Minor League Discussion & Boxes, 8-17-23

[CaliforniaRaisin]

Scheduled Games (All Times Central):

Iowa vs. Louisville, 6:38 pm
Tennessee vs. Rocket City, 6:00 pm
South Bend at West Michigan, 6:35 pm
Myrtle Beach at Columbia, 6:05 pm
ACL Cubs at ACL Rangers, 8:00 pm
DSL Cubs Blue at DSL Orioles Orange, 9:30 am
DSL Cubs Red vs. DSL Red Sox Red, 9:30 am

Probable Starters:

Iowa: LHP Jordan Wicks (28.1 IP, 3.81 ERA, 4.74 FIP, 23 K, 12 BB)
Tennessee: RHP Brandon Birdsell (5 IP, 3.60 ERA, 3.04 FIP, 3 K, 1 BB)
South Bend: RHP Grant Kipp (4.2 IP, 1.93 ERA, 1.34 FIP, 8 K, 2 BB)
Myrtle Beach: RHP Luis Rujano (42.1 IP, 2.34 ERA, 3.82 FIP, 48 K, 25 BB)

[Tim]

With Stroman going down for longer, it would be really helpful if Wicks started dominating.

[CaliforniaRaisin]

@squally1313- Hope the OP is better. Let me know!

[Tim]

Just now, CaliforniaRaisin said:

@squally1313- Hope the OP is better. Let me know!

Looks good in both light and dark mode on my pc

[We Got The Whole 9]

Very strong start for Wicks so far. I like that PCA is pushing his walk rate up at each level.

[CaliforniaRaisin]

Wicks wants Stroman‘s spot in the rotation in September.

[We Got The Whole 9]

Ran out of gas with 2 out and none on in the 5th. Gave up 3 straight hits and got the hook.

[JD94]

13 hours ago, TomtheBombadil said:

The Angels‘ farm picking up just in time to lose the Ohtani/Trout combo (when available) sounds about right. Schanuel’s cool, Kyren Paris is a rare prospect with leadoff potential 

Well the Angels just called up Schanuel lol. They waste no time with their prospects. 

[CubinNY]

16 minutes ago, JD94 said:

Well the Angels just called up Schanuel lol. They waste no time with their prospects. 

1st baseman too. Why wait, lol? 

Matt Mervis got drafted by the wrong org. (Yes I know Mervis struggled in his first season, I'm making a joke here)

[We Got The Whole 9]

He seriously looks like a Soto type with that discipline + power 

[CubinNY]

3 minutes ago, TomtheBombadil said:

That is The Future! MLB didn’t fatten up the NCAA and revamp their relationship to keep all of MiLB around for so long as part of The Pipeline (from LL to MLB). SS leagues are gone and never coming back already, next year is the ACL, and next CBA anything’s up (AAA? A ball?). All the business (all hail) blood in MLB wants to be is the NFL but baseball, esp the part where regular taxpayers cover most of the costs by buying and maintaining private stadiums, and they’ve made tremendous gains already

Congrats to Schanuel, this is what opportunity looks like. I hope he and Neto do damage early and often because The Man and his legions are already working on why they’re already overpaidz and Aging probably 

<Tight fist in air>

[CubinNY]

4 minutes ago, TomtheBombadil said:

That is The Future! MLB didn’t fatten up the NCAA and revamp their relationship to keep all of MiLB around for so long as part of The Pipeline (from LL to MLB). SS leagues are gone and never coming back already, next year is the ACL, and next CBA anything’s up (AAA? A ball?). All the business (all hail) blood in MLB wants to be is the NFL but baseball, esp the part where regular taxpayers cover most of the costs by buying and maintaining private stadiums, and they’ve made tremendous gains already

Congrats to Schanuel, this is what opportunity looks like. I hope he and Neto do damage early and often because The Man and his legions are already working on why they’re already overpaidz and Aging probably 

Tom, you do know that the business of minor league baseball is pretty lucrative for the owners of the minor league teams?

[CubinNY]

1 minute ago, TomtheBombadil said:

Even if true everywhere and all the time (the only kind of business - all hail - truly beloved and respected by The Man and his legions), and probably not so straightforward if it is, the MLB has no particular loyalty to MiLB owners. Maybe some have better relationships than others - I get that vibe with South Bend - and will be lucky enough to be part of a more NBA’s G league format of MiLB in a CBA or two 

I'm not sure, but I think the focus of removing the short season and the ACL is not to get rid of players, (although they do want to trim rosters too), it's because those development activities can be better and perhaps more effectively achieved by other means. 

It would truly not be in their best interest to get rid of the MiLB. But you never know with the owners. 

[Hrubes20]

1 hour ago, We Got The Whole 9 said:

He seriously looks like a Soto type with that discipline + power 

It's a Votto starter kit for me.  

[craig]

We're a farm-loving group.  But I admit I've never really understood the resentment over removing the Northwest League.  Compressing from 7 to 6 levels doesn't look like that slippery of a slope to me.  

The goal is player development, and I think that is better served in Mesa with all of its facilities and volume of coaches and pitch-lab and weight-room resources, etc., rather than sending some up to Eugene and its long bus rides.  That was the perception of the player-development people more than finances.  The cost factor for Eugene was a drop in the bucket relative to Cub expenses. 

There have always been occasional guys who fast-tracked it to the majors.  Neto and Schanuel, Hoerner and Schwarber.  There was a pitcher named Burt Hooton who the Cubs drafted and brought to the majors without a single minor-league appearance back in the 70's.  

I suspect that college is better at player-development now than in years past.  The usage of analytics is advanced.  So maybe some guys will reach their peaks more quickly.  But minor league baseball and player development have plenty of future.  

Edited August 18, 2023 by craig

[craig]

Neto, by the way, has a .315 OBP and .411 slugging.  [His OBP isn't worse because he gets HBP a lot.  He's got more HBP than walks, enabling the >.300 OBP with only a .241 BA.]  Perhaps that's just the developmental beginning, and he's going to improve in future.  Being 96 OPS+ as a rookie is a pretty good way to start a career, and he may get better and better.  But, I also wonder whether he may not perhaps already be near his ceiling?  And maybe won't get very much better than he already is?  

Not trying to criticize him. But if the Angels hypothetically get future what they've already got now, a kinda average guy might not be all that exciting long-term.  Even if they got anti-awful from Neto very quickly.  

[We Got The Whole 9]

9 minutes ago, craig said:

Neto, by the way, has a .315 OBP and .411 slugging.  [His OBP isn't worse because he gets HBP a lot.  He's got more HBP than walks, enabling the >.300 OBP with only a .241 BA.]  Perhaps that's just the developmental beginning, and he's going to improve in future.  Being 96 OPS+ as a rookie is a pretty good way to start a career, and he may get better and better.  But, I also wonder whether he may not perhaps already be near his ceiling?  And maybe won't get very much better than he already is?  

Not trying to criticize him. But if the Angels hypothetically get future what they've already got now, a kinda average guy might not be all that exciting long-term.  Even if they got anti-awful from Neto very quickly.  

He's a lot like Nico. A ready-made SS who can hang around league average offensively has plenty of value. I think he's close to his ceiling. 

[craig]

From economics standpoint, I think hustling guys up quickly is of dubious value.  Six years till free agency, I don't want to waste the first year and two on development.  I'd prefer as much development to for free in the minors, then get as much real big-league value as possible during the cheap and club-controlled years.  

Thus, I'm in no rush to call up Brown, Horton, PCA, Wicks, Shaw economics-wise.  *If* there is hypothetically still development to be gained in the minors, it's economically advantageous to get them as fully-developed as possible before calling them up.  

Obviously economics is one thing, winning is another.  Years-distant budget considerations are routinely outweighed by Nowacrate W-L considerations.  

[CaliforniaRaisin]

The Angels are doing this to a) bring as much talent as possible to try and make the playoffs and re-sign Ohtani and b) possibly because they've found a way to get talent they might not otherwise get or talent they can sign to smaller bonuses with the allure of a quicker promotion to the majors and getting to free agency quicker.

[CubinNY]

10 minutes ago, CaliforniaRaisin said:

The Angels are doing this to a) bring as much talent as possible to try and make the playoffs and re-sign Ohtani and b) possibly because they've found a way to get talent they might not otherwise get or talent they can sign to smaller bonuses with the allure of a quicker promotion to the majors and getting to free agency quicker.

Do you think the made assurances that he'd move through the minors quickly?

[craig]

The negotiation leverage for future draft agents is a great point.  Hadn't considered that.  

[Transmogrified Tiger]

23 minutes ago, TomtheBombadil said:

The long term economic outlook is maybe best reflected by Dansby Swanson vs the more conventional star SSs during 22-‘23 offseason FA. He had the most Future track (draft season MLB debut, first year full time starter) into FA, had all the bells and whistles, but firmly the least earning potential and standing with non-Braves fans and media 

Anything less than non-stop high production on offense from Day 1 MLB to FA is grounds for diminished FA earning potential because anything else lacks mass appeal outside of the home fanbase. It’s the NFL but baseball now. 

This doesn't make any sense man.  Swanson got the least of the FA SS because he got promoted super fast and had more non-elite seasons to criticize?  Swanson wasn't younger in his debut compared to the other SS(the opposite, mostly) and definitionally they have roundly the same amount of service time.

[CaliforniaRaisin]

9 hours ago, CubinNY said:

Do you think the made assurances that he'd move through the minors quickly?

Doubt they went that far but they probably promised a high start and quick promotions if deserved. Either way, multiple 2022 draftees were already in the bigs by the time of the 2023 draft so that's all the Angels really needed to point to.