2011 Bears Offseason thread

[jersey cubs fan]

I was specifically thinking about the offensive line, it consists of 5 positions. In a more general sense the entire offense is lacking in stars. Cutler is star capable, but he's pretty far down the list of star QBs out there. Hester is a special teams star. Forte is a reliable runner, but no star. He makes a point that can't have stars at every position. It would be nice to have a legit pro bowl caliber offensive lineman, at least somewhere. And something resembling a star at WR.

 

New England knows they can't have stars everywhere, but they have stars. Indy knows they can't have stars everywhere, but they have stars.

 

I hear ya. I just don't think Jerry knows how to do offense. I really don't. Cutler fell in his lap and he's been stumbling and fumbling to figure out how to take advantage ever since.

 

Offensive line was the big bugaboo in Tampa for several years when their defense made them legit.

[ConstableRabbit]

That's fine. Despite all the limitations, when you threw that ball to Johnny Knox, you knew only 3 other receivers could get you more yards on average in the NFL. I responded originally when you said you werent sure that Knox was the Bears best receiver last year. Is Knox a number one or two on a lot of other teams? No. But on the 2010 Bears he was the best.

 

Yeah, I don't think he was the best. That's the point. He was targeted a lot and put up decent numbers, but in a very inefficient manner.

 

Inefficient? He had the most yards per target on the entire team...by a decent margin. How is that not a measure of efficiency? I realize he caught a lesser % of balls thrown his way but he made up for it in YAC and YPC. I know its not the only thing, but

 

Tell me which Bears receiver was better last year. Bennett, who didnt even see the field much the first 60% of the season? Hester, who is probably as raw or more as a receiver as Knox? Aromashadou?

 

Not that this adds anything to my argument because you are obviously smart enough to evaluate the numbers I posted before, but this is what their stats would look like if they all had 99 targets

 

          CAT YRD  TD 
Knox      51  960  5
Bennett   65  792  5
Olsen     59  580  7
Hester    54  644  5

 

I just don't see it. Knox stands out as king of the idiots.

 

All of these stats are pretty misleading, imo.

 

When compared to other WRs on the Bears, Knox may have run a lot more "feast-or-famine" go routes that went for a lot of yards when a completion was made. That doesn't necessarily make him a better receiver.

 

I'm not sold.

[UMFan83]

That's fine. Despite all the limitations, when you threw that ball to Johnny Knox, you knew only 3 other receivers could get you more yards on average in the NFL. I responded originally when you said you werent sure that Knox was the Bears best receiver last year. Is Knox a number one or two on a lot of other teams? No. But on the 2010 Bears he was the best.

 

Yeah, I don't think he was the best. That's the point. He was targeted a lot and put up decent numbers, but in a very inefficient manner.

 

Inefficient? He had the most yards per target on the entire team...by a decent margin. How is that not a measure of efficiency? I realize he caught a lesser % of balls thrown his way but he made up for it in YAC and YPC. I know its not the only thing, but

 

Tell me which Bears receiver was better last year. Bennett, who didnt even see the field much the first 60% of the season? Hester, who is probably as raw or more as a receiver as Knox? Aromashadou?

 

Not that this adds anything to my argument because you are obviously smart enough to evaluate the numbers I posted before, but this is what their stats would look like if they all had 99 targets

 

          CAT YRD  TD 
Knox      51  960  5
Bennett   65  792  5
Olsen     59  580  7
Hester    54  644  5

 

I just don't see it. Knox stands out as king of the idiots.

 

All of these stats are pretty misleading, imo.

 

When compared to other WRs on the Bears, Knox may have run a lot more "feast-or-famine" go routes that went for a lot of yards when a completion was made. That doesn't necessarily make him a better receiver.

 

I'm not sold.

 

I just don't see who is better and no one has presented an argument for anyone else. Earl Bennett might be a better route runner, but lacks the breakaway speed and overall athleticism that Knox has. I don't know how you could really make an argument for Hester, considering he has the speed and athleticism that Knox has but doesn't get the numbers Knox does. I mean other than that, unless you want to include TE and/or RB theres no real other candidates on the 10 Bears to argue for. Bennett is the only one that I'm willing to accept an argument for, and considering it took him an entire season to learn the playbook well enough to actually play in the games, I find it hard to accept that he's the best receiver on the team (last year).

 

Actually fine, I'll play devil's advocate and make the argument for him. He's certainly a better possession receiver than Knox, and more reliable on a big down. Bennett led the Bears on 3rd down catches for a 1st down, with 12. Bennett also finished 3rd in the NFC in catches on 3rd and more than 7 yards with 7. And that's despite playing sparingly the first part of the season. Knox was 14th in the NFL with 6 dropped passes. And while Knox was 2nd in the NFC in % of targets ending in a 1st down at 43%, Bennett wasn't too far behind at 18th with 38.6%.

 

So there, the stats are out there and if it hurts my argument, so be it.

[Banedon]

The Chicago Bears have decided not to sign free-agent cornerback Kelvin Hayden at this time, according to multiple sources.

[kujay]

"We made our bed," Angelo said. "We have to make it work. You can't have stars at every position. It doesn't work that way."

 

Don't worry about that Jerry, you definitely don't have stars at every position. Or any position for that matter.

 

Seriously, who says that after you have a completely [expletive] offseason? He might as well have said, "We're idiots, we'll go 8-8 and it doesn't matter because you'll buy tickets anyway."

[jersey cubs fan]

I just don't see who is better and no one has presented an argument for anyone else. Earl Bennett might be a better route runner, but lacks the breakaway speed and overall athleticism that Knox has. I don't know how you could really make an argument for Hester, considering he has the speed and athleticism that Knox has but doesn't get the numbers Knox does. I mean other than that, unless you want to include TE and/or RB theres no real other candidates on the 10 Bears to argue for. Bennett is the only one that I'm willing to accept an argument for, and considering it took him an entire season to learn the playbook well enough to actually play in the games, I find it hard to accept that he's the best receiver on the team (last year).

 

Actually fine, I'll play devil's advocate and make the argument for him. He's certainly a better possession receiver than Knox, and more reliable on a big down. Bennett led the Bears on 3rd down catches for a 1st down, with 12. Bennett also finished 3rd in the NFC in catches on 3rd and more than 7 yards with 7. And that's despite playing sparingly the first part of the season. Knox was 14th in the NFL with 6 dropped passes. And while Knox was 2nd in the NFC in % of targets ending in a 1st down at 43%, Bennett wasn't too far behind at 18th with 38.6%.

 

So there, the stats are out there and if it hurts my argument, so be it.

 

Something to consider is it was the first year in the system for all of them. I think Knox had the easiest transition because all he really does is go deep and hope Cutler finds him. I think the fact that he put up those numbers but was still demoted this year, when other better route runners got up to speed is telling. This isn't baseball. They didn't all get the same PA against the same pitchers over 162 games. It's harder to judge based just on receptions and ypc in one season. Hester went back into the return game more last year, but he's grown as a receiver. I don't see how any "analytical" football site can try and claim Knox is the best receiver. I love what he brings to the table in terms of big play potential and all that. But if I'm lining up 2 guys to start the game I can find many reasons to not have him be one of those two guys.

[Guest]

Seems odd to criticize Bennett for not learning the playbook 2 seasons ago and then prop up Knox, who either doesn't know the playbook, doesn't fundamentally know how to finish routes or was just lazy last season in a more recent season.

[Guest]

People have made the argument against Knox (many, many times) that the interceptions he created by being in the wrong place and/or not fighting for contested balls more than makes up for the difference in yardage/catches.

 

I'd also like to point out that blocking at the line and downfield is an important part of being an all-around receiver. I have no idea how the WR's stack up on this, but I'm sure the Bears take it into consideration.

[Banedon]

ESPN put out power rankings. They have the Bears 13th with this comment:

 

The loss of longtime center Olin Kreutz will hurt Chicago's running game. (Walker)

 

Packers are #1.

[minnesotacubsfan]

 

"Mike Tice has a great track record of developing young players. He is a great evaluator, a great teacher and developer of players. We want to take advantage of his expertise and that's why we want to start bringing these young guys along. Just because they are unknown doesn't mean they won't be good players. At some point the player has to start from the bottom and work his way up."

 

I could buy this argument if the Bears actually drafted more then 1 top 3 draft pick OL every year. But is more like 1 every 7 years. so, what is it you are getting at, Jerry?

[Soul]

People have made the argument against Knox (many, many times) that the interceptions he created by being in the wrong place and/or not fighting for contested balls more than makes up for the difference in yardage/catches.

 

I'd also like to point out that blocking at the line and downfield is an important part of being an all-around receiver. I have no idea how the WR's stack up on this, but I'm sure the Bears take it into consideration.

 

I'll stick my head out on this one.

 

Surely blocking is an underrated component of being a great WR.

 

And surely Knox is well below average in this department.

 

I also buy the idea that Knox has caused interceptions. He runs terrible routes, and quits often. Doesn't fight through coverage.

 

To me he's a deep threat guy, but a liability in many other areas. The fact that he lead the team in receiving yardage just speaks to the lack of talent we have at the position, more than anything else. Knox is a specialist on a good WR team, and not much more.

 

I don't see how anyone could have a contrary view on him, frankly. I still like having him on the team -- don't get me wrong. But he should be guided into his proper role, preferrably with the acquisition/development of better talent at the position.

[tfarks]

I liked the Roy Williams signing and still do, mainly because he is a big target that will fight for the ball and catch it in traffic. Very useful on 3rd down and the redzone - how many interceptions were thrown there last year? No more 3rd and 3 slant passes to Knox that gets intercepted while he stands there looking as confused as Mark Wahlberg.

 

The reduced and more specialized role of Knox will only be a plus to this team. And gives him more time to grow beyond that if he's capable, which I think he is, especially if he keeps adding strength to his frame.

[Banedon]

http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/vault/article/magazine/MAG1189171/1/index.htm

[WrigleyField 22]

Eh, I don't know if I can handle any portrayal of Cutler that doesn't conclude that he is the spawn of Satan.

[Guest]

Good article.

[Banedon]

Anthony Adams is nursing some kind of ankle injury, and is in a walking boot. Adams swears it's a minor injury and looks worse than it is.

[Pushfrog98]

http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/vault/article/magazine/MAG1189171/1/index.htm

Wow... it's from the future!

[Soul]

That's a great Cutler article. I wish people heard more about him like that, the things he does quietly and gets no credit for.

[Guest]

Bears offensive coordinator Mike Martz cited "inconsistency" when discussing Johnny Knox's demotion out of the starting lineup Wednesday.

"Johnny’s very, very talented. He’s very young and he’s still learning how to play," Martz said. "Guys like Johnny just need to learn to be consistent." Deep threat-needy teams like the Ravens would be remiss to not make a phone call about Knox, who's now a fourth receiver in Chicago. He has cheap salaries through the 2012 season, and might only cost a mid- to late-round pick.

 

SMH.

[Guest]

Haha. Let's take away even more weapons from Cutler. Ugh.

[Butterscup1679666578]

Seems like complete speculation on that guy's part.

[WrigleyField 22]

I know Angelo doesn't always make the best decisions, but I think he's smart enough to not trade away cheap, decent production at a position of need for a low draft pick. At least not this year. When he is a year away from maybe not being cheap (ie- Olsen) maybe, but not when he's two years away.

[WrigleyField 22]

First official depth chart released.

 

And we really don't have too much depth. After you project the 45 man active roster its almost exclusively UDFA rookies or other young guys.

 

We have cap space. We didn't use it on star power. Lets use it on veteran depth.

 

Article on best available FAs:

http://nfl.si.com/2011/08/10/theres-still-talent-to-be-found-in-free-agent-market/

 

Lots of LBs on there. Possibly our position with the worst depth (crazy cuz just a year or two ago it was full of depth).

[YearofDaCubs]

I think I'd rather see Knox start over Hester. So far the Hester for WR experiment has failed.

[UMFan83]

I wouldn't say its been a failure. I don't think anyone expected Hester to be an elite WR when they decided to convert him. I think they were just hoping for some production to go along with his kick returns. He's done that so far, so I'd say the 'experiment' is a solid C.