Ken Burns' Baseball 10th Inning

[MSG T]

one thing that burns said on the colbert report struck me - george foster reach the 50 home run mark in 1977, and then the next guy to do it was cecil fielder 13 years later. then by the mid to late 90s everyone (brady anderson, luis gonzalez, greg vaughn) could do it.

 

That struck you?

 

yes, i didn't realize that hitting 50 was as rare as it was before steroids.

 

I could be off, but I think Foster was the first player with 50+ since Mays with 52 in 1965(?).

[jersey cubs fan]

http://deadspin.com/5651459/the-tenth+and+one+third-inning-the-documentary-ken-burns-shouldve-made

 

He's already making the next 1/3rd of an inning.

[chuckywang]

Yeah, so part 2 was Yankees/Red Sox heavy.

[OleMissCub]

George Will on the Bonds of the 90's:

 

"He won 3 MVP's and should have won a fourth, but the sportswriters gave it to someone less obnoxious just to punish him."

 

love it

[OleMissCub]

- loved the opening with the Latin American kids playing ball with Feliciano's version of SPB. Perfect.

 

- Didn't really need a blow-by-blow account of the 2003 ALCS

 

- my fav segment of the whole show was probably the part about Ichiro

 

- Pedro is always a delight to hear from

 

- Both George Will and Keith Olbermann are terrific when they speak about baseball.

 

- Albert Pujols, I think easily the player of the aughts, didn't have his name mentioned once. Even if Burns didn't want to do a whole break on Albert, he could (and should) have at least worked him into his narrative about Latin American players.

 

- No mention (other than a brief montage shot) about the White Sox winning the series for the first time since 1917.

 

- Did like that he discussed how most people were indifferent about Bonds breaking Aaron's record.

 

- Nothing about the end of baseball in Montreal and the game returning the D.C.

 

- Doris Kearns Goodwin is pure filler

[Sammy Sofa]

- No mention (other than a brief montage shot) about the White Sox winning the series for the first time since 1917.

 

- Nothing about the end of baseball in Montreal and the game returning the D.C.

 

The latter was mentioned (at least the end of the Expos) as part of the strike segment.

 

Though really, both of the above just represent the height of baseball apathy and really fly in the face of the whole "baseball is stronger than ever" vibe. I suppose they could have tied the WS win in to the whole Black Sox, but that would have felt pretty perfunctory given that it's the lowest rated WS of all time. If people didn't care when it happened, why would they care now?

[erik316wttn]

George Will on the Bonds of the 90's:

 

"He won 3 MVP's and should have won a fourth, but the sportswriters gave it to someone less obnoxious just to punish him."

 

love it

 

Was that the year Terry Pendelton won it?

[OleMissCub]

George Will on the Bonds of the 90's:

 

"He won 3 MVP's and should have won a fourth, but the sportswriters gave it to someone less obnoxious just to punish him."

 

love it

 

Was that the year Terry Pendelton won it?

 

Yes. Ridiculous when you look at their stats that year.

 

http://www.baseball-reference.com/awards/awards_1991.shtml#NLmvp

[SouthSideRyan]

Pendleton has a case depending on his defense IMO

 

He should've won in 2000 though.

[chuckywang]

Pendleton has a case depending on his defense IMO

 

He should've won in 2000 though.

 

Yeah, it's not like Barry Bonds won a gold glove in 1991 or anything. The writers stole the MVP from Bonds that year, plain and simple.

[MSG T]

George Will on the Bonds of the 90's:

 

"He won 3 MVP's and should have won a fourth, but the sportswriters gave it to someone less obnoxious just to punish him."

 

love it

 

Was that the year Terry Pendelton won it?

 

Yes. Ridiculous when you look at their stats that year.

 

http://www.baseball-reference.com/awards/awards_1991.shtml#NLmvp

 

Agreed. But go to the next season and look at AL MVP. That makes Pendleton's win look appropriate.

[Guest]

Pendleton has a case depending on his defense IMO

 

He should've won in 2000 though.

 

Both BR and Fangraphs have Bonds as 2 wins better. Fangraphs has Bonds at +18 defensively that year, and Sandberg tied with Pendleton in WAR.

[Guest]

And it looks like Eckersley led all contenders in WPA that year...

[chuckywang]

 

- Doris Kearns Goodwin is pure filler

 

She was a Mets fan growing up (read her autobiography Wait Till Next Year) but she's a Red Sox fan in the show? Make up your damn mind, woman!

[TruffleShuffle]

George Will on the Bonds of the 90's:

 

"He won 3 MVP's and should have won a fourth, but the sportswriters gave it to someone less obnoxious just to punish him."

 

love it

 

Was that the year Terry Pendelton won it?

 

Yes. Ridiculous when you look at their stats that year.

 

http://www.baseball-reference.com/awards/awards_1991.shtml#NLmvp

 

Agreed. But go to the next season and look at AL MVP. That makes Pendleton's win look appropriate.

 

there was also the year that ted williams hit .406/.553/.735/1.287 and lost to dimaggio, then hit .356/.499/.648/1.147 and lost to joe gordon. he won 2 MVPs and should've won about 8. nobody got screwed more than willie mays though - he finished 1st in the NL 11 times and only won two MVP awards, losing to terrible selections like dick groat (.325/.371/.394/.766), maury wills (.299/.347/.373/.720) and ken boyer (.295/.365/.489/.854)

[chuckywang]

George Will on the Bonds of the 90's:

 

"He won 3 MVP's and should have won a fourth, but the sportswriters gave it to someone less obnoxious just to punish him."

 

love it

 

Was that the year Terry Pendelton won it?

 

Yes. Ridiculous when you look at their stats that year.

 

http://www.baseball-reference.com/awards/awards_1991.shtml#NLmvp

 

Agreed. But go to the next season and look at AL MVP. That makes Pendleton's win look appropriate.

 

there was also the year that ted williams hit .406/.553/.735/1.287 and lost to dimaggio, then hit .356/.499/.648/1.147 and lost to joe gordon. he won 2 MVPs and should've won about 8. nobody got screwed more than willie mays though - he finished 1st in the NL 11 times and only won two MVP awards, losing to terrible selections like dick groat (.325/.371/.394/.766), maury wills (.299/.347/.373/.720) and ken boyer (.295/.365/.489/.854)

 

Does that stupid unwritten rule that only a player on a team that makes the postseason should win the MVP date back that far?

[TruffleShuffle]

Does that stupid unwritten rule that only a player on a team that makes the postseason should win the MVP date back that far?

 

i'm sure that had a lot to do with it, but the year that mays finished 2nd to wills the giants beat the dodgers in a 3-game playoff to win the pennant. so even when the giants won the league mays still got screwed royally.

[Sammy Sofa]

http://www.jazzexcursion.com/pictures/az_49648_Unforgivable%20Blackness%20The%20Rise%20and%20Fall%20of%20Jack%20Johnson%20%28Score%29_Wynton%20Marsalis.jpg

[Fred Hornkohl]

 

- Doris Kearns Goodwin is pure filler

 

She was a Mets fan growing up (read her autobiography Wait Till Next Year) but she's a Red Sox fan in the show? Make up your damn mind, woman!

 

When Doris Kearns Goodwin was growing up, there was no team called the Mets. She was a fan of the Brooklyn Dodgers. Many Dodgers fans felt abandoned when the team pulled up stakes and left town and began following other teams. Ms. Goodwin seems to have switched to the Red Sox in the late 60's during her time at Harvard. If I'm not mistaken, she still lives in Mass.

[chuckywang]

 

- Doris Kearns Goodwin is pure filler

 

She was a Mets fan growing up (read her autobiography Wait Till Next Year) but she's a Red Sox fan in the show? Make up your damn mind, woman!

 

When Doris Kearns Goodwin was growing up, there was no team called the Mets. She was a fan of the Brooklyn Dodgers. Many Dodgers fans felt abandoned when the team pulled up stakes and left town and began following other teams. Ms. Goodwin seems to have switched to the Red Sox in the late 60's during her time at Harvard. If I'm not mistaken, she still lives in Mass.

 

Good point, it's been awhile

[Backtobanks]

I think they really ought to have 2 awards to clear up the question of MVP meaning "best" player or "most valuable" player. Most Valuable Player goes to a player on a playoff team (or no lower than 2nd place team) and Player of the Year goes to the player who had the best season. Obviously one player could win both awards. As my username shows, I'm a big fan of Ernie Banks, but how could he be a two-time MVP on teams that were at the bottom of the NL?

[JimSorgi]

I think they really ought to have 2 awards to clear up the question of MVP meaning "best" player or "most valuable" player. Most Valuable Player goes to a player on a playoff team (or no lower than 2nd place team) and Player of the Year goes to the player who had the best season. Obviously one player could win both awards. As my username shows, I'm a big fan of Ernie Banks, but how could he be a two-time MVP on teams that were at the bottom of the NL?

Or they could just give the MVP to the best player.

[Sammy Sofa]

Why would a great player not be valuable to a terrible team?