Marquis can have #21

[cbbryan]

Alas the NHL. These guys don't know that retiring #'s is stupid either. They don't know that "it's just a number!" What a shame. [/sarcasm]

 

Listing by number

 

 

1

 

Ed Giacomin - New York Rangers, March 15, 1989

Bernie Parent - Philadelphia Flyers, 1979-10-11

Jacques Plante - Montreal Canadiens, October 7, 1995

Terry Sawchuk - Detroit Red Wings

Glenn Hall - Chicago Blackhawks

 

2

 

Doug Harvey - Montreal Canadiens, October 26, 1985

Tim Horton - Buffalo Sabres

Al MacInnis - St. Louis Blues, April 9, 2006

Rick Ley - Hartford Whalers

Eddie Shore - Boston Bruins

 

3

 

J.C. Tremblay - Québec Nordiques

Ken Daneyko - New Jersey Devils, March 24, 2006

Bob Gassoff - St. Louis Blues

Lionel Hitchman - Boston Bruins

Al Hamilton - Edmonton Oilers

 

4

 

Jean Béliveau - Montreal Canadiens, October 9, 1971

Barry Ashbee - Philadelphia Flyers, 1975-04-03

Bobby Orr - Boston Bruins

Scott Stevens - New Jersey Devils, February 3, 2006

 

5

 

Bill Barilko - Toronto Maple Leafs, 17 October 1992

Aubrey Clapper - Boston Bruins, 1947

Bernie "Boom Boom" Geoffrion - Montreal Canadiens, March 11, 2006

Rod Langway - Washington Capitals

Denis Potvin - New York Islanders

 

6

 

Irvine "Ace" Bailey - Toronto Maple Leafs, 17 October 1992

 

7

 

Phil Esposito - Boston Bruins

Howie Morenz - Montreal Canadiens November 2, 1937

Rod Gilbert - New York Rangers, October 14, 1979

Yvon Labre - Washington Capitals

Ted Lindsay - Detroit Red Wings

Rick Martin - Buffalo Sabres

Neal Broten - Dallas Stars

Bill Barber - Philadelphia Flyers, 1986-03-06

Paul Coffey - Edmonton Oilers

 

8

 

Bill Goldsworthy - Minnesota North Stars, February 15, 1992

Frank Finnigan - Ottawa Senators, 1992

Cam Neely - Boston Bruins

Barclay Plager - St. Louis Blues

 

9

 

Johnny Bucyk - Boston Bruins

Clark Gillies - New York Islanders, 1997

Gordie Howe - Detroit Red Wings

Gordie Howe - Hartford Whalers

Bobby Hull - Chicago Blackhawks, December 18, 1983

Lanny McDonald - Calgary Flames

Maurice Richard - Montreal Canadiens, October 6, 1960

 

10

 

Ron Francis - Carolina Hurricanes, January 28, 2006

Guy Lafleur - Montreal Canadiens, February 16, 1985

Alex Delvecchio - Detroit Red Wings

 

11

 

Gilbert Perreault - Buffalo Sabres

Mark Messier - New York Rangers, January 12, 2006

Mark Messier - Edmonton Oilers, February, 2007

 

12

 

Stan Smyl - Vancouver Canucks, November 3, 1991

Yvan Cournoyer - Montreal Canadiens, November 12, 2005

Dickie Moore - Montreal Canadiens, November 12, 2005

Sid Abel - Detroit Red Wings

 

15

 

Milt Schmidt - 15, Boston Bruins, March 13, 1980

 

16

 

Henri Richard - Montreal Canadiens, December 10, 1975

Bobby Clarke - Philadelphia Flyers, 1984-11-15

Marcel Dionne - Los Angeles Kings, November 8, 1990

Pat LaFontaine - Buffalo Sabres, March 3, 2006

Brett Hull - St. Louis Blues, December 6, 2006

 

17

 

Jari Kurri - October 6, 2001

 

18

 

Dave Taylor - Los Angeles Kings, April 3, 1995

Danny Gare - Buffalo Sabres, November 22, 2005

Denis Savard - Chicago Blackhawks

Serge Savard - Montreal Canadiens, November 18, 2006

 

19

 

Bill Masterton - Minnesota North Stars, 1987

Bryan Trottier - New York Islanders, October 20, 2001

Steve Yzerman - Detroit Red Wings, January 2, 2006

 

21

 

Michel Briere - Pittsburgh Penguins

Stan Mikita - Chicago Blackhawks

 

22

 

Mike Bossy - New York Islanders, March 3, 1992

 

23

 

Bob Nystrom - New York Islanders, April 1, 1995

 

24

 

Terry O'Reilly - 24, Boston Bruins, October 24, 2002

 

25

 

Thomas Steen - Winnipeg Jets, April 1, 1994

 

30

 

Rogatien Vachon - Los Angeles Kings, February 14, 1985

Mike Vernon - Calgary Flames, February 7, 2007

 

31

 

Grant Fuhr - Edmonton Oilers, October 9, 2003

Billy Smith - New York Islanders, February 20, 1993

 

32

 

Dale Hunter - Washington Capitals

 

33

 

Patrick Roy - Colorado Avalanche, 28 October 2003

 

35

 

Mike Richter - New York Rangers, February 4, 2004

Tony Esposito - Chicago Blackhawks

 

66

 

Mario Lemieux - Pittsburgh Penguins

 

77

 

Ray Bourque - Boston Bruins

Ray Bourque - Colorado Avalanche

 

99

 

Wayne Gretzky - Edmonton Oilers, October 1, 1999

Wayne Gretzky - League-wide, November 22, 1999

Wayne Gretzky - Los Angeles Kings, October 9, 2002

[NorthsideAvenger]

 

Please! The Yanks have a great number of retired numbers and have no shortage of numbers to hand out. Your sarcasm is amusing, but it still doesn't change the fact that sports franchises in all major sports retire numbers to HONOR the greats. You may not like it, you may think they should do something different, but the fact still remains that this is how clubs have chosen to honor players. I think it's ridiculous to argue the merits of anyone wearing #21 when you know and understand these facts to be true.

 

I understand fully why teams "Retire numbers," but I don't agree that they should retire numbers. The number on the jersey didn't make the player as great as he was....it was his ability to play the game. Said player made the number famous, not the other way around. The ONLY number that should ever be "RETIRED" where Jackie Robinson, Larry Doby, and Roberto Clemente for not what they did as ballplayers(that would be gravy), but what they did for the game of baseball, and the significance of breaking down barriers of social equality and fairness, not to mention humantiarian efforts. Those are the ONLY numbers that should legitimately be retired. These great players should have something done for them for their contributions to the franchise and baseball, but IMO, retiring numbers shouldn't be the options, because sooner or later we are going to run out of numbers to be worn.

 

Bottomline: The number a'int retired. The Cubs have no plans to retired the number. If Jason Marquis wants the number, the Cubs can't do anything about it, outside of making a suggestion, which I doubt they would offer. (and if they don't make the suggestion, it doesn't mean they are "classless".) Neither can the fans who can only identify players by the number on the jersey, instead of their names.

[WrigleyField 22]

NFL Anyone?

 

Chicago

 

Bronko Nagurski 3

George McAfee 5

George Halas 7

Willie Galimore 28

Walter Payton 34

Gale Sayers 40

Brian Piccolo 41

Sid Luckman 42

Dick Butkus 51

Bill Hewitt 56

Bill George 61

Clyde "Bulldog" Turner 66

Red Grange 77

 

OT, but why was Piccolo's number retired(ditto for Galimore)? I know the whole story, but is that the kind of thing that should get a guy's # retired. Also OT, but why hasn't Singletry's 50 been retired? I can't think of anyone who has actually worn it, so I suppose it is unofficially retired, but still. Also in oh 10-15 years inebackers in Chicago are really going to run out of numbers to wear, at least those in the 50's.

[jjgman21]

 

Besides the many Cub records he owns, the fans absolutely loved him for most of his career in Chicago, and many still do and always will.

 

 

I don't really care about Marquis' number, but the bolded part above is just not true for many of us. in fact, just the opposite.

 

Sosa was an after thought in the Sandberg/Grace years, especially since he was trying to replace the Hawk. then he was the embodiment of overpaid, unfulfilled potential, spazmodic K monster that could have been good if he ever learned to recognize a low and away slider. then there was 1997 when I for one was completely done with him and wanted him gone.

 

only then did he become a hero to all of Wrigleydom, and he was more of a pain in the ass then a beloved character in his last two years with the Cubs. so to many he was loved for his whole Cub career. to most of us that weren't adolescents or younger in the early and mid 90's, he was nothing special.

 

I have to disagree with your disagreement. Sosa's 30-30 seasons made him a big star in Chicago. I'll give you '92, nobody cared about Sosa, and were pissed that we traded George Bell for the bum. But Sosa had the 30-30 year in '93 and then the face of the franchise retired midway through '94. That coupled with Sosa having a very good year in '94 followed up by another 30-30 in '95 made him the new man in Chicago. Then he follows it up with the key power #s, 40 HRs, 100 RBI(without playing in September), even with Sandberg's return, Sosa was the guy in Chicago.

 

I'll give you the '97 season, Sosa was far from loved, and many people thought his contract extension was insane. But I think to say he wasn't adored for most of his career is a gross misrepresentation.

 

you probably had a better perspective on it at the time living in the city while I was at college, but I stand by my overall assessment. for the numbers he put up, his flaws always balanced that out in many of our eyes. picture Jacque on speed. replacing a legend while making mistakes in the field (loved the flailing dive when he stood no chance to catch the ball after taking a bad angle), with his arm (preferred the airmail to the lawn dart), on the basepaths (preferred the pickoff and caught stealing to baserunning mistakes), first pitch hacking and never adjusting to pitches that routinely got him out (same exact pitch that neither could hit).

 

sure he had his fans in the 93-96 seasons. it's inevitable when you put up decent traditional stats on a bad team, and like I alluded to before, most of his fans were kids who dug the longball. but he always had his detractors both in the media and the fanbase, and he always played second fiddle to Grace at least on the Cubs, and Thomas, Ventura and McDowell in Chicago generally. Chicago itself was also a basketball town for much of that era, so in reality no baseball players were that big of stars in Chicago at that time.

[ernie14_billy26]

I'm coming into this pretty late, but hey...a lot of players have worn numbers that were retired after the player who the number is retired for played. See this website http://ignarski.tripod.com/temprost.html #26 was worn by several players before it was retired. Same with #10. I think the reasons 14 and 23 were not reassigned were because Ernie was such a legend when he retired (and he retired as a Cub) and Sandberg stayed in touch with the organization after he retired for the last time. When Kenny Hubbs was killed, the Cubs said they would not issue that number (16) again, and they kept their promise until for about 7 years, and I know people who to this day think 16 should be retired for Hubbs. In my opinion, before Sammys number is retired, the Cubs should honor some of their old time heros. Stan Hack, Charlie Grimm and the biggest oversite, Phil Caveretta.

[goonys evil twin]

I really have no interest in retiring numbers, or putting numbers out of circulation. There are only 100 possible uniform numbers in use, 101 if you count 0 and 00 seperately, you have 25 man active rosters, 40 man rosters that can mean as many as 15 callups during the year, and about 7 or 8 coaches with numbers. That's nearly 50 numbers that have to be available during the year, not counting trades, or guys who are added to the roster midseason. Given how rare, and stupid looking, numbers over 60 are, that leaves very little room for retired numbers. Teams like the Yankees have retired almost all the single digits, and many other double digit unis. I think it's become a silly empty gesture. I don't see what the commotion is about with the supposed need to honor these past players. Guys who accomplished truly remarkable feats, like Jackie Robinson, merit the honor, but the rest were just good baseball players. They aren't being dishonored by having somebody else wear a Cubs jersey with the same number they wore. I don't care what number any current Cubs player wears. Just put it on, and stick with it for ease of identification. We glorify athletes enough without making a fuss over who can wear their numbers once they retire.

[Andy]

The ONLY number that should ever be "RETIRED" where Jackie Robinson, Larry Doby, and Roberto Clemente for not what they did as ballplayers(that would be gravy)

Clemente was far from the first Latin American player. He did great service work, but he didn't break down any 'barriers' that I know of.

[BigbadB]

The ONLY number that should ever be "RETIRED" where Jackie Robinson, Larry Doby, and Roberto Clemente for not what they did as ballplayers(that would be gravy)

Clemente was far from the first Latin American player. He did great service work, but he didn't break down any 'barriers' that I know of.

 

True, but his accomplishments in baseball coupled with dying in an airplane crash on his way to help victims of a natural disaster is definitely noteworthy.

 

If he was flying to Vegas for a long weekend of partying, that might be another story.

[cbbryan]

 

Please! The Yanks have a great number of retired numbers and have no shortage of numbers to hand out. Your sarcasm is amusing, but it still doesn't change the fact that sports franchises in all major sports retire numbers to HONOR the greats. You may not like it, you may think they should do something different, but the fact still remains that this is how clubs have chosen to honor players. I think it's ridiculous to argue the merits of anyone wearing #21 when you know and understand these facts to be true.

 

I understand fully why teams "Retire numbers," but I don't agree that they should retire numbers. The number on the jersey didn't make the player as great as he was....it was his ability to play the game. Said player made the number famous, not the other way around. The ONLY number that should ever be "RETIRED" where Jackie Robinson, Larry Doby, and Roberto Clemente for not what they did as ballplayers(that would be gravy), but what they did for the game of baseball, and the significance of breaking down barriers of social equality and fairness, not to mention humantiarian efforts. Those are the ONLY numbers that should legitimately be retired. These great players should have something done for them for their contributions to the franchise and baseball, but IMO, retiring numbers shouldn't be the options, because sooner or later we are going to run out of numbers to be worn.

 

Bottomline: The number a'int retired. The Cubs have no plans to retired the number. If Jason Marquis wants the number, the Cubs can't do anything about it, outside of making a suggestion, which I doubt they would offer. (and if they don't make the suggestion, it doesn't mean they are "classless".) Neither can the fans who can only identify players by the number on the jersey, instead of their names.

 

I guess we can agree to disagree. You continue to say that we should remember the players names, not their numbers. I would venture to say that all Cub fans know who #10, #14, #25, and #26 are. We've established that. We've also established that Cub fans know who wore #31, #8, #17, and so on. So I don't see how your argument is that we remember their # and nothing more.

 

What this basically comes down to is you don't like the process that sports franchises in general have decided to practice in order to honor greats.

 

I think it's amusing that your argument also included the post that Sammy wasn't even that good with the Cubs (outside of 6 years)! He has shoe-in HOF #'s and they were all basically with the Cubs, yet you question whether he's worthy in the first place.

 

Let's just agree to disagree.

[The Voice of Reason]

Chicago

 

Bronko Nagurski 3

George McAfee 5

George Halas 7

Willie Galimore 28

Walter Payton 34

Gale Sayers 40

Brian Piccolo 41

Sid Luckman 42

Dick Butkus 51

Bill Hewitt 56

Bill George 61

Clyde "Bulldog" Turner 66

Red Grange 77

 

Only one Bear from the 1985 team, that's a travesty. Singletary and Hampton made the Hall of Fame and should have their numbers retired.

[cbbryan]

The ONLY number that should ever be "RETIRED" where Jackie Robinson, Larry Doby, and Roberto Clemente for not what they did as ballplayers(that would be gravy)

Clemente was far from the first Latin American player. He did great service work, but he didn't break down any 'barriers' that I know of.

 

True, but his accomplishments in baseball coupled with dying in an airplane crash on his way to help victims of a natural disaster is definitely noteworthy.

 

If he was flying to Vegas for a long weekend of partying, that might be another story.

 

Well, the majority of players are active nowadays in the community. Whether it be there own charity, i.e. DLee's foundation.

 

So, do we retire every number of a player that gives time and money to charity.

 

If so, we'll run out of #'s a whole heck of a lot quicker.

 

Maybe we should just go back to the deadball era and have no numbers at all!

[goonys evil twin]

I guess we can agree to disagree. You continue to say that we should remember the players names, not their numbers. I would venture to say that all Cub fans know who #10, #14, #25, and #26 are. We've established that. We've also established that Cub fans know who wore #31, #8, #17, and so on.

 

I think you're wrong. I remember who wore those numbers, but I have to think about it for some. And I've followed the Cubs more closely over the past 25 years than most Cubs fans. The number isn't nearly as important as the name.

 

I think the uproar is silly.

[WrigleyField 22]

I think the uproar is silly.

 

Basically sums up everything about right.

[The Voice of Reason]

Compromise - In honor of Sammy, only let Marquis wear #21 on the last day of the year when it wasn't really needed or used by Mr. Sosa anyway.

[CaliforniaRaisin]

Chicago

 

Bronko Nagurski 3

George McAfee 5

George Halas 7

Willie Galimore 28

Walter Payton 34

Gale Sayers 40

Brian Piccolo 41

Sid Luckman 42

Dick Butkus 51

Bill Hewitt 56

Bill George 61

Clyde "Bulldog" Turner 66

Red Grange 77

 

Only one Bear from the 1985 team, that's a travesty. Singletary and Hampton made the Hall of Fame and should have their numbers retired.

 

Singletary's number isn't retired!? That's crazy.

[Southpaw191679666239]

This thread has gotten out of control.... almost wish I didn't start it.

[CaliforniaRaisin]

And I really don't see how one can compare Andre Dawson and Greg Maddux's contribution with the Cubs to Sammy's.

 

I hope time will heel wounds because #21 deserves to be retired as much as some of the other four numbers the Cubs have retired.

[Laura]

Time will.

 

I mentioned this in the transactions thread, but it's worth noting that Hawk, Ryno, Maddux, Sammy and Fergie all have pennants flying over Wrigley Field. Not the same as having a number retired, but still an honor.

 

I was looking for a list of all the flags (or at least the non-year pennant flags), but I couldn't find one.

[cbbryan]

Time will.

 

I mentioned this in the transactions thread, but it's worth noting that Hawk, Ryno, Maddux, Sammy and Fergie all have pennants flying over Wrigley Field. Not the same as having a number retired, but still an honor.

 

I was looking for a list of all the flags (or at least the non-year pennant flags), but I couldn't find one.

 

Retired Uniform Numbers:

 

The pinstriped flags atop the left and right-field foul poles represent the retired uniform numbers worn by four of the greatest Cubs. On August 22, 1982, Ernie Banks became the first Cub to have his number retired. The fabled number 14 flies from the left-field foul pole at Wrigley Field. On August 13, 1987, the Cubs retired Hall of Famer Billy Williams' number. The number 26 flies from the right-field foul pole. On September 28, 2003, the Cubs retired Ron Santo's number. The number 10 also flies from the left-field foul pole. On August 28, 2005, the Cubs retired Hall of Famer Ryne Sandberg's number. The number 23 flies from the right-field foul pole. To honor legendary Cubs broadcaster Jack Brickhouse (1916 - 1998), his famous phrase "Hey Hey" is now affixed on both foul poles.

 

Roof Flags:

 

Flags adorn the upper deck roof to commemorate various special events in the history of the Chicago Cubs.

 

Left Field Roof

 

1906 World Series - Cubs vs. White Sox (Sox win series 4-2)

1907 World Series - Cubs vs. Detroit (Cubs win series 4-0-1)

1908 World Series - Cubs vs. Detroit (Cubs win series 4-1)

1910 World Series - Cubs vs. Philadelphia (Athletics win series 4-1)

1918 World Series - Cubs vs. Boston (Red Sox win series 4-2)

1929 World Series - Cubs vs. Philadelphia (Athletics win series 4-1)

1932 World Series - Cubs vs. New York (Yankees win series 4-0)

1935 World Series - Cubs vs. Detroit (Tigers win series 4-2)

1938 World Series - Cubs vs. New York (Yankees win series 4-0)

1945 World Series - Cubs vs. Detroit (Tigers win series 4-3)

1984 National League Championship Series - Cubs vs. San Diego (Padres win series 3-2)

1989 National League Championship Series - Cubs vs. San Francisco (Giants win series 4-1)

1998 National League Division Series - Cubs vs. Atlanta (Braves win series 3-0)

2003 National League Championship Series - Cubs vs. Florida (Marlins win series 4-3)

 

 

Right Field Roof

 

JR - 42 Jackie Robinson, MLB retired number 1997 (50th Anniversary)

HAWK-8 Andre Dawson, 1987 - 1992

PKW Philip K. Wrigley Owner, 1932 - 1977

HACK-190 Hack Wilson, 190 RBI in 1930

FJ-31 Ferguson Jenkins, 1966 - 1973, 1982 - 1983, Hall of Fame 1991

SAMMY-66 Sammy Sosa, 66 Home Runs 1998

KW-20 Kerry Wood, 20 Strikeouts May 6, 1998

MADDUX 300 Greg Maddux 300 wins

[Laura]

Thanks!

[CaliforniaRaisin]

Oh, that's cool.

[cbbryan]

Thanks!

 

No problem!

[soccer10k]

I guess we can agree to disagree. You continue to say that we should remember the players names, not their numbers. I would venture to say that all Cub fans know who #10, #14, #25, and #26 are. We've established that. We've also established that Cub fans know who wore #31, #8, #17, and so on.

 

I think you're wrong. I remember who wore those numbers, but I have to think about it for some. And I've followed the Cubs more closely over the past 25 years than most Cubs fans. The number isn't nearly as important as the name.

 

I think the uproar is silly.

 

I remember the names and not the numbers. I know Sammy is 21 because of the jersey I own but after that, I don't really know any of the old timers' numbers. But I know who Ernie Banks, Ron Santo, etc. are.

[NorthsideAvenger]

I guess we can agree to disagree. You continue to say that we should remember the players names, not their numbers. I would venture to say that all Cub fans know who #10, #14, #25, and #26 are. We've established that. We've also established that Cub fans know who wore #31, #8, #17, and so on.

 

I think you're wrong. I remember who wore those numbers, but I have to think about it for some. And I've followed the Cubs more closely over the past 25 years than most Cubs fans. The number isn't nearly as important as the name.

 

I think the uproar is silly.

 

I remember the names and not the numbers. I know Sammy is 21 because of the jersey I own but after that, I don't really know any of the old timers' numbers. But I know who Ernie Banks, Ron Santo, etc. are.

 

And that's the point I've been trying to make. If you need to know the number to remember the player, then obviously the fan didn't follow the players' career, or the player wasn't worth following. Great players should be honored, NO DOUBT, but retiring numbers is not the option, I would use.

[cbbryan]

I guess we can agree to disagree. You continue to say that we should remember the players names, not their numbers. I would venture to say that all Cub fans know who #10, #14, #25, and #26 are. We've established that. We've also established that Cub fans know who wore #31, #8, #17, and so on.

 

I think you're wrong. I remember who wore those numbers, but I have to think about it for some. And I've followed the Cubs more closely over the past 25 years than most Cubs fans. The number isn't nearly as important as the name.

 

I think the uproar is silly.

 

I remember the names and not the numbers. I know Sammy is 21 because of the jersey I own but after that, I don't really know any of the old timers' numbers. But I know who Ernie Banks, Ron Santo, etc. are.

 

And that's the point I've been trying to make. If you need to know the number to remember the player, then obviously the fan didn't follow the players' career, or the player wasn't worth following. Great players should be honored, NO DOUBT, but retiring numbers is not the option, I would use.

 

Again, and I hate to beat a dead horse. The issue is not whether or not teams should retire numbers. The issue is that sports franchises in the 3 major sports in the US have set this as a honorary token of respect and gratitude to the GREAT players AND that with that in mind #21 for the Cubs should not be worn again because of the contribution of said player (Said player is Sammy Sosa for those of you that only know names and not numbers!).