Random Cubs Musings

[Sammy Sofa]

Ehhhhhhhhhh...the farm system basically REALLY has to pay out big at this point. All of the money talk makes it sound like they're in a really precarious position, especially with the few current big league players they need to be good looking like garbage.

 

because before, it only sort of needed to pay out big?

 

Pretty much. I seriously doubt the Plan involved Shark, Castro and Rizzo all looking this unimpressive this year. It's not like anyone should give up on them, but it doesn't bode well. It's pretty obvious that those guys panning out is a pretty huge part of the plan.

 

Plus I'm a believer in the "the FO found out about the Ricketts' broken wallet after the fact" theory, which just adds more to the necessity of more of the prospects paying off.

[Beer Kaese]

Seriously, the Cubs are tossing 300 million into the ballpark but they can't pay players?

 

Next year we will draft between 4th and 6th. We will sign a couple intermediate pieces and trade a player or three but it's the last time for a long time.

 

In 2015 the first wave of real prospects arrive.

[davell]

First, the renovation is going to cost 500, not 300 mill. More importantly though is its pay as you go. It's not like they're just forking over 500 mill. In fact, they're trying to do a lot of it that's revenue earning up front, so it basically pays for itself. Not to mention, with a renegotiated TV deal coming very soon as well, the Ricketts won't be spending anything close to 500 mill out of money they already have. Their financial situation may very well be rosy, but it's not available to anyone other than Joe. Who's not even a sports fan. We are sorely counting on the revenue making parts of the renovations and the TV deal to eventually move our payroll forward. And with the amount of solid, cheap players we've got on the way, a big time addition or two in the next few years won't even move the payroll needle anyway.

[Beer Kaese]

First, the renovation is going to cost 500, not 300 mill. More importantly though is its pay as you go. It's not like they're just forking over 500 mill. In fact, they're trying to do a lot of it that's revenue earning up front, so it basically pays for itself. Not to mention, with a renegotiated TV deal coming very soon as well, the Ricketts won't be spending anything close to 500 mill out of money they already have. Their financial situation may very well be rosy, but it's not available to anyone other than Joe. Who's not even a sports fan. We are sorely counting on the revenue making parts of the renovations and the TV deal to eventually move our payroll forward. And with the amount of solid, cheap players we've got on the way, a big time addition or two in the next few years won't even move the payroll needle anyway.

 

Exactally. We have not seen this volume of talent in the minors since the 80's. We are going to have waive after waive. Dallas Green had to bring the fans back and rebuild the farm system (84&89) while the Jedi only need to build farm.

 

In March of 2011 the Cubs prospects ranked about 27th . . . in March of 2013 the Cubs prospests ranked about 12th . . . look at the draft and trades . . .

 

I've been a Cubs fan for more than 40 years and . . . I'm jacked.

[Sammy Sofa]

I've been a Cubs fan for 30 years and I'm torn between using this massive amount of heroin for suicide or celebration.

[SouthSideRyan]

We're going to have wave after wave?? The systems ranked ahead of us must have the greatest farm systems in the history of baseball then.

[Beer Kaese]

I've been a Cubs fan for 30 years and I'm torn between using this massive amount of heroin for suicide or celebration.

 

Don't let me stop you.

[Sammy Sofa]

Oh, it's death either way; the question is simply whether it will be a happy one or a miserable one.

[Beer Kaese]

We're going to have wave after wave?? The systems ranked ahead of us must have the greatest farm systems in the history of baseball then.

 

Yes, wave after wave. Instead of sorting through other teams garbage, we will have our own. They will be cheaper and better. Mathis anyone?

Edited September 13, 2013 by Beer Kaese

[davell]

My post was in no way anything positive about Ricketts, by the way. Just means that we've got such a low payroll, a few big money additions won't stretch the payroll much. And we'll be contending. The first time Ricketts will truly get tested won't be until we need to start buying out FA years of guys that aren't even here yet. How Ricketts handles the 2014 payroll will go a very long way in how I judge him. I know there are 29 other teams out there, but there is no excuse not to go get one of the big FA this offseason. We can certainly afford to trade for a guy in his arb years too. If instead though, payroll drops to 90ish or lower, I'll join Mojo with the forehead heroin.

[Beer Kaese]

My post was in no way anything positive about Ricketts, by the way. Just means that we've got such a low payroll, a few big money additions won't stretch the payroll much. And we'll be contending. The first time Ricketts will truly get tested won't be until we need to start buying out FA years of guys that aren't even here yet. How Ricketts handles the 2014 payroll will go a very long way in how I judge him. I know there are 29 other teams out there, but there is no excuse not to go get one of the big FA this offseason. We can certainly afford to trade for a guy in his arb years too. If instead though, payroll drops to 90ish or lower, I'll join Mojo with the forehead heroin.

 

The top prospects are not factors until 2015 so I don't care about 2014.

 

I have no problem with an outfiielder and pitcher and bumping the payroll back to 100m.

[davell]

Honestly, I want to be buyers at the deadline next year. A big FA addition and a trade for a pitcher(or hitter if FA is Tanaka) could put us in that territory. Without even raising the payroll from where it is now.

[SouthSideRyan]

So you're fine with another 65 win [expletive] sandwich next year?

 

ETA: For Beer Kaese

[Sammy Sofa]

We're going to have wave after wave?? The systems ranked ahead of us must have the greatest farm systems in the history of baseball then.

 

Yes, wave after wave. Instead of sorting through other teams garbage, we will have our own. They will be cheaper and better. Mathis anyone?

 

The top prospects are not factors until 2015 so I don't care about 2014.

 

http://25.media.tumblr.com/1c4597f65b3771072984eb0d8e0855ed/tumblr_mi6qldQK3w1qdwvnio1_500.gif

[Hairyducked Idiot]

I swear like 90% of the fan base has this willful amnesia about how long it's been since we had an elite farm system.

[jersey cubs fan]

I swear like 90% of the fan base has this willful amnesia about how long it's been since we had an elite farm system.

 

Yeah, not sure why the comparison is Dallas Green era.

[neely crenshaw]

It's important to have a great farm system but it comes down to how you use them and how they develop. Hendry had a top loaded system at times but struggled to develop anyone and everyone was untouchable until they proved they couldn't play and had no value.

It's exciting to see the possibilities but we also need as many to actually work out- which is a crap shoot.

[illiniguy]

It's important to have a great farm system but it comes down to how you use them and how they develop. Hendry had a top loaded system at times but struggled to develop anyone and everyone was untouchable until they proved they couldn't play and had no value.

It's exciting to see the possibilities but we also need as many to actually work out- which is a crap shoot.

Except for when he traded Bobby Hill and got back Aramis Ramirez. Oh and then when he traded Hee Seop Choi and got back Derrek Lee.

 

Hendry's big problem at that point was he hired a terrible manager to handle his three young pitching prizes and they broke. Carlos was just a mental break.

[neely crenshaw]

nice deals but those were both salary dumps from teams that did not want to pay what the players were going to be worth soon(or already being paid).

In both cases the players(ours) were worth much more a year or two earlier but had proven to be busts. Pittsburgh and Florida were just happy to get something for them. They were great deals for us but don't pretend that Hendry traded them even up for them(talent-wise) because it was all about those teams not paying them. We probably could have sent over 3 fungos and a dozen gameballs for these deal...

[Backtobanks]

nice deals but those were both salary dumps from teams that did not want to pay what the players were going to be worth soon(or already being paid).

In both cases the players(ours) were worth much more a year or two earlier but had proven to be busts. Pittsburgh and Florida were just happy to get something for them. They were great deals for us but don't pretend that Hendry traded them even up for them(talent-wise) because it was all about those teams not paying them. We probably could have sent over 3 fungos and a dozen gameballs for these deal...

 

Before you criticize "salary dumps", what do you think it's going to be if we go after Price, Stanton, etc.

[Backtobanks]

We're going to have wave after wave?? The systems ranked ahead of us must have the greatest farm systems in the history of baseball then.

 

Yes, wave after wave. Instead of sorting through other teams garbage, we will have our own. They will be cheaper and better. Mathis anyone?

 

We can sort through our own garbage instead of other teams garbage? :lol:

[illiniguy]

nice deals but those were both salary dumps from teams that did not want to pay what the players were going to be worth soon(or already being paid).

In both cases the players(ours) were worth much more a year or two earlier but had proven to be busts. Pittsburgh and Florida were just happy to get something for them. They were great deals for us but don't pretend that Hendry traded them even up for them(talent-wise) because it was all about those teams not paying them. We probably could have sent over 3 fungos and a dozen gameballs for these deal...

I am not sure that is totally right. Wasn't Aramis still very cheap at the time that we traded for him? And while Hill had pretty much lost all of his luster, I thought Choi was still pretty highly regarded at the time of his trade?

[XZero771679666304]

nice deals but those were both salary dumps from teams that did not want to pay what the players were going to be worth soon(or already being paid).

In both cases the players(ours) were worth much more a year or two earlier but had proven to be busts. Pittsburgh and Florida were just happy to get something for them. They were great deals for us but don't pretend that Hendry traded them even up for them(talent-wise) because it was all about those teams not paying them. We probably could have sent over 3 fungos and a dozen gameballs for these deal...

I am not sure that is totally right. Wasn't Aramis still very cheap at the time that we traded for him? And while Hill had pretty much lost all of his luster, I thought Choi was still pretty highly regarded at the time of his trade?

 

Choi was still fairly well regarded, iirc, but some of shine had come off for sure. In 300 PA he hadn't shown much other than good plate discipline. It was a small sample, but not completely insignificant, either. I seem to recall the consensus being that he had been exposed as having a terminal case of "gaping hole in his swing".

 

Still, I had hope for him and was not happy to see him dealt, which was obviously more sentimental than analytic.

[Hairyducked Idiot]

Hill was still thought of as a future leadoff guy. I don't think he'd lost much luster.

[illiniguy]

Hill was still thought of as a future leadoff guy. I don't think he'd lost much luster.

At one point, but at the time of the trade he was one of the guys the Pirates could choose from and they settled on him. I am pretty sure he was kind of Brett Jacksoned by that point.