The Junior Lake thread

[Little Slide Rooter]

Junior Lake was once a "high ceiling prospect" that you're comparing to Olt? The [expletive]?

 

Not on the same level, but yes, he was a very high ceiling prospect. I forget who, either Tiger, Raisin, or one of those guys who know what they're taking about was very high on him around the time Castro came on the radar.

 

Their situation is similar in that they're still here because as long as winning isn't currently of utmost importance, exposure to big league pitching and coaching is more valuable than the replacement guy who might look less silly at the plate.

[Sammy Sofa]

They're just here at this point as cheap bodies because you have to have 25 players on the team and, sadly, there's nobody better who can be brought in at this point. No need to overthink it.

 

And Lake was nowhere near as highly rated a prospect as Olt was.

[Little Slide Rooter]

They're just here at this point as cheap bodies because you have to have 25 players on the team and, sadly, there's nobody better who can be brought in at this point. No need to overthink it.

 

And Lake was nowhere near as highly rated a prospect as Olt was.

 

Like I said, not on the same level. My point is that when your trying to win games, you let these guys figure things out in AAA so they can get regular playing time and not be a liability to your chances. The way those two have looked lately, an upgrade wouldn't be hard to find.

[Guest]

Junior Lake was once a "high ceiling prospect" that you're comparing to Olt? The [expletive]?

There were at least a couple years where Lake had the highest ceiling in the organization. He just won't reach it.

[Guest]

Junior Lake was once a "high ceiling prospect" that you're comparing to Olt? The [expletive]?

There were at least a couple years where Lake had the highest ceiling in the organization. He just won't reach it.

 

A "ceiling" that there clearly wasn't much industry faith in since he was never a highly regarded prospect.

[Sammy Sofa]

Junior Lake was once a "high ceiling prospect" that you're comparing to Olt? The [expletive]?

There were at least a couple years where Lake had the highest ceiling in the organization.

 

Damning with faint praise.

[Little Slide Rooter]

Junior Lake was once a "high ceiling prospect" that you're comparing to Olt? The [expletive]?

There were at least a couple years where Lake had the highest ceiling in the organization. He just won't reach it.

 

A "ceiling" that there clearly wasn't much industry faith in since he was never a highly regarded prospect.

 

There was to us, but not to the Keith Laws and Kevin Goldstein's of the world, who we're taught to disregard anyway. Unless they like our guys. Even Goldstein didn't dislike him so much as he got sick of being trolled by Cubs fans who didn't like his opinion that they asked for.

[Hairyducked Idiot]

Junior Lake sucks

[dew1679666265]

Junior Lake was once a "high ceiling prospect" that you're comparing to Olt? The [expletive]?

There were at least a couple years where Lake had the highest ceiling in the organization. He just won't reach it.

 

A "ceiling" that there clearly wasn't much industry faith in since he was never a highly regarded prospect.

 

In SCS' defense, he never said anything about how they were regarded. Just that they were both high ceiling prospects, which is true.

[Guest]

Junior Lake was once a "high ceiling prospect" that you're comparing to Olt? The [expletive]?

There were at least a couple years where Lake had the highest ceiling in the organization. He just won't reach it.

 

A "ceiling" that there clearly wasn't much industry faith in since he was never a highly regarded prospect.

 

In SCS' defense, he never said anything about how they were regarded. Just that they were both high ceiling prospects, which is true.

 

Then we're back to everybody's ceiling being everything.

 

If the probability of it being reached is low enough, it should not be a ceiling. Which is why the whole thing is stupid to begin with.

[Hairyducked Idiot]

Then we're back to everybody's ceiling being everything.

 

You really have been channeling me a lot lately.

[dew1679666265]

Then we're back to everybody's ceiling being everything.

 

Even the people who didn't regard Lake terribly highly didn't question his talent, just his ability to get there. For instance, I remember debates on here many years ago about who was going to be better - Castro or Lake. We're not talking about a scrub - Lake has always been immensely talented, he's just always been extremely raw and (reportedly) not real open to being coached.

[dew1679666265]

If the probability of it being reached is low enough, it should not be a ceiling. Which is why the whole thing is stupid to begin with.

 

It wasn't seen as terribly unlikely when he and Castro were in the minors together. It became less likely as he continued in the system and didn't seem to be developing.

[Guest]

Then we're back to everybody's ceiling being everything.

 

You really have been channeling me a lot lately.

 

I'm not as extreme on you on it, to be sure, but when you're talking about someone like Lake having a "high ceiling" because he is fast and can hit balls really far in BP, it's like come on.

[dew1679666265]

I'm not as extreme on you on it, to be sure, but when you're talking about someone like Lake having a "high ceiling" because he is fast and can hit balls really far in BP, it's like come on.

 

There was a whole lot more to it than that.

[jersey cubs fan]

I'm not as extreme on you on it, to be sure, but when you're talking about someone like Lake having a "high ceiling" because he is fast and can hit balls really far in BP, it's like come on.

 

There was a whole lot more to it than that.

 

Yeah, I don't get David's frustration. It's not like everybody gets the ceiling of superstar. Lake was a long shot who had enough physical talent that if he miraculously figured things out, he could be pretty awesome.

[Guest]

I'm not as extreme on you on it, to be sure, but when you're talking about someone like Lake having a "high ceiling" because he is fast and can hit balls really far in BP, it's like come on.

 

There was a whole lot more to it than that.

 

Yeah, I don't get David's frustration. It's not like everybody gets the ceiling of superstar. Lake was a long shot who had enough physical talent that if he miraculously figured things out, he could be pretty awesome.

 

The fact that it takes a miracle precludes it from being a ceiling.

[Guest]

It was a miracle by the time Lake was in Iowa, in 2008 when he was considered on the same plane as Castro, not so much. The conversation has played jump rope across those two time frames though.

 

EDIT: And when the miracle ceiling is way, way up there, there's still lots of room to fall short of it and still be productive.

[Guest]

I'm not as extreme on you on it, to be sure, but when you're talking about someone like Lake having a "high ceiling" because he is fast and can hit balls really far in BP, it's like come on.

 

There was a whole lot more to it than that.

 

Yeah, I don't get David's frustration. It's not like everybody gets the ceiling of superstar. Lake was a long shot who had enough physical talent that if he miraculously figured things out, he could be pretty awesome.

 

The fact that it takes a miracle precludes it from being a ceiling.

the entire discussion is silly. But if one wants to talk about a ceiling it has to be a best case if everything goes right. It has no meaning otherwise, no matter the probability. At one point in time Castro and Lake were very close in prognostication circles.

[Guest]

I'm not as extreme on you on it, to be sure, but when you're talking about someone like Lake having a "high ceiling" because he is fast and can hit balls really far in BP, it's like come on.

 

There was a whole lot more to it than that.

 

Yeah, I don't get David's frustration. It's not like everybody gets the ceiling of superstar. Lake was a long shot who had enough physical talent that if he miraculously figured things out, he could be pretty awesome.

 

The fact that it takes a miracle precludes it from being a ceiling.

the entire discussion is silly. But if one wants to talk about a ceiling it has to be a best case if everything goes right. It has no meaning otherwise, no matter the probability. At one point in time Castro and Lake were very close in prognostication circles.

 

If everything goes right, every hitter will hit a home run every time they go to the plate and every pitcher will strike everybody out.

[Guest]

Now you've gone full Kyle, come on.

[Guest]

Now you've gone full Kyle, come on.

 

I'm trying to illustrate the point (that it's silly - which I'm actually pretty sure CubinNY agrees with given previous discussions on the topic).

[Guest]

Now you ARE Kyle, congrats.

[Hairyducked Idiot]

Ceiling is dumb

[Guest]

Now you ARE Kyle, congrats.

 

I actually remember you vehemently arguing that ceiling was the dumbest concept ever so really you're Kyling more by choosing to go the contrarian route on this one.