Why is Happ batting third?

[CubDad62]

Besides getting an incredible amount of BBs, is there another reason Happ has batted 3rd in the lineup most of the season? His last 7, 15 and 30 game stats aren't otherwise impressive.  He seldom seems to hit in the clutch or move runners, etc. Most of his production seems to come after the Cubs have a huge lead. BA is .235 with RISP.   Hoerner has more R's and RBI's than Happ.

[Brock Beauchamp]

55 minutes ago, CubDad62 said:

Besides getting an incredible amount of BBs, is there another reason Happ has batted 3rd in the lineup most of the season? His last 7, 15 and 30 game stats aren't otherwise impressive.  He seldom seems to hit in the clutch or move runners, etc. Most of his production seems to come after the Cubs have a huge lead. BA is .235 with RISP.   Hoerner has more R's and RBI's than Happ.

Welcome to NSBB!

[jersey cubs fan]

What was the title?

[Stratos]

I'd hit Happ maybe 2nd and put Nico towards the bottom of the order.

[Derwood]

Happ shouldn't be 3rd and Bellinger shouldn't be 4th. I want Bellinger up in the first inning every game, even if it's bases empty two outs.

Given the current team, I would probably do something like:

Tauchmann
Happ
Bellinger
Candelario
Swanson
Morel
Gomes
Madrigal
Hoerner

[jersey cubs fan]

[Derwood]

25 minutes ago, jersey cubs fan said:

 

So Dusty running Neifi/Macias out there as the 1/2 hitters was cool with you?

[Brock Beauchamp]

12 hours ago, jersey cubs fan said:

What was the title?

Are you asking about me changing the title? It was simply "Happ", which is so non-specific that I changed it to better reflect what the poster wants to talk about.

[Brock Beauchamp]

26 minutes ago, jersey cubs fan said:

I downplay batting order as much as the next guy but if Happ isn't hitting, he violates the one rule I care about: give your best hitters the most plate appearances.

But he has been good enough that yeah, I don't think it matters much.

[jersey cubs fan]

12 minutes ago, Brock Beauchamp said:

Are you asking about me changing the title? It was simply "Happ", which is so non-specific that I changed it to better reflect what the poster wants to talk about.

No further questions your honor 

[CubinNY]

1 hour ago, Brock Beauchamp said:

Are you asking about me changing the title? It was simply "Happ", which is so non-specific that I changed it to better reflect what the poster wants to talk about.

At least is wasn't Why the horsefeathers is Happ Batting 3rd

[IvyCub66]

I like Happ, I really do, but why oh why is he hitting in the top 1/2 of the order, much less third.  The only players I would hit him ahead of are the backup catchers and wisdom.  His hits (when they finally come) are almost never in contribution to the game.  Either in blow out wins or out of reach losses.  Take him out of a demanding spot and maybe he can perform better.

[IvyCub66]

On 8/10/2023 at 8:51 AM, Derwood said:

Happ shouldn't be 3rd and Bellinger shouldn't be 4th. I want Bellinger up in the first inning every game, even if it's bases empty two outs.

Given the current team, I would probably do something like:

Tauchmann
Happ
Bellinger
Candelario
Swanson
Morel
Gomes
Madrigal
Hoerner

Flip Hoerner and Happ.  I am okay with Madrigal in 8 or 9 and Happ in the other.

[CubUgly]

9 hours ago, IvyCub66 said:

I like Happ, I really do, but why oh why is he hitting in the top 1/2 of the order, much less third.  The only players I would hit him ahead of are the backup catchers and wisdom.  His hits (when they finally come) are almost never in contribution to the game.  Either in blow out wins or out of reach losses.  Take him out of a demanding spot and maybe he can perform better.

It is curious - I know there is a school of thought among sabermatricians and statheads that batting order if fairly insignificant but Rossi has flip-flopped almost everyone around in the batting order so he seems to think there is at least some significance to it, but other than Tauchman pretty much a lock as leadoff when he starts, not other player has been as solidified in one spot as Happ has been at the third spot. 

[Rob]

3 hours ago, CubUgly said:

It is curious - I know there is a school of thought among sabermatricians and statheads that batting order if fairly insignificant but Rossi has flip-flopped almost everyone around in the batting order so he seems to think there is at least some significance to it, but other than Tauchman pretty much a lock as leadoff when he starts, not other player has been as solidified in one spot as Happ has been at the third spot. 

The long and short on batting order is that each spot in the lineup gets about 20 PA more than the one following it. So you generally want to stack your better hitters near the front so they have more opportunities.

The only real change that made to the collective wisdom was pulling some of those high-contact hitters who couldn't actually hit out of the top 1-2 spots. Guys like Neifi Perez were finally relegated to the bottom of the lineup, where they belonged.

But yeah, beyond having top guys in top spots, there isn't much to be done to game the system. So it's quite possible that managerial decisions that make hitters more comfortable are worth more in terms of extracting production from a player than you'd get from truly optimizing lineup order on a day-to-day basis.

[cl smooth]

13 hours ago, IvyCub66 said:

His hits (when they finally come) are almost never in contribution to the game.  Either in blow out wins or out of reach losses.  

This ****** hot take was also said about Sammy Sosa back in the day. Didn’t believe it about Sammy then and I sure as hell don’t believe it about Happ now. 

[Transmogrified Tiger]

2 minutes ago, cl smooth said:

This ****** hot take was also said about Sammy Sosa back in the day. Didn’t believe it about Sammy then and I sure as hell don’t believe it about Happ now. 

It's basically the exact opposite of reality.  This year Happ's OPS in Low/Med/High leverage situations is .712/.812/.869, and for his career it's .811/.770/.801

[Hairyducked Idiot]

Technically if you really want to get into the minutae of mostly meaningless lineup tweaking, third is less important than 1, 2 and 4, and about tied with 5th/6th. It has a pretty high probability of coming up with 2 outs, the least impactful time to hit.

[Hairyducked Idiot]

14 hours ago, IvyCub66 said:

I like Happ, I really do, but why oh why is he hitting in the top 1/2 of the order, much less third.  The only players I would hit him ahead of are the backup catchers and wisdom.  His hits (when they finally come) are almost never in contribution to the game.  Either in blow out wins or out of reach losses.  Take him out of a demanding spot and maybe he can perform better.

That's just something people say when they don't like a player or he didn't hit in some specific high-profile situations that stick out in their memory. It's almost never true.