Re: New GM/Cubs Future News Articles

[UMFan83]

Precedent:

 

In 1994, a few weeks after agreeing to terms with Twins general manager Andy MacPhail to become the president and chief executive office, the Cubs sent Class A pitcher Hector Trinidad to the Twins as compensation.

 

If the Red Sox get anything more than a mediocre A-ball pitcher, they should be happy.

 

Hmm...I think you forgot to account for inflation.

[17 Seconds]

a couple of posts i thoroughly enjoyed from that sox board. first one is re: castro

 

I live in Chicago and have watched gum play on tv and in person, and I don't love him. He rushes a lot of throws or makes them off-balance, missing Pena by a lot. He has no judgement about when not to make a throw, and makes some "concentration" errors, but those can be grown out of. I think he can improve, but I don't see him being a good defensive SS.

 

Also, while he can hit .300, he is absolutely a hacker and will never walk much (probably), as it isn't a matter of recognition so much as a desire to swing at everything.

 

He is good for his age, and kind of fun to watch, but I don't want him on the Sox. What's cute now will be annoying if at 27 he still leads the league in errors and doesn't walk.

 

I saw the original tweet that said Jackson wasn't on the table. What I haven't seen is anything saying that it was the Cubs who took him off.

 

Is it outside the realm of possibility that the Red Sox would prefer others to Jackson simply because he's repetitive in the Sox system? Which would mean you couldn't really infer anything from him not being involved in the discussions.

[TruffleShuffle]

Attempting to shift the conversation a little bit, if the negotiations with the Red Sox do break down, who would you want to go after next? I would assume Beane, Cashman, and Friedman are out at this point.

 

I personally don't get all the love for Hahn. What has he really done to deserve it? My thinking is that Cherington wouldn't be available, either.

 

I think I'd put Coppolella at the very top of my list, after Epstein. Has worked for two top organizations (Braves, Yankees) in both scouting and statistical system development.

 

if we end up with someone like hahn or coppolella because we wouldn't part with trey mcnutt, i may have to go burn down wrigley.

[Guest]

"Epsten deal a go but might miss deadline".

 

Still negotiating about prospects.

 

http://www.suntimes.com/sports/baseball/cubs/8272985-573/theo-epstein-deal-a-go-but-it-might-miss-deadline.html

 

 

And with baseball’s blackout rule regarding such major announcements during the World Series, that could push Epstein’s trip to the podium into the final week of October — assuming the sides settle on the compensation issue by then.

 

These talks, after all, involve a Cubs chairman, Tom Ricketts, whose family endured a three-year negotiating process during a national economic crisis to buy the team.

 

And those who know Ricketts say he’s playing to his strength as an experienced and dogged negotiator as he heads the Cubs’ talks with Red Sox ownership.

 

The sides are said to be hung up on Boston’s demand for top pitching prospect Trey McNutt, with the issue of other personnel the outgoing Red Sox GM might want to bring to Chicago considered less of a sticking point.

 

Despite the potential for the process to drag into the World Series blackout period, sources expressed no concern that the five-year, $18.5 million deal between the Cubs and Epstein was in jeopardy.

 

The sense of inevitability cuts a swath from Wrigley to Fenway, where sources say Ben Cherington already has been internally appointed GM and other members of the Red Sox’ front office are in the process of being shuffled and/or promoted according to that and other falling dominoes anticipated with Epstein’s departure.

 

Reports from Boston and sources in Chicago suggest motivation on both sides for a quick resolution.

 

If an agreement is reached during the World Series, one possible scenario could involve the Cubs seeking an exception to the blackout rule to allow an announcement during a scheduled day off, as they were allowed to do two years ago for the ownership change. Friday is the first scheduled day off of the Series.

[Guest]

Think Sullivan spends some time here?

 

http://www.chicagotribune.com/sports/baseball/cubs/ct-spt-1018-cubs-epstein--20111018,0,2099385.story

 

Sandberg remains a popular pick among Cubs fans because he played the game the right way during his Hall of Fame career. Even some Cubs players talked among themselves at the end of the season about how he'd fare in the job in 2012. Sandberg managed several players during their stops in the minors, and had a good rapport with most.

[Kevin374]

Here is an interesting article on who the Cubs should resist sending to Bos at all costs!! http://m.bleacherreport.com/articles/895713-theo-epstein-compensation-10-cubs-prospects-chicago-should-refuse-to-send?embedded=true

 

 

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[Brett]

Precedent:

 

In 1994, a few weeks after agreeing to terms with Twins general manager Andy MacPhail to become the president and chief executive office, the Cubs sent Class A pitcher Hector Trinidad to the Twins as compensation.

 

If the Red Sox get anything more than a mediocre A-ball pitcher, they should be happy.

Minor leaguers are valued way more now than they were valued in 1994.

 

Technically, that would be a reason that the Twins got MORE in 1994 in terms of prospects than they could get for a comparable executive today.

 

EDIT: I'm an awesome reader. Sorry, didn't see that someone had already made that point.

[C.C.]

Attempting to shift the conversation a little bit, if the negotiations with the Red Sox do break down, who would you want to go after next? I would assume Beane, Cashman, and Friedman are out at this point.

 

I personally don't get all the love for Hahn. What has he really done to deserve it? My thinking is that Cherington wouldn't be available, either.

 

I think I'd put Coppolella at the very top of my list, after Epstein. Has worked for two top organizations (Braves, Yankees) in both scouting and statistical system development.

 

if we end up with someone like hahn or coppolella because we wouldn't part with trey mcnutt, i may have to go burn down wrigley.

 

I'll bring the blow torch.

[Hairyducked Idiot]

if we end up with someone like hahn or coppolella because we wouldn't part with trey mcnutt, i may have to go burn down wrigley.

 

If they lose someone like McNutt because they weren't willing to take someone like Hahn or Coppolella, I may have to burn down Australia.

[ScrubMD]

 

I mean the blister issues don't really scare me too much although with Beckett I've seen that it could be a pain in the ass too...I think also I'm weary of him because he hasn't pitched in the higher rungs yet, I could be dead wrong on the guy, the numbers declined last year but there is always a chance on a bounce back....I'll never root against anyone though.

 

His numbers only declined on paper.

[ScrubMD]

i have one question for Holldsworth's Mug aka cubsfans26-

 

Why do you want Theo Epstein so much when virtually every baseball opinion you have goes against his way of thinking?

 

Been wondering the same thing. Someone citing things like bating avg, RBI, pitcher's wins, "fire & leadership" (or something along those lines) doesn't strike me as someone who really understand what Epstein is about

 

Because he "ended the curse". We have a curse! He's a perfect fit even if he doesn't understand the significance of AVG and a pitcher's wins.

 

I think I channeled them pretty well.

[ScrubMD]

Co-CEO tomorrow and nip this in the butt if they wanted to. Can't believe after 3 hours I still have to argue my main point, we go from McNutt to this...

 

I don't get your hypothetical about the Sox naming him Co-CEO. They clearly are not doing that on top of giving him more privileges and a boost in compensation. If that were the case, then I could understand the compensation more.

 

You have a point in the fact that the Cubs new before they came to the table that there was compensation needed. Posters here merely asked why it was necessary. Arguing that it's necessary because the Cubs already knew before hand is avoiding the debate.

Compensation is necessary because the Red Sox will be releasing a valuable, high-ranking member of their organization that they have under contract.

 

In the end it doesn't really matter if the Cubs want him to run the place or wash cars in the players' lot. In either case the Red Sox are losing his services, and that's what requires compensation.

 

Look back at all the teams that lost a member of their staff's services due to a promotion with another team and then look at how many of those teams got significant compensation.

 

In short, you do not know what you're talking about.

[Guest]

Here is an interesting article on who the Cubs should resist sending to Bos at all costs!! http://m.bleacherreport.com/articles/895713-theo-epstein-compensation-10-cubs-prospects-chicago-should-refuse-to-send?embedded=true

 

 

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bleacherREPORT lol

[Guest]

if we end up with someone like hahn or coppolella because we wouldn't part with trey mcnutt, i may have to go burn down wrigley.

 

If they lose someone like McNutt because they weren't willing to take someone like Hahn or Coppolella, I may have to burn down Australia.

 

Now I know you don't really mean that.

[Brett]

Here is an interesting article on who the Cubs should resist sending to Bos at all costs!! http://m.bleacherreport.com/articles/895713-theo-epstein-compensation-10-cubs-prospects-chicago-should-refuse-to-send?embedded=true

 

 

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bleacherREPORT lol

 

Additionally, you can be certain that I will never sign up for a board and, in my second post, spam the place with my own garbage.

 

 

I wait until my 400th post to spam a place with my own garbage.

[Banedon]

Additionally, you can be certain that I will never sign up for a board and, in my second post, spam the place with my own garbage.

 

 

I wait until my 400th post to spam a place with my own garbage.

 

Either way...brace for the garbage spam!!!

[Vanilla Ice]

Attempting to shift the conversation a little bit, if the negotiations with the Red Sox do break down, who would you want to go after next? I would assume Beane, Cashman, and Friedman are out at this point.

 

I personally don't get all the love for Hahn. What has he really done to deserve it? My thinking is that Cherington wouldn't be available, either.

 

I think I'd put Coppolella at the very top of my list, after Epstein. Has worked for two top organizations (Braves, Yankees) in both scouting and statistical system development.

 

if we end up with someone like hahn or coppolella because we wouldn't part with trey mcnutt, i may have to go burn down wrigley.

Coppolella + McNutt + 6.5 million <<<<<< Epstein ?

 

I'm not so sure about that

[Little Slide Rooter]

This seriously need to get done sooner than later. We need to have a GM as soon as the offseason begins, a good one at that. Here's my suggestion: let Luccino send us a list of 25 players. We cross off 10, and let them chose 2 of the remaining, and we'll send 1 more of our chosing off the same list.

[Guest]

Attempting to shift the conversation a little bit, if the negotiations with the Red Sox do break down, who would you want to go after next? I would assume Beane, Cashman, and Friedman are out at this point.

 

I personally don't get all the love for Hahn. What has he really done to deserve it? My thinking is that Cherington wouldn't be available, either.

 

I think I'd put Coppolella at the very top of my list, after Epstein. Has worked for two top organizations (Braves, Yankees) in both scouting and statistical system development.

 

if we end up with someone like hahn or coppolella because we wouldn't part with trey mcnutt, i may have to go burn down wrigley.

Coppolella + McNutt + 6.5 million <<<<<< Epstein ?

 

I'm not so sure about that

 

 

The difference will probably be a lot more than $6.5M in terms of money.

 

That said, there's a lot of additional value in having Theo. It's proven that he can run an organization and we know that he has an innovative model of his own (although not completely unique) that works. He also is highly respected and lots of people will want to work for him. There's a lot of value in all of that over hiring a former assistant. Not to mention the potential benefit that the high profile hire will have in terms of dealing with the city on the renovations (which, admittedly, is purely speculative and hard to quantify - even though Emmanuel has publicly commented positively on the Theo hire).

 

That's not to say that one of the qualified and intelligent assistants can't do the job, because there are some that can and will. But Theo is more of a sure bet.

[KingCubsFan]

Attempting to shift the conversation a little bit, if the negotiations with the Red Sox do break down, who would you want to go after next? I would assume Beane, Cashman, and Friedman are out at this point.

 

I personally don't get all the love for Hahn. What has he really done to deserve it? My thinking is that Cherington wouldn't be available, either.

 

I think I'd put Coppolella at the very top of my list, after Epstein. Has worked for two top organizations (Braves, Yankees) in both scouting and statistical system development.

 

if we end up with someone like hahn or coppolella because we wouldn't part with trey mcnutt, i may have to go burn down wrigley.

Coppolella + McNutt + 6.5 million <<<<<< Epstein ?

 

I'm not so sure about that

Do we know anything about Coppolella besides an article that says he likes stats? Going into the offseason, I think most would agree that Epstein was at least the second best candidate out there. There's really only a few players in our organization (given our complete lack of top end talent) that should stand in the way, and McNutt isn't one of them. And if 6.5 million is that big of a deal, just get rid of Byrd.

[SouthSideRyan]

if we end up with someone like hahn or coppolella because we wouldn't part with trey mcnutt, i may have to go burn down wrigley.

 

If they lose someone like McNutt because they weren't willing to take someone like Hahn or Coppolella, I may have to burn down Australia.

 

Now I know you don't really mean that.

 

That's only because a trip to Australia would take away from the 70% of income he puts in savings.

[davearm2]

 

I personally don't know the ins-and-outs of contract negotiations, especially ones to this degree. However, if the Sox cause considerable monetary loss (not to mention stalling career path growth) to an employee because they deny that employee from taking a job with the Cubs, I think that employee has litigation rights to help himself to that lost compensation. I may be wrong on that though.

Of course you're wrong. Epstein signed a contract with the Red Sox to be their GM. He can't turn around and sue them for asking him to honor that contract.

 

I'm not saying that the employee is entitled to some type of compensation. Merely that the employee may plead his case that he should be entitled to compensation. If that employee can prove that the decision to retain the employee was not a business decision (IE: spite), I would think there is a case there. It would be very hard to prove, but the way the Red Sox organization have been smearing Epstein, I would think there's at least a threat for litigation.

And I'm telling you there isn't.

[Hairyducked Idiot]

I don't know if I'm willing to stipulate that Epstein is more of a "sure thing." I can think of a few examples off the top of my head of GMs who have had success in multiple places, but that's just anecdotal.

[Hairyducked Idiot]

Now I know you don't really mean that.

 

That's only because a trip to Australia would take away from the 70% of income he puts in savings.

 

The Red Sox taught me that making empty threats around here convinces some people to give in.

[Guest]

I don't know if I'm willing to stipulate that Epstein is more of a "sure thing." I can think of a few examples off the top of my head of GMs who have had success in multiple places, but that's just anecdotal.

 

With the scouting backgrounds that 99% of GMs had up until very recently, achieving sustained success was a roll of the dice more than anything anyway.