Greinke traded to Brewers (pg 2)

[Backtobanks]

From MLBTR:

 

Greinke Wants Out Of Kansas City

By Zach Links [December 17 at 6:47pm CST]

Royals ace Zack Greinke has asked the club for a trade, writes Jon Paul Morosi of FOX Sports. Earlier today, the 2009 American League Cy Young Award winner changed agents, opting to be represented by Jeff Berry and Casey Close of CAA rather than SFX.

 

A high-ranking executive from another team tells Morosi that the pitcher "really wants out" of Kansas City. Separate major league sources confirmed that Greinke has unequivocally asked the club to be dealt.

[Clem Fandango]

From MLBTR:

 

Greinke Wants Out Of Kansas City

By Zach Links [December 17 at 6:47pm CST]

Royals ace Zack Greinke has asked the club for a trade, writes Jon Paul Morosi of FOX Sports. Earlier today, the 2009 American League Cy Young Award winner changed agents, opting to be represented by Jeff Berry and Casey Close of CAA rather than SFX.

 

A high-ranking executive from another team tells Morosi that the pitcher "really wants out" of Kansas City. Separate major league sources confirmed that Greinke has unequivocally asked the club to be dealt.

 

Would be nice to have him... but I'm not holding my breath

[Bote McBoteface]

Greinke and Fukudome make the same money next year. If you could ship him off in a trade for Greinke and then add in a couple of top prospects it could be doable. Dependent on the Royals's need for Fukudome (and the fact that the Royals are probably looking at this more as a salary dump) it may have to be a 3 team trade.

[Clem Fandango]

Greinke and Fukudome make the same money next year. If you could ship him off in a trade for Greinke and then add in a couple of top prospects it could be doable. Dependent on the Royals's need for Fukudome (and the fact that the Royals are probably looking at this more as a salary dump) it may have to be a 3 team trade.

 

[b2B Signal]

[KingKongvs.Godzilla]

Easily the best of the pipe dreams of this offseason (Felix Hernandez doesn't count...Justin Upton could make it a tossup but that was a play rumor anyway).

[Guest]

I think the best way for the Cubs to get involved here is to see if they can insert Gorzelanny in a 3+ team deal and maybe do a little better for themselves prospect-wise than if they were just dumping him alone.

[Guancous]

I think the best way for the Cubs to get involved here is to see if they can insert Gorzelanny in a 3+ team deal and maybe do a little better for themselves prospect-wise than if they were just dumping him alone.

 

Signing Greinke will mortgage the future. I'd rather get the club exclusive years of Cashner, McNutt and Archer instead of selling them for a 86 win season.

[CubsWin]

I think the best way for the Cubs to get involved here is to see if they can insert Gorzelanny in a 3+ team deal and maybe do a little better for themselves prospect-wise than if they were just dumping him alone.

 

Signing Greinke will mortgage the future. I'd rather get the club exclusive years of Cashner, McNutt and Archer instead of selling them for a 86 win season.

What Guancous said.

[Little Slide Rooter]

Greinke and Fukudome make the same money next year. If you could ship him off in a trade for Greinke and then add in a couple of top prospects it could be doable. Dependent on the Royals's need for Fukudome (and the fact that the Royals are probably looking at this more as a salary dump) it may have to be a 3 team trade.

 

[b2B Signal]

 

Cubs get

Greinke

Han Ram

 

Royals get

Gorzalanny

DeWitt

Fuld

 

Marlins get

Chirinos

JR Mathes

[jersey cubs fan]

I would be all over Greinke. You don't win big without big time performers anywhere and nobody in the system is capable of doing what Greinke does. It may fail spectaculiarly, but I'd rather fail in pursuit of 99 wins and a World Series than succeed in staying in contention with 83 win teams.

[CubsWin]

I would be all over Greinke. You don't win big without big time performers anywhere and nobody in the system is capable of doing what Greinke does. It may fail spectaculiarly, but I'd rather fail in pursuit of 99 wins and a World Series than succeed in staying in contention with 83 win teams.

Archer and McNutt were 21 and 20, respectively, last season. That's pretty young. They each put up pretty incredible numbers last season at a very young age. You can't possibly know what they are going to do over the next 6-7 seasons. Grienke is 27. We do know what he did over the last 6-7 years. Some good, some great, some not so good. You might be right that Archer and McNutt will never be as good as Grienke is now. There's a chance you're wrong. Obviously, I'd take that chance if it were a straight up one-for-one deal to get Grienke, but it's likely going to take 3 or four top prospects to get him and I'd rather sit back and see what Cashner, Archer and McNutt can do along with Brett Jackson and Hak-Ju Lee.

[Guest]

I would be all over Greinke. You don't win big without big time performers anywhere and nobody in the system is capable of doing what Greinke does. It may fail spectaculiarly, but I'd rather fail in pursuit of 99 wins and a World Series than succeed in staying in contention with 83 win teams.

Archer and McNutt were 21 and 20, respectively, last season. That's pretty young. They each put up pretty incredible numbers last season at a very young age. You can't possibly know what they are going to do over the next 6-7 seasons. Grienke is 27. We do know what he did over the last 6-7 years. Some good, some great, some not so good. You might be right that Archer and McNutt will never be as good as Grienke is now. There's a chance you're wrong. Obviously, I'd take that chance if it were a straight up one-for-one deal to get Grienke, but it's likely going to take 3 or four top prospects to get him and I'd rather sit back and see what Cashner, Archer and McNutt can do along with Brett Jackson and Hak-Ju Lee.

 

Yeah. If I thought that adding Grienke put the Cubs in the same class as Phily next year, I might get on board with that. As it stands, even with Grienke, there is no promise of winning the division. Might as well start weeding out the bad contracts and filter the youth to the bigs and find out which ones will stick and then build your team around those guys.

 

I don't think Hendry is the guy they should be relying on to go through this mini rebuilding mode, but giving up a significant portion of the farm to get a guy just so you can be a little bit better than average isn't working.

[Backtobanks]

I would be all over Greinke. You don't win big without big time performers anywhere and nobody in the system is capable of doing what Greinke does. It may fail spectaculiarly, but I'd rather fail in pursuit of 99 wins and a World Series than succeed in staying in contention with 83 win teams.

Archer and McNutt were 21 and 20, respectively, last season. That's pretty young. They each put up pretty incredible numbers last season at a very young age. You can't possibly know what they are going to do over the next 6-7 seasons. Grienke is 27. We do know what he did over the last 6-7 years. Some good, some great, some not so good. You might be right that Archer and McNutt will never be as good as Grienke is now. There's a chance you're wrong. Obviously, I'd take that chance if it were a straight up one-for-one deal to get Grienke, but it's likely going to take 3 or four top prospects to get him and I'd rather sit back and see what Cashner, Archer and McNutt can do along with Brett Jackson and Hak-Ju Lee.

 

I disagree simply because Grienke is a top pitcher at 27 and should be very good for quite a few more years (assuming we can re-sign him). Let them pick from 3-5 players from a list of Archer/McNutt (one of them), Gorzelanny, Mateo, Russell, Berg, Coleman, Maine, Stevens, Castillo/Chirinos, Guyer, Vitters, Adduci, Snider, Fuld, etc. There are a few players on that list that are pretty good prospects, but none that are irreplacable.

[Guest]

I would be all over Greinke. You don't win big without big time performers anywhere and nobody in the system is capable of doing what Greinke does. It may fail spectaculiarly, but I'd rather fail in pursuit of 99 wins and a World Series than succeed in staying in contention with 83 win teams.

 

I agree we're missing big time performers, but I'm not sure 2 years of Greinke at 13.5 million(and then either letting him go or signing him to an extension that will inevitably be a bad investment) is worth the player investment he'll command. It doesn't seem like there's a whole lot out there, but I wish a Greinke equivalent with the bat were available to use our prospects on instead.

[mookie]

What kind of a super hero are you? You can't ignore the symbol!!

[CubsWin]

I would be all over Greinke. You don't win big without big time performers anywhere and nobody in the system is capable of doing what Greinke does. It may fail spectaculiarly, but I'd rather fail in pursuit of 99 wins and a World Series than succeed in staying in contention with 83 win teams.

Archer and McNutt were 21 and 20, respectively, last season. That's pretty young. They each put up pretty incredible numbers last season at a very young age. You can't possibly know what they are going to do over the next 6-7 seasons. Grienke is 27. We do know what he did over the last 6-7 years. Some good, some great, some not so good. You might be right that Archer and McNutt will never be as good as Grienke is now. There's a chance you're wrong. Obviously, I'd take that chance if it were a straight up one-for-one deal to get Grienke, but it's likely going to take 3 or four top prospects to get him and I'd rather sit back and see what Cashner, Archer and McNutt can do along with Brett Jackson and Hak-Ju Lee.

 

I disagree simply because Grienke is a top pitcher at 27 and should be very good for quite a few more years (assuming we can re-sign him). Let them pick from 3-5 players from a list of Archer/McNutt (one of them), Gorzelanny, Mateo, Russell, Berg, Coleman, Maine, Stevens, Castillo/Chirinos, Guyer, Vitters, Adduci, Snider, Fuld, etc. There are a few players on that list that are pretty good prospects, but none that are irreplacable.

But at what price financially? If Archer, McNutt and Cashner (or one of their other prospects) can be 3 of the 5 starters for the Cubs the next several seasons, think of the money that will be available to sign someone like Pujols for example. But if we keep trading our young prospects for older more expensive ones, we never get that window.

[davell]

I'm too worried his anxiety issues would flare up again in a large pressure-filled market to go after him. I agree completely we need difference makers on this team, but this is one of the few I'd stay away from.

[Post Count Padder]

Not worth it. If the anxiety issues increase, he'll just implode. I'd rather develop some of the pitchers we'd give up in the trade and see what they can do. Would be cheaper.

 

Also, remember that the Royals asked the Blue Jays for Drabek, Snider and a couple other prospects. That's a lot to give up for an unstable pitcher, especially after we've done a good job restocking the farm the past few years.

[mike2482]

Personally I wouldn't give up too much to get him, but maybe the asking price has gone down some since he really wants traded, not much but some. If they did make the trade I would be excited to have him and I wouldn't lose too much sleep over the prospects we lost, even though I would prefer to keep the prospects.

[Backtobanks]

I would be all over Greinke. You don't win big without big time performers anywhere and nobody in the system is capable of doing what Greinke does. It may fail spectaculiarly, but I'd rather fail in pursuit of 99 wins and a World Series than succeed in staying in contention with 83 win teams.

Archer and McNutt were 21 and 20, respectively, last season. That's pretty young. They each put up pretty incredible numbers last season at a very young age. You can't possibly know what they are going to do over the next 6-7 seasons. Grienke is 27. We do know what he did over the last 6-7 years. Some good, some great, some not so good. You might be right that Archer and McNutt will never be as good as Grienke is now. There's a chance you're wrong. Obviously, I'd take that chance if it were a straight up one-for-one deal to get Grienke, but it's likely going to take 3 or four top prospects to get him and I'd rather sit back and see what Cashner, Archer and McNutt can do along with Brett Jackson and Hak-Ju Lee.

 

I disagree simply because Grienke is a top pitcher at 27 and should be very good for quite a few more years (assuming we can re-sign him). Let them pick from 3-5 players from a list of Archer/McNutt (one of them), Gorzelanny, Mateo, Russell, Berg, Coleman, Maine, Stevens, Castillo/Chirinos, Guyer, Vitters, Adduci, Snider, Fuld, etc. There are a few players on that list that are pretty good prospects, but none that are irreplacable.

But at what price financially? If Archer, McNutt and Cashner (or one of their other prospects) can be 3 of the 5 starters for the Cubs the next several seasons, think of the money that will be available to sign someone like Pujols for example. But if we keep trading our young prospects for older more expensive ones, we never get that window.

 

That's a big "IF".

[SweetZombieJesus]

I'd do this in a second if I wasn't so sure Grienke would committ suicide after the dopes start booing him after a string of bad starts.

 

There's a good chance all three pitchers none will equal greinke

[SweetZombieJesus]

I would be all over Greinke. You don't win big without big time performers anywhere and nobody in the system is capable of doing what Greinke does. It may fail spectaculiarly, but I'd rather fail in pursuit of 99 wins and a World Series than succeed in staying in contention with 83 win teams.

Archer and McNutt were 21 and 20, respectively, last season. That's pretty young. They each put up pretty incredible numbers last season at a very young age. You can't possibly know what they are going to do over the next 6-7 seasons. Grienke is 27. We do know what he did over the last 6-7 years. Some good, some great, some not so good. You might be right that Archer and McNutt will never be as good as Grienke is now. There's a chance you're wrong. Obviously, I'd take that chance if it were a straight up one-for-one deal to get Grienke, but it's likely going to take 3 or four top prospects to get him and I'd rather sit back and see what Cashner, Archer and McNutt can do along with Brett Jackson and Hak-Ju Lee.

 

I disagree simply because Grienke is a top pitcher at 27 and should be very good for quite a few more years (assuming we can re-sign him). Let them pick from 3-5 players from a list of Archer/McNutt (one of them), Gorzelanny, Mateo, Russell, Berg, Coleman, Maine, Stevens, Castillo/Chirinos, Guyer, Vitters, Adduci, Snider, Fuld, etc. There are a few players on that list that are pretty good prospects, but none that are irreplacable.

But at what price financially? If Archer, McNutt and Cashner (or one of their other prospects) can be 3 of the 5 starters for the Cubs the next several seasons, think of the money that will be available to sign someone like Pujols for example. But if we keep trading our young prospects for older more expensive ones, we never get that window.

 

Yeah, because pitching prospects are sure things. J.K. Ryu, Angel Guzman, Bobby Brownlie all became superstars.

[Backtobanks]

I would be all over Greinke. You don't win big without big time performers anywhere and nobody in the system is capable of doing what Greinke does. It may fail spectaculiarly, but I'd rather fail in pursuit of 99 wins and a World Series than succeed in staying in contention with 83 win teams.

Archer and McNutt were 21 and 20, respectively, last season. That's pretty young. They each put up pretty incredible numbers last season at a very young age. You can't possibly know what they are going to do over the next 6-7 seasons. Grienke is 27. We do know what he did over the last 6-7 years. Some good, some great, some not so good. You might be right that Archer and McNutt will never be as good as Grienke is now. There's a chance you're wrong. Obviously, I'd take that chance if it were a straight up one-for-one deal to get Grienke, but it's likely going to take 3 or four top prospects to get him and I'd rather sit back and see what Cashner, Archer and McNutt can do along with Brett Jackson and Hak-Ju Lee.

 

I disagree simply because Grienke is a top pitcher at 27 and should be very good for quite a few more years (assuming we can re-sign him). Let them pick from 3-5 players from a list of Archer/McNutt (one of them), Gorzelanny, Mateo, Russell, Berg, Coleman, Maine, Stevens, Castillo/Chirinos, Guyer, Vitters, Adduci, Snider, Fuld, etc. There are a few players on that list that are pretty good prospects, but none that are irreplacable.

But at what price financially? If Archer, McNutt and Cashner (or one of their other prospects) can be 3 of the 5 starters for the Cubs the next several seasons, think of the money that will be available to sign someone like Pujols for example. But if we keep trading our young prospects for older more expensive ones, we never get that window.

 

Yeah, because pitching prospects are sure things. J.K. Ryu, Angel Guzman, Bobby Brownlie all became superstars.

 

Don't forget the guy with perfect mechanics - Mark Prior.

[CubsWin]

 

I disagree simply because Grienke is a top pitcher at 27 and should be very good for quite a few more years (assuming we can re-sign him). Let them pick from 3-5 players from a list of Archer/McNutt (one of them), Gorzelanny, Mateo, Russell, Berg, Coleman, Maine, Stevens, Castillo/Chirinos, Guyer, Vitters, Adduci, Snider, Fuld, etc. There are a few players on that list that are pretty good prospects, but none that are irreplacable.

But at what price financially? If Archer, McNutt and Cashner (or one of their other prospects) can be 3 of the 5 starters for the Cubs the next several seasons, think of the money that will be available to sign someone like Pujols for example. But if we keep trading our young prospects for older more expensive ones, we never get that window.

 

Yeah, because pitching prospects are sure things. J.K. Ryu, Angel Guzman, Bobby Brownlie all became superstars.

 

Don't forget the guy with perfect mechanics - Mark Prior.

I completely agree that prospects don't always pan out. That's why I said "if". That's the chance that you take. And to be sure there are chances you'd be taking by acquiring Grienke. He was awesome in '09 and league average last season. He's expensive and has a history of emotional instability.

 

You didn't choose very good examples of prospects, however. Mark Prior did pan out. He just got injured. And Ryu, Guzman and Brownlie never put up the kind of numbers that Archer and McNutt did last season at the ages of 21 and 20 with both of them finishing the year in AA. So they don't really compare.

[dew1679666265]

Greinke had one fantastic season (2009), but since then he's been a younger version of Ryan Dempster - outside of 2009 his best ERA is 3.47 and his best xFIP is 3.76. Since 2008, Dempster's ERAs have been 2.96, 3.65 and 3.85 and his xFIPs have been 3.74, 3.81 and 3.89. As for ERA+, Greinke (outside of 2009) has been between 100 and 126 while Dempster has been between 113 and 155.

 

Obviously Greinke is better since he's younger than Demp - I'm not arguing that - but is Greinke really the mega difference maker he's considered? Or is he just a younger version of Ryan Dempster?