Uh-Oh: Cubs offer for Jones confirmed

[anemic offense]

the cards still have the nucleus of edmonds, pujols, and rolen.

 

while we have aram and lee, it's not quite the same. the card lineup scores runs in it's sleep because their 3 main guys hit and get on base.

 

As good as the Cardinals nucleus has been I'd think you'd be surprised what their numbers would have been with this manager on last year's team. The Cards had better overall team speed while we had none. The Cards have LaRussa who is 3 times the manager Baker ever though of being. The Cards had a roster full of guys who could sacrifice, hit and run, and get on base. We had none. Again those three players are great players but some of what they are has been made by what's been around them. In contrast the Cubs have put forth the worst set of complimentary players in all of baseball. Lee, ARam, and Barret consistently produce, 1 guy is maybe average while the rest are so below average they bring evryone else down. How many of these guys have the Cardinals had? Point is some of their guys aren't great, but they don't bring the team down either. And I think their big dogs benefit (they also contribut to it to) from that.

 

the cards success had nothing to do with sacrificing or hitting and running. they simply have 3 perrenial silver sluggers who take walks and hit the crap out of the ball.

 

That's crap. Again not to take away from their offensive superstarts, but this dimension of their game gives them SEVERAL runs a year. Is if the main reason for the success? Of course not. But when you have a team that does SEVERAL little things execeptionally well, it adds to the overall performance of the team. You can't tell me 1st to 3rds, hit and runs, bunts, and situational hitting aren't key cogs to this team's success. If you don't want to take my words for it ask the Cardinal fan's. I think you'd be surprised.

[CubfaninCA]

Hendry's going to get ripped apart regardless of what he does.

 

If Hendry lands Abreu or Tejada (for Hill or Guzman + Williams+ prospect) the only people ripping Hendry will be the village contrarians who feel the need to play martyr.

 

That's a huge IF. Huff, Dunn, Abreu, Tejada, etc. have a lot bigger price tags than what we'd like. Same goes for top tier free agents either they're way too expensive or prefer to stay in San Diego.

[goonys evil twin]

Fine give Lee 390 before he learned how to hit for average last year his OBP was still aroudn 380. Give Murton 360 he has had a great eye his entire minor league career and there is no way that will change now that he is in the majors. Then give Cedeno 330. That is still better than last year.

 

And still not reflective of the likely reality. Hendry still wants Walker gone. And Neifi will play a lot. We'd have to be ecstatic with Murton being at .340. He's also not going to start 140 games. Whatever veteran Dusty has a fetish for to sub in will put up some awful numbers. Blanco will start 50 games at have a sub .300 OBP, negating some of the benefit of Barrett's better than average numbers. There is still no bench, but the bench will play.

 

Right now the offense is no better than last year. If they get a RF who can duplicate Burnitz's numbers, the offense might be marginally better. But marginally better is not worth a $100m payroll. Marginally better is unacceptable. Hendry has a lot of work to do, or a lot of luck to hope for, to make this offense significantly better. And significantly better is the only thing Cubs fans should be remotely satisfied with.

[anemic offense]

The reason our offense was horrible last year was because the OBP of or top two was like .300. That was what killed us.

 

What killed the offense was a lack of OBP almost everywhere, which was due to a lack of walks. It was not solely because of the 1 and 2 spots, no matter what Hendry tries to sell you this offseason. They sucked in the 4 or 5 spot (whichever one Burnitz was hitting from), and were an awful bottom of the order team as well. And they had absolutely no bench. They were a team full of 6 and 7 hitters.

 

which is why we shouldn't get bogged down in this "filling important holes in the lineup" rhetoric.

 

there are no holes in the lineup, we'll be batting 8 position players ahead of 1 pitcher come april. the problem is with overall organizational hitting philosophy. hendry's too busy hoping we'll all be dazzled by a big name like pierre and the proverbial hole he fills at leadoff to worry about hitting philosophy.

 

this lineup needs a healthy dose of OBP, not at a single position, but at all positions.

 

Starting line up as of now with OBP from last year

Pierre 326

Walker 355

Lee 418

Ramirez 358

Barrett 345

Murton 386

Cedeno 350

Patterson 254

 

Assuming Pierre bounces back to the 340-360 range we only ahve one weak spot in our order right now and that is RF. I would have to say our lineup is improved over last year. I don't know how anyone can deny that. The simple fact that we don't have Nefi and Corey or Hairston batting one two improves the lineup.

 

You also can't ignore that there's virtually no chance that Lee, Murton and Cedeno put up OBP's of .418, .386 and .350 over a full season next year.

 

Murton probably won't, but I don't think Lee's will regress all that much. His batting average will probably drop but I bet his OBP is in the .390 - .410 range. Cedeno's a different story. He does SOOO many things well that I wouldn't be surprised if he duplicated that (though I wouldn't count on it). I actually think he could surpass it.

[YearofDaCubs]

I can't believe some of you are putting Murton and Cedeno locks at .350 OBP. The simple fact is we don't knwo what they will give us and if they do struggle in comes Mabry and Perez. I like both rookies but let's not make them into all-stars just yet.

[goonys evil twin]

Murton probably won't, but I don't think Lee's will regress all that much. His batting average will probably drop but I bet his OBP is in the .390 - .410 range. Cedeno's a different story. He does SOOO many things well that I wouldn't be surprised if he duplicated that (though I wouldn't count on it). I actually think he could surpass it.

 

You don't build an offense around what you think guys could do if things work out. You build an offense, and a team, about what is likely to happen. And Ronny is not likely to surpass last year's numbers.

[USSoccer]

Hendry's going to get ripped apart regardless of what he does.

 

If Hendry lands Abreu or Tejada (for Hill or Guzman + Williams+ prospect) the only people ripping Hendry will be the village contrarians who feel the need to play martyr.

 

That's a huge IF. Huff, Dunn, Abreu, Tejada, etc. have a lot bigger price tags than what we'd like. Same goes for top tier free agents either they're way too expensive or prefer to stay in San Diego.

 

At this point the level of criticism will depend on how Hendry handles the lack of options out there. If he decides to make the best of it, minimize the risk and sign Wilson to a 1 yr deal, then the criticism will be muted when it comes to that move, but the criticism will shift to why we ended up with the best of a terrible group of FA options. And it's Hendry's job to plan ahead to make sure he doesn't put himself and the club in a spot where he's forced to overpay for someone as bad as Jones, or get bled for prospects for a player like Aubrey Huff.

 

If you've put yourself in a spot where your free agent RF options are Jones, Encarnacion and Wilson, and you can't trade for someone better for whatever reason, you do the responsible thing and sign whichever one will take the cheapest deal in term of years and money. Minimize your risk. Look to upgrade in June or July. Strengthen the starting rotation to the point here it's a lock to be good. Signing one of them for more than year would be a stupid long term move.

Edited December 20, 2005 by USSoccer

[Magnetic Curses]

That's crap. Again not to take away from their offensive superstarts, but this dimension of their game gives them SEVERAL runs a year.

 

it also takes several runs away per year. paying lip service to the times it is effective while ignoring how many times it's ineffective is short-sighted.

 

You can't tell me 1st to 3rds, hit and runs, bunts, and situational hitting aren't key cogs to this team's success.

 

yes, i can. the cardinals have success because they have 3 great hitters and an overachieving staff.

 

If you don't want to take my words for it ask the Cardinal fan's. I think you'd be surprised.

 

what, by talking to a fan? i talk to cubs fans all of the time, and many of them actually think that neifi is an effective player! i doubt cardinal fans can offer much more insight into their team. they'd probably say something like: "the cards do better because of clubhouse chemistry" or some other bs baseball mythology.

 

i'll repay your sentiment and tell you that your views are full of conventional mythology that amounts to a pile of crap itself.

[goonys evil twin]

That's crap. Again not to take away from their offensive superstarts, but this dimension of their game gives them SEVERAL runs a year. Is if the main reason for the success? Of course not. But when you have a team that does SEVERAL little things execeptionally well, it adds to the overall performance of the team. You can't tell me 1st to 3rds, hit and runs, bunts, and situational hitting aren't key cogs to this team's success. If you don't want to take my words for it ask the Cardinal fan's. I think you'd be surprised.

 

STL and the Cubs were very close in sacrifice hits and sacrifice flies last year, in the middle of the NL pack. Sacrifices, and the little things, are not why STL had success. The big things are. The Cards ranked 3rd in OBP, and 3rd in runs scored. There's your correlation for offensive success. And they pitched extremely well. There's your overall success.

 

Washington, San Francisco, Florida, Pittsburgh, and San Diego were among the most sacrificial teams in the league last year. Those little things are things that weaker offensive teams do, and they don't correlate to success.

[jmajew]

Fine give Lee 390 before he learned how to hit for average last year his OBP was still aroudn 380. Give Murton 360 he has had a great eye his entire minor league career and there is no way that will change now that he is in the majors. Then give Cedeno 330. That is still better than last year.

 

And still not reflective of the likely reality. Hendry still wants Walker gone. And Neifi will play a lot. We'd have to be ecstatic with Murton being at .340. He's also not going to start 140 games. Whatever veteran Dusty has a fetish for to sub in will put up some awful numbers. Blanco will start 50 games at have a sub .300 OBP, negating some of the benefit of Barrett's better than average numbers. There is still no bench, but the bench will play.

 

Right now the offense is no better than last year. If they get a RF who can duplicate Burnitz's numbers, the offense might be marginally better. But marginally better is not worth a $100m payroll. Marginally better is unacceptable. Hendry has a lot of work to do, or a lot of luck to hope for, to make this offense significantly better. And significantly better is the only thing Cubs fans should be remotely satisfied with.

 

I really can't argue with the fact that Dusty may not play these young guys who have much more potential than anyone else we could throw out there. One has to think that Dusty will put the guys out there who will give us the best chance to win. Those guys in my opinion are Murton and Cedeno. If both of them play 140 games which they should IMO and I think everyone elses their OBPs of lets say both about 340 is still better than last years from their respected positions.

 

Theoretically, without the Baker problem included, our lineup should be upgraded over last years. Hendry did what he could to upgrade the lineup. If Baker doesn't use the players properly that is his fault.

[CubfaninCA]

The reason our offense was horrible last year was because the OBP of or top two was like .300. That was what killed us.

 

What killed the offense was a lack of OBP almost everywhere, which was due to a lack of walks. It was not solely because of the 1 and 2 spots, no matter what Hendry tries to sell you this offseason. They sucked in the 4 or 5 spot (whichever one Burnitz was hitting from), and were an awful bottom of the order team as well. And they had absolutely no bench. They were a team full of 6 and 7 hitters.

 

which is why we shouldn't get bogged down in this "filling important holes in the lineup" rhetoric.

 

there are no holes in the lineup, we'll be batting 8 position players ahead of 1 pitcher come april. the problem is with overall organizational hitting philosophy. hendry's too busy hoping we'll all be dazzled by a big name like pierre and the proverbial hole he fills at leadoff to worry about hitting philosophy.

 

this lineup needs a healthy dose of OBP, not at a single position, but at all positions.

 

Starting line up as of now with OBP from last year

Pierre 326

Walker 355

Lee 418

Ramirez 358

Barrett 345

Murton 386

Cedeno 350

Patterson 254

 

Assuming Pierre bounces back to the 340-360 range we only ahve one weak spot in our order right now and that is RF. I would have to say our lineup is improved over last year. I don't know how anyone can deny that. The simple fact that we don't have Nefi and Corey or Hairston batting one two improves the lineup.

 

You also can't ignore that there's virtually no chance that Lee, Murton and Cedeno put up OBP's of .418, .386 and .350 over a full season next year.

 

Fine give Lee 390 before he learned how to hit for average last year his OBP was still aroudn 380. Give Murton 360 he has had a great eye his entire minor league career and there is no way that will change now that he is in the majors. Then give Cedeno 330. That is still better than last year.

 

That lineup will have two problems. 1 Neifi will probably start over Cedeno. He won't produce much, but as long as he's batting 8th I don't mind. 2nd obviously they need more from RF. However, Pierre, Walker, Lee, ARam, Murton & Barrett should provide adequate obp. Neifi, Burnitz & Patterson absolutely killed the Cubs last year. Fortunately, two of those guys probably won't be w/ the Cubs.

[BigbadB]

Hendry's going to get ripped apart regardless of what he does.

 

Not true. You and I have butted heads all offseason, so while you are under the impression I am all gloom and doom while I'm under the impression you believe Hendry can do no wrong, there is a middle point most likely for both of us.

 

I had my hopes set for a certain line up this offseason. Expecting my line up to be that line up is unrealistic. However, that wasn't the only line up that would satisfy me. I said right after the offseason ended to give me a line up with .350+ OBP throughout and this team will win more games than it loses.

 

Burnitz, Preston Wilson, Jacque Jones, Juan Encarnacion, etc.. cannot provide a .350+ OBP. I could honestly deal with a year of Jacque Jones if we had Abreu or Tejada or both playing in the same line up. However, the "improvements" I have seen this offseason are a .326 OBP lead off hitter, the resigning of a sub .300 OBP of Neifi Perez, Cedeno will be lucky to be anywhere close to .350 in his rookie year, Murton will likely make it, but he has no back up in place if he gets hurt, Patterson is sub .300 OBP, and the trade Walker rumors haven't gone away completely.

 

I would have been fine with letting Nomar walk, Walker walk, Patterson walk, etc... if they would have replaced them with guys who know how to get on base at a decent clip.

 

I'm not all gloom and doom. Honestly. I've adopted a philosophy that getting on base improves your run scoring chances. Maybe it's not a good philosophy, and maybe it wouldn't get the Cubs any farther in the standings by adopting it as well, but these stats are why I'm so gung ho on improving team OBP:

 

Cubs in 2005

270 AVG, 440 SLG, 703 runs, 419 walks

Reds in 2005

261 AVG, 446 SLG, 820 runs, 611 walks

 

We had a better AVG, slightly worse SLG, and scored 117 less runs. Couple a comparable offense to the Reds of last year with our pitching staff, and I think you have a pennant winning caliber team.

[Magnetic Curses]

That's crap. Again not to take away from their offensive superstarts, but this dimension of their game gives them SEVERAL runs a year. Is if the main reason for the success? Of course not. But when you have a team that does SEVERAL little things execeptionally well, it adds to the overall performance of the team. You can't tell me 1st to 3rds, hit and runs, bunts, and situational hitting aren't key cogs to this team's success. If you don't want to take my words for it ask the Cardinal fan's. I think you'd be surprised.

 

STL and the Cubs were very close in sacrifice hits and sacrifice flies last year, in the middle of the NL pack. Sacrifices, and the little things, are not why STL had success. The big things are. The Cards ranked 3rd in OBP, and 3rd in runs scored. There's your correlation for offensive success. And they pitched extremely well. There's your overall success.

 

Washington, San Francisco, Florida, Pittsburgh, and San Diego were among the most sacrificial teams in the league last year. Those little things are things that weaker offensive teams do, and they don't correlate to success.

 

total sacrifices:

 

chicago- 106

 

st louis- 112

 

walks:

 

chicago- 419 (dead last)

 

st louis- 534

 

but i'm sure that there was some special kind of magic in st louis sacrifices that gave them the out back or something.

 

i'll say it again, wasting an out is stupid if it's not the pitcher making it.

[goonys evil twin]

One has to think that Dusty will put the guys out there who will give us the best chance to win.

 

Why would one have to think that? I have to think there's enough evidence to support the idea that this will not necessarily be the case.

 

You're still being overly enthusiastic about the realistic rookie seasons from Murton and Cedeno. And while OBP is huge, it's not the only thing. You still need some SLG, especially when you are guaranteed bad OBP is some spots.

 

Look, you can talk all you want about Pierre upgrade in the leadoff spot. But the fact is, while the Cubs were 16th in the NL in OPS from the CF position last year, that was not all Corey, and Florida was 15th. So, while Pierre in 2006 should be much better than Corey in 2005, the Cubs total CF production is not likely to be all that much better in 2006 than 2005.

 

You should never get so focused on one specific area of offense that you ignore total production. If you want SB, fine, but you better watch out that you don't decrease total production just to increase one component of production. If you want more HR, fine, but don't go after HR at the risk of decreasing total production. The Cubs still have issues with the expected total production from their entire lineup.

[anemic offense]

Murton probably won't, but I don't think Lee's will regress all that much. His batting average will probably drop but I bet his OBP is in the .390 - .410 range. Cedeno's a different story. He does SOOO many things well that I wouldn't be surprised if he duplicated that (though I wouldn't count on it). I actually think he could surpass it.

 

You don't build an offense around what you think guys could do if things work out. You build an offense, and a team, about what is likely to happen. And Ronny is not likely to surpass last year's numbers.

 

I never said that, and I agree with the gist of what you're saying. However, my "man love" for Ronny Cedeno won't let me say he'll produce anything less than last year. I base this on very little (outside his rapid progression and fundamentally sound play), but I think he will trump that .350. There I said it. Now flame away. :lol:

[jmajew]

I can't believe some of you are putting Murton and Cedeno locks at .350 OBP. The simple fact is we don't knwo what they will give us and if they do struggle in comes Mabry and Perez. I like both rookies but let's not make them into all-stars just yet.

 

I strongly believe that Murton will have and OBP between 340 and 360. He has had a great eye all throughout the minors. There is no reason for that to change. So his average may drop to like 270 but because he has such a good eye he should still have and OBP of around 340.

 

Cedeno is more of a crapshoot. He could be anywhere between 310 and 360. So lets say he is at 330. Cedeno has lowered is SO totals in every year in the minor and his walks have gone up. So I believe Cedeno has been figuring the strike zone out. Guys who have good plate discipline in the minors will still have it in the majors. The players who rely on talent to get through the minors are the ones you need to worry about. The perfect example being Corey Patterson he never learned plate discipline in the minors which is why he never learned it in the pros.

 

I know these kids are rookies but I don't think these OBP would make them even remotely close to all stars. There are a lot of good supporting players in this league who put up OBP like these. That is all i'm asking and hoping from these kids. The numbers I am hoping for are still better than what we had last year from those positions.

[CubfaninCA]

Hendry's going to get ripped apart regardless of what he does.

 

Not true. You and I have butted heads all offseason, so while you are under the impression I am all gloom and doom while I'm under the impression you believe Hendry can do no wrong, there is a middle point most likely for both of us.

 

I had my hopes set for a certain line up this offseason. Expecting my line up to be that line up is unrealistic. However, that wasn't the only line up that would satisfy me. I said right after the offseason ended to give me a line up with .350+ OBP throughout and this team will win more games than it loses.

 

Burnitz, Preston Wilson, Jacque Jones, Juan Encarnacion, etc.. cannot provide a .350+ OBP. I could honestly deal with a year of Jacque Jones if we had Abreu or Tejada or both playing in the same line up. However, the "improvements" I have seen this offseason are a .326 OBP lead off hitter, the resigning of a sub .300 OBP of Neifi Perez, Cedeno will be lucky to be anywhere close to .350 in his rookie year, Murton will likely make it, but he has no back up in place if he gets hurt, Patterson is sub .300 OBP, and the trade Walker rumors haven't gone away completely.

 

I would have been fine with letting Nomar walk, Walker walk, Patterson walk, etc... if they would have replaced them with guys who know how to get on base at a decent clip.

 

I'm not all gloom and doom. Honestly. I've adopted a philosophy that getting on base improves your run scoring chances. Maybe it's not a good philosophy, and maybe it wouldn't get the Cubs any farther in the standings by adopting it as well, but these stats are why I'm so gung ho on improving team OBP:

 

Cubs in 2005

270 AVG, 440 SLG, 703 runs, 419 walks

Reds in 2005

261 AVG, 446 SLG, 820 runs, 611 walks

 

We had a better AVG, slightly worse SLG, and scored 117 less runs. Couple a comparable offense to the Reds of last year with our pitching staff, and I think you have a pennant winning caliber team.

 

Hendry's done plenty wrong by sticking w/ Baker.

 

I just think that if the Cubs get Tejada, such a deal will tick of a lot of people cause he'll basically have to deal off most of the farm for him. Same goes for Abreu.

 

Maybe Hendry lucks into Floyd or Wilkerson, but I'm starting to lose hope. This is the Cubs afterall. :?

[Fred Hornkohl]

Just thought I'd throw in Zip's projections for 2006 for the afore mentioned lineup.........

 

Name         P    AVG   OBP   SLG   G  AB   R   H 2B 3B HR RBI  BB   K SB CS 
Pierre*      cf  .293  .346  .364 162 676  92 198 22 10  2  61  50  41 52 22 
Walker*      2b  .277  .336  .435 125 451  60 125 26  3 13  57  40  49  1  2 
Lee          1b  .309  .398  .582 159 593 104 183 44  2 38 114  84 121 14  5 
Ramirez      3b  .302  .359  .541 142 549  83 166 33  1 32 104  45  75  1  2 
Barrett      c   .276  .342  .468 125 410  47 113 29  4 14  58  37  60  0  3 
Murton       lf  .289  .350  .430 137 470  64 136 16  4 14  56  42  77 10  5 
Cedeno       ss  .287  .332  .412 113 345  46  99 15  2  8  40  20  63 13  4 
Patterson*   cf  .252  .298  .418 146 564  73 142 23  4 21  68  36 147 23  8

[daske17]

Just thought I'd throw in Zip's projections for 2006 for the afore mentioned lineup.........

 

Name         P    AVG   OBP   SLG   G  AB   R   H 2B 3B HR RBI  BB   K SB CS 
Pierre*      cf  .293  .346  .364 162 676  92 198 22 10  2  61  50  41 52 22 
Walker*      2b  .277  .336  .435 125 451  60 125 26  3 13  57  40  49  1  2 
Lee          1b  .309  .398  .582 159 593 104 183 44  2 38 114  84 121 14  5 
Ramirez      3b  .302  .359  .541 142 549  83 166 33  1 32 104  45  75  1  2 
Barrett      c   .276  .342  .468 125 410  47 113 29  4 14  58  37  60  0  3 
Murton       lf  .289  .350  .430 137 470  64 136 16  4 14  56  42  77 10  5 
Cedeno       ss  .287  .332  .412 113 345  46  99 15  2  8  40  20  63 13  4 
Patterson*   cf  .252  .298  .418 146 564  73 142 23  4 21  68  36 147 23  8

 

I'm not a stat guy, but those projections don't look bad. Am I wrong?

[BigbadB]

Hendry's done plenty wrong by sticking w/ Baker.

 

I just think that if the Cubs get Tejada, such a deal will tick of a lot of people cause he'll basically have to deal off most of the farm for him. Same goes for Abreu.

 

Maybe Hendry lucks into Floyd or Wilkerson, but I'm starting to lose hope. This is the Cubs afterall. :?

 

There might be people who wouldn't like that deal, but that would be THEIR problem, not yours or mine. Tejada is the type of player you sell the farm for, as is Abreu. Not Huff, not Wilkerson, not Mench.

 

Don't lose hope. Once you've lost hope, there won't be anyone left. j/k :D

[nick23]

Just thought I'd throw in Zip's projections for 2006 for the afore mentioned lineup.........

 

Name         P    AVG   OBP   SLG   G  AB   R   H 2B 3B HR RBI  BB   K SB CS 
Pierre*      cf  .293  .346  .364 162 676  92 198 22 10  2  61  50  41 52 22 
Walker*      2b  .277  .336  .435 125 451  60 125 26  3 13  57  40  49  1  2 
Lee          1b  .309  .398  .582 159 593 104 183 44  2 38 114  84 121 14  5 
Ramirez      3b  .302  .359  .541 142 549  83 166 33  1 32 104  45  75  1  2 
Barrett      c   .276  .342  .468 125 410  47 113 29  4 14  58  37  60  0  3 
Murton       lf  .289  .350  .430 137 470  64 136 16  4 14  56  42  77 10  5 
Cedeno       ss  .287  .332  .412 113 345  46  99 15  2  8  40  20  63 13  4 
Patterson*   cf  .252  .298  .418 146 564  73 142 23  4 21  68  36 147 23  8

 

Wow, that's an awful line for Walker. I wonder how they came to that conclusion?

[goonys evil twin]

I just think that if the Cubs get Tejada, such a deal will tick of a lot of people cause he'll basically have to deal off most of the farm for him. Same goes for Abreu.

 

Sure as hell won't tick off me.

[jmajew]

One has to think that Dusty will put the guys out there who will give us the best chance to win.

 

Why would one have to think that? I have to think there's enough evidence to support the idea that this will not necessarily be the case.

 

You're still being overly enthusiastic about the realistic rookie seasons from Murton and Cedeno. And while OBP is huge, it's not the only thing. You still need some SLG, especially when you are guaranteed bad OBP is some spots.

 

Look, you can talk all you want about Pierre upgrade in the leadoff spot. But the fact is, while the Cubs were 16th in the NL in OPS from the CF position last year, that was not all Corey, and Florida was 15th. So, while Pierre in 2006 should be much better than Corey in 2005, the Cubs total CF production is not likely to be all that much better in 2006 than 2005.

 

You should never get so focused on one specific area of offense that you ignore total production. If you want SB, fine, but you better watch out that you don't decrease total production just to increase one component of production. If you want more HR, fine, but don't go after HR at the risk of decreasing total production. The Cubs still have issues with the expected total production from their entire lineup.

 

I'll admit it I am being overly optimistic. I still don't see this offense being any worse than last years. Instead of having two guys in our lineup with and OBP of under 300 we will only have one, if we keep patterson in Right. To me that is automatically an improvement. Plus you also have to take into consideration that you won't have Holly and Dubois taking up time in left field with OBP of under 300. I understand that the upgrades have not been to the caliber that we had all hoped for but I see it as being slightly upgraded. I never said we were going to have a top of the line offense I just said it was upgraded.

[Blueheart05]

Just thought I'd throw in Zip's projections for 2006 for the afore mentioned lineup.........

 

Name         P    AVG   OBP   SLG   G  AB   R   H 2B 3B HR RBI  BB   K SB CS 
Pierre*      cf  .293  .346  .364 162 676  92 198 22 10  2  61  50  41 52 22 
Walker*      2b  .277  .336  .435 125 451  60 125 26  3 13  57  40  49  1  2 
Lee          1b  .309  .398  .582 159 593 104 183 44  2 38 114  84 121 14  5 
Ramirez      3b  .302  .359  .541 142 549  83 166 33  1 32 104  45  75  1  2 
Barrett      c   .276  .342  .468 125 410  47 113 29  4 14  58  37  60  0  3 
Murton       lf  .289  .350  .430 137 470  64 136 16  4 14  56  42  77 10  5 
Cedeno       ss  .287  .332  .412 113 345  46  99 15  2  8  40  20  63 13  4 
Patterson*   cf  .252  .298  .418 146 564  73 142 23  4 21  68  36 147 23  8

 

They seem to think Walker' going to have a subpar season.

[UMFan83]

Lets give Jones $22 million for one season so we can at least say that we spent all our excess money this offseason