whats going on with mark prior???

[Lefty]

I will only report what I heard but here it is.

 

On Sports Central sometime last week (I'm not sure when) I thought I heard David Kaplan (WGN Radio sports guy and huge Cubs fan) answer a question about when to expect Prior back with something like "Because of his contract status, Mark has thrown his last pitch for the Cubs." I don't know what he meant or if I heard it right but that was the gist.

 

*Free with this report is

http://img172.imageshack.us/img172/729/43823ix2.jpg

 

That seems unlikely since the Cubs have control of him through next year. Unless he is done for 2+ years or Kaplan thought he was going to be traded, there's no reason to say he has thrown his last pitch as a Cub.

 

Kap is right. Because Prior is making $3.6 million this year, the least the Cubs can offer him in arbitration next year is $2.8 million. And the best case doesn't have him pitching rehab until next June.

 

If the Cubs wanted to keep him, they wouldn't have let him accrue service time this year and leveraged that. By reinstating him to the major league roster's DL, they gave up that possibility. They only control him through '08 now. Prior will be non-tendered this winter and will sign a two-year "sign and hope" with someone else. I just hope it isn't the Cardinals.

 

Let me count the ways this is wrong.

 

1) His contract is small compared to overall payroll. They have shown willingness to take fliers on injured pitchers in the past.

 

2) Do you have any source for your "best case scenario"? Or are you just using your medical expertise to predict how long he'll be out?

 

3) They had no choice but to let him accrue service time, if they had refused he would have won the grievance case easily, since he was clearly injured before being placed on a minor league roster.

 

4) Again, any source on Prior being non-tendered more reliable than your cristal ball? If the Cubs wanted to release Prior, why not do when it becmae clear he was out for the year, rather than putting him on the DL? Do you really believe that they would give him a year to sit on the DL and cut him as soon as he is ready to pitch? If they were really planning to get rid of him, why wouldn't they have done it at the beginning of the year?

 

1) $2.8 million might be a small fraction of payroll, but is way more than Miller or Dempster got to rehab. That doesn't even include the $3.6 million they're paying him to rehab this year.

 

2) Reports at the time of his surgery mentioned previous instances of this kind of repair and mentioned no competitive throwing for one year.

 

3) Is this your legal expertise? Prior's insistence that he was healthy pokes a huge hole in his grievance. I don't think you can just dismiss the Cubs' claim.

 

4) Why isn't Prior doing any rehab here? The Cubs are cutting bait.

 

Even if they give him arbitration next year, he's a free-agent after 2008. If the initial reports about recovery time were true, why would the Cubs pay more of the downside with less hope of getting the upside? And do you think Prior would take a two-year deal from the Cubs like Miller or Dempster got when Prior is guaranteed $5 million for '08 and '09 if he goes the arbitration route.

 

HE IS GONE!!! HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAH :twisted:

[swordsman]

I e-mailed David Kaplan to get confirmation on what he said/meant. I'll let you know what I hear from him directly.

[Soul]

He better not wind up with the Cards after we paid to rehab him, I can tell you that.

[NCCubFan]

Reports at the time of his surgery mentioned previous instances of this kind of repair and mentioned no competitive throwing for one year.

No competitive throwing doesn't mean he won't be able to do any rehabilitation, it just means not pitching in an actual game. And it seems to me that pitchers who have shoulder surgery aren't usually out longer than a year; that's even longer than pitchers recovering from TJS.

[Sarcastic]

Reports at the time of his surgery mentioned previous instances of this kind of repair and mentioned no competitive throwing for one year.

No competitive throwing doesn't mean he won't be able to do any rehabilitation, it just means not pitching in an actual game. And it seems to me that pitchers who have shoulder surgery aren't usually out longer than a year; that's even longer than pitchers recovering from TJS.

 

Correct. Lefty, you don't seem to have any actual evidence that Prior is leaving. Those shadowy figures in the closet aren't monsters, if you bothered to look. Is it possible that the Cubs may quibble over an extra million for Prior? I guess, but it seems no more likely than any other doomsday scenario you could come up with. Might the Cubs have won the grievance case? I can't say for sure, but they probably wouldn't have, and by doing so they would have pissed off Prior (a definite sign they didn't care to keep him) and gotten a bad reputation for how they treat their players.

 

As far as why he isn't rehabbing in Chicago, I have no idea what his rehab schedule is, and I'm sure he wouldn't want to make it more public than he had tok, considering what he has gone through.

[Lefty]

Reports at the time of his surgery mentioned previous instances of this kind of repair and mentioned no competitive throwing for one year.

No competitive throwing doesn't mean he won't be able to do any rehabilitation, it just means not pitching in an actual game. And it seems to me that pitchers who have shoulder surgery aren't usually out longer than a year; that's even longer than pitchers recovering from TJS.

 

Correct. Lefty, you don't seem to have any actual evidence that Prior is leaving. Those shadowy figures in the closet aren't monsters, if you bothered to look. Is it possible that the Cubs may quibble over an extra million for Prior? I guess, but it seems no more likely than any other doomsday scenario you could come up with. Might the Cubs have won the grievance case? I can't say for sure, but they probably wouldn't have, and by doing so they would have pissed off Prior (a definite sign they didn't care to keep him) and gotten a bad reputation for how they treat their players.

 

As far as why he isn't rehabbing in Chicago, I have no idea what his rehab schedule is, and I'm sure he wouldn't want to make it more public than he had tok, considering what he has gone through.

 

Those aren't black helicopters buddy. Giving up on an unreliable pitcher happens all the time. Not exactly a "doomsday" scenario. Of course we all wish it had been different.

 

My sense of the original post did not imply that Kaplan knew for sure. I never claimed this as fact either. But the evidence seems to indicate that he will be non-tendered. Can't really know for sure until December.

[Ding Dong Johnson]

Reports at the time of his surgery mentioned previous instances of this kind of repair and mentioned no competitive throwing for one year.

No competitive throwing doesn't mean he won't be able to do any rehabilitation, it just means not pitching in an actual game. And it seems to me that pitchers who have shoulder surgery aren't usually out longer than a year; that's even longer than pitchers recovering from TJS.

 

he'll likely not throw a ball at all for 6-7 months after the surgery, and that will be 20-30 feet and very softly. it will probably take another 3 months beyond that to get up enough strength in his shoulder to throw hard enough to be confused with a baseball player. after that 9-10 months, he's looking at either extended spring training or a tour of the minors, racking up 4-6 rehab starts. 1 year isn't out of the question and almost should be expected

 

the rehab he'll do up to that point is mostly basic range of motion exercises

[Sarcastic]

Reports at the time of his surgery mentioned previous instances of this kind of repair and mentioned no competitive throwing for one year.

No competitive throwing doesn't mean he won't be able to do any rehabilitation, it just means not pitching in an actual game. And it seems to me that pitchers who have shoulder surgery aren't usually out longer than a year; that's even longer than pitchers recovering from TJS.

 

he'll likely not throw a ball at all for 6-7 months after the surgery, and that will be 20-30 feet and very softly. it will probably take another 3 months beyond that to get up enough strength in his shoulder to throw hard enough to be confused with a baseball player. after that 9-10 months, he's looking at either extended spring training or a tour of the minors, racking up 4-6 rehab starts. 1 year isn't out of the question and almost should be expected

 

the rehab he'll do up to that point is mostly basic range of motion exercises

 

I expect there is a solid chance he won't be back to start the year, but do you have any sources or evidence to back up your numbers, or are we just going with gut feeling here?

 

Lefty, again, you say the evidence suggests Prior is gone, and yet you have yet to present any real evidence. What you have is speculative at best.

[Ding Dong Johnson]

I expect there is a solid chance he won't be back to start the year, but do you have any sources or evidence to back up your numbers, or are we just going with gut feeling here?

 

I'm speaking from experience

[Sarcastic]

I expect there is a solid chance he won't be back to start the year, but do you have any sources or evidence to back up your numbers, or are we just going with gut feeling here?

 

I'm speaking from experience

 

What sort of experience?

[Ding Dong Johnson]

I expect there is a solid chance he won't be back to start the year, but do you have any sources or evidence to back up your numbers, or are we just going with gut feeling here?

 

I'm speaking from experience

 

What sort of experience?

 

I had the same surgery

[Sarcastic]

I expect there is a solid chance he won't be back to start the year, but do you have any sources or evidence to back up your numbers, or are we just going with gut feeling here?

 

I'm speaking from experience

 

What sort of experience?

 

I had the same surgery

 

Interesting. I still think there are likely to be enough variables to make the recovery time between his rehab and your rehab substantially different, though, whether that means it takes more or less time. I don't claim to know when he'll be back, and I don't think we can really get any better idea than "sometime next year" until someone who actually worked with Prior or has some kind of knowledge of his rehab gives some info. We'll see.

[Ding Dong Johnson]

Interesting. I still think there are likely to be enough variables to make the recovery time between his rehab and your rehab substantially different, though, whether that means it takes more or less time. I don't claim to know when he'll be back, and I don't think we can really get any better idea than "sometime next year" until someone who actually worked with Prior or has some kind of knowledge of his rehab gives some info. We'll see.

 

all I know is that it was the most excruciating pain I have ever been through in my life, and I wasn't able to start ANY exercises until approximately 4 months after the operation

 

Prior very well may be better off than me because I had laxity in addition to a completely torn labrum, but my Dr warned me in advance that the recovery would be quite similar for either injury (just so happened I had both)

[Lefty]

Reports at the time of his surgery mentioned previous instances of this kind of repair and mentioned no competitive throwing for one year.

No competitive throwing doesn't mean he won't be able to do any rehabilitation, it just means not pitching in an actual game. And it seems to me that pitchers who have shoulder surgery aren't usually out longer than a year; that's even longer than pitchers recovering from TJS.

 

he'll likely not throw a ball at all for 6-7 months after the surgery, and that will be 20-30 feet and very softly. it will probably take another 3 months beyond that to get up enough strength in his shoulder to throw hard enough to be confused with a baseball player. after that 9-10 months, he's looking at either extended spring training or a tour of the minors, racking up 4-6 rehab starts. 1 year isn't out of the question and almost should be expected

 

the rehab he'll do up to that point is mostly basic range of motion exercises

 

I expect there is a solid chance he won't be back to start the year, but do you have any sources or evidence to back up your numbers, or are we just going with gut feeling here?

 

Lefty, again, you say the evidence suggests Prior is gone, and yet you have yet to present any real evidence. What you have is speculative at best.

 

What is speculation? Is it not someone's opinion based on available evidence? You may not agree with my conclusion, but labelling it "speculation" does not degrade it one bit. Until we know for sure it is speculation. As is your assumption that they will offer him arbitration or that he will accept a multi-year contract.

 

Just writing that last sentence makes me look better.

[CubinNY]

 

Prior very well may be better off than me because I had laxity

 

One bottle of Imodium AD and hunck of cheddar should clear that up in a matter of days.

[Derwood]

Interesting. I still think there are likely to be enough variables to make the recovery time between his rehab and your rehab substantially different, though, whether that means it takes more or less time. I don't claim to know when he'll be back, and I don't think we can really get any better idea than "sometime next year" until someone who actually worked with Prior or has some kind of knowledge of his rehab gives some info. We'll see.

 

all I know is that it was the most excruciating pain I have ever been through in my life, and I wasn't able to start ANY exercises until approximately 4 months after the operation

 

Prior very well may be better off than me because I had laxity in addition to a completely torn labrum, but my Dr warned me in advance that the recovery would be quite similar for either injury (just so happened I had both)

 

you should have injected steroids into your calves. that might have helped

[Electron Blue]

The Cubs are much more freely spending money than in the past -- i.e. there's more cash available. For that reason, my irrational Cub-brain wants to continue to pay Mark Prior 2 million-ish dollars through his mid-30s, playing or not. For the sole reason to prevent him from "figuring it out" with another team . . . Like I said, Irrational. but that's my gut feeling.

[coreyMVP]

Judging from Prior's past pain tolerance, it would be foolish to expect a quick recovery. He is certainly not one to push himself.

[UBlink]

Judging from Prior's past pain tolerance, it would be foolish to expect a quick recovery. He is certainly not one to push himself.

 

:shock:

 

I don't know where to start.

[CyHawk_Cub]

Judging from Prior's past pain tolerance, it would be foolish to expect a quick recovery. He is certainly not one to push himself.

 

:shock:

 

I don't know where to start.

 

x2.... Oh, boy....

[anabiono]

Judging from Prior's past pain tolerance, it would be foolish to expect a quick recovery. He is certainly not one to push himself.

 

:shock:

 

I don't know where to start.

 

x2.... Oh, boy....

 

nice to see this "point" pop up on every cubs board

 

:!:

[Bote McBoteface]

Judging from Prior's past pain tolerance, it would be foolish to expect a quick recovery. He is certainly not one to push himself.

 

Flipping over Marcus Giles and landing on his throwing shoulder, then pitching the next inning. (which is possibly where this injury originated)

 

Taking a line drive off his elbow, breaking it, and coming back a month later

 

 

Yeah, Prior is a real wuss. This board doesn't take fondly to insults on other members, so I'll stop here. Have a nice day :)

[TruffleShuffle]

what kind of pansy can't push through a torn labrum? cut him loose.

[IWU_CUBS_FAN]

what kind of pansy can't push through a torn labrum? cut him loose.

bill brasky once tore both his labrums then pitched a perfect game

[Drew Doughty]

what kind of pansy can't push through a torn labrum? cut him loose.

bill brasky once tore both his labrums then pitched a perfect game

 

well it's not fair since he did it while kicking the ball from the mound. with his left foot.