought Puig was terrible.

Scouts also thought Concepcion was terrible.

[OleMissCub]

Could Rizzo play 3B? I know people [expletive] on Aramis ridiculously his whole time here, but if he could do it, couldn't Rizzo? Or is he even slower/less mobile?

 

Oh, right, dur, the whole LH thing. Stupid question.

 

yeah I was already moving my mouse to the "quote" button when I read your second line.

[imb]

Could Rizzo play 3B? I know people [expletive] on Aramis ridiculously his whole time here, but if he could do it, couldn't Rizzo? Or is he even slower/less mobile?

 

Oh, right, dur, the whole LH thing. Stupid question.

 

new market inefficiency

[Guest]

Scouts also thought Puig was terrible.

 

Well, they didn't think he was terrible, just overhyped. Puig was a complete unknown since he was suspended by Cuba and didn't play for nearly two years. So when he showed up in his showcase fat and out of shape, wouldn't do half the things you expect baseball players to do in tryouts, the scouts had to rate him on the little information they did have.

 

Abreu has been seen far more than Puig since he's older and has taken part in a numerous international tournaments. There's a lot less mystery with him so scouts should have a much better idea rating him.

[Tracer Bullet]

Could Rizzo play 3B? I know people [expletive] on Aramis ridiculously his whole time here, but if he could do it, couldn't Rizzo? Or is he even slower/less mobile?

 

Oh, right, dur, the whole LH thing. Stupid question.

 

new market inefficiency

 

Rizzo at SS with vogelbach at 3b. Live on the God Damn edge already

[Tracer Bullet]

God followed by damn is an expletive?

[TruffleShuffle]

Scouts also thought Puig was terrible.

 

Well, they didn't think he was terrible, just overhyped. Puig was a complete unknown since he was suspended by Cuba and didn't play for nearly two years. So when he showed up in his showcase fat and out of shape, wouldn't do half the things you expect baseball players to do in tryouts, the scouts had to rate him on the little information they did have.

 

Abreu has been seen far more than Puig since he's older and has taken part in a numerous international tournaments. There's a lot less mystery with him so scouts should have a much better idea rating him.

 

yeah, the impression i got from the opinions on puig was that the range of possible outcomes was enormous - like a lot of people could see him becoming an all star and the same people could see him struggling to hit at AA.

 

and holy [expletive], how does puig still have a .476 babip?

[Tangled Up in Plaid]

Scouts also thought Puig was terrible.

Scouts also thought Concepcion was terrible.

 

Well, we could do that dance all day. I wants Abreu.

[TruffleShuffle]

Could Rizzo play 3B? I know people [expletive] on Aramis ridiculously his whole time here, but if he could do it, couldn't Rizzo? Or is he even slower/less mobile?

 

Oh, right, dur, the whole LH thing. Stupid question.

 

new market inefficiency

 

Rizzo at SS with vogelbach at 3b. Live on the [expletive] edge already

 

cubs become first team to allow 20 bunt hits in a single game.

[davell]

Rizzo/Alcantara/Lake for Stanton. 2016 opening day lineup of AlmoraCF/CastroSS/StantonRF/Baez2B/Abreu1B/Bryant3B/SolerLF/CastilloC.......

[Guest]

How would you rank these potential offseason targets, especially keeping in mind that in all likelihood, you can afford to add 2 of them at the most? When I say rank, I mean which should the Cubs prioritize, given the likely cost to acquire.

 

Abreu

Cano

Choo

Ellsbury

Tanaka

[imb]

Cano

Choo

Abreu

ellsbury

whoever the last guy is

[Tangled Up in Plaid]

Yeah, who is Tanaka?

[sneakypower]

Ellsbury #1

[davell]

How would you rank these potential offseason targets, especially keeping in mind that in all likelihood, you can afford to add 2 of them at the most? When I say rank, I mean which should the Cubs prioritize, given the likely cost to acquire.

 

Abreu

Cano

Choo

Ellsbury

Tanaka

For me, it's Tanaka/Abreu/Cano/Ellsbury/Choo. If we wind up with an unprotected pick, I'd cross Ellsbury and Choo off altogether, as I don't look at them as elite guys anyway.

[Sammy Sofa]

Could Rizzo play 3B? I know people [expletive] on Aramis ridiculously his whole time here, but if he could do it, couldn't Rizzo? Or is he even slower/less mobile?

 

Oh, right, dur, the whole LH thing. Stupid question.

 

yeah I was already moving my mouse to the "quote" button when I read your second line.

 

Stupid devil-handed monster!