Baker upset that Barrett told the truth

[CubinNY]

If he really did say "Maybe you should read it". . Sounds pretty rude to me. Maybe you should read a book about "OBP" D.u.s.t.b.a.g. Dusty should worry about himself rather than some minor thing like this? I mean WTH is going to happen if the brewers see Barret with his hands in ice? Purposely hit his hands with the next pitch? I seriously doubt this minor sprain will effect Barrets ability to swing a bat.

 

Dusty here's another one. How about reading the book that tells you to use Jones in the one thing his is GOOD at. Defense in RF during the late innings!!

 

Phil Jackson has been giving books to his players for years. I don't see anything wrong with Dusty showing Barrett some books to make his point.

 

I think many of you are missing the importance of this. You have a 25 man roster. If one player is unavailable it absolutely impacts that game. For the sake of argument, Barrett unavailable impacts the following:

• Mabry is now your backup catcher and unavailable early in the game

• Aramis up in a critical situation in the middle innings vs. a tiring pitcher now becomes Aramis vs. the opponent's ace reliever (since there's no RH pop on the bench hence nothing to save him for)

• Your pitchers have to bat because of a short bench, allowing the opposition to pitch around the eigth place hitter

 

You may not agree but I think these are huge advantages for the opposition and will affect the game. Kirk Gibson wasn't available for the rest of the World Series after his HR off Eckersley - do you think LaRussa would have liked to know that?

 

This is not a big deal, but everybody knew Barrett wasn't going to play and was unavailable to play.

 

All one had to do was read any one of a number of local newspapers before Barrett said anything. They were all reporting he would be down for a couple of days.

 

IMO, it is pretty stupid of Dusty to be upset about it, if he is upset. I think the media might be making too much out of this.

[KW34]

I remember not too long ago there was a thread where Dusty/Hendry supporters argued that they weren't deliberately hiding injuries because there was no good reason to do so. Now Dusty admits he does do it, and his supporters are arguing that it's smart strategy. If nothing else, I have to admire the loyalty of Dusty's fans.

 

Do you really believe this is dumb strategy? Do you think there should be an injury report then for baseball? Or do you think before every game a manager should say who is unavailable due to illness/fatigue/soreness/tweak/bruise?

 

I'm really trying to understand what your argument is here. This seems to be a philosophical issue rather than a Dusty issue.

[KW34]

This is not a big deal, but everybody knew Barrett wasn't going to play and was unavailable to play.

 

All one had to do was read any one of a number of local newspapers before Barrett said anything. They were all reporting he would be down for a couple of days.

 

IMO, it is pretty stupid of Dusty to be upset about it, if he is upset. I think the media might be making too much out of this.

 

The way I understand it, the reason everyone knew was because Barrett told them, and that's the issue.

[Danny82]

I remember not too long ago there was a thread where Dusty/Hendry supporters argued that they weren't deliberately hiding injuries because there was no good reason to do so. Now Dusty admits he does do it, and his supporters are arguing that it's smart strategy. If nothing else, I have to admire the loyalty of Dusty's fans.

 

There's obviously a difference between hiding an injury for strategic purposes vis a vis another baseball team and hiding an injury to try to pull the wool over fans' eyes like was the implication made around here.

 

But, go ahead an ignore that distinction so that you can make your "point".

[RynoRules]

CubinNY wrote:

IMO, it is pretty stupid of Dusty to be upset about it, if he is upset. I think the media might be making too much out of this

 

Ding ding ding!!!

[erik316wttn]

Don't you think that with Barrett missing multiple games that someone would figure out he was hurt?

 

Teams aren't stupid. They'd know something was up.

[Danny82]

But the point is, going into yesterday, he hadn't missed any.

[erik316wttn]

But the point is, going into yesterday, he hadn't missed any.

 

Really. I thought he missed a few. I know Blanco caught Guzman, and didn't Blanco catch the game before, too?

[Danny82]

OK, I should rephrase. Barrett did sit out the last game of the Marlins series...but had started the last 3-4 before that. He was due to take a game off and the extent of his injury was still unknown heading into yesterday's game.

[Laura]

If he really did say "Maybe you should read it". . Sounds pretty rude to me.

 

I'm not a Dusty fan ... but ... I have met and talked with him in passing a couple of times and that quote (which I realize is Dusty quoting himself) strikes me as something that comes across more rude second-hand than it likely did in the actual conversation. Barrett's comments afterwards seemed joking as well. JMO.

[Roast]

I think Neifi is bad, but he's not in the legendary class of badness that some think he is and doesn't warrent the constant criticism he gets. If he was a starter, ok, fine, but he's not so I don't understand the obsession.

 

You know that somebody is going to come out with a bunch of stats trying to prove that you are wrong. I agree with you BTW.

 

So what you're saying is.... People will come out with their side of the evidense, with actual *GASP* proof to back up what they are saying...

 

What a novel concept.

[Blueheart05]

I don't believe it was an attempt to hide an injury but the fact that Barrett basically said he was unavailable (to even pinch hit). We all know he is day to day, so at least let them go under the assumption that you may be available to pinch hit. The injury was not hidden they just didn't want the fact that he was unavailable to pinch hit known, I think that is a pretty smart move.

 

Bingo! I think this is the real point. Barrett removed the idea that he was available at all which potentially changes how the Brewers will use their bullpen late in the game.

[Blueheart05]

If he really did say "Maybe you should read it". . Sounds pretty rude to me. Maybe you should read a book about "OBP" D.u.s.t.b.a.g. Dusty should worry about himself rather than some minor thing like this? I mean WTH is going to happen if the brewers see Barret with his hands in ice? Purposely hit his hands with the next pitch? I seriously doubt this minor sprain will effect Barrets ability to swing a bat.

 

Dusty here's another one. How about reading the book that tells you to use Jones in the one thing his is GOOD at. Defense in RF during the late innings!!

 

Phil Jackson has been giving books to his players for years. I don't see anything wrong with Dusty showing Barrett some books to make his point.

 

I think many of you are missing the importance of this. You have a 25 man roster. If one player is unavailable it absolutely impacts that game. For the sake of argument, Barrett unavailable impacts the following:

• Mabry is now your backup catcher and unavailable early in the game

• Aramis up in a critical situation in the middle innings vs. a tiring pitcher now becomes Aramis vs. the opponent's ace reliever (since there's no RH pop on the bench hence nothing to save him for)

• Your pitchers have to bat because of a short bench, allowing the opposition to pitch around the eigth place hitter

 

You may not agree but I think these are huge advantages for the opposition and will affect the game. Kirk Gibson wasn't available for the rest of the World Series after his HR off Eckersley - do you think LaRussa would have liked to know that?

 

This is not a big deal, but everybody knew Barrett wasn't going to play and was unavailable to play.

 

All one had to do was read any one of a number of local newspapers before Barrett said anything. They were all reporting he would be down for a couple of days.

 

IMO, it is pretty stupid of Dusty to be upset about it, if he is upset. I think the media might be making too much out of this.

 

Not being in the starting lineup and being completely unavailable are two different things. I disagree that everyone knew he was unavailable. The initial reports were that he would probably play on Friday and at the very least, was day to day.

[Productive Outs]

I think Neifi is bad, but he's not in the legendary class of badness that some think he is and doesn't warrent the constant criticism he gets. If he was a starter, ok, fine, but he's not so I don't understand the obsession.

 

You know that somebody is going to come out with a bunch of stats trying to prove that you are wrong. I agree with you BTW.

 

So what you're saying is.... People will come out with their side of the evidense, with actual *GASP* proof to back up what they are saying...

 

What a novel concept.

 

 

he is the second-worst hitter of ALL TIME. if he gets enough playing time this year, he will move into first. what more do you need? no amount of defense makes up for the amount of playing time he's gotten.

[3Dog]

he is the second-worst hitter of ALL TIME. if he gets enough playing time this year, he will move into first. what more do you need? no amount of defense makes up for the amount of playing time he's gotten.

 

I knew Neifi was bad but not THAT bad!

 

By what measurement is he the 2nd worst of all time? OPB, SLG?

[Productive Outs]

he is the second-worst hitter of ALL TIME. if he gets enough playing time this year, he will move into first. what more do you need? no amount of defense makes up for the amount of playing time he's gotten.

 

I knew Neifi was bad but not THAT bad!

 

By what measurement is he the 2nd worst of all time? OPB, SLG?

 

looks like i was a bit off. he's only the third worst hitter of all time at the moment.

 

http://www.hardballtimes.com/main/article/the-real-chase/

[anemic offense]

Wow, another thread questioning Dusty's every utterance.

I think this is legit. It's absurd to hide an injury to "bluff".

 

I don't necessarily think bluffing an injury is absurd if there's something to be gained from it. But in this instance, how can the opposition exploit the injury? It's a friggin finger for Keyriced sakes, what are they going to do, try to drill him every time he's up?

 

Not that it was ever in doubt, but this just reaffirms the stupidity that is Dusty Baker. Unbelievable.

[anemic offense]

I don't believe it was an attempt to hide an injury but the fact that Barrett basically said he was unavailable (to even pinch hit). We all know he is day to day, so at least let them go under the assumption that you may be available to pinch hit. The injury was not hidden they just didn't want the fact that he was unavailable to pinch hit known, I think that is a pretty smart move.

 

Bingo! I think this is the real point. Barrett removed the idea that he was available at all which potentially changes how the Brewers will use their bullpen late in the game.

 

This could be a valid argument, for one AB. However the first time Barrett DOESN'T come on to pinch hit in a likely situation the cover's blown anyway. I wouldn't think 1 "phantom" AB would make that much of a difference in the greater scheme of things, though strenger things have happened.

[Blueheart05]

I don't believe it was an attempt to hide an injury but the fact that Barrett basically said he was unavailable (to even pinch hit). We all know he is day to day, so at least let them go under the assumption that you may be available to pinch hit. The injury was not hidden they just didn't want the fact that he was unavailable to pinch hit known, I think that is a pretty smart move.

 

Bingo! I think this is the real point. Barrett removed the idea that he was available at all which potentially changes how the Brewers will use their bullpen late in the game.

 

This could be a valid argument, for one AB. However the first time Barrett DOESN'T come on to pinch hit in a likely situation the cover's blown anyway. I wouldn't think 1 "phantom" AB would make that much of a difference in the greater scheme of things, though strenger things have happened.

 

I disagree. Teams decoy all the time with hitters they really don't intend to bat. I remember last year, Kenny Williams was upset with Frank Thomas because he didn't conceal his foot injury during the Cubs series. He wanted Thomas to stand on deck and help alter the manger's decision. Anyway, the Cubs have a short bench to start with so if teams know that Barrett is unavailable it will affect more than just one AB. Having the threat of power off the bench is big.

[Monco]

Are the Cubs finally admitting that they will lie about an injury?

[Diffusion]

Are the Cubs finally admitting that they will lie about an injury?

 

For the ten thousandth time, it's not lying, it's war strategy.

[Monco]

Are the Cubs finally admitting that they will lie about an injury?

 

For the ten thousandth time, it's not lying, it's war strategy.

 

I wish people would believe yhat the Cubs use war strategy.Like when they say Prior may be delayed a week.You cannot take it literally.

[abuck1220]

i wish you guys would quit bumping this thread...other teams may read this and find out about barrett's...um...decision to randomly take a couple days off. 8-[

[CubsWin]

I don't believe it was an attempt to hide an injury but the fact that Barrett basically said he was unavailable (to even pinch hit). We all know he is day to day, so at least let them go under the assumption that you may be available to pinch hit. The injury was not hidden they just didn't want the fact that he was unavailable to pinch hit known, I think that is a pretty smart move.

 

Bingo! I think this is the real point. Barrett removed the idea that he was available at all which potentially changes how the Brewers will use their bullpen late in the game.

 

This could be a valid argument, for one AB. However the first time Barrett DOESN'T come on to pinch hit in a likely situation the cover's blown anyway. I wouldn't think 1 "phantom" AB would make that much of a difference in the greater scheme of things, though strenger things have happened.

 

I disagree. Teams decoy all the time with hitters they really don't intend to bat. I remember last year, Kenny Williams was upset with Frank Thomas because he didn't conceal his foot injury during the Cubs series. He wanted Thomas to stand on deck and help alter the manger's decision. Anyway, the Cubs have a short bench to start with so if teams know that Barrett is unavailable it will affect more than just one AB. Having the threat of power off the bench is big.

Apparently, the Cubs aren't the only team in MLB to have this policy...

 

mlb.com[/url]"]Brewers manager Ned Yost, whose bullpen was already stretched thin at that time, stayed mum about the fact Kolb was unavailable to pitch in a series at Shea Stadium against the Mets.

 

"There's times when the information is pertinent, and there's times when it ain't," Yost said.

 

Injuries are pertinent, according to Yost, when they are "obvious" -- a player leaves a game, for example -- or are serious enough to send a player to the DL. Day-to-day issues like Barrett's thumb and Kolb's elbow should be kept in-house, the way the Brewers treated Rickie Weeks' thumb injury during the second half of last season.

 

"People knew he had some thumb problems, but not that it was serious enough that it needed surgery," said Yost of Weeks, who did have surgery after the season to repair a torn ligament at the base of his left thumb. "That's nothing new -- everybody does that. Why tell the other team about every little thing?"

Can we say, "mountain out of a molehill" with this thread?

[3Dog]

looks like i was a bit off. he's only the third worst hitter of all time at the moment.

 

http://www.hardballtimes.com/main/article/the-real-chase/

 

Thanks Dobson. Now we need the Cub brain trust to start paying attention to this RCAA!