No Doubt Who's The Ace

[Ding Dong Johnson]

I have doubts

[Handlebar McSkullet]

Lilly has been great. The term "ace" is meaningless. The term "stopper" is more aptly applied.

[BDWeav71]

I just heard that Lilly is 9-1 when winning a game after a loss...

 

Ted Lilly...slumpbuster.

 

http://www.sonic.net/~ckelly/Seekay/dana_lilly.jpg

 

HAWT.

 

 

Hilarious.

[Little Slide Rooter]

Just gos to show what happens when you take a mediocre pitcher from a strong division and put him in a weak one.

[inari]

Just gos to show what happens when you take a mediocre pitcher from a strong division and put him in a weak one.

 

Except Lilly isn't mediocre and he never has been.

[fibro]

I just heard that Lilly is 9-1 when winning a game after a loss...

 

Ted Lilly...slumpbuster.

 

http://www.sonic.net/~ckelly/Seekay/dana_lilly.jpg

 

HAWT.

 

 

Hilarious.

 

I think I would rather be in a slump.

[Warren Brusstar]

I think it depends on how you define "ace." If it means the pitcher who is the best during the current season then it would be Lilly. If it means the pitcher who has the ability to be the best then it would be Zambrano. Since you win or lose based on performance rather than ability I'll go with Lilly for now.

 

Its the person who is most likely to be the best in the near future.

 

If Lord of Khemennu says so, it must be so.

 

:roll:

 

What a stupid post.

[Keener98]

I just heard that Lilly is 9-1 when winning a game after a loss...

 

Ted Lilly...slumpbuster.

 

http://www.sonic.net/~ckelly/Seekay/dana_lilly.jpg

 

HAWT.

 

 

Hilarious.

 

I think I would rather be in a slump.

 

think?

[Omar]

I think it depends on how you define "ace." If it means the pitcher who is the best during the current season then it would be Lilly. If it means the pitcher who has the ability to be the best then it would be Zambrano. Since you win or lose based on performance rather than ability I'll go with Lilly for now.

 

Its the person who is most likely to be the best in the near future.

 

If Lord of Khemennu says so, it must be so.

 

:roll:

 

What a stupid post.

 

Don't fire him up. He'll put you on his ignore list. You know, the one we all really care about.

[Guest]

I have doubts

 

You're not the only one.

[Bruno7481]

I have doubts

 

You're not the only one.

 

Why? What specifically concerns you?

 

I'm not saying he's a Cy Young candidate or anything, but I am beyond pleased with what he has given the Cubs this year.

[Little Slide Rooter]

Just gos to show what happens when you take a mediocre pitcher from a strong division and put him in a weak one.

 

Except Lilly isn't mediocre and he never has been.

 

If you look at his career stats prior to coming to this season, they define mediocre.

[inari]

Just gos to show what happens when you take a mediocre pitcher from a strong division and put him in a weak one.

 

Except Lilly isn't mediocre and he never has been.

 

If you look at his career stats prior to coming to this season, they define mediocre.

 

Only if you don't know what stats to look at.

[Butterscup1679666578]

Just gos to show what happens when you take a mediocre pitcher from a strong division and put him in a weak one.

 

Except Lilly isn't mediocre and he never has been.

 

If you look at his career stats prior to coming to this season, they define mediocre.

 

ERA+ since 2001 (his first full season)

83

120

98

120

80

109

118 (this year)

 

Two years below league average, 1 year just about league average, and 4 years above league average. Yeah, he's mediocre alright.

 

Edit: Also, his first below average year was his first full season, and 2005, the year his ERA+ was 80, he was injured and only got 25 starts.

[UBlink]

Sucks that our best pitcher has a 3.85 ERA. You usually expect more from an ace of the staff. Lilly has been good for us all year but on a good pitching staff he wouldn't be considered an ace.

 

So the Cubs pitching staff ranks 3rd in WHIP, 3rd in OBA, 4th in SLGA and 3rd in OPSA in the NL but they are not a good pitching staff. Or, alternatively, only the Padres and Dodgers have good pitching staffs.

[davearm]

If we had to win 1 game as of today, I'd be Ted Lilly taking the ball. End of discussion.

Best definition yet.

 

Zambrano may give you the best chance of any Cub starter for an epic 1-hit CG, but he also gives you the best chance of being down 7 by the end of the 2nd.

 

I'll take Lilly and the near certainty of being in the game throughout.

[GoCubsGo1679625768]

I just heard that Lilly is 9-1 when winning a game after a loss...

 

How did he get the one loss when he won the game?

 

http://www.feebleminds-gifs.com/exploding-head.gif

[abuck1220]

Just gos to show what happens when you take a mediocre pitcher from a strong division and put him in a weak one.

 

Except Lilly isn't mediocre and he never has been.

 

If you look at his career stats prior to coming to this season, they define mediocre.

 

Only if you don't know what stats to look at.

 

what stats are you looking at?

[GoCubsGo1679625768]

If we had to win 1 game as of today, I'd be Ted Lilly taking the ball. End of discussion.

Best definition yet.

 

Zambrano may give you the best chance of any Cub starter for an epic 1-hit CG, but he also gives you the best chance of being down 7 by the end of the 2nd.

 

I'll take Lilly and the near certainty of being in the game throughout.

 

I'll take Jake Peavy..personally.

[Mephistopheles]

I think it depends on how you define "ace." If it means the pitcher who is the best during the current season then it would be Lilly. If it means the pitcher who has the ability to be the best then it would be Zambrano. Since you win or lose based on performance rather than ability I'll go with Lilly for now.

 

Its the person who is most likely to be the best in the near future.

 

If Lord of Khemennu says so, it must be so.

 

:roll:

 

What a stupid post.

 

youre right it must be true. the ace of a staff is the best pitcher any other definition is trying to make an argument about nothing

[Exile on Waveland]

What's more important, yesterday or tomorrow?

 

Lilly may have been the Cubs best pitcher so far this year, but I'll still take Zambrano as the ace.

[CubmanPi]

I can't tell if this thread is debating what it means to be an ace or who the best/most reliable pitcher is. I hope it's the latter, because the former is pointless.

 

As of right now, if all 5 starters were on enough rest and there was only one game left that mattered, Ted Lilly most consistently gives the team a chance to win, and I think Hill and Marquis are a tie for second. Zambrano easily has the highest ceiling on the staff, and in the three seasons prior to this one, he has easily been "ace" material, but he's been very bipolar this season, with plenty more games on the crappy end of the spectrum.

 

To respond to the previous post asking about whether yesterday or tomorrow matters more, I think cubbiechris nailed it to say that it's always today that matters most, and Lilly is that guy on this team.

[C.C.]

I can't tell if this thread is debating what it means to be an ace or who the best/most reliable pitcher is. I hope it's the latter, because the former is pointless.

 

As of right now, if all 5 starters were on enough rest and there was only one game left that mattered, Ted Lilly most consistently gives the team a chance to win, and I think Hill and Marquis are a tie for second. Zambrano easily has the highest ceiling on the staff, and in the three seasons prior to this one, he has easily been "ace" material, but he's been very bipolar this season, with plenty more games on the crappy end of the spectrum.

 

To respond to the previous post asking about whether yesterday or tomorrow matters more, I think cubbiechris nailed it to say that it's always today that matters most, and Lilly is that guy on this team.

 

Nicely said...

[Backtobanks]

I can't tell if this thread is debating what it means to be an ace or who the best/most reliable pitcher is. I hope it's the latter, because the former is pointless.

 

As of right now, if all 5 starters were on enough rest and there was only one game left that mattered, Ted Lilly most consistently gives the team a chance to win, and I think Hill and Marquis are a tie for second. Zambrano easily has the highest ceiling on the staff, and in the three seasons prior to this one, he has easily been "ace" material, but he's been very bipolar this season, with plenty more games on the crappy end of the spectrum.

 

To respond to the previous post asking about whether yesterday or tomorrow matters more, I think cubbiechris nailed it to say that it's always today that matters most, and Lilly is that guy on this team.

 

When I started this thread, I didn't think there would be all of this discussion over semantics. My point is that Lilly has been the best Cub starter all year, has been the starter to break all of the losing streaks, and continues to be the pitcher who gives the Cubs the best chance to win games this year. To me, that defines the "ace" of a staff. I'm not talking about next year, who has the best stuff, his flyball ratio, or whether he would be the "ace" on other teams.

[CuseCubFan69]

I can't tell if this thread is debating what it means to be an ace or who the best/most reliable pitcher is. I hope it's the latter, because the former is pointless.

 

As of right now, if all 5 starters were on enough rest and there was only one game left that mattered, Ted Lilly most consistently gives the team a chance to win, and I think Hill and Marquis are a tie for second. Zambrano easily has the highest ceiling on the staff, and in the three seasons prior to this one, he has easily been "ace" material, but he's been very bipolar this season, with plenty more games on the crappy end of the spectrum.

 

To respond to the previous post asking about whether yesterday or tomorrow matters more, I think cubbiechris nailed it to say that it's always today that matters most, and Lilly is that guy on this team.

 

When I started this thread, I didn't think there would be all of this discussion over semantics. My point is that Lilly has been the best Cub starter all year, has been the starter to break all of the losing streaks, and continues to be the pitcher who gives the Cubs the best chance to win games this year. To me, that defines the "ace" of a staff. I'm not talking about next year, who has the best stuff, his flyball ratio, or whether he would be the "ace" on other teams.

 

Oh come on now Btb....if you said the sky looked blue you'd get a nice little semantic debate about what shade of blue!