Baseball History Thread

[Guest]

Got this from another website. Freaking Albert Pujols...amazing. Cool that Vlad is in the top 20 as well.

 

 

MLB Players by OPS+ to age of 25:

 

  Cnt Player            OPS+   BA   OBP   SLG    PA  From  To
+----+-----------------+----+-----+-----+-----+-----+----+----+
   1 Ty Cobb            180  .366  .414  .513  4343 1905 1912 
   2 Joe Jackson        177  .365  .434  .527  3086 1908 1915 
   3 Mickey Mantle      174  .316  .427  .574  4116 1951 1957 
   4 Jimmie Foxx        171  .339  .435  .638  3938 1925 1933 
   5 Albert Pujols      167  .332  .416  .621  3428 2001 2005 
   6 Tris Speaker       166  .340  .412  .492  3231 1907 1913 
   7 Rogers Hornsby     165  .337  .398  .499  3577 1915 1921 
   8 Joe DiMaggio       156  .343  .402  .623  3116 1936 1940 
   9 Eddie Mathews      155  .281  .388  .556  3808 1952 1957 
  10 Mel Ott            153  .316  .412  .554  4645 1926 1934 
  11 Hank Aaron         151  .323  .372  .559  3866 1954 1959 
  12 Mike Tiernan       150  .303  .386  .464  3283 1887 1892 
  13 Joe Medwick        149  .342  .374  .564  3405 1932 1937 
  14 Ken Griffey        147  .302  .379  .536  3920 1989 1995 
  15 Arky Vaughan       147  .334  .424  .491  3712 1932 1937 
  16 Frank Robinson     146  .302  .384  .561  3792 1956 1961 
  17 Joe Kelley         146  .346  .441  .511  3344 1891 1897 
  18 Sherry Magee       145  .296  .367  .431  4091 1904 1910 
  19 Vladimir Guerrero  144  .319  .378  .587  3044 1996 2001 
  20 Alex Rodriguez     141  .311  .378  .571  4247 1994 2001 
  21 Sam Crawford       141  .303  .352  .449  3575 1899 1905 
  22 Miguel Cabrera     140  .309  .381  .541  3756 2003 2008 
  23 Orlando Cepeda     140  .310  .352  .537  3847 1958 1963 
  24 David Wright       139  .309  .389  .533  3047 2004 2008 
  25 Eddie Murray       136  .291  .354  .493  3148 1977 1981 
  26 Ross Youngs        136  .326  .399  .442  3028 1917 1922 
  27 Goose Goslin       134  .330  .393  .503  3107 1921 1926 
  28 Larry Doyle        134  .303  .371  .433  3235 1907 1912 
  29 Barry Bonds        133  .265  .358  .479  3009 1986 1990 
  30 Hal Trosky         133  .314  .372  .559  3379 1933 1938 
  31 Cesar Cedeno       132  .294  .351  .468  4126 1970 1976 
  32 Joe Torre          132  .300  .361  .478  3101 1960 1966 
  33 Rickey Henderson   131  .291  .400  .408  3488 1979 1984 
  34 Del Ennis          131  .298  .355  .501  3133 1946 1950 
  35 Greg Luzinski      130  .290  .358  .477  3054 1970 1976 

OPS+ as a measurement will greatly benefit the older players because the talent pyramid was much steeper back then. The best players from that era were vastly better than their peers. Alternatively, the scrubs today are much better than the scrubs of those eras. Thus, the ERA+ of those guys was much better than the ones for players today.

 

Except Albert, of course.

[OleMissCub]

The only way we'd see something like that happen now would be if Dusty were managing both teams.

 

I have to admit that might be the first of your jokes that actually made me "lol"

[erik316wttn]

Check out this pitching duel. This is something you will NEVER see again.

 

http://www.baseball-almanac.com/box-scores/boxscore.php?boxid=196307020SFN

 

July 2nd, 1963. Braves v. Giants

 

Spahn: 15.1 IP, 9 Hits, 1 ER, 2 K

 

Marichal: 16.0 IP, 8 Hits, 0 ER, 10 K

 

I seem to remember Pat Hughes telling a story this past season about Warren Spahn. They had a nice conversation, and Pat was bringing this game up. Before Pat was even finished with his sentence, Spahn said "I hung a screwball." Pat marveled on how that stayed with him all those years.

 

Also, It's kind of surprising that Spahn only struck out 2 guys in 15+ innings of work. His defense must have been extremely tired after that game.

[OleMissCub]

factoid: Frank Chance is the Cubs all-time stolen base leader with exactly 400.

 

never would have thought that. I bet the Cubs are the only team whose all time SB leader was a first baseman.

[ELCABALLO45]

Just wanted to say this thread kick ass.

[Soul]

Got this from another website. Freaking Albert Pujols...amazing. Cool that Vlad is in the top 20 as well.

 

 

MLB Players by OPS+ to age of 25:

 

  Cnt Player            OPS+   BA   OBP   SLG    PA  From  To
+----+-----------------+----+-----+-----+-----+-----+----+----+
   1 Ty Cobb            180  .366  .414  .513  4343 1905 1912 
   2 Joe Jackson        177  .365  .434  .527  3086 1908 1915 
   3 Mickey Mantle      174  .316  .427  .574  4116 1951 1957 
   4 Jimmie Foxx        171  .339  .435  .638  3938 1925 1933 
   5 Albert Pujols      167  .332  .416  .621  3428 2001 2005 
   6 Tris Speaker       166  .340  .412  .492  3231 1907 1913 
   7 Rogers Hornsby     165  .337  .398  .499  3577 1915 1921 
   8 Joe DiMaggio       156  .343  .402  .623  3116 1936 1940 
   9 Eddie Mathews      155  .281  .388  .556  3808 1952 1957 
  10 Mel Ott            153  .316  .412  .554  4645 1926 1934 
  11 Hank Aaron         151  .323  .372  .559  3866 1954 1959 
  12 Mike Tiernan       150  .303  .386  .464  3283 1887 1892 
  13 Joe Medwick        149  .342  .374  .564  3405 1932 1937 
  14 Ken Griffey        147  .302  .379  .536  3920 1989 1995 
  15 Arky Vaughan       147  .334  .424  .491  3712 1932 1937 
  16 Frank Robinson     146  .302  .384  .561  3792 1956 1961 
  17 Joe Kelley         146  .346  .441  .511  3344 1891 1897 
  18 Sherry Magee       145  .296  .367  .431  4091 1904 1910 
  19 Vladimir Guerrero  144  .319  .378  .587  3044 1996 2001 
  20 Alex Rodriguez     141  .311  .378  .571  4247 1994 2001 
  21 Sam Crawford       141  .303  .352  .449  3575 1899 1905 
  22 Miguel Cabrera     140  .309  .381  .541  3756 2003 2008 
  23 Orlando Cepeda     140  .310  .352  .537  3847 1958 1963 
  24 David Wright       139  .309  .389  .533  3047 2004 2008 
  25 Eddie Murray       136  .291  .354  .493  3148 1977 1981 
  26 Ross Youngs        136  .326  .399  .442  3028 1917 1922 
  27 Goose Goslin       134  .330  .393  .503  3107 1921 1926 
  28 Larry Doyle        134  .303  .371  .433  3235 1907 1912 
  29 Barry Bonds        133  .265  .358  .479  3009 1986 1990 
  30 Hal Trosky         133  .314  .372  .559  3379 1933 1938 
  31 Cesar Cedeno       132  .294  .351  .468  4126 1970 1976 
  32 Joe Torre          132  .300  .361  .478  3101 1960 1966 
  33 Rickey Henderson   131  .291  .400  .408  3488 1979 1984 
  34 Del Ennis          131  .298  .355  .501  3133 1946 1950 
  35 Greg Luzinski      130  .290  .358  .477  3054 1970 1976 

OPS+ as a measurement will greatly benefit the older players because the talent pyramid was much steeper back then. The best players from that era were vastly better than their peers. Alternatively, the scrubs today are much better than the scrubs of those eras. Thus, the ERA+ of those guys was much better than the ones for players today.

 

Except Albert, of course.

I agree. Tends to underscore how special Pujols has been.

[OleMissCub]

interesting set of pics of President Harding with the Cubs from sometime in the early 20's:

 

http://i255.photobucket.com/albums/hh153/OleMissCub17/PresWarrenGHardingChiCubs1921-231.jpg

 

http://i255.photobucket.com/albums/hh153/OleMissCub17/PresWarrenGHardingChiCubs1921-232.jpg

 

http://i255.photobucket.com/albums/hh153/OleMissCub17/PresWarrenGHardingChiCubs1921-233.jpg

 

http://i255.photobucket.com/albums/hh153/OleMissCub17/PresWarrenGHardingChiCubs1921-234.jpg

 

[OleMissCub]

This is a very nice one:

 

1906 Chicago Cubs, 116-36, .763, 20 games ahead, (WS L 4-2 to White Sox)

 

 

http://i255.photobucket.com/albums/hh153/OleMissCub17/1906ChicagoCubsTeamlg.jpg

[OleMissCub]

Some nice shots of Ruth:

 

http://i255.photobucket.com/albums/hh153/OleMissCub17/babe3.jpg

 

 

With Rogers Hornsby (I'd like to take this opportunity to remind people that in 1924 Hornsby went .424/.507/.696, 222 OPS+, 25 HR, 43 2B, 14 3B, 94 RBI, 121 Runs in 143 games and DID NOT win the MVP.):

 

http://i255.photobucket.com/albums/hh153/OleMissCub17/BabeRuthalongsideRogersHornsby.jpg

 

http://i255.photobucket.com/albums/hh153/OleMissCub17/ruthhornsbyphoto.jpg

 

 

Excellent "Roaring 20's" photo:

 

http://i255.photobucket.com/albums/hh153/OleMissCub17/TheBabeinLAforBabeComesHomesm.jpg

[OleMissCub]

Another Babe one, this one after knocking himself out on July 5th, 1924 after chasing a ball into foul territory and hitting his head on a concrete abatement. Note the amount of black fans in the photograph. The right field line was the "Colored Section" in Griffith Stadium (in D.C.) back then.

 

http://i255.photobucket.com/albums/hh153/OleMissCub17/1-BR.jpg

[OleMissCub]

Article from when Babe was in the minors:

 

http://img8.imageshack.us/img8/5207/babe1914.jpg

 

Robbing a homer from Cobb:

 

http://img23.imageshack.us/img23/1429/ruthcobb.jpg

[ELCABALLO45]

Article from when Babe was in the minors:

 

http://img8.imageshack.us/img8/5207/babe1914.jpg

 

 

That's unreal.

[OleMissCub]

http://i255.photobucket.com/albums/hh153/OleMissCub17/cobbyank.jpg

 

 

This was a year before the Yanks got Ruth. Imagine a team with your 2-4 hitters being Cobb, Ruth, and then Gehrig. That'd be pretty horrifying for an opposing pitcher.

[VladiRad]

The images of the stars when they were in the minor leagues don't work. They're on page 20. I'm interested in seeing those pictures, especially the Ty Cobb one.

[OleMissCub]

The images of the stars when they were in the minor leagues don't work. They're on page 20. I'm interested in seeing those pictures, especially the Ty Cobb one.

 

It's fixed bud.

[OleMissCub]

Nice high quality image of what is probably the most famous photograph ever taken in baseball history. It was taken on July 23rd, 1910 during a game between the Tigers and Highlanders (now Yankees) in New York. The baserunner is Ty Cobb (23 at the time) and the third baseman is Jimmy Austin (29). Some insight from the photographer:

 

The strange thing about that picture was that I did not know that I had snapped it. I was off third, chatting with Jimmy Austin, third baseman for the New York club. Cobb was on second, with one out, and the hitter was trying to bunt him to third. Austin moved in for the sacrifice. As Jimmy stood there, Cobb started. The fans shouted. Jimmy turned, backed into the base, and was greeted by a storm of dirt, spikes, shoes, uniforms—and Ty Cobb. My first thought was that my friend, Austin, had been injured. When Cobb stole, he stole. Spikes flew and he did not worry where. I saw Ty's clenched teeth, his determined look. The catcher's peg went right by Jimmy, as he was thrown on his face.

 

But in a moment I realized he wasn't hurt, and I was relieved because Jimmy and I were very close friends. Then I began to wonder if by any chance I had snapped the play. I couldn't remember that I had, but I decided to play [it] safe and change plates anyway. I went home kicking myself. I said, "Now there was a great picture and you missed it." I took out my plates and developed them. There was Cobb stealing third. In my excitement, I had snapped it, by instinct.

 

Also, at about 6:20 in

you can hear an 80-something year old Austin talking about the photograph. Pretty neat.

 

 

http://i255.photobucket.com/albums/hh153/OleMissCub17/cobbaustin.jpg

[Roast]

That's awesome

[OleMissCub]

Frank Thomas used to be BAD TO THE BONE:

 

7 straight .300/.400/.500 BA/OB%/Slg

7 Straight 100 Run/Walk/RBI

7 Straight 170 OPS+ playing at least 140 games (or pro-rated to 140/162)

5 straight .600 slugging

4 Straight .600 slugging/.450 OB%

 

Did the emergence of the steroid era in the late 90's serve to overshadow Frank's early to mid 90's greatness in the minds of the common fan? I think so.

[manbearcub]

When did MLB quit using the "pillow" bases?

[OleMissCub]

When did MLB quit using the "pillow" bases?

 

Sometime in the mid 60's.

[OleMissCub]

Walter Johnson's 1913 season (age 25) was just looney tunes:

 

36-7, 1.14 ERA, 0.780 WHIP, 29 complete games, 11 shutouts, 259 ERA+, 346 IP, 243 K

 

He had 13 more wins and 77 more K's than the next player down on the league leaderboard.

[NCCubFan]

Walter Johnson's 1913 season (age 25) was just looney tunes:

 

36-7, 1.14 ERA, 0.780 WHIP, 29 complete games, 11 shutouts, 259 ERA+, 346 IP, 243 K

 

He had 13 more wins and 77 more K's than the next player down on the league leaderboard.

Had to have been roids. Nobody's that much better than the entire rest of the league. :D

[Guest]

Walter Johnson's 1913 season (age 25) was just looney tunes:

 

36-7, 1.14 ERA, 0.780 WHIP, 29 complete games, 11 shutouts, 259 ERA+, 346 IP, 243 K

 

He had 13 more wins and 77 more K's than the next player down on the league leaderboard.

 

That seems like an awfully low number of complete games for that era.

[NCCubFan]

Walter Johnson's 1913 season (age 25) was just looney tunes:

 

36-7, 1.14 ERA, 0.780 WHIP, 29 complete games, 11 shutouts, 259 ERA+, 346 IP, 243 K

 

He had 13 more wins and 77 more K's than the next player down on the league leaderboard.

 

That seems like an awfully low number of complete games for that era.

Actually he only started 36 games that year; he also appeared in 12 games as a reliever (finishing 11 of them). Back then it was common for starting pitchers to also pitch in relief between starts.

[OleMissCub]

Couple of pics I found from the 1910 season when the Chalmers Auto Corporation (now Chrysler) decided to give one of their new auto's to the person with the highest batting average that year. The race came down to the last day with Lajoie hitting .384 and Cobb at .383, but they decided to give cars to both Nap and Ty because Cobb was apparently so disliked that on the final day St. Louis pretty much intentionally gave Nap five basehits against them just so he'd win.

 

 

http://i255.photobucket.com/albums/hh153/OleMissCub17/napcar.jpg

 

 

http://i255.photobucket.com/albums/hh153/OleMissCub17/tycar.jpg