Baker on who may be in the 2 hole...

[BigbadB]

And again I will say that Perez will be starting at SS and play in at least 140 games.

 

I'd love to be able to argue this point, but with Baker as manager, I can't. Look at Jason Dubois' game log last year. When he was crushing the ball, he sat. When Dusty finally figured out Hollandsworth was not the answer, Dubois had cooled off dramatically. Might have been all that extra bench time. We'll never know.

 

Murton sat. Cedeno got sent down in favor of Enrique Wilson. First sign of struggle, and I wouldn't doubt that Grissom and Perez are playing everyday.

 

And I have even less faith that Dusty learned his lesson batting Neifi at the top of the order. I'd bet he wouldn't know how many times Neifi hit into a double play last year. I'd bet he wouldn't know how poor his OBP was hitting at the top of the order.

 

I hope I'm wrong.

[barodacubs]

i think neifi should be starting

 

 

 

in Triple-A

[Jehrico]

i think neifi should be starting

 

 

 

for the Cardinals.

 

Fixed

[Chief_Cardinal]

Dusty can talk all he wants. The bottom line is that with very very few exceptions, when given the option, he's almost ALWAYS taken the bad veteran over the youngster with more potential, and he's used the bad veteran incorrectly almost 100% of the time.

 

If this is true, then all the worry about Walker not starting shouldn't be a concern! :wink: Sorry, I still don't understand the love Walker gets on here, he certainly doesn't get that kind of love around MLB and the non NSBB Cubs fans (to an extent). While he may be the best available option at this time, I understand completely that 2B would be a position up for grabs for the Cubs.

 

As for the 2 hole, I would think having someone who can move the runners over would be a must. If DLee is having another year like last year, the concern should be more about the guy batting behind him in the order than in front of him. If they keep walking DLee and ARam is driving them in a lot, then teams won't be so anxious to walk DLee everytime 1st base is open. Putting DLee on first should be viewed as a positive, rather than a negative...its one more chance to score!

[goonys evil twin]

Dusty can talk all he wants. The bottom line is that with very very few exceptions, when given the option, he's almost ALWAYS taken the bad veteran over the youngster with more potential, and he's used the bad veteran incorrectly almost 100% of the time.

 

If this is true, then all the worry about Walker not starting shouldn't be a concern! :wink: Sorry, I still don't understand the love Walker gets on here, he certainly doesn't get that kind of love around MLB and the non NSBB Cubs fans (to an extent). While he may be the best available option at this time, I understand completely that 2B would be a position up for grabs for the Cubs.

 

As for the 2 hole, I would think having someone who can move the runners over would be a must. If DLee is having another year like last year, the concern should be more about the guy batting behind him in the order than in front of him. If they keep walking DLee and ARam is driving them in a lot, then teams won't be so anxious to walk DLee everytime 1st base is open. Putting DLee on first should be viewed as a positive, rather than a negative...its one more chance to score!

 

You and a lot of others mistake accepting the fact that Walker is the best option we got with a love for his game.

 

Walker is the only legit 2 hitter on the team. I don't see what makes you think that the concern is more about the guy batting behind Lee. Ramirez is perfectly capable of filling that spot. The real problem area on the team is the 5 hole. However, if the Cubs deal Walker, then go with Neifi/Hairston in the 2 hole, then 2 and 5 could become huge problems.

[CuseCubFan69]

And again I will say that Perez will be starting at SS and play in at least 140 games.

 

I'd love to be able to argue this point, but with Baker as manager, I can't. Look at Jason Dubois' game log last year. When he was crushing the ball, he sat. When Dusty finally figured out Hollandsworth was not the answer, Dubois had cooled off dramatically. Might have been all that extra bench time. We'll never know.

 

Murton sat. Cedeno got sent down in favor of Enrique Wilson. First sign of struggle, and I wouldn't doubt that Grissom and Perez are playing everyday.

 

And I have even less faith that Dusty learned his lesson batting Neifi at the top of the order. I'd bet he wouldn't know how many times Neifi hit into a double play last year. I'd bet he wouldn't know how poor his OBP was hitting at the top of the order.

 

I hope I'm wrong.

 

Me too BbB....me too. Unless somebody gets hurt I think Perez will get his time in. Why, because he has a good glove and has a decent batting average and IMO Baker has a comfort level with him.

 

I thought Mabry would get the AB's in left but what really worries me is a platoon of Mabry and Grissom in left and Murton on the bench.

[Chief_Cardinal]

I don't think the 5 hole will be a concern. I was just noting that the people worried about DLee getting walked all the time due to the #2 guy moving the runner over shouldn't be concerned about DLee getting walked all the time. Those walks are a good thing for the team, as long as the guy hitting behind Lee is producing. Granted its not exciting to see DLee getting walked all the time (heck I even want to see him hit), but thats a plus for the team, not a minus. Then if ARam is tearing it up behind him....even better. And if ARam is tearing it up behind him, then thats eventually going to lead to more chances for DLee.

[dalgreen]

It's not just that Pierre shouldn't steal with Neifi batting second. He won't be able to steal with Neifi batting second. The guy just doesn't take enough pitchers.

 

And if Dusty values Pierre's speed enough to not bad Neifi there, that could mean 1) he's not starting at second and 2) might not be starting regularly since Neifi's value to Dusty goes down a bit if he's hitting 7th or 8th.

 

At least I hope.

 

I can't imagine how many blown steals Pierre will have when Neifi fouls off a pitch in the dirt after Pierre is almost standing on second.

 

There is still no doubt in my mind Perez will be the starting SS.

 

Are we all talking about the same Juan Pierre? Or are some of you assuming he's going to all of a sudden start stealing at an 80% success rate? I won't mention that he needs to also improve his OBP for any of this concern regarding the #2 position to be relevant. I loathe the idea of Perez starting at second, but if neither Walker nor Hairston clearly beats him out statistically then that's more of a slam on Walker and Hairston.

 

I'm not a big fan of Baker to say the least. But I'll give him a little more of a chance since he'll have no excuses this year. After all, he finally has more speed, a leadoff man, a good bullpen and better defense up the middle.... something he's been crying about since the end of 2003. Now he has no excuses to fall back on.

 

I don't remember writing about him having a 80% steal rate but I'll read my post again to see if I did........nope, I didn't. My point is that Perez will take away steals from him because he swings at every pitch.

 

And again I will say that Perez will be starting at SS and play in at least 140 games.

 

Sorry, Cuse. I used your quote but wasn't necessarily addressing my post to you. I was addressing those who think that whoever hits second will have a negative effect on Pierre's stolen base accuracy. He's going to have to improve an awful lot because he wasn't an efficient basestealer even without Neifi hitting behind him, plus Pierre has to get on base to even have a chance at stealing -- something else he wasn't that good at. Barring an injury to Cedeno, I'll make a cyber bet with you that Perez won't be starting at SS. Wish I felt as confident that he won't be starting at second, though.

[CuseCubFan69]

It's not just that Pierre shouldn't steal with Neifi batting second. He won't be able to steal with Neifi batting second. The guy just doesn't take enough pitchers.

 

And if Dusty values Pierre's speed enough to not bad Neifi there, that could mean 1) he's not starting at second and 2) might not be starting regularly since Neifi's value to Dusty goes down a bit if he's hitting 7th or 8th.

 

At least I hope.

 

I can't imagine how many blown steals Pierre will have when Neifi fouls off a pitch in the dirt after Pierre is almost standing on second.

 

There is still no doubt in my mind Perez will be the starting SS.

 

Are we all talking about the same Juan Pierre? Or are some of you assuming he's going to all of a sudden start stealing at an 80% success rate? I won't mention that he needs to also improve his OBP for any of this concern regarding the #2 position to be relevant. I loathe the idea of Perez starting at second, but if neither Walker nor Hairston clearly beats him out statistically then that's more of a slam on Walker and Hairston.

 

I'm not a big fan of Baker to say the least. But I'll give him a little more of a chance since he'll have no excuses this year. After all, he finally has more speed, a leadoff man, a good bullpen and better defense up the middle.... something he's been crying about since the end of 2003. Now he has no excuses to fall back on.

 

I don't remember writing about him having a 80% steal rate but I'll read my post again to see if I did........nope, I didn't. My point is that Perez will take away steals from him because he swings at every pitch.

 

And again I will say that Perez will be starting at SS and play in at least 140 games.

 

Sorry, Cuse. I used your quote but wasn't necessarily addressing my post to you. I was addressing those who think that whoever hits second will have a negative effect on Pierre's stolen base accuracy. He's going to have to improve an awful lot because he wasn't an efficient basestealer even without Neifi hitting behind him, plus Pierre has to get on base to even have a chance at stealing -- something else he wasn't that good at. Barring an injury to Cedeno, I'll make a cyber bet with you that Perez won't be starting at SS. Wish I felt as confident that he won't be starting at second, though.

 

How about this bet Dale...how about an under/over with Perez? I say 140 games or more....you want to take the under? I'll even make this bet with a healthy Cedeno, Walker and Hairston.

 

 

I think that Perez would still take some steals from Pierre. Pierre might even add to Perez and his total amount of DP's that he hits into if that could be possible, that is if Neifi bats second. I agree that Pierre has to get on base in the first place to steal but he has gotten on base better than Patterson or Perez did when they lead off so he is better in that regard. Of course this goes along the thoughts of Murton being the most productive OF....we're always marking on a curve we Cub fans are.

[dalgreen]

It's not just that Pierre shouldn't steal with Neifi batting second. He won't be able to steal with Neifi batting second. The guy just doesn't take enough pitchers.

 

And if Dusty values Pierre's speed enough to not bad Neifi there, that could mean 1) he's not starting at second and 2) might not be starting regularly since Neifi's value to Dusty goes down a bit if he's hitting 7th or 8th.

 

At least I hope.

 

I can't imagine how many blown steals Pierre will have when Neifi fouls off a pitch in the dirt after Pierre is almost standing on second.

 

There is still no doubt in my mind Perez will be the starting SS.

 

Are we all talking about the same Juan Pierre? Or are some of you assuming he's going to all of a sudden start stealing at an 80% success rate? I won't mention that he needs to also improve his OBP for any of this concern regarding the #2 position to be relevant. I loathe the idea of Perez starting at second, but if neither Walker nor Hairston clearly beats him out statistically then that's more of a slam on Walker and Hairston.

 

I'm not a big fan of Baker to say the least. But I'll give him a little more of a chance since he'll have no excuses this year. After all, he finally has more speed, a leadoff man, a good bullpen and better defense up the middle.... something he's been crying about since the end of 2003. Now he has no excuses to fall back on.

 

I don't remember writing about him having a 80% steal rate but I'll read my post again to see if I did........nope, I didn't. My point is that Perez will take away steals from him because he swings at every pitch.

 

And again I will say that Perez will be starting at SS and play in at least 140 games.

 

Sorry, Cuse. I used your quote but wasn't necessarily addressing my post to you. I was addressing those who think that whoever hits second will have a negative effect on Pierre's stolen base accuracy. He's going to have to improve an awful lot because he wasn't an efficient basestealer even without Neifi hitting behind him, plus Pierre has to get on base to even have a chance at stealing -- something else he wasn't that good at. Barring an injury to Cedeno, I'll make a cyber bet with you that Perez won't be starting at SS. Wish I felt as confident that he won't be starting at second, though.

 

How about this bet Dale...how about an under/over with Perez? I say 140 games or more....you want to take the under? I'll even make this bet with a healthy Cedeno, Walker and Hairston.

 

 

I think that Perez would still take some steals from Pierre. Pierre might even add to Perez and his total amount of DP's that he hits into if that could be possible, that is if Neifi bats second. I agree that Pierre has to get on base in the first place to steal but he has gotten on base better than Patterson or Perez did when they lead off so he is better in that regard. Of course this goes along the thoughts of Murton being the most productive OF....we're always marking on a curve we Cub fans are.

 

I haven't heard Baker use the dreaded "platoon" word yet, so I feel pretty confident that Perez won't start at SS. And if neither Walker nor Hairston can't clearly beat him out statistically in spring training then those two don't deserve to start. Having said that, the only way I see Perez playing in 140 games is due to injuries or he comes in every game in the eighth and ninth as a defensive replacement at second. Other than that, there's no way he plays in 140 games -- I'll take the under.

[CuseCubFan69]

How about this bet Dale...how about an under/over with Perez? I say 140 games or more....you want to take the under? I'll even make this bet with a healthy Cedeno, Walker and Hairston.

 

 

I think that Perez would still take some steals from Pierre. Pierre might even add to Perez and his total amount of DP's that he hits into if that could be possible, that is if Neifi bats second. I agree that Pierre has to get on base in the first place to steal but he has gotten on base better than Patterson or Perez did when they lead off so he is better in that regard. Of course this goes along the thoughts of Murton being the most productive OF....we're always marking on a curve we Cub fans are.

 

I haven't heard Baker use the dreaded "platoon" word yet, so I feel pretty confident that Perez won't start at SS. And if neither Walker nor Hairston can't clearly beat him out statistically in spring training then those two don't deserve to start. Having said that, the only way I see Perez playing in 140 games is due to injuries or he comes in every game in the eighth and ninth as a defensive replacement at second. Other than that, there's no way he plays in 140 games -- I'll take the under.

 

 

You're on my friend! If I win you have to use a Syracuse sig and if you win I'll use an Illinois one...sound fair?

[dalgreen]

How about this bet Dale...how about an under/over with Perez? I say 140 games or more....you want to take the under? I'll even make this bet with a healthy Cedeno, Walker and Hairston.

 

 

I think that Perez would still take some steals from Pierre. Pierre might even add to Perez and his total amount of DP's that he hits into if that could be possible, that is if Neifi bats second. I agree that Pierre has to get on base in the first place to steal but he has gotten on base better than Patterson or Perez did when they lead off so he is better in that regard. Of course this goes along the thoughts of Murton being the most productive OF....we're always marking on a curve we Cub fans are.

 

I haven't heard Baker use the dreaded "platoon" word yet, so I feel pretty confident that Perez won't start at SS. And if neither Walker nor Hairston can't clearly beat him out statistically in spring training then those two don't deserve to start. Having said that, the only way I see Perez playing in 140 games is due to injuries or he comes in every game in the eighth and ninth as a defensive replacement at second. Other than that, there's no way he plays in 140 games -- I'll take the under.

 

 

You're on my friend! If I win you have to use a Syracuse sig and if you win I'll use an Illinois one...sound fair?

 

My undying allegiance to my alma mater will prohibit me from using a sig (a non negative one) from another institution. I'll be happy to use you in a sig in some way, though. And the bet is that barring injuries, or coming in late as a defensive replacement, Neifi Perez will not play in 140 games as a Cub this season.

[frostwyrm]

It's not just that Pierre shouldn't steal with Neifi batting second. He won't be able to steal with Neifi batting second. The guy just doesn't take enough pitchers.

 

And if Dusty values Pierre's speed enough to not bad Neifi there, that could mean 1) he's not starting at second and 2) might not be starting regularly since Neifi's value to Dusty goes down a bit if he's hitting 7th or 8th.

 

At least I hope.

 

I can't imagine how many blown steals Pierre will have when Neifi fouls off a pitch in the dirt after Pierre is almost standing on second.

 

There is still no doubt in my mind Perez will be the starting SS.

 

Are we all talking about the same Juan Pierre? Or are some of you assuming he's going to all of a sudden start stealing at an 80% success rate? I won't mention that he needs to also improve his OBP for any of this concern regarding the #2 position to be relevant. I loathe the idea of Perez starting at second, but if neither Walker nor Hairston clearly beats him out statistically then that's more of a slam on Walker and Hairston.

 

I'm not a big fan of Baker to say the least. But I'll give him a little more of a chance since he'll have no excuses this year. After all, he finally has more speed, a leadoff man, a good bullpen and better defense up the middle.... something he's been crying about since the end of 2003. Now he has no excuses to fall back on.

 

I don't remember writing about him having a 80% steal rate but I'll read my post again to see if I did........nope, I didn't. My point is that Perez will take away steals from him because he swings at every pitch.

 

And again I will say that Perez will be starting at SS and play in at least 140 games.

 

At 3.23 pitches per PA Neifi ranked 146 of 148 qualified MLB batters in ESPN's stats. I doubt Dusty knows that.

 

http://sports.espn.go.com/mlb/stats/batting?seasonType=2&type=exp&sort=pitchesPerPlateAppearance&minpa=0&split=0&season=2005&pos=all&hand=a&league=mlb&ageMin=17&ageMax=51&qual=true&count=109

[nilodnayr]

Did anyone see the Walker quote where he said he wishes Hairston the best of luck and is completely fine with either Hairston or himself starting? Notice Neifi is nowhere to be found as I'm sure Walker sees him as Pokey the second.

[nilodnayr]

Dusty can talk all he wants. The bottom line is that with very very few exceptions, when given the option, he's almost ALWAYS taken the bad veteran over the youngster with more potential, and he's used the bad veteran incorrectly almost 100% of the time.

 

If this is true, then all the worry about Walker not starting shouldn't be a concern! :wink: Sorry, I still don't understand the love Walker gets on here, he certainly doesn't get that kind of love around MLB and the non NSBB Cubs fans (to an extent). While he may be the best available option at this time, I understand completely that 2B would be a position up for grabs for the Cubs.

 

As for the 2 hole, I would think having someone who can move the runners over would be a must. If DLee is having another year like last year, the concern should be more about the guy batting behind him in the order than in front of him. If they keep walking DLee and ARam is driving them in a lot, then teams won't be so anxious to walk DLee everytime 1st base is open. Putting DLee on first should be viewed as a positive, rather than a negative...its one more chance to score!

 

The only NL secondbasemen with OPS over 800 in both 2004 and 2005 are Kent, Walker, and Giles. Considering Giles is making over 1M more than Walker already in his first year of arbi, and Kent is making 6.5M more than him, Walker might be something of a good value. Frankly, I dont care what you, the rest of the MLB or non NSBB cubs fans think. I know that Walker is a ridiculously good value with average (not detrimental) defense. Would you have liked 90 more OPS points coming out of second base last year for the cards?

[SouthSideRyan]

I thought Mabry would get the AB's in left but what really worries me is a platoon of Mabry and Grissom in left and Murton on the bench.

 

Please don't. I'm approaching my character limit in my sig.

[CuseCubFan69]

I thought Mabry would get the AB's in left but what really worries me is a platoon of Mabry and Grissom in left and Murton on the bench.

 

Please don't. I'm approaching my character limit in my sig.

 

I noticed that you don't have a "Perez will not start" on your sig. :wink:

 

If Baker proves me wrong I'll be thrilled. The second Murton struggles he'll be learning from the bench like a good young player should.

[SouthSideRyan]

I thought Mabry would get the AB's in left but what really worries me is a platoon of Mabry and Grissom in left and Murton on the bench.

 

Please don't. I'm approaching my character limit in my sig.

 

I noticed that you don't have a "Perez will not start" on your sig. :wink:

 

 

Cause I only post things I know, and one can never underestimate the power of Neifury~!

[Soul]

It's not just that Pierre shouldn't steal with Neifi batting second. He won't be able to steal with Neifi batting second. The guy just doesn't take enough pitchers.

 

And if Dusty values Pierre's speed enough to not bad Neifi there, that could mean 1) he's not starting at second and 2) might not be starting regularly since Neifi's value to Dusty goes down a bit if he's hitting 7th or 8th.

 

At least I hope.

 

I can't imagine how many blown steals Pierre will have when Neifi fouls off a pitch in the dirt after Pierre is almost standing on second.

 

There is still no doubt in my mind Perez will be the starting SS.

 

Are we all talking about the same Juan Pierre? Or are some of you assuming he's going to all of a sudden start stealing at an 80% success rate? I won't mention that he needs to also improve his OBP for any of this concern regarding the #2 position to be relevant. I loathe the idea of Perez starting at second, but if neither Walker nor Hairston clearly beats him out statistically then that's more of a slam on Walker and Hairston.

 

I'm not a big fan of Baker to say the least. But I'll give him a little more of a chance since he'll have no excuses this year. After all, he finally has more speed, a leadoff man, a good bullpen and better defense up the middle.... something he's been crying about since the end of 2003. Now he has no excuses to fall back on.

 

I don't remember writing about him having a 80% steal rate but I'll read my post again to see if I did........nope, I didn't. My point is that Perez will take away steals from him because he swings at every pitch.

 

And again I will say that Perez will be starting at SS and play in at least 140 games.

 

At 3.23 pitches per PA Neifi ranked 146 of 148 qualified MLB batters in ESPN's stats. I doubt Dusty knows that.

 

http://sports.espn.go.com/mlb/stats/batting?seasonType=2&type=exp&sort=pitchesPerPlateAppearance&minpa=0&split=0&season=2005&pos=all&hand=a&league=mlb&ageMin=17&ageMax=51&qual=true&count=109

 

I doubt he cares, either. Dusty was never one to let reality get in the way of favoritism. Kind of like Scott Skiles and Kirk Heinrich. If he's your boy, then he can do no wrong.

 

Neifi is Dusty's boy.

[ToupeeOnFire]

Duzty loves Walka,

 

Herez proooof...

 

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v511/freejju/22077925.jpg

[Soul]

Duzty loves Walka,

 

Herez proooof...

 

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v511/freejju/22077925.jpg

 

:lol:

 

With that wry smile on Walker's face, I had to do a double take to make sure it wasn't his middle finger sticking up.