Willis available at deadline?

[David]

Why would we go after Cabrera?

 

How can anyone ask this question seriously?

 

Cabrera is the next big superstar of this league. Actually, with the numbers he has put up in his first 2.5 years, he already is one at the young age of 22.

[soccer10k]

Why would we go after Cabrera?

 

How can anyone ask this question seriously?

 

Cabrera is the next big superstar of this league. Actually, with the numbers he has put up in his first 2.5 years, he already is one at the young age of 22.

 

How do you know that Murton isn't going to be a superstar as well? As for Cabrera being 22, we have seen with Latin American players that what they claim their age to be isn't always true (re: Rafael Furcal). Murton is only 24, 25 in October and Cabrera is about to turn 23.

[Guest]

Why would we go after Cabrera?

 

How can anyone ask this question seriously?

 

Cabrera is the next big superstar of this league. Actually, with the numbers he has put up in his first 2.5 years, he already is one at the young age of 22.

 

How do you know that Murton isn't going to be a superstar as well? As for Cabrera being 22, we have seen with Latin American players that what they claim their age to be isn't always true (re: Rafael Furcal). Murton is only 24, 25 in October and Cabrera is about to turn 23.

The point isn't that he believes Murton won't be a star. The point is that while Murton may or may not reach star level, Cabrera already is one.

[snoodmonger]

Why would we go after Cabrera?

 

How can anyone ask this question seriously?

 

Cabrera is the next big superstar of this league. Actually, with the numbers he has put up in his first 2.5 years, he already is one at the young age of 22.

 

How do you know that Murton isn't going to be a superstar as well? As for Cabrera being 22, we have seen with Latin American players that what they claim their age to be isn't always true (re: Rafael Furcal). Murton is only 24, 25 in October and Cabrera is about to turn 23.

 

There's not really much of a comparison between the two players. Cabrera is already vastly superior. If you have a chance to get him, do it.

[texascub]

Is it possible we could get a middle infielder in the deal too?

 

Why? Cedeno has looked solid at the bat and I think once he gets settled in the big leagues his D will return to normal as well. We've also got E-Patt who is absolutely destroying AA right now and he barely turned 23 on Saturday.

[soccer10k]

Why would we go after Cabrera?

 

How can anyone ask this question seriously?

 

Cabrera is the next big superstar of this league. Actually, with the numbers he has put up in his first 2.5 years, he already is one at the young age of 22.

 

How do you know that Murton isn't going to be a superstar as well? As for Cabrera being 22, we have seen with Latin American players that what they claim their age to be isn't always true (re: Rafael Furcal). Murton is only 24, 25 in October and Cabrera is about to turn 23.

 

There's not really much of a comparison between the two players. Cabrera is already vastly superior. If you have a chance to get him, do it.

 

My point is that we don't even know what Murton can do over a full season yet. If he ends up being a step below Cabrera offensively, then there is no point in getting Cabrera for just a small upgrade.

[Transmogrified Tiger]

Why would we go after Cabrera?

 

How can anyone ask this question seriously?

 

Cabrera is the next big superstar of this league. Actually, with the numbers he has put up in his first 2.5 years, he already is one at the young age of 22.

 

How do you know that Murton isn't going to be a superstar as well? As for Cabrera being 22, we have seen with Latin American players that what they claim their age to be isn't always true (re: Rafael Furcal). Murton is only 24, 25 in October and Cabrera is about to turn 23.

 

There's not really much of a comparison between the two players. Cabrera is already vastly superior. If you have a chance to get him, do it.

 

My point is that we don't even know what Murton can do over a full season yet. If he ends up being a step below Cabrera offensively, then there is no point in getting Cabrera for just a small upgrade.

 

Again, Cabrera can play RF. And again, there's no comparison between Cabrera and Murton. Cabrera is already one of the best hitters in the game at age 22, Murton has the ceiling of a decent corner OF at age 24.

[SouthSideRyan]

Is it possible we could get a middle infielder in the deal too?

 

Why? Cedeno has looked solid at the bat and I think once he gets settled in the big leagues his D will return to normal as well. We've also got E-Patt who is absolutely destroying AA right now and he barely turned 23 on Saturday.

 

Sarcasm. As we already have a glut of starting pitching, I thought adding to our all MIF bench would be a good idea.

[NorthsideAvenger]

Why would we go after Cabrera?

 

How can anyone ask this question seriously?

 

Cabrera is the next big superstar of this league. Actually, with the numbers he has put up in his first 2.5 years, he already is one at the young age of 22.

 

How do you know that Murton isn't going to be a superstar as well? As for Cabrera being 22, we have seen with Latin American players that what they claim their age to be isn't always true (re: Rafael Furcal). Murton is only 24, 25 in October and Cabrera is about to turn 23.

 

There's not really much of a comparison between the two players. Cabrera is already vastly superior. If you have a chance to get him, do it.

 

My point is that we don't even know what Murton can do over a full season yet. If he ends up being a step below Cabrera offensively, then there is no point in getting Cabrera for just a small upgrade.

 

I don't see how you can fessibly compare Murton and Cabrera. I love "The Red Ghost" as much as anybody, but his likely "average" statline, would be a "down yr" for Cabrera. Look this is Cabrera's career numbers of BA/OBP/SLG/OPS 299 .365 .523 .888, now I could see Murton hit slightly better, reach base about the same, but I don't SEE Murton slugging as well as Cabrera. I see Murton as a low .800 (to low .900 slg in a career yr) OPS kind of player in his prime. Which to me...means Murton is likekly to be a 22-23 type homerun power with 30 doubles. Cabrera in his career has average 33 doubles and 26 homeruns a yr, and his numbers are still GOING UP.

 

I like Murton, but if the Marlins want him in a deal for Cabrera, I would do it in a heartbeat. Cause Murton is a complimentary player, while Cabrera is an IMPACT player. Nonetheless, I am glad to have "The Red Ghost."

[soccer10k]

Why would we go after Cabrera?

 

How can anyone ask this question seriously?

 

Cabrera is the next big superstar of this league. Actually, with the numbers he has put up in his first 2.5 years, he already is one at the young age of 22.

 

How do you know that Murton isn't going to be a superstar as well? As for Cabrera being 22, we have seen with Latin American players that what they claim their age to be isn't always true (re: Rafael Furcal). Murton is only 24, 25 in October and Cabrera is about to turn 23.

 

There's not really much of a comparison between the two players. Cabrera is already vastly superior. If you have a chance to get him, do it.

 

My point is that we don't even know what Murton can do over a full season yet. If he ends up being a step below Cabrera offensively, then there is no point in getting Cabrera for just a small upgrade.

 

I don't see how you can fessibly compare Murton and Cabrera. I love "The Red Ghost" as much as anybody, but his likely "average" statline, would be a "down yr" for Cabrera. Look this is Cabrera's career numbers of BA/OBP/SLG/OPS 299 .365 .523 .888, now I could see Murton hit slightly better, reach base about the same, but I don't SEE Murton slugging as well as Cabrera. I see Murton as a low .800 (to low .900 slg in a career yr) OPS kind of player in his prime. Which to me...means Murton is likekly to be a 22-23 type homerun power with 30 doubles. Cabrera in his career has average 33 doubles and 26 homeruns a yr, and his numbers are still GOING UP.

 

I like Murton, but if the Marlins want him in a deal for Cabrera, I would do it in a heartbeat. Cause Murton is a complimentary player, while Cabrera is an IMPACT player. Nonetheless, I am glad to have "The Red Ghost."

 

If you are going to trade Murton then yes. But I don't want to give up some of our good young arms to get Cabrera (re: Dontrelle Willis). If we can get a good deal for him then by all means go for it. But based on the fact that (since I found this out recently and if I'm wrong please correct me) Cabrera isn't going to leave via free agency after the year so I'm assuming the Marlins are going to want to get a good deal for him.

[David]

I know you can't tell everything from looks (Actually, I'm Cabrera's age and look just as young as he does).. but, for whatever reason, I don't think this guy is lying about his age...(unless he said he was older so he could get signed sooner :lol: )

 

http://florida.marlins.mlb.com/mlb/photo/photogallery/2003_2nd_half_moments/fla/10.jpg

 

http://www.justminors.com/Images/Stuff_8x10CCExclusiveCabrera.jpg

Edited April 11, 2006 by David

[NorthsideAvenger]

Why would we go after Cabrera?

 

How can anyone ask this question seriously?

 

Cabrera is the next big superstar of this league. Actually, with the numbers he has put up in his first 2.5 years, he already is one at the young age of 22.

 

How do you know that Murton isn't going to be a superstar as well? As for Cabrera being 22, we have seen with Latin American players that what they claim their age to be isn't always true (re: Rafael Furcal). Murton is only 24, 25 in October and Cabrera is about to turn 23.

 

There's not really much of a comparison between the two players. Cabrera is already vastly superior. If you have a chance to get him, do it.

 

My point is that we don't even know what Murton can do over a full season yet. If he ends up being a step below Cabrera offensively, then there is no point in getting Cabrera for just a small upgrade.

 

I don't see how you can fessibly compare Murton and Cabrera. I love "The Red Ghost" as much as anybody, but his likely "average" statline, would be a "down yr" for Cabrera. Look this is Cabrera's career numbers of BA/OBP/SLG/OPS 299 .365 .523 .888, now I could see Murton hit slightly better, reach base about the same, but I don't SEE Murton slugging as well as Cabrera. I see Murton as a low .800 (to low .900 slg in a career yr) OPS kind of player in his prime. Which to me...means Murton is likekly to be a 22-23 type homerun power with 30 doubles. Cabrera in his career has average 33 doubles and 26 homeruns a yr, and his numbers are still GOING UP.

 

I like Murton, but if the Marlins want him in a deal for Cabrera, I would do it in a heartbeat. Cause Murton is a complimentary player, while Cabrera is an IMPACT player. Nonetheless, I am glad to have "The Red Ghost."

 

If you are going to trade Murton then yes. But I don't want to give up some of our good young arms to get Cabrera (re: Dontrelle Willis). If we can get a good deal for him then by all means go for it. But based on the fact that (since I found this out recently and if I'm wrong please correct me) Cabrera isn't going to leave via free agency after the year so I'm assuming the Marlins are going to want to get a good deal for him.

 

Not to be argumentative, but HOW ELSE are you going to get Cabrera? You expect to Miggy for pitchers like Pinto/Nolasco/Welly type ability? Of course not...Obviously you would have to part with a Marshall or a Guzman type talented youngster to get Cabera, and IMO, it's worth it.

[SouthSideRyan]

I know you can't tell everything from looks (Actually, I'm Cabrera's age and look just as young as he does).. but, for whatever reason, I don't think this guy is lying about his age...(unless he said he was older so he could get signed sooner :lol: )

 

Yeah, and just think of how good he's gonna get once he goes through puberty.

[MeatampPotatoesMan]

Why would we go after Cabrera?

 

How can anyone ask this question seriously?

 

Cabrera is the next big superstar of this league. Actually, with the numbers he has put up in his first 2.5 years, he already is one at the young age of 22.

 

How do you know that Murton isn't going to be a superstar as well? As for Cabrera being 22, we have seen with Latin American players that what they claim their age to be isn't always true (re: Rafael Furcal). Murton is only 24, 25 in October and Cabrera is about to turn 23.

 

There's not really much of a comparison between the two players. Cabrera is already vastly superior. If you have a chance to get him, do it.

 

My point is that we don't even know what Murton can do over a full season yet. If he ends up being a step below Cabrera offensively, then there is no point in getting Cabrera for just a small upgrade.

 

I don't see how you can fessibly compare Murton and Cabrera. I love "The Red Ghost" as much as anybody, but his likely "average" statline, would be a "down yr" for Cabrera. Look this is Cabrera's career numbers of BA/OBP/SLG/OPS 299 .365 .523 .888, now I could see Murton hit slightly better, reach base about the same, but I don't SEE Murton slugging as well as Cabrera. I see Murton as a low .800 (to low .900 slg in a career yr) OPS kind of player in his prime. Which to me...means Murton is likekly to be a 22-23 type homerun power with 30 doubles. Cabrera in his career has average 33 doubles and 26 homeruns a yr, and his numbers are still GOING UP.

 

I like Murton, but if the Marlins want him in a deal for Cabrera, I would do it in a heartbeat. Cause Murton is a complimentary player, while Cabrera is an IMPACT player. Nonetheless, I am glad to have "The Red Ghost."

 

If you are going to trade Murton then yes. But I don't want to give up some of our good young arms to get Cabrera (re: Dontrelle Willis). If we can get a good deal for him then by all means go for it. But based on the fact that (since I found this out recently and if I'm wrong please correct me) Cabrera isn't going to leave via free agency after the year so I'm assuming the Marlins are going to want to get a good deal for him.

 

Not to be argumentative, but HOW ELSE are you going to get Cabrera? You expect to Miggy for pitchers like Pinto/Nolasco/Welly type ability? Of course not...Obviously you would have to part with a Marshall or a Guzman type talented youngster to get Cabera, and IMO, it's worth it.

 

Florida is going to want solid position player prospects, including 2B. Their pitching is pretty stacked right now. I don't doubt that they'll net a quality pitcher in a Cabrera trade, but we just don't have the right pieces.

[Diffusion]

2B Eric Patterson

1B Derrek Lee

RF Miguel Cabrera

3B Aramis Ramirez

CF Felix Pie

LF Matt Murton

C Michael Barrett

SS Ronny Cedeno

 

There ya go.

[neely crenshaw]

look at what florida has traded for other spare parts(to them at least) i do not think they will get a ton at the break. no one really moved last break because the offers were underwhelming. add in that everyone knew what a slow year it would be in the offseason, i can't see people dropping a ton of big time prospects for 1 player. with the pitchers that will be free agents next year why would anyone unload the farm for willis? i'd like him but we could a zito or mulder for wood's salary slot and no prospects! if they want one high level like marshall or hill (not guzman or pie) then i am all for it if they want us to replenish there system again...FORGET IT! unless we have a healthy prior and/or wood we won't be a world series contender thsi season with or without willis.

now if we went after cabrera then we might go a little deeper. i would guess it would have to involve murton. jones is here for 3 years(which is who we should replace) if we are not signing pierre then we have to have pie over murton.

perhaps we send murton,dopriak or hill with a youngin for cabrera. he(mig) would certainly allow cedeno to just be average offensively(.240) and play defense.

-in a dream world we would have an outfield of murton, pierre and cabrera with pie waiting in the wings! but the only way someone is taking jones is if we pay him.....

[Ding Dong Johnson]

2B Eric Patterson

1B Derrek Lee

RF Miguel Cabrera

3B Aramis Ramirez

CF Felix Pie

LF Matt Murton

C Michael Barrett

SS Ronny Cedeno

 

There ya go.

 

Where do I sign?

[anemic offense]

Why would we go after Cabrera? He's listed as a 3B and I believe we have a decent 3B already. I'm not sure on that so somebody will have to let me know for sure. If you want him to play LF, don't we have Matt Murton already? I understand if Murton is hitting like Corey Patterson or suffers a serious injury. We need to wait and see if we really need him.

 

As for Willis, I agree that we need to wait and see if Wood/Prior/Miller can come back and pitch well for us. Even if 2 of them come back that solidifies our rotation.

 

Overall we need to take a wait and see approach to both players. I hope we don't need to make any trades because that will mean everything is going well.

 

I agree with that. His attitude stinks and he really won't fit anywhere on this team (with Jaque stuck in RF). The only logical way to fit him in this lineup would be to trade Murton, which I'm not a big fan of.

 

In addition one would also have to consider the salary ramifications. Assuming this team will have Aram, Lee, Prior, Z, and Cabrera (via trade) around long term, they would be committing roughly $60 million dollars in annual payroll to FIVE guys. Is that really feasible with the self-imposed monetary restraints this team faces? Not at all.

[CubinNY]

I agree with that. His attitude stinks and he really won't fit anywhere on this team (with Jaque stuck in RF). The only logical way to fit him in this lineup would be to trade Murton, which I'm not a big fan of.

 

In addition one would also have to consider the salary ramifications. Assuming this team will have Aram, Lee, Prior, Z, and Cabrera (via trade) around long term, they would be committing roughly $60 million dollars in annual payroll to FIVE guys. Is that really feasible with the self-imposed monetary restraints this team faces? Not at all.

 

You have a very ironic screen name.

[anemic offense]

I agree with that. His attitude stinks and he really won't fit anywhere on this team (with Jaque stuck in RF). The only logical way to fit him in this lineup would be to trade Murton, which I'm not a big fan of.

 

In addition one would also have to consider the salary ramifications. Assuming this team will have Aram, Lee, Prior, Z, and Cabrera (via trade) around long term, they would be committing roughly $60 million dollars in annual payroll to FIVE guys. Is that really feasible with the self-imposed monetary restraints this team faces? Not at all.

 

You have a very ironic screen name.

 

For now...yes, and I hope it stays that way. :D

[CaliforniaRaisin]

2B Eric Patterson

1B Derrek Lee

RF Miguel Cabrera

3B Aramis Ramirez

CF Felix Pie

LF Matt Murton

C Michael Barrett

SS Ronny Cedeno

 

There ya go.

 

That's a sexy lineup.

[Guest]

2B Eric Patterson

1B Derrek Lee

RF Miguel Cabrera

3B Aramis Ramirez

CF Felix Pie

LF Matt Murton

C Michael Barrett

SS Ronny Cedeno

 

There ya go.

 

That's a sexy lineup.

Too right handed. ;)

 

There's no way any manager in baseball would hit Lee 2nd. You'd have one of Pie, Murton or Cedeno up there.

[vance_the_cubs_fan]

Marlins owner Jeffery Loria calls the Willis trade rumors "ridiculous."

 

Link

 

"I saw Buster Olney talking about it. I looked at the TV and said, 'What the (heck) are you talking about?' " Loria said before Friday's game. "It's outrageous. It's utterly ridiculous. They're not going anywhere."

 

Loria acknowledged that during his tenure here, no player has been untouchable.

 

"It's never safe to assume anything in this game," he said, "but if we were going to go do something, we would have done something in the off-season."

 

And a last word on it...

 

Sources with several teams said they had not heard any talk within the industry about the Marlins' interest in trading Willis or Cabrera.

 

But those sources also said they would not be surprised if one or both were aggressively shopped after the season, before their salaries climb.

 

My guess is that neither is moved this season unless the Marlins are overwhelmed with an offer.

[vance_the_cubs_fan]

Here's Peter Gammons' take on what it would take to get Willis should the Marlins make him available.

 

Now, if they believe that Nolasco, Johnson and others can form the core of a rotation similar to that of Willis, Josh Beckett, A.J. Burnett and Brad Penny, they might explore a Willis deal in July, or over the winter. They do not need cash, so any deal would have to include two prime positional prospects: center field, catcher, a major bat -- and a top pitching prospect. Only the Dodgers and Angels would seem to be in a position to even discuss that kind of a trade.

 

The Beckett deal was different, because they needed to unload $18M in Mike Lowell. But they still got two of Boston's six best prospects in Ramirez and Sanchez. Willis would only be moved if the deal completed most of the remaining parts of the 2008 puzzle.

 

There is no need to move payroll now. Revenue-sharing will take care of any paper losses.