Big Z will leave

[oldstyle81]

Good Riddance then. Seriously, why say this? It helps the Cubs more then anything. They can paint him the greedy guy he is being and trade him off for a stable of young players from the Angels.

 

I am more for the Trade Z bandwgn then ever now. The 2 sides are as far apart as they can possibly be. Zambrano might be a budding talent but nowhere worth 15.5 million. It took Zito longer to get that kind of cash and he earned it. Hwere is Z's cy young or era title or anything worth noting? Sure he is in the discussion but Z has never dominated a statistical category. Why pay him like he has?

 

Z's value is never going to be higher. Trade his whiny, sorry butt away and get Wood & Adenhart and I guarantee that Cub fans will forget Z in 2 years.

 

im sure people said the same thing about Maddux in 92

[Mark_R]

Good Riddance then. Seriously, why say this? It helps the Cubs more then anything. They can paint him the greedy guy he is being and trade him off for a stable of young players from the Angels.

 

I am more for the Trade Z bandwgn then ever now. The 2 sides are as far apart as they can possibly be. Zambrano might be a budding talent but nowhere worth 15.5 million. It took Zito longer to get that kind of cash and he earned it. Hwere is Z's cy young or era title or anything worth noting? Sure he is in the discussion but Z has never dominated a statistical category. Why pay him like he has?

 

Z's value is never going to be higher. Trade his whiny, sorry butt away and get Wood & Adenhart and I guarantee that Cub fans will forget Z in 2 years.

 

Z is a lot better than Zito.

[ChiCubsFan]

Good Riddance then. Seriously, why say this? It helps the Cubs more then anything. They can paint him the greedy guy he is being and trade him off for a stable of young players from the Angels.

 

I am more for the Trade Z bandwgn then ever now. The 2 sides are as far apart as they can possibly be. Zambrano might be a budding talent but nowhere worth 15.5 million. It took Zito longer to get that kind of cash and he earned it. Hwere is Z's cy young or era title or anything worth noting? Sure he is in the discussion but Z has never dominated a statistical category. Why pay him like he has?

 

Z's value is never going to be higher. Trade his whiny, sorry butt away and get Wood & Adenhart and I guarantee that Cub fans will forget Z in 2 years.

 

im sure people said the same thing about Maddux in 92

 

im sure the cubs did not get a Brandon Wood and Nick Adenhart for getting rid of Maddux in 92

[ChiCubsFan]

Good Riddance then. Seriously, why say this? It helps the Cubs more then anything. They can paint him the greedy guy he is being and trade him off for a stable of young players from the Angels.

 

I am more for the Trade Z bandwgn then ever now. The 2 sides are as far apart as they can possibly be. Zambrano might be a budding talent but nowhere worth 15.5 million. It took Zito longer to get that kind of cash and he earned it. Hwere is Z's cy young or era title or anything worth noting? Sure he is in the discussion but Z has never dominated a statistical category. Why pay him like he has?

 

Z's value is never going to be higher. Trade his whiny, sorry butt away and get Wood & Adenhart and I guarantee that Cub fans will forget Z in 2 years.

 

Z is a lot better than Zito.

 

this is true.

[oldstyle81]

Good Riddance then. Seriously, why say this? It helps the Cubs more then anything. They can paint him the greedy guy he is being and trade him off for a stable of young players from the Angels.

 

I am more for the Trade Z bandwgn then ever now. The 2 sides are as far apart as they can possibly be. Zambrano might be a budding talent but nowhere worth 15.5 million. It took Zito longer to get that kind of cash and he earned it. Hwere is Z's cy young or era title or anything worth noting? Sure he is in the discussion but Z has never dominated a statistical category. Why pay him like he has?

 

Z's value is never going to be higher. Trade his whiny, sorry butt away and get Wood & Adenhart and I guarantee that Cub fans will forget Z in 2 years.

 

im sure people said the same thing about Maddux in 92

 

im sure the cubs did not get a Brandon Wood and Nick Adenhart for getting rid of Maddux in 92

 

no but there is nothing saying any prospects will be as good as everyone thinks they will be

[Mephistopheles]

Good Riddance then. Seriously, why say this? It helps the Cubs more then anything. They can paint him the greedy guy he is being and trade him off for a stable of young players from the Angels.

 

I am more for the Trade Z bandwgn then ever now. The 2 sides are as far apart as they can possibly be. Zambrano might be a budding talent but nowhere worth 15.5 million. It took Zito longer to get that kind of cash and he earned it. Hwere is Z's cy young or era title or anything worth noting? Sure he is in the discussion but Z has never dominated a statistical category. Why pay him like he has?

 

Z's value is never going to be higher. Trade his whiny, sorry butt away and get Wood & Adenhart and I guarantee that Cub fans will forget Z in 2 years.

 

im sure people said the same thing about Maddux in 92

 

im sure the cubs did not get a Brandon Wood and Nick Adenhart for getting rid of Maddux in 92

 

no but they did get a Kevin Orie who turned into a prospect as good as Nick Adenhart...

[davearm]

Good Riddance then. Seriously, why say this? It helps the Cubs more then anything. They can paint him the greedy guy he is being and trade him off for a stable of young players from the Angels.

 

I am more for the Trade Z bandwgn then ever now. The 2 sides are as far apart as they can possibly be. Zambrano might be a budding talent but nowhere worth 15.5 million. It took Zito longer to get that kind of cash and he earned it. Hwere is Z's cy young or era title or anything worth noting? Sure he is in the discussion but Z has never dominated a statistical category. Why pay him like he has?

 

Z's value is never going to be higher. Trade his whiny, sorry butt away and get Wood & Adenhart and I guarantee that Cub fans will forget Z in 2 years.

 

im sure people said the same thing about Maddux in 92

They didn't trade Maddux though.

 

People wouldn't be nearly so bent on the Maddux situation if we had, say, Chipper Jones to show for it.

[oldstyle81]

Good Riddance then. Seriously, why say this? It helps the Cubs more then anything. They can paint him the greedy guy he is being and trade him off for a stable of young players from the Angels.

 

I am more for the Trade Z bandwgn then ever now. The 2 sides are as far apart as they can possibly be. Zambrano might be a budding talent but nowhere worth 15.5 million. It took Zito longer to get that kind of cash and he earned it. Hwere is Z's cy young or era title or anything worth noting? Sure he is in the discussion but Z has never dominated a statistical category. Why pay him like he has?

 

Z's value is never going to be higher. Trade his whiny, sorry butt away and get Wood & Adenhart and I guarantee that Cub fans will forget Z in 2 years.

 

im sure people said the same thing about Maddux in 92

 

im sure the cubs did not get a Brandon Wood and Nick Adenhart for getting rid of Maddux in 92

 

no but they did get a Kevin Orie who turned into a prospect as good as Nick Adenhart...

 

Adenhart has already had 1 tommy john

[oldstyle81]

Good Riddance then. Seriously, why say this? It helps the Cubs more then anything. They can paint him the greedy guy he is being and trade him off for a stable of young players from the Angels.

 

I am more for the Trade Z bandwgn then ever now. The 2 sides are as far apart as they can possibly be. Zambrano might be a budding talent but nowhere worth 15.5 million. It took Zito longer to get that kind of cash and he earned it. Hwere is Z's cy young or era title or anything worth noting? Sure he is in the discussion but Z has never dominated a statistical category. Why pay him like he has?

 

Z's value is never going to be higher. Trade his whiny, sorry butt away and get Wood & Adenhart and I guarantee that Cub fans will forget Z in 2 years.

 

im sure people said the same thing about Maddux in 92

They didn't trade Maddux though.

 

People wouldn't be nearly so bent on the Maddux situation if we had, say, Chipper Jones to show for it.

 

i know we didnt trade him but he was pretty much told we can get more players in the amount it would cost us for you. Those players didnt do much of anything to remember

[sethuel1]

Good Riddance then. Seriously, why say this? It helps the Cubs more then anything. They can paint him the greedy guy he is being and trade him off for a stable of young players from the Angels.

 

I am more for the Trade Z bandwgn then ever now. The 2 sides are as far apart as they can possibly be. Zambrano might be a budding talent but nowhere worth 15.5 million. It took Zito longer to get that kind of cash and he earned it. Hwere is Z's cy young or era title or anything worth noting? Sure he is in the discussion but Z has never dominated a statistical category. Why pay him like he has?

 

Z's value is never going to be higher. Trade his whiny, sorry butt away and get Wood & Adenhart and I guarantee that Cub fans will forget Z in 2 years.

 

im sure people said the same thing about Maddux in 92

They didn't trade Maddux though.

 

People wouldn't be nearly so bent on the Maddux situation if we had, say, Chipper Jones to show for it.

 

i know we didnt trade him but he was pretty much told we can get more players in the amount it would cost us for you. Those players didnt do much of anything to remember

I think it's disingenuous to say that this situation is analogous to Maddux.

[davearm]

 

Adenhart has already had 1 tommy john

That's not a bad thing. In fact in this day and age, it's almost a positive.

 

Recovery rates are excellent, recurrence is infrequent, and sometimes guys even pick up a MPH or two.

 

Seriously. TJS is not nearly the stigma it used to be. It's not a stigma at all, really.

[davearm]

Good Riddance then. Seriously, why say this? It helps the Cubs more then anything. They can paint him the greedy guy he is being and trade him off for a stable of young players from the Angels.

 

I am more for the Trade Z bandwgn then ever now. The 2 sides are as far apart as they can possibly be. Zambrano might be a budding talent but nowhere worth 15.5 million. It took Zito longer to get that kind of cash and he earned it. Hwere is Z's cy young or era title or anything worth noting? Sure he is in the discussion but Z has never dominated a statistical category. Why pay him like he has?

 

Z's value is never going to be higher. Trade his whiny, sorry butt away and get Wood & Adenhart and I guarantee that Cub fans will forget Z in 2 years.

 

im sure people said the same thing about Maddux in 92

They didn't trade Maddux though.

 

People wouldn't be nearly so bent on the Maddux situation if we had, say, Chipper Jones to show for it.

 

i know we didnt trade him but he was pretty much told we can get more players in the amount it would cost us for you. Those players didnt do much of anything to remember

I think it's disingenuous to say that this situation is analogous to Maddux.

Indeed.

 

Having 2 or 3 elite prospects, plus $15M or so to reallocate to veterans, is a completely different circumstance than just having the $15M to spend.

[SouthSideRyan]

Good Riddance then. Seriously, why say this? It helps the Cubs more then anything. They can paint him the greedy guy he is being and trade him off for a stable of young players from the Angels.

 

I am more for the Trade Z bandwgn then ever now. The 2 sides are as far apart as they can possibly be. Zambrano might be a budding talent but nowhere worth 15.5 million. It took Zito longer to get that kind of cash and he earned it. Hwere is Z's cy young or era title or anything worth noting? Sure he is in the discussion but Z has never dominated a statistical category. Why pay him like he has?

 

Z's value is never going to be higher. Trade his whiny, sorry butt away and get Wood & Adenhart and I guarantee that Cub fans will forget Z in 2 years.

 

im sure people said the same thing about Maddux in 92

They didn't trade Maddux though.

 

People wouldn't be nearly so bent on the Maddux situation if we had, say, Chipper Jones to show for it.

 

And people would be more bent on it if we had, say, Todd Van Poppel and 1 less year of Maddux to show for it.

[oldstyle81]

Good Riddance then. Seriously, why say this? It helps the Cubs more then anything. They can paint him the greedy guy he is being and trade him off for a stable of young players from the Angels.

 

I am more for the Trade Z bandwgn then ever now. The 2 sides are as far apart as they can possibly be. Zambrano might be a budding talent but nowhere worth 15.5 million. It took Zito longer to get that kind of cash and he earned it. Hwere is Z's cy young or era title or anything worth noting? Sure he is in the discussion but Z has never dominated a statistical category. Why pay him like he has?

 

Z's value is never going to be higher. Trade his whiny, sorry butt away and get Wood & Adenhart and I guarantee that Cub fans will forget Z in 2 years.

 

im sure people said the same thing about Maddux in 92

They didn't trade Maddux though.

 

People wouldn't be nearly so bent on the Maddux situation if we had, say, Chipper Jones to show for it.

 

i know we didnt trade him but he was pretty much told we can get more players in the amount it would cost us for you. Those players didnt do much of anything to remember

I think it's disingenuous to say that this situation is analogous to Maddux.

Indeed.

 

Having 2 or 3 elite prospects, plus $15M or so to reallocate to veterans, is a completely different circumstance than just having the $15M to spend.

 

i was comparing it more to he possibly could go to the Cards or White Sox and win a few cy youngs while we decent players but nothing to show for it.

[rocket]

if we're truly going for a ring this year, there's no way we trade zambrano, even if he is walking at the end of the season.

[oldstyle81]

Good Riddance then. Seriously, why say this? It helps the Cubs more then anything. They can paint him the greedy guy he is being and trade him off for a stable of young players from the Angels.

 

I am more for the Trade Z bandwgn then ever now. The 2 sides are as far apart as they can possibly be. Zambrano might be a budding talent but nowhere worth 15.5 million. It took Zito longer to get that kind of cash and he earned it. Hwere is Z's cy young or era title or anything worth noting? Sure he is in the discussion but Z has never dominated a statistical category. Why pay him like he has?

 

Z's value is never going to be higher. Trade his whiny, sorry butt away and get Wood & Adenhart and I guarantee that Cub fans will forget Z in 2 years.

 

im sure people said the same thing about Maddux in 92

They didn't trade Maddux though.

 

People wouldn't be nearly so bent on the Maddux situation if we had, say, Chipper Jones to show for it.

 

And people would be more bent on it if we had, say, Todd Van Poppel and 1 less year of Maddux to show for it.

 

which in that case wouldve been his first cy young

[davearm]

Good Riddance then. Seriously, why say this? It helps the Cubs more then anything. They can paint him the greedy guy he is being and trade him off for a stable of young players from the Angels.

 

I am more for the Trade Z bandwgn then ever now. The 2 sides are as far apart as they can possibly be. Zambrano might be a budding talent but nowhere worth 15.5 million. It took Zito longer to get that kind of cash and he earned it. Hwere is Z's cy young or era title or anything worth noting? Sure he is in the discussion but Z has never dominated a statistical category. Why pay him like he has?

 

Z's value is never going to be higher. Trade his whiny, sorry butt away and get Wood & Adenhart and I guarantee that Cub fans will forget Z in 2 years.

 

im sure people said the same thing about Maddux in 92

They didn't trade Maddux though.

 

People wouldn't be nearly so bent on the Maddux situation if we had, say, Chipper Jones to show for it.

 

And people would be more bent on it if we had, say, Todd Van Poppel and 1 less year of Maddux to show for it.

Serious question here.

 

If you were Jim Hendry and Carlos Zambrano looked you in the face and said, "I'm leaving after this year", what would you do?

 

Would you keep him, pray you win the WS in 2007, then watch him walk for nothing?

 

Or would you trade him now for the best package of young players you could get?

 

Reasonable minds can disagree here, but I'm taking the latter every time. Getting nothing but a draft pick or two for Z would be disastrous.

[Transmogrified Tiger]

Reminder: "Nothing" in this case = 2 draft picks, in all likelihood 2 of the Top 50.

[Outshined_One]

Here's the breakdown as I see it, assuming the worst...

 

-If the Cubs are in the race by the trade deadline, Zambrano's going nowhere. Trading your best pitcher in the middle of a pennant race is utter stupidity, especially given the enormous pressure on this organization to win. I have a hard time seeing how the Cubs could trade Zambrano while getting players back in return who could fill in for him immediately. Zambrano for A-Rod is a pipe dream, imo.

 

-If the Cubs are out of it by the trade deadline, I'd absolutely guarantee teams would be lining up and getting into a bidding war with one another for Zambrano. He'd be the best way to instantly upgrade any rotation and could very well be the kind of guy who could put a team in a playoff chase over the top.

 

Moreover, I think a package of players like Kendrick, Weaver, and Morales would be doable. Zambrano is a legitimate ace and we've seen guys with significantly less talent get traded for obscene packages. You don't think Zambrano could command a package like Tabata/Hughes/Sanchez from the Yankees, Maybin/Miller/Jurrjens from the Tigers, Pelfrey/Milledge/Gomez from the Mets? Personally, I think teams would be happy to offer up those packages to get what essentially would be a guaranteed playoff ticket in Zambrano.

[Mephistopheles]

Reminder: "Nothing" in this case = 2 draft picks, in all likelihood 2 of the Top 50.

 

Reminder: Jim Hendry essentially traded two Top 50 picks for Cesar Izturis. Well to be technically correct it was a top 30 pick and the 31st pick for Izturis...

[A New Era]

Is it just me or is Zambrano sounding a little erogant (not in a good way) lately?

 

"I'm ready to sign, and I would do my job anyway with the Cubs this year," Zambrano said. "Whatever happens, I don't want to know [anything] about a contract during the season. I want to sign with the Cubs before the season starts. If they don't sign me, sorry, but I must go. That's what Carlos Zambrano thinks."

 

Talking about himself in the first person?

 

"[Cubs general manager] Jim [Hendry] spent a lot of money. I hope he has more for 'Big Z.'"

 

Don't get me wrong I've always loved Big Z. I love his "attitude" and flare out there on the mound. But some of the things he's said lately is sounding really prima donna to me. And I'm starting to sour on his whole attitude right now.

[nilodnayr]

Good Riddance then. Seriously, why say this? It helps the Cubs more then anything. They can paint him the greedy guy he is being and trade him off for a stable of young players from the Angels.

 

I am more for the Trade Z bandwgn then ever now. The 2 sides are as far apart as they can possibly be. Zambrano might be a budding talent but nowhere worth 15.5 million. It took Zito longer to get that kind of cash and he earned it. Hwere is Z's cy young or era title or anything worth noting? Sure he is in the discussion but Z has never dominated a statistical category. Why pay him like he has?

 

Z's value is never going to be higher. Trade his whiny, sorry butt away and get Wood & Adenhart and I guarantee that Cub fans will forget Z in 2 years.

 

im sure people said the same thing about Maddux in 92

They didn't trade Maddux though.

 

People wouldn't be nearly so bent on the Maddux situation if we had, say, Chipper Jones to show for it.

 

And people would be more bent on it if we had, say, Todd Van Poppel and 1 less year of Maddux to show for it.

Serious question here.

 

If you were Jim Hendry and Carlos Zambrano looked you in the face and said, "I'm leaving after this year", what would you do?

 

Would you keep him, pray you win the WS in 2007, then watch him walk for nothing?

 

Or would you trade him now for the best package of young players you could get?

 

Reasonable minds can disagree here, but I'm taking the latter every time. Getting nothing but a draft pick or two for Z would be disastrous.

 

The reality of the situation is that instead of getting one ace this offseason we got a middle of the rotation guy and a back of the rotation guy. I'm not blaming Hendry, Im just stating the facts. If we had gotten a #1 or #2 starter, we might have been able to survive this year without Z. But instead, right now subtracting Z does more to hurt our chances of making the playoffs than any other player on this team. After spending 300M this offseason, you just can't do that. Basically Hendry's hands are tied.

 

IF we did have another ace, I would most definitely send feelers out to see what he would bring in return. I'm not sure the angels would give us Adenhart and Wood, its not like their starting pitching is a weakness (Bartolo ain't a bad 5th starter).

 

The Mets would probably be the most interested given the lack of an ace in their rotation. Milledge, Heilman, Gomez/Martinez, and Pelfry/Humber would be a great great haul (and probably not realistic).

[b_wiggy_66]

Z is just trying to get paid. He wants his money just like everyone else. If he comes out and says this it puts an urgency into Hendry to get it done.

 

"Show me the Money"-Rod Tidwell

[Balsa]

It's a lose-lose situation for the Cubs and a win-win for Z.

 

Let's just hope that Hendry finds some extra money to lock him up.

 

Best case, he's signed before the season to a 3-5 year deal.

 

Worst cast, he isn't signed, but the Cubs are close enough to the playoffs near the deadline, so Hendry can't trade him, and then the Cubs miss the playoffs, and the Cubs get diddly poo.

[Balsa]

I think the posturing is a bit unprofessional, but we don't really know what normally goes into these negotiations behind closed doors.

 

I think letting Z go at this point because he just wants to get paid is unrealistic. We need him, and he rocks and he's young.