Chicago Bulls Playoff Thread

[ChiCubsFan]

Wait what? You said he was down from his Cleveland/Utah days.

 

I said his production and efficiency are down.

 

Two posts up you said he's the same player he was in Utah. Either he is or he isn't.

 

He is the same player. When did I say he is not?? Just because his production and efficiency are down does not mean he is a worse player or he has lost his skill or whatever people are trying to argue.

[Banedon]

Wait what? You said he was down from his Cleveland/Utah days.

 

I said his production and efficiency are down.

 

Two posts up you said he's the same player he was in Utah. Either he is or he isn't.

 

He is the same player. When did I say he is not?? Just because his production and efficiency are down does not mean he is a worse player or he has lost his skill or whatever people are trying to argue.

 

He's the same player, just not as good. Got it.

[ChiCubsFan]

Wait what? You said he was down from his Cleveland/Utah days.

 

I said his production and efficiency are down.

 

Two posts up you said he's the same player he was in Utah. Either he is or he isn't.

 

He is the same player. When did I say he is not?? Just because his production and efficiency are down does not mean he is a worse player or he has lost his skill or whatever people are trying to argue.

 

He's the same player, just not as good. Got it.

 

Read CCP's post below or Ryan's post above.

Edited March 14, 2012 by ChiCubsFan

[CubColtPacer]

Wait what? You said he was down from his Cleveland/Utah days.

 

I said his production and efficiency are down.

 

Two posts up you said he's the same player he was in Utah. Either he is or he isn't.

 

He is the same player. When did I say he is not?? Just because his production and efficiency are down does not mean he is a worse player or he has lost his skill or whatever people are trying to argue.

 

He's the same player, just not as good. Got it.

 

Banedon, he's saying that Boozer hasn't actually declined, but that his numbers are down because of the team change and an offense that doesn't suit him as well. He's the same player, but placed in a bad situation that has caused his efficiency and productivity to go down. If he changed teams, he would return to the player he was in Utah. I have no idea if it's actually true or not (some people have posted some very good counterarguments that suggest his team isn't the problem), but it's a logically consistent argument.

[ChiCubsFan]

Wait what? You said he was down from his Cleveland/Utah days.

 

Two posts up you said he's the same player he was in Utah. Either he is or he isn't.

 

He is the same player. When did I say he is not?? Just because his production and efficiency are down does not mean he is a worse player or he has lost his skill or whatever people are trying to argue.

 

He's the same player, just not as good. Got it.

 

Banedon, he's saying that Boozer hasn't actually declined, but that his numbers are down because of the team change and an offense that doesn't suit him as well. He's the same player, but placed in a bad situation that has caused his efficiency and productivity to go down. If he changed teams, he would return to the player he was in Utah. I have no idea if it's actually true or not (some people have posted some very good counterarguments that suggest his team isn't the problem), but it's a logically consistent argument.

 

Thank you.

 

I find it more likely that his situation (playing with a center who clogs the lane, wings who can't dribble or create, and a PG who is not primarily a distributor) has changed how he plays rather than his skills have diminished from April 2010 to October 2010.

[squally1313]

I saw a Boozer/Asik for Melo proposal get thrown out in the General NBA thread, but that doesn't really work for either team, for obvious Deng and Stoudemire reasons. But it does lead to the question...

 

What do you guys think about something like Deng+Asik for Melo? With how Melo is perceived right now in NYC, I honestly don't know if that's enough, too much, close, or even a good trade for us in general. The salaries are close enough to make it work (throw in Mike James or something).

[Banedon]

Thank you.

 

I find it more likely that his situation (playing with a center who clogs the lane, wings who can't dribble or create, and a PG who is not primarily a distributor) has changed how he plays rather than his skills have diminished from April 2010 to October 2010.

 

You don't think it's possible that he's never gotten his game back fully since his hand injury at the start of that season?

 

Ultimately, it doesn't even matter that much offensively. I could deal with what he brings offensively if his defense was there. But it's not. He's a major hole in the Bulls defense, and that much I'll grant, is nothing new for him. He's always been a poor defender. And I think he's getting worse at it.

[rawaction]

I saw a Boozer/Asik for Melo proposal get thrown out in the General NBA thread, but that doesn't really work for either team, for obvious Deng and Stoudemire reasons. But it does lead to the question...

 

What do you guys think about something like Deng+Asik for Melo? With how Melo is perceived right now in NYC, I honestly don't know if that's enough, too much, close, or even a good trade for us in general. The salaries are close enough to make it work (throw in Mike James or something).

 

Let's see. Knicks were OK before the trade with a decent amount of young talent. Got him, didn't win as many games. Melo got hurt, Lin took over, they won a lot of games this year. Melo came back they started losing. NYC hates him.

[ChiCubsFan]

Thank you.

 

I find it more likely that his situation (playing with a center who clogs the lane, wings who can't dribble or create, and a PG who is not primarily a distributor) has changed how he plays rather than his skills have diminished from April 2010 to October 2010.

 

You don't think it's possible that he's never gotten his game back fully since his hand injury at the start of that season?

 

Ultimately, it doesn't even matter that much offensively. I could deal with what he brings offensively if his defense was there. But it's not. He's a major hole in the Bulls defense, and that much I'll grant, is nothing new for him. He's always been a poor defender. And I think he's getting worse at it.

 

I guess it is possible. I don't know. He's dealt with a lot of injuries throughout his career so there's really no way for me to know.

 

Agree about the defense.

 

Regardless, this all stemmed from the discussion of Boozer, Sessions, and the Bobcats pick for Gasol. According to the ESPN trade machine (which uses PER) trading Gasol for Boozer and Sessions would improve their projected win total by 6 wins. I know it isn't the most accurate measure in the world, but it still demonstrates how bad their PG play is and how much adding Sessions will compensate for the downgrade from Gasol to Boozer. Add in getting a pick that could be very valuable in a few years (just in time to replace Kobe) and I don't think it's ludicrous to think the Lakers may consider that.

[squally1313]

I saw a Boozer/Asik for Melo proposal get thrown out in the General NBA thread, but that doesn't really work for either team, for obvious Deng and Stoudemire reasons. But it does lead to the question...

 

What do you guys think about something like Deng+Asik for Melo? With how Melo is perceived right now in NYC, I honestly don't know if that's enough, too much, close, or even a good trade for us in general. The salaries are close enough to make it work (throw in Mike James or something).

 

Let's see. Knicks were OK before the trade with a decent amount of young talent. Got him, didn't win as many games. Melo got hurt, Lin took over, they won a lot of games this year. Melo came back they started losing. NYC hates him.

 

So his value won't be much lower than it is right now. And look at the schedules during the winning streak (NJ, Utah, Washington, LAL, Minn, Toronto, Sac) versus the losing streak (Boston, Dallas, San Antonio, Milwaukee, Philly, Chicago).

 

Can we at least agree that Carmelo would be a clear upgrade over Deng. And if so, why not even bring up the idea with New York in basically crisis mode?

[Proven Veteran]

I saw a Boozer/Asik for Melo proposal get thrown out in the General NBA thread, but that doesn't really work for either team, for obvious Deng and Stoudemire reasons. But it does lead to the question...

 

What do you guys think about something like Deng+Asik for Melo? With how Melo is perceived right now in NYC, I honestly don't know if that's enough, too much, close, or even a good trade for us in general. The salaries are close enough to make it work (throw in Mike James or something).

 

Let's see. Knicks were OK before the trade with a decent amount of young talent. Got him, didn't win as many games. Melo got hurt, Lin took over, they won a lot of games this year. Melo came back they started losing. NYC hates him.

 

So his value won't be much lower than it is right now. And look at the schedules during the winning streak (NJ, Utah, Washington, LAL, Minn, Toronto, Sac) versus the losing streak (Boston, Dallas, San Antonio, Milwaukee, Philly, Chicago).

 

Can we at least agree that Carmelo would be a clear upgrade over Deng. And if so, why not even bring up the idea with New York in basically crisis mode?

Carmelo is the most overrated player in the league. I have no interest in trading for him.

[Ryne Ween]

I have no interest in trading for him.

 

If they would do a deal with deng and picks as the centerpiece than we would be idiotic to not go for Carmelo. That would be perfect for us. However, even NYK's stupidity has limitations and they would never do it.

[Proven Veteran]

I have no interest in trading for him.

 

If they would do a deal with deng and picks as the centerpiece than we would be idiotic to not go for Carmelo. That would be perfect for us. However, even NYK's stupidity has limitations and they would never do it.

I'd rather get Landry Fields.

[Tyrant]

Can we at least agree that Carmelo would be a clear upgrade over Deng.

 

I don't know that we can.

[UMFan83]

Quite hilarious following Ochocincos twitter feed as he tries to charter a jet from Miami to Chicago in time for tonight's game.

[Brian]

Watson, Deng in, Rose out

 

This game just got a lot less interesting

[cubbyvirus00]

Watson, Deng in, Rose out

 

This game just got a lot less interesting

 

Well I can now do something else with my time instead of watching the bulls get boned

[chuckywang]

Watson, Deng in, Rose out

 

This game just got a lot less interesting

 

URGH! Why THIS game??

[Magnetic Curses]

good technical there for deng

[Careless]

And there goes Watson again?

[rawaction]

Bad charge call there.

[Magnetic Curses]

Bad charge call there.

 

2 in a row. refs starstruck by the heat.

[Mark Priors Calves]

Bad charge call there.

 

2 in a row. refs starstruck by the heat.

Nice retweet by jgoff!

[Magnetic Curses]

Bad charge call there.

 

2 in a row. refs starstruck by the heat.

Nice retweet by jgoff!

 

you see that too? haha

[Careless]

The Heat have two points from notlebronwade?