The Mets are $625 milliion in debt

[Sammy Sofa]

It's unlikely Wilpon was "fleeced" by Madoff. He knew what was going on.

 

Well, whatever; he lost a [expletive]-ton of money because of Madoff.

Actually, if the stories are true the Wilpons made money with Madoff and may have helpd perpatrate the scam so he could get cash from banks.

 

But he ultimately lost around $700 million, right?

[Careless]

I didn't know it was possible to have not heard the Bonilla story.

or the Saberhagen one

 

I presume they were large deals that Bonilla and Saberhagen elected to spread out over the long haul after the fact...but still.

 

Even better. Bonilla had 5.9m and 1 year left on his deal that Steve Phillips didn't want to pay, so of course he agreed to this beaut of an arrangement..

 

http://online.wsj.com/article/SB10001424052748703426004575339013108198050.html

 

In fact, according to Mr. Gilbert, the only real sticking point in the deal was the interest rate. The two sides eventually agreed on 8 percent.

There are more levels of terrible negotiating here than I could have guessed.

[erik316wttn]

How did Bonilla's agent contain his glee while negotiating this deal?

[Jake]

Oh, and they've got a $145 million payroll, and are paying Bobby Bonilla and Brett Saberhagen for the next 15 or so years.

 

Hahahah, is this true?

 

Yes, it's in the article.

 

Hilarious. Bobby Bonilla was washed up when I was like 9.

 

That's why they owe him money. I forget the exact details, but they cut some years off of his contract to make him tradable, in return for these future payments.

[Jake]

Generally, I take articles like this with a grain of salt.

 

It doesn't mention the terms of the debt. Think about a mortgage. In the grand scheme of my income, my mortgage looks insurmountable. Until you look at the payments in terms of 30 years, then it's not so bad. Also, how much of the debt is tied into the new stadium? The start up of the TV network? And speaking of the TV network, will they make enough money from that to cover losses from the team?

 

The article is too vague, to really know the state of the team. Obviously, they're in trouble irrespective of Madoff, but we don't really know how bad it is based on this article.

[Jake]

It's unlikely Wilpon was "fleeced" by Madoff. He knew what was going on.

 

Well, whatever; he lost a [expletive]-ton of money because of Madoff.

Actually, if the stories are true the Wilpons made money with Madoff and may have helpd perpatrate the scam so he could get cash from banks.

 

But he ultimately lost around $700 million, right?

[Outshined_One]

It's unlikely Wilpon was "fleeced" by Madoff. He knew what was going on.

 

Well, whatever; he lost a [expletive]-ton of money because of Madoff.

Actually, if the stories are true the Wilpons made money with Madoff and may have helpd perpatrate the scam so he could get cash from banks.

 

But he ultimately lost around $700 million, right?

 

The trustee is now seeking to claw back a billion dollars from them. Wilpon and Katz made a good bit of money off of the Madoff scheme. They took some losses, but overall, if the allegations are true, their loss of $150m is no skin off their backs.

 

The story on the face of things is pretty much that the owners took out stupid loans and have run the Mets in impressively incompetent fashion. What's really been happening with the Mets' books will probably come out in the next few years.

[Tarver]

As big a prick as he is, you can't blame Mccourt for rightfully pointing out the double standard. The Wilpons are in far worse financial distress, but he's Selig's buddy. What a joke.

[Guest]

As big a prick as he is, you can't blame Mccourt for rightfully pointing out the double standard. The Wilpons are in far worse financial distress, but he's Selig's buddy. What a joke.

 

Moores pretty much needed to sell off most of his interest in the Padres to pay off his wife and make her go away. Probably what McCourt will need to do. McCourt's wife probably saw how smoothly that transaction took place and decided that was way better than more Frank McCourt. :lol:

[KingCubsFan]

As big a prick as he is, you can't blame Mccourt for rightfully pointing out the double standard. The Wilpons are in far worse financial distress, but he's Selig's buddy. What a joke.

Apparently the Wilpons have been pretty honest about their situation from the beginning, whereas McCourt has continually lied to MLB.

[jersey cubs fan]

Sources: Mets OK minority share sale

ESPN.com news services

 

The New York Mets have agreed to sell less than 49 percent of the club to David Einhorn, president of Greenlight Capital Inc., for approximately $200 million, sources close to the deal tell ESPN's Karl Ravech.

 

The sale will not include a stake in SNY, the television network owned by the Mets, the sources said.

 

Einhorn, a hedge fund investor, co-founded Greenlight Capital in 1996 and is the author of "Fooling Some Of The People All Of The Time," a book about his battle with private investing firm Allied Capital.

 

Mets principal owner Fred Wilpon, who became ensnared in the Bernie Madoff Ponzi scheme, is facing a multimillion dollar lawsuit filed by a court trustee seeking to recover money for Madoff's other victims.

 

The Mets received a loan from Major League Baseball in November to help cover expenses.

[jersey cubs fan]

The Einhorn deal with the Mets has apparently fallen through. Not sure where this leaves them but I assume the Mets remain in financial limbo.

[Little Slide Rooter]

This kind of sucks for MLB as a whole. The Cubs, Mets, and Dodgers have been 3 of baseballs top draws, certainly in the NL and all 3 of them are in some kind of financial mess and fans are losing patience.

[jersey cubs fan]

This kind of sucks for MLB as a whole. The Cubs, Mets, and Dodgers have been 3 of baseballs top draws, certainly in the NL and all 3 of them are in some kind of financial mess and fans are losing patience.

 

The Chicaco Cubs are not in any kind of financial mess.

[Sammy Sofa]

This kind of sucks for MLB as a whole. The Cubs, Mets, and Dodgers have been 3 of baseballs top draws, certainly in the NL and all 3 of them are in some kind of financial mess and fans are losing patience.

 

The Chicaco Cubs are not in any kind of financial mess.

 

Yeah, what the [expletive] is he talking about? The sale? A few bad contracts? How is he possibly lumping the Cubs in with the Mets and Dodgers?

[Ding Dong Johnson]

What the what?

[javy knows my name]

This kind of sucks for MLB as a whole. The Cubs, Mets, and Dodgers have been 3 of baseballs top draws, certainly in the NL and all 3 of them are in some kind of financial mess and fans are losing patience.

 

The Chicaco Cubs are not in any kind of financial mess.

 

Yeah, what the [expletive] is he talking about? The sale? A few bad contracts? How is he possibly lumping the Cubs in with the Mets and Dodgers?

 

Is there any precedent in baseball history at the magnitude of Mets and Dodgers are going through? Lumping todays Cubs in there just doesn't make a bit of sense.

[MWV]

I assume he's referring to the Cubs' appearing on the list of teams found to be in violation of MLB debt servicing rules. Although the commisioner himself pointed out that this is not a big deal and he has no problem with the Cubs' financial status, so I don't think Chicago's situation is at all comparable at all to NY or LA.

[Cubswin11]

This kind of sucks for MLB as a whole. The Cubs, Mets, and Dodgers have been 3 of baseballs top draws, certainly in the NL and all 3 of them are in some kind of financial mess and fans are losing patience.

 

The Chicaco Cubs are not in any kind of financial mess.

 

Yeah, what the [expletive] is he talking about? The sale? A few bad contracts? How is he possibly lumping the Cubs in with the Mets and Dodgers?

Yeah the Mets and Dodgers are in serious financial trouble, like owners not being able to make payroll/expense payments on time trouble. The end result likely being the owners in both cases have to sell the team completely or give up decent portions of ownership. The Cubs have debt with new owners in place, a couple hundred million dollars by most accounts, but it appears they structured it well and will be able to manage the debt it took to buy the team without issues. The Cubs are far from being a financial mess. The Ricketts are smart business people, they wouldn't have proposed/agreed to a deal to buy the team that involved them taking out a large amount of debt without having a way to manage it in their business plan with the Cubs.

 

The Mets/Dodgers owners did tons of shady things that put them in a financial mess. The debt they had to take on to buy the teams wasn't what put them where they are. It was years of mismanagement, getting involved in shady investments (Wilpons have been involved in at least two Ponzi Schemes), and borrowing money against the team to us that money towards things in the owners personal lives and not using it for business/baseball related operations amongst other things.

[Sammy Sofa]

I assume he's referring to the Cubs' appearing on the list of teams found to be in violation of MLB debt servicing rules. Although the commisioner himself pointed out that this is not a big deal and he has no problem with the Cubs' financial status, so I don't think Chicago's situation is at all comparable at all to NY or LA.

 

Given who we're talking about I'd assume he didn't mean that at all.

[Little Slide Rooter]

I shouldn't have lumped them together as financial messes so much as the franchises themselves being a mess. Yeah, we have our share of bad contracts, but nothing compared to those 2. The Dodgers ownership situation coupled with Collettis bad decisons have downed them indefinitely, and The Mets are just a mess from their debts due to the fact that they're still paying guys like Bobby Bonillas and Bret Saberhagen, and probably Dwight Gooden and Tom Seaver.

 

The Cubs, as a franchise are a mess with fans losing patience, the difference being that they have the ability to turn things around with 1 or 2 productive offseasons.

[jersey cubs fan]

I shouldn't have lumped them together as financial messes so much as the franchises themselves being a mess.

 

Except that is just about as asinine of a statement to make. The Cubs are not in a mess. The relatively new financial solvent owner has decided to make a change at GM. They have a sound, if unspectaculiar minor league system and actually assets on the major league team. The revenue continues to flow, if at slower rates than when they won more frequently. The team on the field isn't any good, but the franchise is in no way shape or form a mess right now.

[davearm2]

I shouldn't have lumped them together as financial messes so much as the franchises themselves being a mess.

 

Except that is just about as asinine of a statement to make. The Cubs are not in a mess. The relatively new financial solvent owner has decided to make a change at GM. They have a sound, if unspectaculiar minor league system and actually assets on the major league team. The revenue continues to flow, if at slower rates than when they won more frequently. The team on the field isn't any good, but the franchise is in no way shape or form a mess right now.

The Cubs aren't a mess financially, but they're paying a whole lot of money to finish in 5th place, and like WSR said, fan angst is building.

 

The fact that so many here are so desperate to sign Pujols or Fielder should tell you something. The on-field product needs a major overhaul.

[jersey cubs fan]

I shouldn't have lumped them together as financial messes so much as the franchises themselves being a mess.

 

Except that is just about as asinine of a statement to make. The Cubs are not in a mess. The relatively new financial solvent owner has decided to make a change at GM. They have a sound, if unspectaculiar minor league system and actually assets on the major league team. The revenue continues to flow, if at slower rates than when they won more frequently. The team on the field isn't any good, but the franchise is in no way shape or form a mess right now.

The Cubs aren't a mess financially, but they're paying a whole lot of money to finish in 5th place, and like WSR said, fan angst is building.

 

The fact that so many here are so desperate to sign Pujols or Fielder should tell you something. The on-field product needs a major overhaul.

 

Yes, the baseball team is bad. The organization is healthy.

[Sammy Sofa]

Unless the Cubs had an all-star-caliber player locking down 1B it's ridiculous to paint the want for Fielder or Pujols as "desperation." Desperation is drowning someone like Soriano in money to play for the Cubs. Signing 28-year-old Prince Fielder or the greatest hitter ever to huge contracts isn't.

 

Bottom line, listing the Cubs with the Dodgers and Mets as if they're in comparable financial situations is asinine. The Cubs have to produce a better team and have the means to do so. The Dodgers and Mets don't have any money.