Angel Guzman

[Bruno7481]

Kind of hard not to see this coming.

 

It amazed me how some around here will still including him in the discussion of helping the bullpen not too long ago.

 

He has never really shown the ability to stay healthy, for whatever reason, and I don't think it really has anything to do with the Cubs medical staff.

 

Some guys are just prone to injury, and a lot of them play for the Cubs. :)

[Wilson A2000]

Is this his second TJ?

[E.J.]

I'm not surprised in the least. Guzman is about as injury prone as it gets.

 

Still, it's too bad. Another great arm who can't stay healthy. :x

[Sammy Sofa]

So why is this just now getting done in Sept?

 

i don't know much about injuries and whatnot, but this is what rotoworld said on June 8th, and it might be why the Cubs waited.

 

An MRI showed that Angel Guzman has a strained medial ligament in his pitching elbow.

The good news for Guzman is he didn't injure the ulnar collateral ligament which is associated with Tommy John surgery. He won't touch a baseball for at least two weeks in an effort to let the ligament heal.

 

So further proof the Cubs medical staff is full of jackasses

 

So you're saying it's impossible it wasn't damaged further over the last 3 full months?

 

And are these type of tests done by some sort of exclusive "Cubs medical staff?" I thought things like this were handled by doctors that treated players in general from around the league.

[jjgman21]

That really sucks.

 

Let's make a list:

 

Lance Dickson

Mike Harkey

Mark Prior

Angel Guzman

 

Jeremi Gonzalez

[Guest]

Is this his second TJ?

 

No, his first. He had arthroscopic surgery on his shoulder after a slight labrum tear in 2003.

[jjgman21]

So why is this just now getting done in Sept?

 

i don't know much about injuries and whatnot, but this is what rotoworld said on June 8th, and it might be why the Cubs waited.

 

An MRI showed that Angel Guzman has a strained medial ligament in his pitching elbow.

The good news for Guzman is he didn't injure the ulnar collateral ligament which is associated with Tommy John surgery. He won't touch a baseball for at least two weeks in an effort to let the ligament heal.

 

So further proof the Cubs medical staff is full of jackasses

 

So you're saying it's impossible it wasn't damaged further over the last 3 full months?

 

And are these type of tests done by some sort of exclusive "Cubs medical staff?" I thought things like this were handled by doctors that treated players in general from around the league.

 

the most noteworthy orthopedic surgeon working on athletes in this country found nothing structurally wrong with Prior until the 'exploratory surgery.'

 

we see this type of thing over and over. same type of thing happened with Carpenter this year. it says nothing about Cubs management or the Cubs training staff. the only thing it speaks to is the short comings of medical science and the extraordinary bad luck of the Cubs.

 

 

TJS doesn't mean Guz's career is over. the fact that he makes JD drew look invincible is the problem here. sure wish the Marlins went for the best pitcher from Boise instead of the spazz with the crappy mechanics.

[Flames24Rulz]

I like Guzman a lot. But, it's time to stick a fork in him. He's done.

[Drew Doughty]

why are people saying he's done because of TJS? pitchers come back from it all the time. it's frustrating sure but he's not done because of this setback. if it was another serious rotator cuff/labrum injury, sure...but he could come back from this and be effective still.

[soccer10k]

See you in 2009, Angel.

[Guest]

why are people saying he's done because of TJS? pitchers come back from it all the time. it's frustrating sure but he's not done because of this setback. if it was another serious rotator cuff/labrum injury, sure...but he could come back from this and be effective still.

 

Totally agree.

[Keener98]

So why is this just now getting done in Sept?

 

i don't know much about injuries and whatnot, but this is what rotoworld said on June 8th, and it might be why the Cubs waited.

 

An MRI showed that Angel Guzman has a strained medial ligament in his pitching elbow.

The good news for Guzman is he didn't injure the ulnar collateral ligament which is associated with Tommy John surgery. He won't touch a baseball for at least two weeks in an effort to let the ligament heal.

 

So further proof the Cubs medical staff is full of jackasses

 

So you're saying it's impossible it wasn't damaged further over the last 3 full months?

 

And are these type of tests done by some sort of exclusive "Cubs medical staff?" I thought things like this were handled by doctors that treated players in general from around the league.

 

I really dont see how in his very limited rehab stint he could have hurt it that much too cause the problem. To me it seems more likely the problem was there in June, and they either mis evaluated it(its happened before) or they overlooked it. My guess is the problem was there in June but was mis diagnosed, which sucks cause he loses 3 months of rehab time.

[RynoRules]

That really sucks.

 

Let's make a list:

 

Lance Dickson

Mike Harkey

Mark Prior

Angel Guzman

 

I'm not sure if Wood had TJS. *shrug*

Yes, in '99

 

I was actually thinking of highly touted Cubs pitching prospects whose careers just stalled outright after they spent some time in the majors. Not very scientific, I know.

 

I did not count Woody b/c he spent quite a bit of time up here and is still on the ML roster (though who knows for how long). Plus I am holding out hope that he can still pitch as a short reliever.

[RynoRules]

why are people saying he's done because of TJS? pitchers come back from it all the time. it's frustrating sure but he's not done because of this setback. if it was another serious rotator cuff/labrum injury, sure...but he could come back from this and be effective still.

 

Totally agree.

 

Perhaps he is right, but his injury history (which is longer than my...well its long) suggests otherwise.

 

That said, I hope he's right. Guz's stuff is electric.

[A New Era]

See you in 2009, Angel.

 

I agree. Hopefully TJS can get him going in the right direction. .

[jjgman21]

at this point, I wouldn't be surprised to see Angel make a full recovery from his surgery, only to have coccyx shoot out through his taint two weeks later.

 

why people hold out hope that this guy will ever be an effective pitcher for the Cubs for more than a couple of months, I have no idea. haven't we learned our lesson? how long will we continue to count on pitchers to stay healthy, only to put us into a bind when they so predictably get hurt again?

[Sammy Sofa]

So why is this just now getting done in Sept?

 

i don't know much about injuries and whatnot, but this is what rotoworld said on June 8th, and it might be why the Cubs waited.

 

An MRI showed that Angel Guzman has a strained medial ligament in his pitching elbow.

The good news for Guzman is he didn't injure the ulnar collateral ligament which is associated with Tommy John surgery. He won't touch a baseball for at least two weeks in an effort to let the ligament heal.

 

So further proof the Cubs medical staff is full of jackasses

 

So you're saying it's impossible it wasn't damaged further over the last 3 full months?

 

And are these type of tests done by some sort of exclusive "Cubs medical staff?" I thought things like this were handled by doctors that treated players in general from around the league.

 

I really dont see how in his very limited rehab stint he could have hurt it that much too cause the problem. To me it seems more likely the problem was there in June, and they either mis evaluated it(its happened before) or they overlooked it. My guess is the problem was there in June but was mis diagnosed, which sucks cause he loses 3 months of rehab time.

 

Maybe...but again, isn't this the result of evaluations from national medical resources as opoosed to "the Cubs' medical staff?" I'm not saying they haven't screwed up, but I think it's pretty shortsighted to pin this on the Cubs organization alone. Plenty of doctors outside of the club have been involved along the way.

[Sammy Sofa]

at this point, I wouldn't be surprised to see Angel make a full recovery from his surgery, only to have coccyx shoot out through his taint two weeks later.

 

why people hold out hope that this guy will ever be an effective pitcher for the Cubs for more than a couple of months, I have no idea. haven't we learned our lesson? how long will we continue to count on pitchers to stay healthy, only to put us into a bind when they so predictably get hurt again?

 

Who has been counting on Guzman, either within the organization or amongst the fans?

[Guest]

why are people saying he's done because of TJS? pitchers come back from it all the time. it's frustrating sure but he's not done because of this setback. if it was another serious rotator cuff/labrum injury, sure...but he could come back from this and be effective still.

 

Totally agree.

 

Perhaps he is right, but his injury history (which is longer than my...well its long) suggests otherwise.

 

That said, I hope he's right. Guz's stuff is electric.

 

Certainly right, but at least this time, the injury is straightforward compared to most of his non-labrum tear injuries and the rehab is more common/easier than the labrum rehab. He'll still have an option year whenever he gets back to the big leagues which can also help him during his year of rehab.

[Yeti]

at this point, I wouldn't be surprised to see Angel make a full recovery from his surgery, only to have coccyx shoot out through his taint two weeks later.

:lmao:

[Mephistopheles]

at this point, I wouldn't be surprised to see Angel make a full recovery from his surgery, only to have the Cardinals sign him and he becomes an ace for ten years.

[SouthSideRyan]

at this point, I wouldn't be surprised to see Angel make a full recovery from his surgery, only to have coccyx shoot out through his taint two weeks later.

 

why people hold out hope that this guy will ever be an effective pitcher for the Cubs for more than a couple of months, I have no idea. haven't we learned our lesson? how long will we continue to count on pitchers to stay healthy, only to put us into a bind when they so predictably get hurt again?

 

Who has been counting on Guzman, either within the organization or amongst the fans?

 

This. Reminiscent of the people saying we need to cut Prior and Wood now just because it'll make themselves feel better. Gooz is costing us nothing and it's not like anyone's writing him into a rotation spot then panicking when he turns up injured. He's just another one of those guys who's a bonus if he gives us anything, it's not a big deal.

[Sammy Sofa]

at this point, I wouldn't be surprised to see Angel make a full recovery from his surgery, only to have coccyx shoot out through his taint two weeks later.

 

why people hold out hope that this guy will ever be an effective pitcher for the Cubs for more than a couple of months, I have no idea. haven't we learned our lesson? how long will we continue to count on pitchers to stay healthy, only to put us into a bind when they so predictably get hurt again?

 

Who has been counting on Guzman, either within the organization or amongst the fans?

 

This. Reminiscent of the people saying we need to cut Prior and Wood now just because it'll make themselves feel better. Gooz is costing us nothing and it's not like anyone's writing him into a rotation spot then panicking when he turns up injured. He's just another one of those guys who's a bonus if he gives us anything, it's not a big deal.

 

Exactly.

[jjgman21]

at this point, I wouldn't be surprised to see Angel make a full recovery from his surgery, only to have coccyx shoot out through his taint two weeks later.

 

why people hold out hope that this guy will ever be an effective pitcher for the Cubs for more than a couple of months, I have no idea. haven't we learned our lesson? how long will we continue to count on pitchers to stay healthy, only to put us into a bind when they so predictably get hurt again?

 

Who has been counting on Guzman, either within the organization or amongst the fans?

 

This. Reminiscent of the people saying we need to cut Prior and Wood now just because it'll make themselves feel better. Gooz is costing us nothing and it's not like anyone's writing him into a rotation spot then panicking when he turns up injured. He's just another one of those guys who's a bonus if he gives us anything, it's not a big deal.

 

Exactly.

 

no. unless he is a reliever and there are tons of relief options available, you can't count on him to be a key member of the bullpen. you also can't go into a season expecting this guy to be a starting pitcher and counting on a minor leaguer to replace him come the inevitable injury.

 

 

yes, anything he gives us will be gravy, but unless the pitching staff is completely stacked, you can't put him on the 25 man roster. the lesson that should have been learned long ago is to not count on a chronically injured pitcher to be a key member of your staff. either he's the best sixth man out of the pen in baseball, or I don't want him on the team.

[badnews]

Angel Guzman is going to be the next guy we never hear from again, ever see that Simpsons episode where Ozzie Smith falls into the Mystery Vortex? That's where Luke Hagerty and Ben Christensen are.