Gary Hughes Not Returning Next Year

[davearm2]

The man's job was to evaluate amateur talent, and he clearly didn't understand why there might be a difference in the odds of a high school pitcher vs. a college pitcher reaching their ceiling.

 

One bad interview didn't make him look dumb. His dumb made him look dumb.

 

Are you sure he didn't understand or is it that his job is to try to beat the odds?

 

I'm very sure he didn't understand. Are you sure you read the interview?

You can't be serious.

 

The guy may or may not suck at his job, but he surely understands the pros and cons of drafting HS players vs. college players.

[Hairyducked Idiot]

Then why did he say what he said?

[Hairyducked Idiot]

The man's exact words were

 

Why are they an unknown? I don’t understand.

 

I can't give him a lot of leeway on interpreting that one.

[javy knows my name]

The man's job was to evaluate amateur talent, and he clearly didn't understand why there might be a difference in the odds of a high school pitcher vs. a college pitcher reaching their ceiling.

 

One bad interview didn't make him look dumb. His dumb made him look dumb.

 

Are you sure he didn't understand or is it that his job is to try to beat the odds?

 

I'm very sure he didn't understand. Are you sure you read the interview?

You can't be serious.

 

The guy may or may not suck at his job, but he surely understands the pros and cons of drafting HS players vs. college players.

 

NOW this thread can realize its full potential.

[davearm2]

The man's exact words were

 

Why are they an unknown? I don’t understand.

 

I can't give him a lot of leeway on interpreting that one.

So it is your belief that a man that has spent his entire professional career as a baseball scout does not realize that the development curve, risk/reward equation, maturity process, injury potential, etc. etc. is different for HS players versus college players.

 

You believe Gary Hughes does not grasp any of these concepts, and is in fact totally oblivious to all of these considerations.

 

Do I have that right?

[Hairyducked Idiot]

Let's ask Gary himself...

 

Why are they an unknown? I don't understand.

 

Thanks, Gary.

[UK1679666180]

What accounts? I keep hearing about his amazing history of talent evaluation. What is it?

Leiter, Alou, Kevin Brown, Nen, Grissom, Floyd, etc. He was pivotal in the success of the Expos and Marlins of the 90s. If you don't remember how good the Spos were, look it up.

 

I'm confused, are these players he scouted? Because they came from disparate organizations in the minors and were acquired by the GM in Florida, which he was not.

 

Those Expos teams were nice. Floyd and Alou were nice first-rounders, but I don't know that it took scouting genius to find them. The best player on those teams, Larry Walker, predated Hughes' run as scouting director by two years. Nor did the two key rotation pitchers come from the minors.

 

It looks to me like he just had two or three draft picks that turned out well and happened to be in the organization at the same time as a bunch of other talent was acquired, thus cementing his reputation.

 

Scouted, signed, and recommended, he was with Florida and Montreal for each of their runs.

 

If 1st rounders were easy, the Cubs would not be where they are.

[UK1679666180]

What accounts? I keep hearing about his amazing history of talent evaluation. What is it?

Leiter, Alou, Kevin Brown, Nen, Grissom, Floyd, etc. He was pivotal in the success of the Expos and Marlins of the 90s. If you don't remember how good the Spos were, look it up.

 

I'm confused, are these players he scouted? Because they came from disparate organizations in the minors and were acquired by the GM in Florida, which he was not.

 

Those Expos teams were nice. Floyd and Alou were nice first-rounders, but I don't know that it took scouting genius to find them. The best player on those teams, Larry Walker, predated Hughes' run as scouting director by two years. Nor did the two key rotation pitchers come from the minors.

 

It looks to me like he just had two or three draft picks that turned out well and happened to be in the organization at the same time as a bunch of other talent was acquired, thus cementing his reputation.

 

Scouted, signed, and recommended, he was with Florida and Montreal for each of their runs.

 

If 1st rounders were easy, the Cubs would not be where they are.

[UK1679666180]

The man's job was to evaluate amateur talent, and he clearly didn't understand why there might be a difference in the odds of a high school pitcher vs. a college pitcher reaching their ceiling.

 

One bad interview didn't make him look dumb. His dumb made him look dumb.

It was in the context of teams unwilling to draft HS pitchers b/c of injury possibility being increased. I'm sure he knows the differences between the two in both development and arm structure but he would draft a HS arm in the 1st unlike some clubs.

 

I'm not sure at all that he knows that. He seemed to be saying that if you scout a guy properly, the risk is identical, because that's what scouts do.

 

His response to the assertion that high school pitchers get hurt more was "college pitchers don't get hurt?" That's a dumb argument.

 

Sure, he knows that. That's scouting 101.

 

Let me ask you, would you want the Cubs to take a chance and draft a HS pitcher knowing the developmental and injury risks?

 

His response was geared towards the teams who don't draft HS pitchers b/c of that risk and mentioned "college pitchers don't risk) it was a snide yet true remark.

[Hairyducked Idiot]

What accounts? I keep hearing about his amazing history of talent evaluation. What is it?

Leiter, Alou, Kevin Brown, Nen, Grissom, Floyd, etc. He was pivotal in the success of the Expos and Marlins of the 90s. If you don't remember how good the Spos were, look it up.

 

I'm confused, are these players he scouted? Because they came from disparate organizations in the minors and were acquired by the GM in Florida, which he was not.

 

Those Expos teams were nice. Floyd and Alou were nice first-rounders, but I don't know that it took scouting genius to find them. The best player on those teams, Larry Walker, predated Hughes' run as scouting director by two years. Nor did the two key rotation pitchers come from the minors.

 

It looks to me like he just had two or three draft picks that turned out well and happened to be in the organization at the same time as a bunch of other talent was acquired, thus cementing his reputation.

 

Scouted, signed, and recommended, he was with Florida and Montreal for each of their runs.

 

If 1st rounders were easy, the Cubs would not be where they are.

 

So he is getting credit for saying "Hey Florida and Montreal, you should sign some good MLB players"? Most of these guys weren't exactly diamonds in the rough. And again: The Florida organization wasn't all that good while he was there. Florida did not have a "run."

[UK1679666180]

What accounts? I keep hearing about his amazing history of talent evaluation. What is it?

Leiter, Alou, Kevin Brown, Nen, Grissom, Floyd, etc. He was pivotal in the success of the Expos and Marlins of the 90s. If you don't remember how good the Spos were, look it up.

 

I'm confused, are these players he scouted? Because they came from disparate organizations in the minors and were acquired by the GM in Florida, which he was not.

 

Those Expos teams were nice. Floyd and Alou were nice first-rounders, but I don't know that it took scouting genius to find them. The best player on those teams, Larry Walker, predated Hughes' run as scouting director by two years. Nor did the two key rotation pitchers come from the minors.

 

It looks to me like he just had two or three draft picks that turned out well and happened to be in the organization at the same time as a bunch of other talent was acquired, thus cementing his reputation.

 

Scouted, signed, and recommended, he was with Florida and Montreal for each of their runs.

 

If 1st rounders were easy, the Cubs would not be where they are.

 

So he is getting credit for saying "Hey Florida and Montreal, you should sign some good MLB players"? Most of these guys weren't exactly diamonds in the rough. And again: The Florida organization wasn't all that good while he was there. Florida did not have a "run."

 

They acquired good players while there, granted b/c of payroll limitations, they could not maintain it.

 

If he is doing pro coverage and he recommends guys they should sign and help the team, that is his job.

 

If it was that easy, every team would be perfect with FA signees.

 

God bless fantasy baseball.

[Hairyducked Idiot]

They acquired good players while there, granted b/c of payroll limitations, they could not maintain it.

 

If he is doing pro coverage and he recommends guys they should sign and help the team, that is his job.

 

If it was that easy, every team would be perfect with FA signees.

 

God bless fantasy baseball.

 

 

So after *decades* in major league organizations, his primary accomplishments are a brief run of good drafts with the Expos and being a part of a 92-win, one-off team.

 

Forgive me for not being overwhelmed with his resume.

[UK1679666180]

The man's exact words were

 

Why are they an unknown? I don’t understand.

 

I can't give him a lot of leeway on interpreting that one.

 

He didn't say they weren't an unknown, he was responding to McCracken stating HS players were more of an unknown given the physical maturity peaks.

 

I don't believe they are unknown either, in the literal sense either, scouts know enough about a HS player to draft him, therefore it is not unknown, while McCracken was speaking of projection. There's less odds of them making it to the majors, but that risk is worth the 3 season of the best instructional baseball they will get compared to college.

[UK1679666180]

They acquired good players while there, granted b/c of payroll limitations, they could not maintain it.

 

If he is doing pro coverage and he recommends guys they should sign and help the team, that is his job.

 

If it was that easy, every team would be perfect with FA signees.

 

God bless fantasy baseball.

 

 

So after *decades* in major league organizations, his primary accomplishments are a brief run of good drafts with the Expos and being a part of a 92-win, one-off team.

 

Forgive me for not being overwhelmed with his resume.

 

No, he spent many years as an area scout before working his way up to scouting director and then assistant GM. He worked up from a part-time scout to Scouting Dir. and Assistant GM. His recognition as one of the 10 scouts of the 20th century by Baseball America is plenty for me.

[imb]

Yeah george bush was a shitty president but he'd be great to have a beer with

[SouthSideRyan]

 

God bless fantasy baseball.

 

FINALLY!!!

[UK1679666180]

 

God bless fantasy baseball.

 

FINALLY!!!

When people can't grasp scouting is and will be predom. Subjective, that is their lack of knowledge on scouting.

[Hairyducked Idiot]

I don't play fantasy baseball.

[jersey cubs fan]

 

God bless fantasy baseball.

 

FINALLY!!!

When people can't grasp scouting is and will be predom. Subjective, that is their lack of knowledge on scouting.

 

Is this yoda?

[Magnetic Curses]

 

God bless fantasy baseball.

 

FINALLY!!!

When people can't grasp scouting is and will be predom. Subjective, that is their lack of knowledge on scouting.

 

i don't know what this means, but i know that scouting is the scouting of scouting, and scouting scouting scouting scouting scouting is scouting.

 

now someone go scout me a scout of scout.

[mul21]

It was supposed to say this:

 

When people can't grasp scouting is and will be predominantly subjective, that is their lack of knowledge on scouting.

 

But I'm guessing it was posted from a phone that auto capitalized after the period.

[davearm2]

Let's ask Gary himself...

 

Why are they an unknown? I don't understand.

 

Thanks, Gary.

What was said:

VOROS McCRACKEN: The lower-revenue teams are in a bit of a bind when it comes to high school prospects because they are more of an unknown. It becomes difficult for a team that's not bringing in that much in terms of revenue to take a big-money chance . . .

 

GARY HUGHES: Why are they an unknown? I don't understand. Because of the data?

 

What it meant:

"I don't understand why you believe high school prospects that can be evaluated through scouting are an unknown. They're not unknown."

 

What you heard:

"I don't understand baseball."

[javy knows my name]

Let's ask Gary himself...

 

Why are they an unknown? I don't understand.

 

Thanks, Gary.

What was said:

VOROS McCRACKEN: The lower-revenue teams are in a bit of a bind when it comes to high school prospects because they are more of an unknown. It becomes difficult for a team that's not bringing in that much in terms of revenue to take a big-money chance . . .

 

GARY HUGHES: Why are they an unknown? I don't understand. Because of the data?

 

What it meant:

"I don't understand why you believe high school prospects that can be evaluated through scouting are an unknown. They're not unknown."

 

What you heard:

"I don't understand baseball."

 

Gary Hughes doesn't see the difference between projecting a high school kid vs a college kid because he sees them with his EYES and feels their potential with his GUT. Not only does that fly in the face of any responsible use of statistics, it defies common sense. That's a problem.

[davearm2]

Let's ask Gary himself...

 

Why are they an unknown? I don't understand.

 

Thanks, Gary.

What was said:

VOROS McCRACKEN: The lower-revenue teams are in a bit of a bind when it comes to high school prospects because they are more of an unknown. It becomes difficult for a team that's not bringing in that much in terms of revenue to take a big-money chance . . .

 

GARY HUGHES: Why are they an unknown? I don't understand. Because of the data?

 

What it meant:

"I don't understand why you believe high school prospects that can be evaluated through scouting are an unknown. They're not unknown."

 

What you heard:

"I don't understand baseball."

 

Gary Hughes doesn't see the difference between projecting a high school kid vs a college kid because he sees them with his EYES and feels their potential with his GUT. Not only does that fly in the face of any responsible use of statistics, it defies common sense. That's a problem.

He didn't say that. That's your spin.

 

I'm going to go ahead and continue to cling to the apparently bizarre notion that a lifelong professional scout grasps the difference between projecting HS prospects and college prospects.

[UK1679666180]

 

Gary Hughes doesn't see the difference between projecting a high school kid vs a college kid because he sees them with his EYES and feels their potential with his GUT. Not only does that fly in the face of any responsible use of statistics, it defies common sense. That's a problem.

 

If you were a scouting director of a smaller market club, would you draft a HS pitcher in the 1st?