Re: Bears Offseason Thread

[WrigleyField 22]

I like Pierre Thomas.

 

me, too. but not as a backup. he'd be great to split carries 50/50.

I think any of Thomas/Norwood/Washington could go ahead and split carries with Forte. I suggested all those guys with that in mind. If we're just looking for a strict backup and keeping Forte as a guy who get 80% or more of the carries, might as well just have Bell fill that role. But that would be stupid, so I hope we get a player that we can at least give Forte a 60/40 role with, if not 50/50 or even 40/60 if the player is good enough.

 

Edit- just some Matt Forte stats:

Only four times did he get more than 75 yards: Detroit (twice), St. Louis, Cleveland.

Only four TDs: Detroit (twice), St. Louis, Cleveland.

[mul21]

Does Forte's performance have more to do with those teams being bad and him taking advantage or the line not being able to block anybody but those crappy D lines? Honest question, I have no idea, but I don't think you can entirely blame him for his performance, whether the knee was a big factor or not. I think he has some responsibility because there were a few games I did see where he just didn't get through a hole that was there quick enough and turned an 8 yard gain into 2.

[jersey cubs fan]

Does Forte's performance have more to do with those teams being bad and him taking advantage or the line not being able to block anybody but those crappy D lines? Honest question, I have no idea, but I don't think you can entirely blame him for his performance, whether the knee was a big factor or not. I think he has some responsibility because there were a few games I did see where he just didn't get through a hole that was there quick enough and turned an 8 yard gain into 2.

 

Forte was an okay college back who was far from an elite prospect coming out, and he had a lot of wear getting a ton of carries on turf. Then in his rookie year he took more wear and tear than most RBs ever take, and he wasn't that good. He couldn't run the ball well in 2008 and he was worse in 2009. The line isn't any help, but he isn't any good.

[Soul]

Does Forte's performance have more to do with those teams being bad and him taking advantage or the line not being able to block anybody but those crappy D lines? Honest question, I have no idea, but I don't think you can entirely blame him for his performance, whether the knee was a big factor or not. I think he has some responsibility because there were a few games I did see where he just didn't get through a hole that was there quick enough and turned an 8 yard gain into 2.

 

Forte was an okay college back who was far from an elite prospect coming out, and he had a lot of wear getting a ton of carries on turf. Then in his rookie year he took more wear and tear than most RBs ever take, and he wasn't that good. He couldn't run the ball well in 2008 and he was worse in 2009. The line isn't any help, but he isn't any good.

 

Straight runner, little ability to move laterally quickly, and no burst. Not much power either. He can catch the ball though. But as a runner, it wouldn't be difficult or expensive at all to find a better one. I don't see why we'd need to sacrifice much to accomplish an upgrade.

[UMFan83]

I like Pierre Thomas.

 

me, too. but not as a backup. he'd be great to split carries 50/50.

I think any of Thomas/Norwood/Washington could go ahead and split carries with Forte. I suggested all those guys with that in mind. If we're just looking for a strict backup and keeping Forte as a guy who get 80% or more of the carries, might as well just have Bell fill that role. But that would be stupid, so I hope we get a player that we can at least give Forte a 60/40 role with, if not 50/50 or even 40/60 if the player is good enough.

 

Edit- just some Matt Forte stats:

Only four times did he get more than 75 yards: Detroit (twice), St. Louis, Cleveland.

Only four TDs: Detroit (twice), St. Louis, Cleveland.

 

I added more to this in the last game thread. Forte only had 3 runs over 16 yards all year, and all 3 were against Detroit.

[WrigleyField 22]

Does Forte's performance have more to do with those teams being bad and him taking advantage or the line not being able to block anybody but those crappy D lines? Honest question, I have no idea, but I don't think you can entirely blame him for his performance, whether the knee was a big factor or not. I think he has some responsibility because there were a few games I did see where he just didn't get through a hole that was there quick enough and turned an 8 yard gain into 2.

A better line would help, but a lot of it is still on Forte. Another good complimentary back would also help though. Forte definitely still has value as a pass catcher, which is nice because that doesn't limit you when looking for another back to split time with him. If that back isn't a pass catcher... no problem.

 

It's actually too bad that Benson probably needed a kick in the ass to get his stuff together, him and Forte would make a nice combo, even though it lacks some speed, they compliment each other from a runner vs pass catcher.

[DivineBovine]

I like Pierre Thomas.

 

me, too. but not as a backup. he'd be great to split carries 50/50.

I think any of Thomas/Norwood/Washington could go ahead and split carries with Forte. I suggested all those guys with that in mind. If we're just looking for a strict backup and keeping Forte as a guy who get 80% or more of the carries, might as well just have Bell fill that role. But that would be stupid, so I hope we get a player that we can at least give Forte a 60/40 role with, if not 50/50 or even 40/60 if the player is good enough.

 

Edit- just some Matt Forte stats:

Only four times did he get more than 75 yards: Detroit (twice), St. Louis, Cleveland.

Only four TDs: Detroit (twice), St. Louis, Cleveland.

 

I added more to this in the last game thread. Forte only had 3 runs over 16 yards all year, and all 3 were against Detroit.

 

 

Did I miss something? Where did this Pierre Thomas talk come from? He's the number 1 RB for the #1 seed in the NFC. Why is he being mentioned in a Bears thread? There's no way he's going to be a Bear.

[DivineBovine]

Oh, apparently something thinks Bates would be good because Cutler "likes" him.

 

http://www.chicagobreakingsports.com/2010/01/bates.html

 

I'm so sick of the media's talk about Cutler this, Cutler that, Cutler needs to get along with the OC.

 

How about this for a thought? How about getting someone who can DESIGN A DAMN PLAY? or CALL A DAMN PLAY? I could care less about whether Cutler "likes" a guy or not. If the offense is scoring points, I'm sure they will get along just fine.

 

USC wasn't very good this year. And this dude was a QB coach in Denver. How about a guy who can run an offense?

 

Like it or not, the Bears success in the next few years is going to live and die by Cutler's success or lack thereof. It behooves the Bears to build this offense around him, and what works for him. Bates called plays while Cutler was in Denver, so there's a familiarity there, and at least some experience there as well.

 

It's clear you're not a Cutler fan, and that's fine. But to pretend that taking some kind of hardline "you'll get along with whoever we pick, and you'll like it" stance with him is going to lead to anything positive is just fooling yourself. It's going to lead to more drama, and less wins.

 

 

Why would you say that? I actually give Cutler a lot more credit than all the media-types who seem to think he's a whiny, fragile-minded, high maintenance, little crybaby who can only work with certain offensive coordinators. I'm the one who gives him a little credit for being more professional than that. In the article, Michael Lombardi says Cutler "accepts what he says as coaching." What an absurd statement. As if he wouldn't listen to another offensive coordinator that he doesn't like?

 

They say that Ron Turner and Cutler had a cool relationship. I've never heard or seen Cutler act unprofessionally when it came to Turner. The problem they had was that Turner proved to be a fool when it came to running an offense. Not that Cutler didn't listen to the fool.

 

Of course Cutler should be a consideration in choosing an offensive coordinator, but not so he can approve of a guy who he "likes" and "accepts what he says as coaching". First and foremost, they need an offensive coordinator who can design an offense and run it. If they have a successful offense, Cutler will certainly "accept what he says as coaching".

[dew1679666265]

If this was posted and I didn't see it, I apologize.

 

Former Chicago Bears defensive backs coach Perry Fewell will interview for the team's defensive coordinator position on Monday, according to a source with knowledge of the situation.

Fewell, the Bears defensive backs coach in 2005, is interviewing today with the New York Giants for their defensive coordinator position.

[WrigleyField 22]

I like Pierre Thomas.

 

me, too. but not as a backup. he'd be great to split carries 50/50.

I think any of Thomas/Norwood/Washington could go ahead and split carries with Forte. I suggested all those guys with that in mind. If we're just looking for a strict backup and keeping Forte as a guy who get 80% or more of the carries, might as well just have Bell fill that role. But that would be stupid, so I hope we get a player that we can at least give Forte a 60/40 role with, if not 50/50 or even 40/60 if the player is good enough.

 

Edit- just some Matt Forte stats:

Only four times did he get more than 75 yards: Detroit (twice), St. Louis, Cleveland.

Only four TDs: Detroit (twice), St. Louis, Cleveland.

 

I added more to this in the last game thread. Forte only had 3 runs over 16 yards all year, and all 3 were against Detroit.

 

 

Did I miss something? Where did this Pierre Thomas talk come from? He's the number 1 RB for the #1 seed in the NFC. Why is he being mentioned in a Bears thread? There's no way he's going to be a Bear.

Well he is a free agent. And he is their best back, but hasn't gotten the carries like it. He splits pretty substantial time with two other backs in Bell and Bush. So if you could make a good sales pitch with enough money attached, you could always try luring him away. I've constantly mentioned Norwood or Washington as more likely scenarios though.

[RedFlash]

Did I miss something? Where did this Pierre Thomas talk come from? He's the number 1 RB for the #1 seed in the NFC. Why is he being mentioned in a Bears thread? There's no way he's going to be a Bear.

Well he is a free agent. And he is their best back, but hasn't gotten the carries like it. He splits pretty substantial time with two other backs in Bell and Bush. So if you could make a good sales pitch with enough money attached, you could always try luring him away. I've constantly mentioned Norwood or Washington as more likely scenarios though.

 

I doubt Thomas makes it to FA. I've heard that the Saints all more then likely to cut Bush and if that is the case, it is prolly because they want to re-sign Thomas.

[jersey cubs fan]

My new favorite stupid David Kaplan thing is his insistence on labelling certain losses this year solely on Cutler and insinuating the team could have or should have been a 10 or 11 win team without Cutler. It's incredibly stupid reasoning. First off, Chicago doesn't even compete with Minnesota in that one win without him, they might not have beaten Detroit the 2nd time without him, they wouldn't have been in the 2nd GB game without him (and that was a loss he pinned on Jay) and they probably lose to both Pittsburgh and Seattle without Cutler. There's no way you can assume the Bears would have been better this year with Orton. Kyle went to a much better offensive system (players and coaches) and played with a significantly better defense and won one more game in Denver than Jay did in Chicago. Orton had a nice season in Denver, but he would not have had that season with the Bears.

 

There's no doubt that Cutler played a significant roll in multiple losses, but you can't just take him off the team and assume 4 more wins.

[Soul]

Kaplan is so sure he's right about everything. Except that he isn't.

[Sammy Sofa]

I really didn't think anyone would replace Mariotti so soon in terms of a Chicago sports press figure being SO infuriatingly stupid and set in their stupidity, but hey, Kaplan actually pulled it off a while ago.

 

It never ceases to amuse me how he basically screams at anyone he's interviewing over the phone on CTL like they're using some archaic technology were he can't be heard otherwise. Everyone else on the show speaks normally and then you have this bald lump of skin bellowing like a spastic idiot.

[jersey cubs fan]

I find it odd that Kaplan claims to have been against just about every deal the Cubs/Blackhawks/Bears have made, and a lot of people accuse me of the same, and yet we have basically the opposite opinion, or at least very different ones on almost everybody he discusses. He was always against Cutler, I was ecstatic about getting him, he was always against Bradley, I was intrigued by the acquisition, he was ecstatic when they got rid of him, I was pissed they gave him away.

[Guest]

I find it odd that Kaplan claims to have been against just about every deal the Cubs/Blackhawks/Bears have made, and a lot of people accuse me of the same, and yet we have basically the opposite opinion, or at least very different ones on almost everybody he discusses. He was always against Cutler, I was ecstatic about getting him, he was always against Bradley, I was intrigued by the acquisition, he was ecstatic when they got rid of him, I was pissed they gave him away.

That's because everyone always over-generalizes things. ;)

[Magnetic Curses]

kaplan is a demagogue. he's the exact opposite of dan bernstein, whom i love.

[jersey cubs fan]

kaplan is a demagogue. he's the exact opposite of dan bernstein, whom i love.

 

I don't love that guy. I find myself taking his side in a lot of what he says though.

[DivineBovine]

Did I miss something? Where did this Pierre Thomas talk come from? He's the number 1 RB for the #1 seed in the NFC. Why is he being mentioned in a Bears thread? There's no way he's going to be a Bear.

Well he is a free agent. And he is their best back, but hasn't gotten the carries like it. He splits pretty substantial time with two other backs in Bell and Bush. So if you could make a good sales pitch with enough money attached, you could always try luring him away. I've constantly mentioned Norwood or Washington as more likely scenarios though.

 

 

 

 

It's a pipe dream. He's not going anywhere. He's gotten more carries as the year has gone on after starting the year as a part time back. He's the featured back in a potent offense. Bush is a third down type guy and Bell has been a guy they've given the ball to primarily on short yardage situations recently.

 

To think the Bears are going to dish out millions on him when they have Forte, and to think that Thomas would even think that the Bears with Forte are more appealing than the Saints with Bush and Bell is crazy. We might as well start talking about Albert Pujols signing with the Cubs because that's more likely.

[jersey cubs fan]

It's a pipe dream. He's not going anywhere. He's gotten more carries as the year has gone on after starting the year as a part time back. He's the featured back in a potent offense. Bush is a third down type guy and Bell has been a guy they've given the ball to primarily on short yardage situations recently.

 

To think the Bears are going to dish out millions on him when they have Forte, and to think that Thomas would even think that the Bears with Forte are more appealing than the Saints with Bush and Bell is crazy. We might as well start talking about Albert Pujols signing with the Cubs because that's more likely.

 

It's unlikely but your reasoning is ridiculous. He did not get more carries as the year has gone on, he got less. In 2008 he got more and more, in 2009 he got less and less. He is nothing like Pujols and the chances of the Bears getting him are much, much better. New Orleans has offensive skill position players all over the place, and multiple backs that can produce, and they have not come close to featuring Thomas.

 

The Bears have Forte, but they aren't exactly in love with the guy, and they aren't financially committed to him as the everydown back. He's got 2 years left on his deal and he makes peanuts. They have relatively little money dedicated to offensive skill positions, and have shown a willingness to spend on free agents, even if they avoid the biggest guys.

 

They could probably offer him a contract that could get it done.

[Tyrant]

To think the Bears are going to dish out millions on him when they have Forte, and to think that Thomas would even think that the Bears with Forte are more appealing than the Saints with Bush and Bell is crazy. We might as well start talking about Albert Pujols signing with the Cubs because that's more likely.

 

I think Forte might end up being the Bears version of Ryan Theriot. A guy that they way overvalue and think is good, so they don't want to go out and find a better option even though there are available ones.

[Soul]

To think the Bears are going to dish out millions on him when they have Forte, and to think that Thomas would even think that the Bears with Forte are more appealing than the Saints with Bush and Bell is crazy. We might as well start talking about Albert Pujols signing with the Cubs because that's more likely.

 

I think Forte might end up being the Bears version of Ryan Theriot. A guy that they way overvalue and think is good, so they don't want to go out and find a better option even though there are available ones.

 

I think this season has put plenty of doubts in the coaches minds about Forte. Maybe not enough for them to want to boot him, but I don't think he'll be skating by with no one noticing his low ypc or his lack of overall speed.

[rawaction]

Wow, last year at this time people (Bears fans on THIS board included) were arguing that Forte was up there with Peterson as the best RBs in the NFC because of his ability to catch the ball and stay on the field on 3rd down. Now, he isn't fit to get more than 50% of the carries with another RB on the team.

 

Is he seriously being knocked down in status because of the line he played behind most of the year? I don't think you people truly understand how bad this line is/was. Especially Orlando Pace. In the last 5 games, WITHOUT Pace in the lineup, Forte ran the ball 93 times for 386 yards. That's not great by any means, but that is 4.15 yards per carry....1/2 yard more than his overall ypc and 3/4 yard more than he was getting with Pace in there. And yes, he played Detroit and St Louis in that stretch, but also faced GB, Min, and Baltimore and had decent games for 2009 Bears standards.

 

Matt Forte is a fine NFL runningback. Replace Omiyale and Kreutz and he will have decent numbers next year. Now, I will wholeheartedly agree that the Bears need someone to help him with carries, but I won't go as far as some have suggested and say the Bears need to spend an early pick on a RB, need to sign a veteran FA, or lose 60% of his carries to Pierre Thomas.

[jersey cubs fan]

Matt Forte is a fine NFL runningback. Replace Omiyale and Kreutz and he will have decent numbers next year. Now, I will wholeheartedly agree that the Bears need someone to help him with carries, but I won't go as far as some have suggested and say the Bears need to spend an early pick on a RB, need to sign a veteran FA, or lose 60% of his carries to Pierre Thomas.

 

Forte isn't good. He's barely adequate. I overrated him last year probably based on the fact that he was a good fantasy RB, but he wasn't a good RB. No team should have one primary back unless that guy is great, and Forte doesn't run the ball well enough to deserve the role he has. The line plays a part, but Forte should have never been a 300 rushes guy, and he shouldn't be a 250 guy either. There's no reason why he and a guy like Thomas can't split with 150 each.

 

Forte has no burst speed or moves. The Bears have no quality RB depth. I can't imagine why somebody would have a problem taking carries away from him or trying to get better depth at a position they suck at and get very little from. Money is not an issue as Forte is signed for nothing for 2 more years.

[Tyrant]

Is he seriously being knocked down in status because of the line he played behind most of the year?

 

No, he's being knocked down because he isn't fast or elusive. Those are kind of important traits for a running back.

 

He's a fine 3rd down running back. Maybe 10-12 touches a game. That's about all.