Corey Patterson?

[Warpticon]

Look, people.

 

Why do people stick up so hard for Patterson? Because he takes more crap than anybody not named Macias or Perez. Basically, because there are more opportunities to stick up for him. I'm honestly not sure why I do it so much, myself; I end up repeating the same things over and over, frequently to the same people.

 

See, here's the thing. Nobody's acting like he's not struggling. Nobody's saying you shouldn't be frustrated with his lack of production right now. I know I sure as hell am. The difference between the Patterson bashers and those that stand up for him is that we see it as a slump (those happen in baseball, you know), whereas the other side tends to proclaim that he's done, is stupid, has never improved, will never improve, doesn't care, is too stubborn to learn, hates Jews, lights gerbils on fire, whatever. And no, not everybody does that, but the sentiment is pervasive. People like myself don't comment just because we want to hype him up (it's amazing to me how many corey "bashers" talk about how hyped he is, or how his tolerable numbers are disappointed because of all the HYPE. Where is this hype coming from? I post here a lot, and I don't see it. Certainly haven't seen it lately. I see exponentially more bashing than I see hype.), but to defend him against the many misconceptions, unfair judgments, attacks, insults, and outright lies that come flying out when people are frustrated with his performance at any given time.

 

The bashers also have been a lot more inclined to throw out past positive performance to support their stances than the supporters are to do the opposite. (gotta love the "can't bunt" guy leading the majors in bunting efficiency, and a guy with 16 bunt hits only caring about home runs.) Corey is sucking with RISP and against lefties. Corey did not suck in that capacity last season, nor the season before. But because he's struggling now, bashers would say that he sucks against them in general. This happens much more rarely coming from the other direction.

 

DKWG, believe what you want to believe, but hyperbole does not help your cause. .329 and .320 aren't good, but they're a good bit better than .300. Completely incapable of making contact? That's an impressive stat line for a guy batting .000. Guess you missed the last two years? Extremely overrated defensively? Hardly, considering most outside of Cubs boards don't seem to know or care about his defensive abilities. Yes, his BB/k (and BB rate in general) is bad, but it's not everything. So if he breaks out of his slump in a week and starts putting up all-star numbers, are you going to reneg on your ascertainment? Not saying he's going to, but he's capable of it. If he continues to hit at as poorly as he has the last week or so over the long haul, then, certainly, there's serious cause for concern. I do find it interesting, though, how frequently other players get far more leeway with regards to struggle than Patterson does.

[sandberg23]

Look, people.

 

Why do people stick up so hard for Patterson? Because he takes more crap than anybody not named Macias or Perez. Basically, because there are more opportunities to stick up for him. I'm honestly not sure why I do it so much, myself; I end up repeating the same things over and over, frequently to the same people.

 

See, here's the thing. Nobody's acting like he's not struggling. Nobody's saying you shouldn't be frustrated with his lack of production right now. I know I sure as hell am. The difference between the Patterson bashers and those that stand up for him is that we see it as a slump (those happen in baseball, you know), whereas the other side tends to proclaim that he's done, is stupid, has never improved, will never improve, doesn't care, is too stubborn to learn, hates Jews, lights gerbils on fire, whatever. And no, not everybody does that, but the sentiment is pervasive. People like myself don't comment just because we want to hype him up (it's amazing to me how many corey "bashers" talk about how hyped he is, or how his tolerable numbers are disappointed because of all the HYPE. Where is this hype coming from? I post here a lot, and I don't see it. Certainly haven't seen it lately. I see exponentially more bashing than I see hype.), but to defend him against the many misconceptions, unfair judgments, attacks, insults, and outright lies that come flying out when people are frustrated with his performance at any given time.

 

The bashers also have been a lot more inclined to throw out past positive performance to support their stances than the supporters are to do the opposite. (gotta love the "can't bunt" guy leading the majors in bunting efficiency, and a guy with 16 bunt hits only caring about home runs.) Corey is sucking with RISP and against lefties. Corey did not suck in that capacity last season, nor the season before. But because he's struggling now, bashers would say that he sucks against them in general. This happens much more rarely coming from the other direction.

 

DKWG, believe what you want to believe, but hyperbole does not help your cause. .329 and .320 aren't good, but they're a good bit better than .300. Completely incapable of making contact? That's an impressive stat line for a guy batting .000. Guess you missed the last two years? Extremely overrated defensively? Hardly, considering most outside of Cubs boards don't seem to know or care about his defensive abilities. Yes, his BB/k (and BB rate in general) is bad, but it's not everything. So if he breaks out of his slump in a week and starts putting up all-star numbers, are you going to reneg on your ascertainment? Not saying he's going to, but he's capable of it. If he continues to hit at as poorly as he has the last week or so over the long haul, then, certainly, there's serious cause for concern. I do find it interesting, though, how frequently other players get far more leeway with regards to struggle than Patterson does.

 

Great post. Couldn't have said better myself. You nailed it when you said those that support Corey at least recognize he's not doing well now but that doesn't mean he's always done poorly nor is he completely sucking at every aspecct of the game currently. Those that "hate" him have no acknowledgement of his past successes nor can they admit that he may break out of whatever funk he's in now.

[Mizzou]

Putting up Corey's 03 numbers is a joke right?

 

I'll assume that was directed towards me. (too lazy to see if anyone else has posted numbers on the first page) I'm not sure where you're going with that though.

[CubinNY]

Putting up Corey's 03 numbers is a joke right?

 

I'll assume that was directed towards me. (too lazy to see if anyone else has posted numbers on the first page) I'm not sure where you're going with that though.

 

Corey played less than half a season in 03. Putting up his numbers in that year makes it look like he has regressed.

 

I'll assume you forgot that he was hurt in '03. I'll also assume that you don't believe that '03 couldn't have had an effect on '04, especially at the end of the year. So I'll assume that your statistical analysis although accurate, does not tell the whole story.

 

As warp wrote, we all wish Corey would be hitting better. But a bad Corey is still better than most CFers in the league.

[Warpticon]

Putting up Corey's 03 numbers is a joke right?

 

I'll assume that was directed towards me. (too lazy to see if anyone else has posted numbers on the first page) I'm not sure where you're going with that though.

 

Corey played less than half a season in 03. Putting up his numbers in that year makes it look like he has regressed.

 

I'll assume you forgot that he was hurt in '03. I'll also assume that you don't believe that '03 couldn't have had an effect on '04, especially at the end of the year. So I'll assume that your statistical analysis although accurate, does not tell the whole story.

 

As warp wrote, we all wish Corey would be hitting better. But a bad Corey is still better than most CFers in the league.

 

More accurately, a struggling Corey is still about a middle-of-the-pack CF.

[Mizzou]

Putting up Corey's 03 numbers is a joke right?

 

I'll assume that was directed towards me. (too lazy to see if anyone else has posted numbers on the first page) I'm not sure where you're going with that though.

 

Corey played less than half a season in 03. Putting up his numbers in that year makes it look like he has regressed.

 

I'll assume you forgot that he was hurt in '03. I'll also assume that you don't believe that '03 couldn't have had an effect on '04, especially at the end of the year. So I'll assume that your statistical analysis although accurate, does not tell the whole story.

 

As warp wrote, we all wish Corey would be hitting better. But a bad Corey is still better than most CFers in the league.

 

So you want to throw out his numbers from 03 just because he missed half the season? Had I have put up numbers like homers, RBI's, runs, etc. I could understand that, however, the only numbers I posted were AVG, OBP, and SLG. So I don't see why on earth you'd want to throw those out.

[Mark_R]

Putting up Corey's 03 numbers is a joke right?

 

I'll assume that was directed towards me. (too lazy to see if anyone else has posted numbers on the first page) I'm not sure where you're going with that though.

 

Corey played less than half a season in 03. Putting up his numbers in that year makes it look like he has regressed.

 

I'll assume you forgot that he was hurt in '03. I'll also assume that you don't believe that '03 couldn't have had an effect on '04, especially at the end of the year. So I'll assume that your statistical analysis although accurate, does not tell the whole story.

 

As warp wrote, we all wish Corey would be hitting better. But a bad Corey is still better than most CFers in the league.

 

Very doubtful. From an overall standpoint, maybe. But from a hitting standpoint, that's really way off.

 

Now if you were arguing based on production compared to price, I'd be more inclined to agree.

[ondeckchamps]

He's a five tool player and will become a 10-time all-star!

 

 

You've got to be kidding,right??

 

 

The "5" tools

Hitting for average-no

Hitting for power-Thinks he's Sosa

Fielding-average,doesn't make enough plays to be considered "great".

Throwing-yes,not bad

Baserunning-He doesn't get on enough to find out.

[Transmogrified Tiger]

He's a five tool player and will become a 10-time all-star!

 

 

You've got to be kidding,right?

 

Yes, yes he was.

[biittner77]

He's a five tool player and will become a 10-time all-star!

 

 

You've got to be kidding,right??

 

 

The "5" tools

Hitting for average-no

Hitting for power-Thinks he's Sosa

Fielding-average,doesn't make enough plays to be considered "great".

Throwing-yes,not bad

Baserunning-He doesn't get on enough to find out.

 

Now who's kidding?

 

Patterson has more HRs than Carlos Beltran. He should hit between 20-30 HRs. Not bad for what is primarily a defense first position.

 

Fielding: he's better than average. He covers a lot of ground.

 

Baserunning: He may be the fastest Cub player I've ever seen.

[erik316wttn]

He's a five tool player and will become a 10-time all-star!

 

 

You've got to be kidding,right?

 

Yes, yes he was.

 

Yes, I was kidding.

[ondeckchamps]

Patterson has more HRs than Carlos Beltran.

 

 

And he also has more s/o's!

 

 

he's better than average. He covers a lot of ground.

 

 

He might cover a lot of ground but more times than not he misses it,he'll never compare to Edmonds or Andruw Jones.

 

 

He may be the fastest Cub player I've ever seen.

 

 

Well good for you,Anybody that wants to bat 6th is never going to be anything close to Carlos Beltran. He should be developing his skills at the top of the lineup and not worrying about HRs. If his goal is to be a 6th hitter, his ceiliing is Reggie Sanders.

[The_Realist]

Please don't ever compare Corey to Beltran again.

 

 

Beltran is a proven offensive/clutch player. Corey is NOT.

[ondeckchamps]

Hey, didn't start it look at biittner77.

[burnt out cubbie fan]

Please don't ever compare Corey to Beltran again.

 

 

Beltran is a proven offensive/clutch player. Corey is NOT.

He said that Corey has more home runs than Beltran. I don't understand why that got you all upset. It's true.

[Transmogrified Tiger]

Patterson has more HRs than Carlos Beltran.

 

 

And he also has more s/o's!

 

 

he's better than average. He covers a lot of ground.

 

 

He might cover a lot of ground but more times than not he misses it,he'll never compare to Edmonds or Andruw Jones.

 

 

He may be the fastest Cub player I've ever seen.

 

 

Well good for you,Anybody that wants to bat 6th is never going to be anything close to Carlos Beltran. He should be developing his skills at the top of the lineup and not worrying about HRs. If his goal is to be a 6th hitter, his ceiliing is Reggie Sanders.

 

Please read this

[ondeckchamps]

http://northsidebaseball.com/Forum/viewtopic.php?t=21572&start=30

 

Then read.

[Transmogrified Tiger]

http://northsidebaseball.com/Forum/viewtopic.php?t=21572&start=30

 

Then read.

 

I don't get it. I linked the other thread since you didn't post in it, and it rebutted several of your arguments. What's the point of linking this page of the thread that I've already posted in twice and telling me to read it?

[dime]

I don't care that Patterson is not a leadoff hitter...but I do care that he's not a good hitter. The Cubs have invested too much in him to settle for this poor man's Preston Wilson routine. They can't afford to "miss" on such a huge prospect...they don't have enough depth to settle for this.

 

The Andrew Jones comparison was interesting, because at that time the Braves could have gotten anyone they wanted for Jones in a trade. Sadly, it would appear Patterson's trade value peaked a year or two ago. They have to stick with him, hopefully he will show some improvement.

[ondeckchamps]

CPatterson20 I wasn't replying to you!!! I replied what biittner77 said I don't care what they said on the other page.

[Transmogrified Tiger]

CPatterson20 I wasn't replying to you!!! I replied what biittner77 said I don't care what they said on the other page.

 

Whoops. My bad. :oops:

[CubfaninCA]

Trade Patterson and a filler or two to Oakland and get Zito & Kotsay. Since rumors were that Beane wanted Mike Cameron, seems Patterson would be a nice fit in Oakland.

 

With Zito in the rotation, it makes it easier to deal Wood and upgrade the hitting.

[erik316wttn]

Trade Patterson and a filler or two to Oakland and get Zito & Kotsay. Since rumors were that Beane wanted Mike Cameron, seems Patterson would be a nice fit in Oakland.

 

With Zito in the rotation, it makes it easier to deal Wood and upgrade the hitting.

 

Zito sucks. Wood doesn't. Why not just turn around and trade Zito if you're so itching to trade a starter?

[CuseCubFan69]

I think it's ironic that 25/26 year old CPatt is tired and gets some rest but 85 year old Burnitz hasn't had a day off yet.

[biittner77]

Perhaps I should clarify. I'm not saying Patterson is better than Beltran. Nor am I saying that Patterson will ever be as good as Beltran. However, as it stands right now Patterson has more HRs than Beltran. Not bad for a guy that "Thinks he's Sammy Sosa". The point: hate Patterson all you want but he does have power.