Cubs Defeat Theriot in Arbitration

[Wrigley Rat]

http://nbcsports.msnbc.com/id/35494215/ns/sports-player_news/

[XZero771679666304]

No surprise there.

[Sammy Sofa]

Not a surprise, but still wonderful.

 

I hope to one day see a thread title without the "in Arbitration" part.

[SouthSideRyan]

The demon hath been vanquished!

[CubsWin]

Here's some juicy Hendry quotes from the Cubs.com article on the arby decision which are sure to draw some responses...

 

"We've always paid players what's fair," Cubs general manager Jim Hendry said Saturday. "I think those of you who know us know we would've never been in Tampa unless I thought we'd reached the highest level of fairness.

 

That's got to be one of the understatements of the still young century right there. And I didn't know fairness had levels. What exactly is the highest level of fairness?

[imb]

maybe they thought they had signed aaron miles to a 10-year deal

[Guest]

Actually, I believe Hendry has shattered the previously held record of the highest level of fairness.

[Derwood]

It's still nearly 5x his previous salary. Don't we all wish we could get that kind of raise for being extremely average

[davell]

Sorry Scrappy. Not really, here's to Castro unseating you very soon.

[TruffleShuffle]

It's still nearly 5x his previous salary. Don't we all wish we could get that kind of raise for being extremely average

 

if you are extremely average at absolutely the highest level of your profession, you're going to be making very good money no matter what you do, unless you are a lunch lady or something.

[Tracer Bullet]

It's still nearly 5x his previous salary. Don't we all wish we could get that kind of raise for being extremely average

 

if you are extremely average at absolutely the highest level of your profession, you're going to be making very good money no matter what you do, unless you are a lunch lady or something.

 

that's not really the point though, is it? His '09 salary was "very good money." It's not about whether he makes a lot of money. If you're average for your job (even if that job is the highest level of your profession), it's not common to get a raise to 5-times your prior year's salary. It's the nature of baseball contracts, but I think Derwood's point is still fair.

[CubColtPacer]

It's still nearly 5x his previous salary. Don't we all wish we could get that kind of raise for being extremely average

 

if you are extremely average at absolutely the highest level of your profession, you're going to be making very good money no matter what you do, unless you are a lunch lady or something.

 

that's not really the point though, is it? His '09 salary was "very good money." It's not about whether he makes a lot of money. If you're average for your job (even if that job is the highest level of your profession), it's not common to get a raise to 5-times your prior year's salary. It's the nature of baseball contracts, but I think Derwood's point is still fair.

 

As you said though, it's the way baseball contracts work. Most employers don't get to pay someone who's average for the top level of the profession near minmum wage for that profession for 3 years. The only reason Theriot's contract escalated that much is because the rules allow him to be very underpaid to begin with. The arbitration process is designed to slowly let players get closer and closer to their true market value.

 

So in some ways the fact that Theriot got that much of a raise this year shows how much baseball rules are unfair to players and not the other way around.

[TruffleShuffle]

exactly. it's a red herring to say that theriot is extremely average; he's only extremely average when compared to his very well-paid peers in major league baseball. as far as shortstops who play baseball, he's way way way above average, which is why he gets paid well.

[Tracer Bullet]

exactly. it's a red herring to say that theriot is extremely average; he's only extremely average when compared to his very well-paid peers in major league baseball. as far as shortstops who play baseball, he's way way way above average, which is why he gets paid well.

 

no one's arguing that. and no one doesn't understand that "average" is a relative term.

[Tracer Bullet]

It's still nearly 5x his previous salary. Don't we all wish we could get that kind of raise for being extremely average

 

if you are extremely average at absolutely the highest level of your profession, you're going to be making very good money no matter what you do, unless you are a lunch lady or something.

 

that's not really the point though, is it? His '09 salary was "very good money." It's not about whether he makes a lot of money. If you're average for your job (even if that job is the highest level of your profession), it's not common to get a raise to 5-times your prior year's salary. It's the nature of baseball contracts, but I think Derwood's point is still fair.

 

As you said though, it's the way baseball contracts work. Most employers don't get to pay someone who's average for the top level of the profession near minmum wage for that profession for 3 years. The only reason Theriot's contract escalated that much is because the rules allow him to be very underpaid to begin with. The arbitration process is designed to slowly let players get closer and closer to their true market value.

 

So in some ways the fact that Theriot got that much of a raise this year shows how much baseball rules are unfair to players and not the other way around.

 

the fact that he's now getting a "fair" contract (assuming that's what it is) shows that baseball rules are unfair? In many professions, you don't get paid your true value right away if you're really, really good. You have to establish that reputation and put some time in first. You may come out of school with great grades, but until employers see that put to work for a period of years, you're probably not getting paid what you're bringing in for the company. 3 years isn't a terribly long time to have to establish that performance, even in baseball.

[jersey cubs fan]

the fact that he's now getting a "fair" contract (assuming that's what it is) shows that baseball rules are unfair? In many professions, you don't get paid your true value right away if you're really, really good. You have to establish that reputation and put some time in first. You may come out of school with great grades, but until employers see that put to work for a period of years, you're probably not getting paid what you're bringing in for the company. 3 years isn't a terribly long time to have to establish that performance, even in baseball.

 

If you're actually bringing in big bucks to a company you can get paid quickly. And 3 years is a long time to wait in an industry where a 12-year career is a long one.

 

There's really no point in noting that he got a big raise. That's how the system is set up.

[Derwood]

the fact that he's now getting a "fair" contract (assuming that's what it is) shows that baseball rules are unfair? In many professions, you don't get paid your true value right away if you're really, really good. You have to establish that reputation and put some time in first. You may come out of school with great grades, but until employers see that put to work for a period of years, you're probably not getting paid what you're bringing in for the company. 3 years isn't a terribly long time to have to establish that performance, even in baseball.

 

If you're actually bringing in big bucks to a company you can get paid quickly. And 3 years is a long time to wait in an industry where a 12-year career is a long one.

 

There's really no point in noting that he got a big raise. That's how the system is set up.

 

I only mentioned it because he got a 500% raise by "losing" his arbitration case. It's not like the two options were $500,000 or $5,000,000

[Tracer Bullet]

the fact that he's now getting a "fair" contract (assuming that's what it is) shows that baseball rules are unfair? In many professions, you don't get paid your true value right away if you're really, really good. You have to establish that reputation and put some time in first. You may come out of school with great grades, but until employers see that put to work for a period of years, you're probably not getting paid what you're bringing in for the company. 3 years isn't a terribly long time to have to establish that performance, even in baseball.

 

If you're actually bringing in big bucks to a company you can get paid quickly. And 3 years is a long time to wait in an industry where a 12-year career is a long one.

 

There's really no point in noting that he got a big raise. That's how the system is set up.

 

Depends on the industry, goony. Besides, 3 years isn't that long when you're making $500k. While that's low compared to MLB, it's incredible compared even to the minors. Plus, players can be so streaky that having FA start right away or after 1 year would create a great deal of risk. All things considered, it just doesn't seem unreasonable or "unfair." None of which really addresses the point of Derwood's post.

[jersey cubs fan]

the fact that he's now getting a "fair" contract (assuming that's what it is) shows that baseball rules are unfair? In many professions, you don't get paid your true value right away if you're really, really good. You have to establish that reputation and put some time in first. You may come out of school with great grades, but until employers see that put to work for a period of years, you're probably not getting paid what you're bringing in for the company. 3 years isn't a terribly long time to have to establish that performance, even in baseball.

 

If you're actually bringing in big bucks to a company you can get paid quickly. And 3 years is a long time to wait in an industry where a 12-year career is a long one.

 

There's really no point in noting that he got a big raise. That's how the system is set up.

 

Depends on the industry, goony. Besides, 3 years isn't that long when you're making $500k. While that's low compared to MLB, it's incredible compared even to the minors. Plus, players can be so streaky that having FA start right away or after 1 year would create a great deal of risk. All things considered, it just doesn't seem unreasonable or "unfair." None of which really addresses the point of Derwood's post.

 

What are you even arguing at this point? Ryan Theriot became a professional baseball player 10 years ago. He started playing in the majors 5 years ago, and he's just now starting to make some real baseball money.

There was no point to Derwood's post.

Edited February 23, 2010 by jersey cubs fan

[Hunter]

Wonder what the chances of him ever being traded to Seattle are? I would love to see him reunited with Bradley.

[Guest]

Wonder what the chances of him ever being traded to Seattle are? I would love to see him reunited with Bradley.

 

You and me both.

[Eric Clipperton]

Have to think the chances Seattle ever trades for Theriot are basically zero. Some other team will value his grit so highly that Seattle would never even think about matching their trade offer for Theriot, so unless Hendry punishes Theriot for breaking his arb-free streak by sending him to Seattle for little return value, that dream seems to be little more than an amusing hypothetical.

[Hunter]

Trading Theriot to Seattle isn't going to happen, but one can dream. Theriot isn't going anywhere soon, and Seattle signed Jack Wilson to a 2 year deal this winter.

[Formerly Snayke]

So are you all lukewarm about Theriot?

[Guest]

So are you all lukewarm about Theriot?

There weren't many bigger supporters of Theriot while he was coming through the system than I was.

 

As a major leaguer, he's been a good value to the team the past few years. However, his core value to the team has been providing league average production at a minimal price. That core value starts to dissipate this season and will likely completely disappear next season. If he doesn't get traded this year, I'd likely non-tender him going into next season because of his escalating salary.