Murton on the block?!

[wilk]

I People are sitting here saying he's cheap since he gives you a .360 OBP and .800 OPS. Yeah well those aren't his numbers. If they were ...!

 

They aren't his numbers becuase he doesn't get to play on a consistent basis.

 

The people running the Cubs are traditionalists. They want a Slugger in the corner outfiled spot.

 

I called this as soon as Hendry went ga-ga over Soriano. Then they went out and got Floyd. Hendry and crew are clueless.

 

It's a shame.

 

I disagree that the only thing lacking is consistent play. I think there's a little more to it than that but that's impossible to argue so we'll just leave that up to be determined. It's not quite as simple as the Cubs wanting a slugger there either. The problem is he'd have to be better in every other area -- defense, speed, discipline -- and he's just not. He's below average defensively in right field and does not have significant speed. He has good discipline at the plate but this is another thing that's always been exaggerated for him. He is not an elite walker; he doesn't even have great patience. He's just a little above average when the Cubs have been so used to players below average. A breath of fresh air, no doubt, and personally I think Murton will come around to find some power but he's out of place here now. Unless you move Soriano to rightfield and he adjusts well there, you cannot imagine any longterm future for Murton with the club without serious improvements.

 

Now if he's traded for a middle reliever - I'm pissed. But let's not treat it as if the only acceptable trade is for Miguel Cabrera because that's just nonsense.

 

It's sensless what the Cubs are doing. To try to portray it as anything else is just silly.

 

Hendry & Co. should have asked themselves: What do we have and what do we need?

 

They had a cheap LFer who produced at a good rate and looked to be improving

 

They had JJ comming off a career year and were looking to trade him.

 

They needed a CFer

They needed people who could get on base

 

They got nothing that they needed (offensively) and allocated a lot of money and a lot of years to do so.

 

I'm willing to bet a year's worth of premium that if Murton gets regularly playing time from 2008-2010 he will have better three year numbers OBP/OPS+ than Soriano.

 

Yes much of it is pretty senseless. This is an entirely different conversation though. They really needed Soriano to be able to handle CF if not RF and keeping him in left really disrupts things. Floyd should never have been signed either. But that's what we now have to deal with.

 

Murton with regular playing time probably will have a better OBP than Soriano. I wouldn't think a better OPS+ though.

[C.C.]

Ummm, ladies and gentlemen--it was a little blurb in a non-chicago article. Does anyone think we might be overreacting just a bit--I dont want to trade Murton either, but to be fair for all we know neither does Jim Hendry. Let's at least wait until he is traded before we start to crucify him!

 

I was starting to think that I was the only rational person left on NSBB. I am amazed how some posters overreact to anything that happens to be whispered by someone. I have supported Hendry in the past, but I can't believe he would give up Murton for a relief pitcher especially since we seem to lead the league in quantity (not quality) of relief pitchers. As some posters have pointed out, Murton is the kind of player that you package with pitching prospects to get a big name player. I don't believe this rumor unless it is really an outstanding relief pitcher.

 

 

I was thinking the same thing. First, the over-reaction to a rumor. Second, that trading Murton would not be even close to the worst thing Hendry has done. If the Cubs were playing fantasy baseball, then Muton has has good value, but when you actually have to put a 9 man team on the field, mixing defense with offense, Murton has avg. value.

 

False. Murton would be just fine in an OF with a slugging RF and a decent CF.

 

He's a better LF than Soriano. He gets on base better than Soriano and Jones. He runs better than Floyd. His skillset is a better fit for our team than Jones or Floyd.

 

Soriano can outslug and outsteal him, but Murton's other numbers make up for that.

 

Basically I'm saying if you think Murton is average based on our OF, then Soriano, Jones and Floyd are also average to below average, because he does something better than all of them do.

 

That's very questionable.

[Guest]

I'm actually a big fan of trading Murton for a SP, as part of a sequence of moves.

 

Trading Murton for a middle reliever means I'll be a little more sad every time we make fun of Krivsky.

 

I've given up on making fun of other GMs.

[JeffH]

Actually, if the organization has settled on Murton as no more than a platoon OF, I support them trading him for value (i.e., not Matt Karchner).

 

Fill his role with DeRosa or, ultimately, Jake Fox.

[USSoccer]

 

He's a better LF than Soriano. .

 

That's very questionable.

 

Are you kidding me? Soriano is a terrible defensive player no matter where you put him.

[jersey cubs fan]

Ummm, ladies and gentlemen--it was a little blurb in a non-chicago article. Does anyone think we might be overreacting just a bit--I dont want to trade Murton either, but to be fair for all we know neither does Jim Hendry. Let's at least wait until he is traded before we start to crucify him!

 

I was starting to think that I was the only rational person left on NSBB. I am amazed how some posters overreact to anything that happens to be whispered by someone. I have supported Hendry in the past, but I can't believe he would give up Murton for a relief pitcher especially since we seem to lead the league in quantity (not quality) of relief pitchers. As some posters have pointed out, Murton is the kind of player that you package with pitching prospects to get a big name player. I don't believe this rumor unless it is really an outstanding relief pitcher.

 

 

I was thinking the same thing. First, the over-reaction to a rumor. Second, that trading Murton would not be even close to the worst thing Hendry has done. If the Cubs were playing fantasy baseball, then Muton has has good value, but when you actually have to put a 9 man team on the field, mixing defense with offense, Murton has avg. value.

 

Murton is only good if it's fantasy baseball? Funny, considering it's Soriano who is actually overrated by the fantasty game, with the overemphasis on counting stats like HR and SB.

 

Murton has well above average value because he's a cheap player who can give you a .360 OBP along with an 800+ OPS. That is valuable. A multi million player with those numbers is far less valuable.

 

 

The problem is Hendry painted himself into a corner years ago with the construction of this team. Every year he's made it more and more difficult to fix the issue. Murton had great value to this team until they decided he wasn't worth playing.

[CubColtPacer]

 

He's a better LF than Soriano. .

 

That's very questionable.

 

Are you kidding me? Soriano is a terrible defensive player no matter where you put him.

 

I think Soriano are about equal defensively-Soriano has superior range and the much better arm, while Murton takes much better routes to balls.

[Lockes Eye Scar]

And Murton doesn't skip around like a girl when he catches the ball.

 

:lol:

[USSoccer]

 

He's a better LF than Soriano. .

 

That's very questionable.

 

Are you kidding me? Soriano is a terrible defensive player no matter where you put him.

 

I think Soriano are about equal defensively-Soriano has superior range and the much better arm, while Murton takes much better routes to balls.

 

Soriano's range doesn't mean crap if he can't figure out the right route to take. His poor play in the OF has probably negated the OF assists he's had. He's an absolute butcher.

 

Now, add to that the fact that Murton will get on base at a better clip, and costs a fraction of what Soriano costs, and tell me that Murton is merely an average player in our OF.

[A New Era]

 

He's a better LF than Soriano. .

 

That's very questionable.

 

Are you kidding me? Soriano is a terrible defensive player no matter where you put him.

 

Someone has him. Not sure if It's BP or Rotoworld. Soriano at +2 defensively at LF.

[C.C.]

 

He's a better LF than Soriano. .

 

That's very questionable.

 

Are you kidding me? Soriano is a terrible defensive player no matter where you put him.

 

I think Soriano are about equal defensively-Soriano has superior range and the much better arm, while Murton takes much better routes to balls.

 

Soriano's range doesn't mean crap if he can't figure out the right route to take. His poor play in the OF has probably negated the OF assists he's had. He's an absolute butcher.

 

Now, add to that the fact that Murton will get on base at a better clip, and costs a fraction of what Soriano costs, and tell me that Murton is merely an average player in our OF.

 

C'mon. Both have weaknesses and strengths to say one is clearly better then the other is a bit of a stretch.

[CubColtPacer]

 

He's a better LF than Soriano. .

 

That's very questionable.

 

Are you kidding me? Soriano is a terrible defensive player no matter where you put him.

 

I think Soriano are about equal defensively-Soriano has superior range and the much better arm, while Murton takes much better routes to balls.

 

Soriano's range doesn't mean crap if he can't figure out the right route to take. His poor play in the OF has probably negated the OF assists he's had. He's an absolute butcher.

 

Now, add to that the fact that Murton will get on base at a better clip, and costs a fraction of what Soriano costs, and tell me that Murton is merely an average player in our OF.

 

I wouldn't call Soriano a butcher out there-he hasn't been good out there (and probably the only thing improved when he switched to LF was his arm, as his routes got worse), but his range has allowed him to make up some mistakes he's made on his routes.

 

In our outfield, Murton is one of the better players. I don't see him fitting in the Cubs plans long-term though-Pie/Soriano will get two of the spots, and I can't see them leaving Murton in the other spot for years, especially after this year when our plus offense at catcher disappears. I do think that they should play him a pretty good amount of the time this year, and only trade him if the right deal comes along-and if it's for one pitcher, it better be for either a dominant reliever (who I doubt people will want to give up, because there are only 10-15 names I'd put under this category), an average or better starting pitcher, or packaged together with pitching to get an impact bat. Otherwise I think he'd be a good option for an offseason trade-not because I don't think he's a good ballplayer, but only because he will start to get slowly squeezed out with the Cubs, and his value to the team might end up being higher trading him to a small market team than it would to possibly only be a part-time player with the Cubs.

[Bruno7481]

While I think it would be best not to trade him, I wouldn't exacty consider him untouchable. It all depends on the deal. It seems like for every team there is at least one guy who is severely overrated by its fans. There is no debate that player is Murton for the Cubs.

 

It's nonsense like this that explains why the Cubs would make such a move.

 

Those who want to see Murton play do so becauase he's a cost effective option capable of putting up a solid 800+ OPS with a .350 or better OBP, not because they think he's great. But when you support such a player, the naysayers want to say you severely overrate said player because they assume that in order to really like a player it means you think he's tremendously productive. You don't have to be tremendously productive to be tremendously valuable to a major league roster. I like Murton because he is exactly what this team has lacked, and needed, for quite some time.

 

People, including the Cubs, just don't get that.

 

I get it quite fine thank you. Re-read my post, I don't want to trade him. He is a cheap, cost-effective option. But it is still my opinion that he is ovverated. He has potential to be a goodplayer, up until this point he has simply been average.

 

And by average I mean based on typical production you would want out of a corner outfielder.

Edited May 22, 2007 by Bruno7481

[RichHillIsABeast]

 

He's a better LF than Soriano. .

 

That's very questionable.

 

Are you kidding me? Soriano is a terrible defensive player no matter where you put him.

 

Soriano's thrown more runners out in a month in LF than Murton has his whole big league career.

 

Soriano's "terrible" in LF? Give me a break. Hater.

[USSoccer]

 

He's a better LF than Soriano. .

 

That's very questionable.

 

Are you kidding me? Soriano is a terrible defensive player no matter where you put him.

 

Soriano's thrown more runners out in a month in LF than Murton has his whole big league career.

 

Soriano's "terrible" in LF? Give me a break. Hater.

 

A strong arm does not mean he's a good LF. He takes really bad routes, and positions himself pretty poorly.

 

Sincerely,

 

The Hater

 

http://www.out-of-kilter.com/wp-content/uploads/2006/11/silky_johnson1.jpg

[C.C.]

 

He's a better LF than Soriano. .

 

That's very questionable.

 

Are you kidding me? Soriano is a terrible defensive player no matter where you put him.

 

Soriano's thrown more runners out in a month in LF than Murton has his whole big league career.

 

Soriano's "terrible" in LF? Give me a break. Hater.

 

A strong arm does not mean he's a good LF. He takes really bad routes, and positions himself pretty poorly.

 

Sincerely,

 

The Hater

 

http://www.out-of-kilter.com/wp-content/uploads/2006/11/silky_johnson1.jpg

 

When the games on the line who would you rather have in LF. A guy that can gun down that lead guy or a guy that occasionally takes better routes to fly balls?

[USSoccer]

In our outfield, Murton is one of the better players. I don't see him fitting in the Cubs plans long-term though-Pie/Soriano will get two of the spots, and I can't see them leaving Murton in the other spot for years, especially after this year when our plus offense at catcher disappears. I do think that they should play him a pretty good amount of the time this year, and only trade him if the right deal comes along-and if it's for one pitcher, it better be for either a dominant reliever (who I doubt people will want to give up, because there are only 10-15 names I'd put under this category), an average or better starting pitcher, or packaged together with pitching to get an impact bat. Otherwise I think he'd be a good option for an offseason trade-not because I don't think he's a good ballplayer, but only because he will start to get slowly squeezed out with the Cubs, and his value to the team might end up being higher trading him to a small market team than it would to possibly only be a part-time player with the Cubs.

 

I'm not necessarily against trading him, but he's worth a heck of a lot more than just some random middle reliever. He's an important trading chip that can be used to get someone actually worth getting.

[USSoccer]

 

He's a better LF than Soriano. .

 

That's very questionable.

 

Are you kidding me? Soriano is a terrible defensive player no matter where you put him.

 

Soriano's thrown more runners out in a month in LF than Murton has his whole big league career.

 

Soriano's "terrible" in LF? Give me a break. Hater.

 

A strong arm does not mean he's a good LF. He takes really bad routes, and positions himself pretty poorly.

 

Sincerely,

 

The Hater

 

http://www.out-of-kilter.com/wp-content/uploads/2006/11/silky_johnson1.jpg

 

When the games on the line who would you rather have in LF. A guy that can gun down that lead guy or a guy that occasionally takes better routes to fly balls?

 

I'd rather have the guy who has the better chance of catching the ball in the first place than the guy who takes a stupid route and lets the ball go flying over his head.

 

Maybe when his hammy improves Soriano will improve defensively, but so far I'm just not impressed. He looks clueless at times.

[Bruno7481]

 

He's a better LF than Soriano. .

 

That's very questionable.

 

Are you kidding me? Soriano is a terrible defensive player no matter where you put him.

 

Soriano's thrown more runners out in a month in LF than Murton has his whole big league career.

 

Soriano's "terrible" in LF? Give me a break. Hater.

 

A strong arm does not mean he's a good LF. He takes really bad routes, and positions himself pretty poorly.

 

Sincerely,

 

The Hater

 

http://www.out-of-kilter.com/wp-content/uploads/2006/11/silky_johnson1.jpg

 

When the games on the line who would you rather have in LF. A guy that can gun down that lead guy or a guy that occasionally takes better routes to fly balls?

 

I'd rather have the guy who has the better chance of catching the ball in the first place than the guy who takes a stupid route and lets the ball go flying over his head.

 

Maybe when his hammy improves Soriano will improve defensively, but so far I'm just not impressed. He looks clueless at times.

 

I agree with you there. but what has Murton done to show he's any better defensively than Soriano this year? It is not like he hasn't had his bonehead moments either.

[frostwyrm]

Predictable. I posted a couple days ago that I thought Hendry would try to fix the bullpen by throwing more money at it in the near future. Murt on the block for a pricy veteran reliever doesn't surprise me one bit.

[Shilzzz]

seriously... what is going on here? hendry - after having moved guzman to the bullpen after a couple good starts (better than what anyone else in the organization has to offer right now, plus he will improve), bringing up wade miller after having not one good outing in the minors (i'm still confused as to whether this happened or not), and throwing sean marshall into the rotation after no spectacular minor starts and surgery - is now thinking about trading matt murton, one of the clubs top three outfielders, for a middle reliever?

 

these are the things being done to solve the problem(s)???

 

wow. i really need to find a better hobby.

[98navigator]

Soriano will anchor LF for 7 more seasons, Pie is the heir apparent in CF and honestly, I don't see Murton producing enough offensively (or defensively) in RF to secure the job full time. BP projects him to hit 15 home runs in 507 PA. Even if he were to reach his 90th percentile he'd only hit 23 home runs with 35 doubles and 84 RBI. I think the Cubs will eventually trade him or relegate him to full-time bench player status (similar to right now except on a permanent basis). Considering the options, I wouldn't have a problem with trading him for something that can upgrade the ML roster.

[C.C.]

 

He's a better LF than Soriano. .

 

That's very questionable.

 

Are you kidding me? Soriano is a terrible defensive player no matter where you put him.

 

Soriano's thrown more runners out in a month in LF than Murton has his whole big league career.

 

Soriano's "terrible" in LF? Give me a break. Hater.

 

A strong arm does not mean he's a good LF. He takes really bad routes, and positions himself pretty poorly.

 

Sincerely,

 

The Hater

 

http://www.out-of-kilter.com/wp-content/uploads/2006/11/silky_johnson1.jpg

 

When the games on the line who would you rather have in LF. A guy that can gun down that lead guy or a guy that occasionally takes better routes to fly balls?

 

I'd rather have the guy who has the better chance of catching the ball in the first place than the guy who takes a stupid route and lets the ball go flying over his head.

 

Maybe when his hammy improves Soriano will improve defensively, but so far I'm just not impressed. He looks clueless at times.

 

And Murton hasn't? All I'm saying is taking better routes can be learned (he's only played LF for one year) having a strong accurate arm can't.

[SouthSideRyan]

Murton was tried out in RF and he sucked.

 

Jesus, this is getting annoying.

[FergieJ31]

Yeah I don't think anyone is shocked at all; at least not those who have been paying attention to the Hendry-era Cubs.

 

I realize this thread is predicated on a speculative little blurb, but trading Murton for relief help would be SO Cubs that I'll be shocked if it doesn't happen.