Brewers are the new Reds

[Post Count Padder]

Another reliever:

 

Luis Vizcaino-R-Yankees Dec. 14 - 1:57 pm et

 

The Brewers and Luis Vizcaino have reportedly agreed to terms on a two-year, $7 million contract.

 

So much for Ken Rosenthal's report that he was deciding between the Rockies and Pirates. This is probably about as good of a bullpen bargain as a team is going to get this winter, though it does leave the Brewers with a ridiculous six relievers making at least $3 million (Eric Gagne, David Riske, Derrick Turnbow, Guillermo Mora and Salomon Torres). Lefty specialist Brian Shouse figures to get the other spot, so pitchers like Claudio Vargas, Carlos Villanueva and Manny Parra won't be on the team if they fail to claim rotation spots.

Source: The Journal News

[C.C.]

Man, the Brewers have spent a ton on their 'pen. You'd think they'd learn from us.

[Rob]

Man, the Brewers have spent a ton on their 'pen. You'd think they'd learn from us.

 

The difference is that they've got most of their team filled out with cheap, homegrown guys... Fielder, Weeks, Hardy, Braun, and Hart are all making league-minimum, IIRC.

 

Not that spending money on the bullpen is a great investment, but they can afford to blow a bit of their cash on it since they aren't paying like we are for position players. Lee, Ramirez, Soriano, and Fukudome, Z, and Lilly alone is gonna cost us more than their entire team, most likely.

[pitchcs]

Are these guys even better than Parra, Vargas and Villanueva? Not much, if any.

[JeffH]

Riske is the only move that's really, really dumb. None of the others are long term commitments.

 

If they're out of contention in July (let's hope), they'll probably be able to move a few of those other guys for some C+/B- prospects.

[nilodnayr]

Are these guys even better than Parra, Vargas and Villanueva? Not much, if any.

 

 

Possibly they are freeing themselves up to make a major move and trade some of their SP depth.

[Ender]

Looks like it was really the Rockies that signed him not the Brewers.

 

With any luck Villanueva will be in the rotation full time as he has sub 4.00 ERA potential there so is wasted in the bullpen.

 

Vargas is kind of mediocre but maybe he could be effective in the bullpen, dunno.

[Soul]

Who will be the closer for them then?

 

Surely not Gagne. This isn't the same roided up monster, he's back to where he was before he was pumping juice. And that wasn't all that great.

[XZero771679666304]

Who will be the closer for them then?

 

Surely not Gagne. This isn't the same roided up monster, he's back to where he was before he was pumping juice. And that wasn't all that great.

 

 

Oh, I am pretty sure Gagne is penciled in as the closer. We'll see how that turns out.

[Ding Dong Johnson]

wait, so who are the Reds now?

[Post Count Padder]

Apparantly, nevermind:

 

Luis Vizcaino-R-Yankees Dec. 14 - 3:03 pm et

 

The Journal News has changed its report and no longer says the Brewers and Luis Vizcaino have agreed to a two-year, $7 million contract.

 

That's what we get for trusting a beat reporter who covers another team. Peter Abraham says two years, $7 million is still the right amount, but he's signing with another NL team, "likely Colorado." He probably picked that up from WFAN, which is saying a deal with the Rockies is in place.

Source: The Journal News

[rawaction]

I wonder what the average NL Central reliever's salary is. Between Howry, Dempster, Wood, Eyre, Gagne, Riske, the Reds guys, Isringhausen, Lidge...it's gotta be up with any division in the game.

[Butterscup1679666578]

I wonder what the average NL Central reliever's salary is. Between Howry, Dempster, Wood, Eyre, Gagne, Riske, the Reds guys, Isringhausen, Lidge...it's gotta be up with any division in the game.

 

Lidge isn't on the Astros anymore, but yeah, the number of overpaid relievers in this division is ridiculous

[Ender]

Gagne had an xERA in the high 3's last year and a FIP in the mid 3's. I would expect him to improve with slightly better health. He won't be the stud of the past and he probably won't earn his $10M unless he becomes a type A FA and brings back draft picks but he shouldn't be a debacle either.

[jjwalker48]

the Milwaukee journal states this rumor is "complete garbage", no interest in Vizcaino

 

Link:http://blogs.jsonline.com/brewers/archive/2007/12/14/vizcaino-rumor-is-quot-complete-garbage-quot.aspx

[badnews]

I don't find reliever FIPs to be anywhere as convincing as for starters. A lot of the time the really good guys have higher FIPs than their ERAs and the crappy ones have lower FIPs. Ryan Dempster always has a lower FIP, Will Ohman had a 3.60 FIP in 2007, J. J. Putz had a 2.81 FIP, Marmol had a 2.62 FIP... I think Gagne only has a certain number of innings in his glass arm before he craps out, he was already going south in his last month with the Rangers. He should start off well enough and fade.

[Ender]

The real key with FIP is that it is relatively stable from year to year and ERA swings wildly so is almost completely useless. Yes FIP is not anywhere near all inclusive and some players will very obviously trend to one side or the other it is still a more reliable baseline stat than just plain old ERA. If a player has a big improvement in ERA one season and his FIP stays steady(see David Riske last season) you know it was pretty much just a good luck season.