NBA PLAYOFF THREAD

[illiniguy]

Earlier you said that Aaron Brooks was a stud. For fun,

 

Rose .483 from the field 6.2 assists 3.8 rebounds for his career

Brooks .421 from the field 3.6 assists 2.0 rebounds for his career

 

 

Do you understand how basketball works?

 

Yep that is realistic. Use a guys career stats when he has only started for one season. Seems far to me.

 

Rose 2009-10: 20.8 points, 6 assists, 3.8 rebounds, .489 FG% on 1373 FGA (.495 Adjusted FG%), .267 3PT% on 60 3PA, .766 FT% on 338 FTA, 36.8 minutes

 

Brooks 2009-10: 19.6 points, 5.3 assists, 2.6 rebounds, .432 FG% on 1331 FGA (.511 Adjusted FG%), .398 3PT% on 525 3PA, .822 FT% on 298 FTA, 35.6 minutes

 

 

Everyone, including me, would take Rose but it is not a large gap. Brooks is one of the best 3-pt shooters in the league (No. 1 in attempts and makes this year) and drives well because no one can stay with him but lacks a good jumper. Rose has a good jumper and drives well because he has good quickness and size for his position. If I'm not mistaken both are also helped in driving by having ridiculous verticals.

Oh my bad, Rose was good enough to start from day one. I just assumed Brooks was as well. Also it's such a wide gap if Houston called and offered Aaron Brooks for Rose Paxson would luagh and then hang up. If the roles were reversed Houston's GM would drive Aaron to the airport. Rose is a stud and you tried to limit his ability becuase he can't shoot threes. Neither could Magic Johnson or Michael Jordan. They ended up alright.

 

Like I said Rose is better so of course every team would rather have him. Rose has also likely not yet hit his peak while Brooks likely has. That is the biggest reason why everyone would jump at the chance to trade Brooks for Rose.

 

Anyways Jordan wasn't a PG and Magic's game is different than any other PG's in history because he was so big and capable of playing C in short stints which he did rarely in his career but still did. They were also both more than 6% better than Rose on career 3P%.

By the end of their careers they were better, what were their stats their first two years? Plus Rose is different from every point guard ever, name me one other point guard who catches reverse alley oops. Go ahead I'll wait. Rose is a freak athlete and is going to go down as one of the best pgs of all time barring an injury.

[Exile on Waveland]

I just assumed he said "thug" -- which would have fit with the preface. If he said the other thing, well, sheesh. Not sure why he thought the preface would help at all (not that it really ever would/could).

He said the other.

 

And I'm pretty sure that the majority of people who have started out their post with "not to be racist, but..." have ended up banned.

 

Yowza.

 

But, yeah, anytime you need to preface a statement with "not to be racist, but . . ." you should immediately stop because what you're about to say/write will indubitably be racist. I could see, however, why that preface would work better with the usage of "thug" than the other. I am shocked someone could think any preface would alleviate that level of epithet.

[CubbieBum]

Earlier you said that Aaron Brooks was a stud. For fun,

 

Rose .483 from the field 6.2 assists 3.8 rebounds for his career

Brooks .421 from the field 3.6 assists 2.0 rebounds for his career

 

 

Do you understand how basketball works?

 

Yep that is realistic. Use a guys career stats when he has only started for one season. Seems far to me.

 

Rose 2009-10: 20.8 points, 6 assists, 3.8 rebounds, .489 FG% on 1373 FGA (.495 Adjusted FG%), .267 3PT% on 60 3PA, .766 FT% on 338 FTA, 36.8 minutes

 

Brooks 2009-10: 19.6 points, 5.3 assists, 2.6 rebounds, .432 FG% on 1331 FGA (.511 Adjusted FG%), .398 3PT% on 525 3PA, .822 FT% on 298 FTA, 35.6 minutes

 

 

Everyone, including me, would take Rose but it is not a large gap. Brooks is one of the best 3-pt shooters in the league (No. 1 in attempts and makes this year) and drives well because no one can stay with him but lacks a good jumper. Rose has a good jumper and drives well because he has good quickness and size for his position. If I'm not mistaken both are also helped in driving by having ridiculous verticals.

Oh my bad, Rose was good enough to start from day one. I just assumed Brooks was as well. Also it's such a wide gap if Houston called and offered Aaron Brooks for Rose Paxson would luagh and then hang up. If the roles were reversed Houston's GM would drive Aaron to the airport. Rose is a stud and you tried to limit his ability becuase he can't shoot threes. Neither could Magic Johnson or Michael Jordan. They ended up alright.

 

Like I said Rose is better so of course every team would rather have him. Rose has also likely not yet hit his peak while Brooks likely has. That is the biggest reason why everyone would jump at the chance to trade Brooks for Rose.

 

Anyways Jordan wasn't a PG and Magic's game is different than any other PG's in history because he was so big and capable of playing C in short stints which he did rarely in his career but still did. They were also both more than 6% better than Rose on career 3P%.

By the end of their careers they were better, what were their stats their first two years? Plus Rose is different from every point guard ever, name me one other point guard who catches reverse alley oops. Go ahead I'll wait. Rose is a freak athlete and is going to go down as one of the best pgs of all time barring an injury.

 

Rose may indeed do that but he needs to get his assists way up before even being able to be one of the best current PG's.

 

So you're saying no other PG in history had the capability to do reverse alley-oops? Just because others haven't doesn't mean they couldn't. This is different from Rose's 3PT shooting ability. He can shoot them just not well.

 

Right now I would compare Rose to D-Wade. Rose is a good player who can raise his game to Wade's level but never is really a a true PG. He's a hybrid of PG and SG. LeBron is as much a PG as either of them to me. LeBron plays a very similar game to Magic now that I think of it.

[illiniguy]

 

Right now I would compare Rose to D-Wade. Rose is a good player who can raise his game to Wade's level but never is really a a true PG. He's a hybrid of PG and SG. LeBron is as much a PG as either of them to me. LeBron plays a very similar game to Magic now that I think of it.

What I am trying to say is Rose is by far the best athlete ever to play the point guard spot. His assists are down because he plays on a bad team with a bunch of lousy jump shooters. I'm a Deron Williams mark and were I running the Jazz I would trade Deron Williams and my top pick for Rose.

[SouthSideRyan]

 

Right now I would compare Rose to D-Wade. Rose is a good player who can raise his game to Wade's level but never is really a a true PG. He's a hybrid of PG and SG. LeBron is as much a PG as either of them to me. LeBron plays a very similar game to Magic now that I think of it.

What I am trying to say is Rose is by far the best athlete ever to play the point guard spot. His assists are down because he plays on a bad team with a bunch of lousy jump shooters. I'm a Deron Williams mark and were I running the Jazz I would trade Deron Williams and my top pick for Rose.

 

Considering where the Jazz could be picking, that's madness. You'd trade Deron Williams and a shot at Evan Turner/John Wall for Rose????

[illiniguy]

 

Right now I would compare Rose to D-Wade. Rose is a good player who can raise his game to Wade's level but never is really a a true PG. He's a hybrid of PG and SG. LeBron is as much a PG as either of them to me. LeBron plays a very similar game to Magic now that I think of it.

What I am trying to say is Rose is by far the best athlete ever to play the point guard spot. His assists are down because he plays on a bad team with a bunch of lousy jump shooters. I'm a Deron Williams mark and were I running the Jazz I would trade Deron Williams and my top pick for Rose.

 

Considering where the Jazz could be picking, that's madness. You'd trade Deron Williams and a shot at Evan Turner/John Wall for Rose????

I'd have to see where the pick landed. If it's not one of those two, yes I would. This draft looks to be 2 deep to me.

[imb]

 

Right now I would compare Rose to D-Wade. Rose is a good player who can raise his game to Wade's level but never is really a a true PG. He's a hybrid of PG and SG. LeBron is as much a PG as either of them to me. LeBron plays a very similar game to Magic now that I think of it.

What I am trying to say is Rose is by far the best athlete ever to play the point guard spot. His assists are down because he plays on a bad team with a bunch of lousy jump shooters. I'm a Deron Williams mark and were I running the Jazz I would trade Deron Williams and my top pick for Rose.

 

Considering where the Jazz could be picking, that's madness. You'd trade Deron Williams and a shot at Evan Turner/John Wall for Rose????

I'd have to see where the pick landed. If it's not one of those two, yes I would. This draft looks to be 2 deep to me.

 

don't forget favors

[CubbieBum]

 

Right now I would compare Rose to D-Wade. Rose is a good player who can raise his game to Wade's level but never is really a a true PG. He's a hybrid of PG and SG. LeBron is as much a PG as either of them to me. LeBron plays a very similar game to Magic now that I think of it.

What I am trying to say is Rose is by far the best athlete ever to play the point guard spot. His assists are down because he plays on a bad team with a bunch of lousy jump shooters. I'm a Deron Williams mark and were I running the Jazz I would trade Deron Williams and my top pick for Rose.

 

Considering where the Jazz could be picking, that's madness. You'd trade Deron Williams and a shot at Evan Turner/John Wall for Rose????

I'd have to see where the pick landed. If it's not one of those two, yes I would. This draft looks to be 2 deep to me.

 

That is still crazy. Deron is a better passer, can shoot from anywhere as well as drive pretty well. Right now Deron is better. I would take him over Rose in a trade. Rose may turn out better but at the worst with Deron you are getting 18-10. Rose may never reach that level.

 

Rose would certainly have more assists with a better cast (his scoring may go down) but 6 assists is still bad. Paul got 10.7 this year with crap around him except for West. Baron Davis also managed 8 assists with the Clippers. Heck even Devin Harris averaged 6.6.

[imb]

why is this even a debate? the only pg i wouldn't trade for rose straight up would be deron williams, and even then i'd have to think about it.

[Derwood]

Given 100 chances, I would not pick jaydee as someone who would get perma-banned

[RedFlash]

I love Deron Williams' game, and he is right now the 2nd best pg in the game, a healthy Chris Paul is first, but even then I wouldn't trade Rose for him. Not because of some homerism towards the Bulls, but because Deron needs good players around for him to work his magic, whereas Rose doesn't need help to work his magic.

[CubbieBum]

I love Deron Williams' game, and he is right now the 2nd best pg in the game, a healthy Chris Paul is first, but even then I wouldn't trade Rose for him. Not because of some homerism towards the Bulls, but because Deron needs good players around for him to work his magic, whereas Rose doesn't need help to work his magic.

 

1. Paul 2. Nash 3. Deron 4. Rondo 5. Kidd

 

I could see Curry rising into the top five next season, Collison is intriguing with his 19 pts 9 assists as a starter this year in replace of Paul, Rose has already been mentioned and Westbrook could develop further and join the conversation.

[SouthSideRyan]

but because Deron needs good players around for him to work his magic, whereas Rose doesn't need help to work his magic.

 

What are you basing this on? The Jazz were awful the year before Deron got there.

[SouthSideRyan]

I love Deron Williams' game, and he is right now the 2nd best pg in the game, a healthy Chris Paul is first, but even then I wouldn't trade Rose for him. Not because of some homerism towards the Bulls, but because Deron needs good players around for him to work his magic, whereas Rose doesn't need help to work his magic.

 

1. Paul 2. Nash 3. Deron 4. Rondo 5. Kidd

 

I could see Curry rising into the top five next season, Collison is intriguing with his 19 pts 9 assists as a starter this year in replace of Paul, Rose has already been mentioned and Westbrook could develop further and join the conversation.

 

So you took the assist leaderboard but gave Paul injury credit so you moved him ahead of Nash.

[Flames24Rulz]

I love Deron Williams' game, and he is right now the 2nd best pg in the game, a healthy Chris Paul is first, but even then I wouldn't trade Rose for him. Not because of some homerism towards the Bulls, but because Deron needs good players around for him to work his magic, whereas Rose doesn't need help to work his magic.

 

1. Paul 2. Nash 3. Deron 4. Rondo 5. Kidd

 

I could see Curry rising into the top five next season, Collison is intriguing with his 19 pts 9 assists as a starter this year in replace of Paul, Rose has already been mentioned and Westbrook could develop further and join the conversation.

 

Keep 'em coming. These are quite humorous.

 

I really wish Rose had teammates like KG, Pierce, or Allen to make his job a lot easier. I'd settle for Dirk and Caron Butler. Amare and J-Rich really aren't bad options either. How Rose isn't in your top five is absolutely ridiculous and diminishes your NBA credibility; not like it needs to take another hit.

[CubbieBum]

I love Deron Williams' game, and he is right now the 2nd best pg in the game, a healthy Chris Paul is first, but even then I wouldn't trade Rose for him. Not because of some homerism towards the Bulls, but because Deron needs good players around for him to work his magic, whereas Rose doesn't need help to work his magic.

 

1. Paul 2. Nash 3. Deron 4. Rondo 5. Kidd

 

I could see Curry rising into the top five next season, Collison is intriguing with his 19 pts 9 assists as a starter this year in replace of Paul, Rose has already been mentioned and Westbrook could develop further and join the conversation.

 

So you took the assist leaderboard but gave Paul injury credit so you moved him ahead of Nash.

 

No I did that list without looking anything up. The only reason I knew what Collison had done is that I looked it up the other day because I attended his breakout game as a starter and was curious just how well he had done the rest of the way. I don't know much about who was where on the assist list. I tend to look at that stuff in the offseason when I get bored and football hasn't started yet.

[Flames24Rulz]

 

Right now I would compare Rose to D-Wade. Rose is a good player who can raise his game to Wade's level but never is really a a true PG. He's a hybrid of PG and SG. LeBron is as much a PG as either of them to me. LeBron plays a very similar game to Magic now that I think of it.

What I am trying to say is Rose is by far the best athlete ever to play the point guard spot. His assists are down because he plays on a bad team with a bunch of lousy jump shooters. I'm a Deron Williams mark and were I running the Jazz I would trade Deron Williams and my top pick for Rose.

 

Considering where the Jazz could be picking, that's madness. You'd trade Deron Williams and a shot at Evan Turner/John Wall for Rose????

I'd have to see where the pick landed. If it's not one of those two, yes I would. This draft looks to be 2 deep to me.

 

That is still crazy. Deron is a better passer, can shoot from anywhere as well as drive pretty well. Right now Deron is better. I would take him over Rose in a trade. Rose may turn out better but at the worst with Deron you are getting 18-10. Rose may never reach that level.

 

Rose would certainly have more assists with a better cast (his scoring may go down) but 6 assists is still bad. Paul got 10.7 this year with crap around him except for West. Baron Davis also managed 8 assists with the Clippers. Heck even Devin Harris averaged 6.6.

 

I can't believe you're using assists to determine who's a good passer and who's not. If you've actually seen Rose play, you'd realize that he's a great passer. It doesn't help matters when you have teammates who constantly blow wide open jump shots to hinder your assist total.

[CubbieBum]

I love Deron Williams' game, and he is right now the 2nd best pg in the game, a healthy Chris Paul is first, but even then I wouldn't trade Rose for him. Not because of some homerism towards the Bulls, but because Deron needs good players around for him to work his magic, whereas Rose doesn't need help to work his magic.

 

1. Paul 2. Nash 3. Deron 4. Rondo 5. Kidd

 

I could see Curry rising into the top five next season, Collison is intriguing with his 19 pts 9 assists as a starter this year in replace of Paul, Rose has already been mentioned and Westbrook could develop further and join the conversation.

 

Keep 'em coming. These are quite humorous.

 

I really wish Rose had teammates like KG, Pierce, or Allen to make his job a lot easier. I'd settle for Dirk and Caron Butler. Amare and J-Rich really aren't bad options either. How Rose isn't in your top five is absolutely ridiculous and diminishes your NBA credibility; not like it needs to take another hit.

 

Rose isn't that close to the top 5. If you think he is then you must be going off reputation alone. As I posted in the other thread where Rose was discussed you can't blame everything on his supporting cast. Devin Harris averaged more assists this year. So did Paul who doesn't have much of a supporting cast (and Collison when he was a starter). Rose has the ability to be towards the top in assists but he isn't there yet. He's a good scorer but not that far above a a bunch of other PG's who averaged a good amount more in assists while still scoring 16+. Rose is in the 5-10 group but the top five, especially top 3 are pretty far above the rest in my opinion.

[CubbieBum]

 

That is still crazy. Deron is a better passer, can shoot from anywhere as well as drive pretty well. Right now Deron is better. I would take him over Rose in a trade. Rose may turn out better but at the worst with Deron you are getting 18-10. Rose may never reach that level.

 

Rose would certainly have more assists with a better cast (his scoring may go down) but 6 assists is still bad. Paul got 10.7 this year with crap around him except for West. Baron Davis also managed 8 assists with the Clippers. Heck even Devin Harris averaged 6.6.

 

I can't believe you're using assists to determine who's a good passer and who's not. If you've actually seen Rose play, you'd realize that he's a great passer. It doesn't help matters when you have teammates who constantly blow wide open jump shots to hinder your assist total.

 

And Devin Harris doesn't have the same problem? The Bulls are a playoff team, albeit a bad one, but the Nets were one of the worst teams ever. Are you really trying to argue Rose had a relatively low assist total solely because of his supporting cast when others on worse teams had higher assists totals?

[Flames24Rulz]

I love Deron Williams' game, and he is right now the 2nd best pg in the game, a healthy Chris Paul is first, but even then I wouldn't trade Rose for him. Not because of some homerism towards the Bulls, but because Deron needs good players around for him to work his magic, whereas Rose doesn't need help to work his magic.

 

1. Paul 2. Nash 3. Deron 4. Rondo 5. Kidd

 

I could see Curry rising into the top five next season, Collison is intriguing with his 19 pts 9 assists as a starter this year in replace of Paul, Rose has already been mentioned and Westbrook could develop further and join the conversation.

 

Keep 'em coming. These are quite humorous.

 

I really wish Rose had teammates like KG, Pierce, or Allen to make his job a lot easier. I'd settle for Dirk and Caron Butler. Amare and J-Rich really aren't bad options either. How Rose isn't in your top five is absolutely ridiculous and diminishes your NBA credibility; not like it needs to take another hit.

 

Rose isn't that close to the top 5. If you think he is then you must be going off reputation alone. As I posted in the other thread where Rose was discussed you can't blame everything on his supporting cast. Devin Harris averaged more assists this year. So did Paul who doesn't have much of a supporting cast (and Collison when he was a starter). Rose has the ability to be towards the top in assists but he isn't there yet. He's a good scorer but not that far above a a bunch of other PG's who averaged a good amount more in assists while still scoring 16+. Rose is in the 5-10 group but the top five, especially top 3 are pretty far above the rest in my opinion.

 

Why are you only using assists to determine who is a good point guard and who's not?

[Flames24Rulz]

 

That is still crazy. Deron is a better passer, can shoot from anywhere as well as drive pretty well. Right now Deron is better. I would take him over Rose in a trade. Rose may turn out better but at the worst with Deron you are getting 18-10. Rose may never reach that level.

 

Rose would certainly have more assists with a better cast (his scoring may go down) but 6 assists is still bad. Paul got 10.7 this year with crap around him except for West. Baron Davis also managed 8 assists with the Clippers. Heck even Devin Harris averaged 6.6.

 

I can't believe you're using assists to determine who's a good passer and who's not. If you've actually seen Rose play, you'd realize that he's a great passer. It doesn't help matters when you have teammates who constantly blow wide open jump shots to hinder your assist total.

 

And Devin Harris doesn't have the same problem? The Bulls are a playoff team, albeit a bad one, but the Nets were one of the worst teams ever. Are you really trying to argue Rose had a relatively low assist total solely because of his supporting cast when others on worse teams had higher assists totals?

 

Yes.

 

Rose had to average close to 20 shots down the stretch to get us into the playoffs. The assist numbers will rise when he gets support around him.

[SouthSideRyan]

but because Deron needs good players around for him to work his magic, whereas Rose doesn't need help to work his magic.

 

What are you basing this on? The Jazz were awful the year before Deron got there.

 

Nevermind, Kyle Korver and Kousta [expletive] Koufos are making the difference here.

[SouthSideRyan]

Rose isn't close to a top 5 point guard???

[CubbieBum]

 

That is still crazy. Deron is a better passer, can shoot from anywhere as well as drive pretty well. Right now Deron is better. I would take him over Rose in a trade. Rose may turn out better but at the worst with Deron you are getting 18-10. Rose may never reach that level.

 

Rose would certainly have more assists with a better cast (his scoring may go down) but 6 assists is still bad. Paul got 10.7 this year with crap around him except for West. Baron Davis also managed 8 assists with the Clippers. Heck even Devin Harris averaged 6.6.

 

I can't believe you're using assists to determine who's a good passer and who's not. If you've actually seen Rose play, you'd realize that he's a great passer. It doesn't help matters when you have teammates who constantly blow wide open jump shots to hinder your assist total.

 

And Devin Harris doesn't have the same problem? The Bulls are a playoff team, albeit a bad one, but the Nets were one of the worst teams ever. Are you really trying to argue Rose had a relatively low assist total solely because of his supporting cast when others on worse teams had higher assists totals?

 

Yes.

 

Rose had to average close to 20 shots down the stretch to get us into the playoffs. The assist numbers will rise when he gets support around him.

 

Well no [expletive] Sherlock. That does nothing to explain why he has lower assists than guys on much worse teams.

 

You can try to explain it by him having to shoot more down the stretch but if you looked it up (as I just did) you will find that isn't true. He indeed shot more at the end of the season with 18.8 attempts in April but take a wild guess at what month he averaged the most assists. April. In fact his two highest monthly averages where in the final two months of the season. He shot more than his season average in the last month and shot less than season average in the second to last month. Considering that he averaged the most assists in those two months it's pretty easy to see his assists, at least this season, weren't tied to how many shots he was taking.

[CubbieBum]

Rose isn't close to a top 5 point guard???

 

As I explained he is 6-10 in rank in my mind but the top 5 are quite a bit better than the rest so he isn't very close to being top 5.