Harden 4th starter in NLDS???

[UMFan83]

Given the uncertain state of the Cubs' rotation, it appears that Carlos Zambrano, Ryan Dempster and Ted Lilly will be the starters for the National League Division Series.

 

Manager Lou Piniella and pitching coach Larry Rothschild spent Sunday morning going over the possibilities and came up with a schedule for the rest of the season. It has Lilly, Rich Harden and Jason Marquis pitching the final three games in Milwaukee.

 

http://www.chicagotribune.com/sports/chi-080907-chicago-cubs-playoffs-rotation,0,7594541.story

 

Umm didn't we get Harden for the playoffs??

[cbbryan]

Given the uncertain state of the Cubs' rotation, it appears that Carlos Zambrano, Ryan Dempster and Ted Lilly will be the starters for the National League Division Series.

 

Manager Lou Piniella and pitching coach Larry Rothschild spent Sunday morning going over the possibilities and came up with a schedule for the rest of the season. It has Lilly, Rich Harden and Jason Marquis pitching the final three games in Milwaukee.

 

http://www.chicagotribune.com/sports/chi-080907-chicago-cubs-playoffs-rotation,0,7594541.story

 

Umm didn't we get Harden for the playoffs??

 

I'd be shocked if Harden didn't pitch in the NLDS.

[SouthSideRyan]

I think that's Van Dyck's speculation because of the order of the rotation for the regular season. Harden can start the 2nd to last game of the year and still pitch in game 3.

[UMFan83]

I think that's Van Dyck's speculation because of the order of the rotation for the regular season. Harden can start the 2nd to last game of the year and still pitch in game 3.

 

That's true, I'm a moron. If the Cubs haven't clinched a playoff spot by the second to last game of the season, we have more problems than where Rich Hill is starting in the NLDS.

[bhogg]

This is the kind of crap that pisses me off. I don't like to get into second guessing managers, but for Christ's sake, it takes complete boob to watch harden pitch and not see that he's the best we have. To have him pitch 4th is an insult to the young man's talent and that's not taking anything away from Lilly --- Lilly is good. He'll make a fine 4th starter.

 

 

Also, why are they trying to plan out the last week of the season? Seems like the playoffs will be in the bag at that time and hopefully the divsion will be decided before that last series. If so, I don't care if Ronnie Woo Woo gets the start.

[17 Seconds]

I think that writer might just be jumping to conclusions. I don't see any quotes of Lou saying what the postseason rotation would be, just quotes of his plans for the rest of the regular season. That doesn't mean they have to stick with that order into the playoffs.

 

Even if that guy is right that the top 3 starters would be Zambrano/Dempster/Lilly, that doesn't mean Harden wouldn't get a start. Because of the layout of the DS, the only way your number 2 starter gets 2 starts is if your number 1 starter pitches game 4 on short rest, and I don't think he'll want to do that with Zambrano.

 

Still, it would be kind of stupid to not have Harden pitch towards the beginning of the series. What if it's a sweep? Then he doesn't even get a start.

[17 Seconds]

I think that's Van Dyck's speculation because of the order of the rotation for the regular season. Harden can start the 2nd to last game of the year and still pitch in game 3.

 

Or even game 2.

[sneakypower]

it'd be nice to have 1 sacrificial "overreact to something stupid a beat writer printed" thread so we could confine all madness to a singular place i'd learn to avoid

[TruffleShuffle]

I think that's Van Dyck's speculation because of the order of the rotation for the regular season. Harden can start the 2nd to last game of the year and still pitch in game 3.

 

That's true, I'm a moron. If the Cubs haven't clinched a playoff spot by the second to last game of the season, we have more problems than where Rich Hill is starting in the NLDS.

 

actually if he's starting in the NLDS, that's probably our biggest problem.

[Little Slide Rooter]

Does anyone think that if weve clinched by that time, that Rich Harden will be pitching in the Milwaukee series?

 

And of we havnt clinched by then, wouldnt we want Harden to pitch in that series?

 

And if Z, Demp, and Lilly all pitch an the NLDS first 3 games, and we win all 3 games, and Hardens spot doesnt come up, will it matter?

Edited September 8, 2008 by Little Slide Rooter

[Schwarber Fan]

Does anyone think that if weve clinched by that time, that Rich Harden will be pitching in the Milwaukee series?

 

No, but if we haven't, Marquis and Lilly against Milwaukee scares me

[rynefan]

Without seeing the entire article, on what is he basing this prediction?

[JeffH]

Mr. Miles is reporting the same potential, if unlikely to be needed, NLDS rotation.

 

The reason that Harden is not mentioned may very well be that his arm is cooked and he's done for the season.

[soapy]

Without seeing the entire article, on what is he basing this prediction?

The rotations is "set" (pending health) for the next week. It seems to me the local writers are simply taking that and speculating what the rotation will be for the rest of the year (assuming all games mean something) and how that would play out in the playoffs.

 

I think if the last series turns out to be meaningless things could/will change.

[soapy]

because i don't want to work, this is how it plays out if there are no changes:

 

9/9 @ STL: Dempster

9/10 @ STL: Lilly

9/11 @ STL: Harden

9/12 @ HOU: Marquis

9/13 @ HOU: Zambrano

9/14 @ HOU: Dempster

9/16 v. MIL: Lilly

9/17 v. MIL: Harden

9/18 v. MIL: Marquis

9/19 v. STL: Zambrano

9/20 v. STL: Dempster

9/21 v. STL: Lilly

9/22 @ NYM: Harden

9/23 @ NYM: Marquis

9/24 @ MYM: Zambrano

9/25 @ NYM: Dempster

9/26 @ MIL: Lilly

9/27 @ MIL: Harden

9/28 @ MIL: Marquis

 

I have to believe if the Cubs have the division won before the 9/27 game, Harden gets held back for the playoffs and starts game 2 or 3.

[SouthSideRyan]

If this is true, then it's tough guy Lou getting all pouty about a pitcher needing rest. I'm giving him the benefit of the doubt for now.

[Little Slide Rooter]

Mr. Miles is reporting the same potential, if unlikely to be needed, NLDS rotation.

 

The reason that Harden is not mentioned may very well be that his arm is cooked and he's done for the season.

 

If that were the case, why would Lou have Harden in the rotation the rest of the way?

[rynefan]

I'm starting to get this feeling that something more is going on with Harden, they just don't know for sure what it is at this point.

[JeffH]

Mr. Miles is reporting the same potential, if unlikely to be needed, NLDS rotation.

 

The reason that Harden is not mentioned may very well be that his arm is cooked and he's done for the season.

 

If that were the case, why would Lou have Harden in the rotation the rest of the way?

 

You might want to hold off on that argument until Harden, you know, pitches again.

[Little Slide Rooter]

Mr. Miles is reporting the same potential, if unlikely to be needed, NLDS rotation.

 

The reason that Harden is not mentioned may very well be that his arm is cooked and he's done for the season.

 

If that were the case, why would Lou have Harden in the rotation the rest of the way?

 

You might want to hold off on that argument until Harden, you know, pitches again.

 

And you might want to hold on to that arguement until Harden, you know, doesnt pitch. As far as Ive heard, there are no indications that Harden wont pitch wednesday or thursday. If he doesnt pitch either of those games, then theres something wrong, and all the were just keeping him rested talk becomes bull pocky.

 

At any rate, this season is going from Beautiful, to scary, to downright weird.

[biittner77]

because i don't want to work, this is how it plays out if there are no changes:

 

9/9 @ STL: Dempster

9/10 @ STL: Lilly

9/11 @ STL: Harden

9/12 @ HOU: Marquis

9/13 @ HOU: Zambrano

9/14 @ HOU: Dempster

9/16 v. MIL: Lilly

9/17 v. MIL: Harden

9/18 v. MIL: Marquis

9/19 v. STL: Zambrano

9/20 v. STL: Dempster

9/21 v. STL: Lilly

9/22 @ NYM: Harden

9/23 @ NYM: Marquis

9/24 @ MYM: Zambrano

9/25 @ NYM: Dempster

9/26 @ MIL: Lilly

9/27 @ MIL: Harden

9/28 @ MIL: Marquis

 

I have to believe if the Cubs have the division won before the 9/27 game, Harden gets held back for the playoffs and starts game 2 or 3.

 

I think, at the very least, another spot start for Marshall against Houston so they can throw Dempster, Lilly and Harden against Mil. is pretty smart and hopefully likely. 9/13 and then Zambrano on 9/14 makes sense in a lot of ways.

[Soul]

Mr. Miles is reporting the same potential, if unlikely to be needed, NLDS rotation.

 

The reason that Harden is not mentioned may very well be that his arm is cooked and he's done for the season.

 

If that were the case, why would Lou have Harden in the rotation the rest of the way?

 

You might want to hold off on that argument until Harden, you know, pitches again.

 

And you might want to hold on to that arguement until Harden, you know, doesnt pitch. As far as Ive heard, there are no indications that Harden wont pitch wednesday or thursday. If he doesnt pitch either of those games, then theres something wrong, and all the were just keeping him rested talk becomes bull pocky.

 

At any rate, this season is going from Beautiful, to scary, to downright weird.

 

Let's just wait to see what happens.

[BigbadB]

Lou won't even plan his playoff rotation until the Cubs have actually locked up a playoff spot.

[Little Slide Rooter]

Mr. Miles is reporting the same potential, if unlikely to be needed, NLDS rotation.

 

The reason that Harden is not mentioned may very well be that his arm is cooked and he's done for the season.

 

If that were the case, why would Lou have Harden in the rotation the rest of the way?

 

You might want to hold off on that argument until Harden, you know, pitches again.

 

And you might want to hold on to that arguement until Harden, you know, doesnt pitch. As far as Ive heard, there are no indications that Harden wont pitch wednesday or thursday. If he doesnt pitch either of those games, then theres something wrong, and all the were just keeping him rested talk becomes bull pocky.

 

At any rate, this season is going from Beautiful, to scary, to downright weird.

 

Let's just wait to see what happens.

 

Thats essentially what I was trying to say. If Thursday rolls around however, and no Harden, then there could be trouble, but so far, there have been no indications that he wont take his scheduled start in St. Louis.

[Jehrico]

Mr. Miles is reporting the same potential, if unlikely to be needed, NLDS rotation.

 

The reason that Harden is not mentioned may very well be that his arm is cooked and he's done for the season.

I don't think so. If that were the case, they wouldn't be publicizing potential rotations that has him pitching again during the regular season. If he was cooked, then they'd be tipping their hand by having him scheduled the first time he didn't pitch as announced. If he was cooked and they were trying to hide it, they'd be better off just saying they're saving him for the playoffs, and they may or may not give him a spot start or two to keep him sharp, then let the opponent see when he's not on the roster on game 1 of the NLDS.