Kaplan: Royals interested in Z

[Hairyducked Idiot]

dude you can't trick people into thinking you won an argument by saying "next"

 

Trick? Na, I posted facts.

 

Your fact is the implication that a person can't be racist if they've ever said something nice about a minority.

[Sammy Sofa]

This guy is totally Kaplan.

 

And the other one just might be Hollandsworth.

[CUBZ99]

This guy is totally Kaplan.

 

And the other one just might be Hollandsworth.

 

And you've added nothing to the argument.

[Hollandsworths mug]

I will give yet another example. On Cubs post game over the summer, Quade absolutely RIPPED Castro for losing a ball in the sun. Kaplan and Hollandsworth thought it was bush league to call out Castro (he of the hispanic race) and not blast the underperforming, do not give a rats ass vets.

 

Kinda puts the "race card" to rest.

 

Out of curiosity, did he give any examples of the underperforming, uncaring veterans?

 

 

No one has ever claimed that every thing Kaplan ever said follows in some hideous pattern of racism. He's a simpleton, and as such has to fall onto dumb stereotypes to even have an opinion. A favorite pastime of his is questioning the effort of players, and in a funny coincidence, there's quite a pattern of hispanic players getting the full brunt of his criticism. He's not calling for Jim Crow MLB, he's a moron who can't think of anything more interesting to say then the baseball equivalent of "WOMEN BE SHOPPIN".

 

To be 100 percent honest, I do not remember if Kaplan or Hollandworth mentioned specific players. However, they stuck up for the hispanic/brown Castro and felt Quade was way out of line.

[CUBZ99]

dude you can't trick people into thinking you won an argument by saying "next"

 

Trick? Na, I posted facts.

 

Your fact is the implication that a person can't be racist if they've ever said something nice about a minority.

 

Your really stretching there.

[Sammy Sofa]

To be 100 percent honest, I do not remember if Kaplan or Hollandworth mentioned specific players. However, they stuck up for the hispanic/brown Castro and felt Quade was way out of line.

 

Yet again, nobody is saying he sits there actively hating everything and everything about all non-white players. The point has been that he routinely falls back on lazy criticism borne out of racial stereotypes time and time again with non-white players that he has a beef with.

[Hollandsworths mug]

This guy is totally Kaplan.

 

And the other one just might be Hollandsworth.

 

Spoken like a guy who has added nothing to the discussion.

[Hairyducked Idiot]

dude you can't trick people into thinking you won an argument by saying "next"

 

Trick? Na, I posted facts.

 

Your fact is the implication that a person can't be racist if they've ever said something nice about a minority.

 

Your really stretching there.

 

No, that was actually his argument. He said that when he defended Castro against Quade's tirade, that should "put away the race card" discussion.

[Sammy Sofa]

This guy is totally Kaplan.

 

And the other one just might be Hollandsworth.

 

And you've added nothing to the argument.

 

Actually, I've made it abundantly clear what our issue is with Kaplan. You and HM are just refusing to grasp that and instead just continue to respond as if we're saying he's some kind of frothing at the mouth hatemonger who despises all non-white players.

[Hollandsworths mug]

To be 100 percent honest, I do not remember if Kaplan or Hollandworth mentioned specific players. However, they stuck up for the hispanic/brown Castro and felt Quade was way out of line.

 

Yet again, nobody is saying he sits there actively hating everything and everything about all non-white players. The point has been that he routinely falls back on lazy criticism borne out of racial stereotypes time and time again with non-white players that he has a beef with.

 

Hmm, perhaps it's because the players in question just happen to be hispanic? Na, couldn't be that.

[Sammy Sofa]

This guy is totally Kaplan.

 

And the other one just might be Hollandsworth.

 

Spoken like a guy who has added nothing to the discussion.

 

The [expletive]? Is this the same guy jumping between accounts?

[17 Seconds]

This guy is totally Kaplan.

 

And the other one just might be Hollandsworth.

 

Spoken like a guy who has added nothing to the discussion.

 

The [expletive]? Is this the same guy jumping between accounts?

 

well, that puts this argument to rest. NEXT.

[Sammy Sofa]

To be 100 percent honest, I do not remember if Kaplan or Hollandworth mentioned specific players. However, they stuck up for the hispanic/brown Castro and felt Quade was way out of line.

 

Yet again, nobody is saying he sits there actively hating everything and everything about all non-white players. The point has been that he routinely falls back on lazy criticism borne out of racial stereotypes time and time again with non-white players that he has a beef with.

 

Hmm, perhaps it's because the players in question just happen to be hispanic? Na, couldn't be that.

 

It could be. But given how long this has been going on, and that it also occurs with black players but almost never with white players, probably not.

[seanimal]

Yet another topic derailed into race this, race that. Brown, white. Whatever. My god some of you love to argue.

 

well what, were we supposed to all come here and agree with each other?

[seanimal]

Kaplan: Randy Wells was extremely erratic and must become more focused on his craft before the Cubs can fully count on him as a full fledged member of their rotation.

 

Lazy hispanic.

You can stop posting these examples as they really are not helping your argument.

 

None of what you are posting is falling back on stereotypical criticisms of players performing well at the time. Yet others have posted quite a few examples of players like aramis who get vilified for complaints that fall back on typical stereotypes about their race. Posting the examples that you are simply shows a lack of understanding of what is being said instead of refuting the argument.

 

I doubt that Kaplan or any other major figure in the Chicago media is overtly racist. However, they do make many characterizations about certain players that very much fall into stereotypes.

 

Once again the problem is that many of the complaints about Aramis have been justified or at least amplified by actual games. Not running out basehits....loafing on balls he thought were home runs....not hustling...poor decision making...etc....

 

I will agree with you that I think in regards to Aramis, his flat affect appearance sometimes doesn't do him justice. But the criticism is not limited to Kaplan and it is hardly race based. I think if he were white and did the same thing, he would be jumped on just the same. For a good example just look at Jay Cutler. That guy has taken a ton of criticism about his will to win, laziness, wimpiness etc. I think you are stretching to call it a race problem.

 

dude STOP. aramis ramirez is not lazy. he's the single greatest contributor to the cubs offense over the last half-decade and beyond. he made great strides in improving his defense and conditioning when he got here, which he has been lauded for by non-meatheads on many many occasions. it is absolutely, positively, [expletive] stupid to ask your most valuable player to run out routine fly balls when he has experienced significant leg-related injuries. it's not because he's lazy, it's because he's smart. anyone who thinks the complaints of fat, balding, white tribune employees concerning aramis ramirez are at all valid are just as mentally void as they are.

 

and really, your example of the flip side is the criticism of jay cutler? the media came to the defense of jay cutler, it was players and fans that burned him at the stake. and good for them. i'm always glad when someone outs themselves as a total moron. it's always good to hear a couch-bound type-2 diabetic accusing a type-1 diabetic of laziness and wimpiness.

[seanimal]

oh, and i love how this guy has to go back to [expletive] HEILMAN to find a criticism of a white player. i forgot that guy even soiled the pinstripes.

[Ding Dong Johnson]

This guy is totally Kaplan.

 

And the other one just might be Hollandsworth.

 

Spoken like a guy who has added nothing to the discussion.

You make me laugh.

[Little Slide Rooter]

Zambranos in aleague of his own. Whether he was white, black, Irish, or French Canadian, he'd be called out for his non sense. Meatball fans and media alike are going to come after big money players when they under perform or mess up no matter their race, and let's look at our recent big money guys : Soriano, Ramirez, Zambrano, Bradley, Sosa. Ted Lilly and Derrek Lee were also big money guys who were never trashed, but that was primarily because they were consistently good, aside from the last year or so for Lee, when I can't remember anyone really trashing him. Dempster was starting to hear it too early on when he was struggling, but that's probably just because he's Canadian. As for some of Castros brain farts, it has more to do with his age than anything, and I have to assume that anyone would have been called on for it. It doesn't help Kaplans case that he has made some poorly worded comments but as much of a doushe as he is and the fact that hes made some I'll advised comments, it's hard to see him as an all out racist.

 

As for white guys getting the same treatment, Hundleys the only example that we have, but across town, Adam Dunn hasn't had it much better. Not since Milton Bradley have i seen a guy get that consistently booed every time he comes to bat in his own park.

 

To elaborate, I thuink it has more to do with these media guys valuing the wrong things, IE Theriot and Reed Johnsons grittyness and playing the game right as opposed to Ramirez and Castro who play the game well but make some mental mistakes here and there.

[SouthSideRyan]

I've mentioned it before that if Carlos Zambrano did some of the things Ted Lilly did they'd be marks against him, instead it makes Lilly a bulldog who just wants to win.

[jersey cubs fan]

Who ever called Cutler lazy?

[Little Slide Rooter]

I've mentioned it before that if Carlos Zambrano did some of the things Ted Lilly did they'd be marks against him, instead it makes Lilly a bulldog who just wants to win.

 

I don't think anyone would be able to get away with most of Zs antics. Sure, if Lilly or Dempster or whoever had an isolated incident, it would be sloughed off, however, when there are just so many year after year, he becomes an easy target. Also, the Cubs have done an awful job with damage control, as they did with Bradley before him. When a player has meldows and outbursts on the field or caught on camera in the dugout, there's nothing you can do. However, the organization should be minimizing the press rather than fanning the flames. For example, noboody needed to know about Zs "retirement" or a big chink of the Lou/Bradley saga.

[Hairyducked Idiot]

I don't think anyone would be able to get away with most of Zs antics.

 

How do you feel about Ron Santo?

 

Also, the Cubs have done an awful job with damage control, as they did with Bradley before him. When a player has meldows and outbursts on the field or caught on camera in the dugout, there's nothing you can do. However, the organization should be minimizing the press rather than fanning the flames. For example, noboody needed to know about Zs "retirement" or a big chink of the Lou/Bradley saga.

 

It's not an awful job in the sense that they failed to do what they wanted. They *wanted* this stuff to come out to deflect attention away from the failures of the team.

[Little Slide Rooter]

I don't think anyone would be able to get away with most of Zs antics.

 

How do you feel about Ron Santo?

 

I'm not following. Santo was more of a loveable goof as an announcer. I've heard stories that he was disliked for various reasons as a player, but that was a time when it wasn't in fashion for the media to go after celebrities and politicians. If so, there wouldn't celebrity scandal rags to keep up with them. If they did try to make a name for themselves or expose someone of power, they were eithe given hush money or dealt with as many conspiracy theorisits think that the CIA did Marilyn Monroe, or course that would pertain more to politicians than general celebs.

[seanimal]

I don't think anyone would be able to get away with most of Zs antics.

 

How do you feel about Ron Santo?

 

I'm not following. Santo was more of a loveable goof as an announcer. I've heard stories that he was disliked for various reasons as a player, but that was a time when it wasn't in fashion for the media to go after celebrities and politicians. If so, there wouldn't celebrity scandal rags to keep up with them. If they did try to make a name for themselves or expose someone of power, they were eithe given hush money or dealt with as many conspiracy theorisits think that the CIA did Marilyn Monroe, or course that would pertain more to politicians than general celebs.

 

lol what

[SouthSideRyan]

I don't think anyone would be able to get away with most of Zs antics.

 

How do you feel about Ron Santo?

 

I'm not following. Santo was more of a loveable goof as an announcer. I've heard stories that he was disliked for various reasons as a player, but that was a time when it wasn't in fashion for the media to go after celebrities and politicians. If so, there wouldn't celebrity scandal rags to keep up with them. If they did try to make a name for themselves or expose someone of power, they were eithe given hush money or dealt with as many conspiracy theorisits think that the CIA did Marilyn Monroe, or course that would pertain more to politicians than general celebs.

 

lol what

 

I was hoping we'd all agree to pretend that never happened.