Re: 2009-10 Chicago Bulls Thread

[KaiserCesar]

what are you confused about? one is an okie joke and the other is reality.

 

No, that's not how it works. Teams are allowed to offer more money to their own players.

 

bird rights give current teams the ability to go over the cap to sign their own free agents, but only up to the maximum salary. and it only applies, obviously, if the team is close to the cap. the cavs aren't close to the cap, if we're really talking about lebron.

 

in addition, current teams can offer 2.5% more in raises per year, but that only gives current teams advantages in years 2-6. however, if another team signs a FA, in year 4, they gain bird rights, meaning that they can offer the 2.5% raise starting after year 3. giving the home team a 2.5% advanatge in years 2 and 3 of any contract. not much of an advantage

 

they CAN offer a 6th year, which other teams can't, though.

 

Doesn't that mean that they have a decent advantage for the rest of the contract? The other team can't raise the ~5% that's already been hypothetically raised in years 2 and 3 plus the 2.5% in year 4, so the current teams salary will be larger than the new team in each year, and the difference will actually grow since you'll be raising 2.5% of a larger base.

[snoodmonger]

hey free agents, come on down to chicago! we've got derrick rose! He doesn't pass! Don't forget about big man joakhim noah! He has foot problems! Those always heal up 100% on big men! Also, we're a playoff team, we got the 7-seed!/We've got a lottery pick! It's cold as hell! Vinny Del Negro gets his plays from NBA Live 98 on the Super Nintendo! Did you know that Brad Miller is still in the league!

 

I know you're just kidding around but pshhh, that can be applied anywhere.

 

hey free agents, come on down to oklahoma city! we've got kevin durant! He doesn't pass! Don't forget about big man .... uh, we don't really have a big man! Also, we're a playoff team, we got the 6-seed! You can't find an open restaurant in town on Sundays! Did you know that Nick Collison is still in the league!

 

i'm not gonna sit idly by while people make fun of Nick Collison.

[imb]

if no one can answer the question, i'll give it to you:

 

over the life of a max 5 year contract, an incumbent team can offer roughly $400,000 total more than any other.

 

not enough to make a difference.

 

i still don't buy it. ever since lebron signed that last deal in cleveland, the talk was that the cavs' best hopes were that they could offer him substantially more.

[Sammy Sofa]

Hey, 400k might as well be 400 billion in Cleveland.

[Guest]

what are you confused about? one is an okie joke and the other is reality.

 

No, that's not how it works. Teams are allowed to offer more money to their own players.

 

bird rights give current teams the ability to go over the cap to sign their own free agents, but only up to the maximum salary. and it only applies, obviously, if the team is close to the cap. the cavs aren't close to the cap, if we're really talking about lebron.

 

in addition, current teams can offer 2.5% more in raises per year, but that only gives current teams advantages in years 2-6. however, if another team signs a FA, in year 4, they gain bird rights, meaning that they can offer the 2.5% raise starting after year 3. giving the home team a 2.5% advanatge in years 2 and 3 of any contract. not much of an advantage

 

they CAN offer a 6th year, which other teams can't, though.

 

Doesn't that mean that they have a decent advantage for the rest of the contract? The other team can't raise the ~5% that's already been hypothetically raised in years 2 and 3 plus the 2.5% in year 4, so the current teams salary will be larger than the new team in each year, and the difference will actually grow since you'll be raising 2.5% of a larger base.

I believe the percentage raise is based off the year one salaries, so there's no compounding.

[Derwood]

the ability to add a 6th year isn't such a big deal either, as the trend that James/Wade/etc. set last time was to take LESS years in order to cash in on a bigger max deal sooner

[UMFan83]

hey free agents, come on down to chicago! we've got derrick rose! He doesn't pass! Don't forget about big man joakhim noah! He has foot problems! Those always heal up 100% on big men! Also, we're a playoff team, we got the 7-seed!/We've got a lottery pick! It's cold as hell! Vinny Del Negro gets his plays from NBA Live 98 on the Super Nintendo! Did you know that Brad Miller is still in the league!

 

I know you're just kidding around but pshhh, that can be applied anywhere.

 

hey free agents, come on down to oklahoma city! we've got kevin durant! He doesn't pass! Don't forget about big man .... uh, we don't really have a big man! Also, we're a playoff team, we got the 6-seed! You can't find an open restaurant in town on Sundays! Did you know that Nick Collison is still in the league!

 

I tend to agree with imb about this. Let me preface this by saying I love Chicago and everything about it, and there's no place I'd rather live. That said, I really don't understand how Chicago appeals to a superstar FA. The weather sucks, the taxes are high, the team has promise but it's probably not championship ready with just the addition of 1 FA. There are some good things too, the city is a big market, the stadium is always sold out, Derrick Rose. I mean if you are comparing Chicago to all the other smaller cold weather cities Chicago is the king. But I just cannot see a superstar choosing Chicago over NYC or Miami, I just can't.

[Magnetic Curses]

if no one can answer the question, i'll give it to you:

 

over the life of a max 5 year contract, an incumbent team can offer roughly $400,000 total more than any other.

 

not enough to make a difference.

 

i still don't buy it. ever since lebron signed that last deal in cleveland, the talk was that the cavs' best hopes were that they could offer him substantially more.

 

for an atheist, you aren't requiring that much proof.

 

you've been listening to those cav fan/believers. those guys are adding the 6th year salary to the contract numbers and telling you that the cavs can offer that much more.

 

in actuality, the 6th year will probably be worth less than the first year of a new contract to a 30-year-old lebron.

Edited March 9, 2010 by Stannis

[Magnetic Curses]

what are you confused about? one is an okie joke and the other is reality.

 

No, that's not how it works. Teams are allowed to offer more money to their own players.

 

bird rights give current teams the ability to go over the cap to sign their own free agents, but only up to the maximum salary. and it only applies, obviously, if the team is close to the cap. the cavs aren't close to the cap, if we're really talking about lebron.

 

in addition, current teams can offer 2.5% more in raises per year, but that only gives current teams advantages in years 2-6. however, if another team signs a FA, in year 4, they gain bird rights, meaning that they can offer the 2.5% raise starting after year 3. giving the home team a 2.5% advanatge in years 2 and 3 of any contract. not much of an advantage

 

they CAN offer a 6th year, which other teams can't, though.

 

Doesn't that mean that they have a decent advantage for the rest of the contract? The other team can't raise the ~5% that's already been hypothetically raised in years 2 and 3 plus the 2.5% in year 4, so the current teams salary will be larger than the new team in each year, and the difference will actually grow since you'll be raising 2.5% of a larger base.

I believe the percentage raise is based off the year one salaries, so there's no compounding.

 

exactly.

[Magnetic Curses]

anybody else want to accuse me of "talking out of my ass" on this subject when they're actually the ones who don't know what they're talking about?

[Garwilly]

anybody else want to accuse me of "talking out of my ass" on this subject when they're actually the ones who don't know what they're talking about?

 

A. What have I shown myself to be ignorant of?

 

B. You still talk out of your ass.

[Magnetic Curses]

anybody else want to accuse me of "talking out of my ass" on this subject when they're actually the ones who don't know what they're talking about?

 

A. What have I shown myself to be ignorant of?

 

B. You still talk out of your ass.

 

:confused:

[Garwilly]

besides, the bulls aren't going to be offering less money than anyone's current team can offer. that's not how things work.

 

 

over the life of a max 5 year contract, an incumbent team can offer roughly $400,000 total more than any other.

[Magnetic Curses]

are you serious?

[Magnetic Curses]

that's what i thought.

[Tyrant]

The difference isn't $400,000, Sully. The 2.5 percent difference in raises comes out to more than that.

 

For example, this summer, the Cavs can offer LeBron a six-year deal that's worth $125.5 million. Every other team can offer him a five-year deal worth $96.1 million.

 

Over the first five years of the deal, the Cavs' contract would be worth $100.2 million. So, you're talking a little more than $4 million difference over the course of five years.

 

We've already talked about the five vs. six years thing, but there's no way that a 6/$125 million deal isn't significantly more attractive than 5/$96 million.

[Hairyducked Idiot]

We've already talked about the five vs. six years thing, but there's no way that a 6/$125 million deal isn't significantly more attractive than 5/$96 million.

 

The five-year deal is more attractive if the player thinks he can make at least 30 million in the sixth season.

[Magnetic Curses]

The difference isn't $400,000, Sully. The 2.5 percent difference in raises comes out to more than that.

 

For example, this summer, the Cavs can offer LeBron a six-year deal that's worth $125.5 million. Every other team can offer him a five-year deal worth $96.1 million.

 

Over the first five years of the deal, the Cavs' contract would be worth $100.2 million. So, you're talking a little more than $4 million difference over the course of five years.

 

We've already talked about the five vs. six years thing, but there's no way that a 6/$125 million deal isn't significantly more attractive than 5/$96 million.

 

like i said, a 30 year old lebron won't be playing for free in the sixth year if he signs with another team. so, it's not that much more attractive.

 

bird rights are not going to be a factor in where he signs, at all. can we agree on that?

[SpongeWorthy]

$30 million in hand is worth two in the bush.

[Magnetic Curses]

$30 million in hand is worth two in the bush.

 

but it's disingenuous to count the money in his final year as over and above what he'd be making without it. is there a chance he'll be out of the league or be worth less? yes. is it a probability and an aspect that makes cleveland significantly more attractive than a better city? nope.

 

the money is not going to be the reason, it's just not enough.

[SpongeWorthy]

For someone like Lebron I agree that it wouldn't make much of a difference. If he's healthy he has pretty good reason to believe he'll make it up on the back end.

 

But I do think that that extra year of guaranteed money means a lot more to someone like Chris Bosh who doesn't have the wattage of Lebron.

[Magnetic Curses]

For someone like Lebron I agree that it wouldn't make much of a difference. If he's healthy he has pretty good reason to believe he'll make it up on the back end.

 

But I do think that that extra year of guaranteed money means a lot more to someone like Chris Bosh who doesn't have the wattage of Lebron.

 

i really think there's no chance bosh stays in toronto, but that's just me.

 

i think the exposure bosh gets in an american city will more than trump whatever toronto can give him. he's a very marketable personality, perhaps even more interesting than lebron.

[jersey cubs fan]

i think the exposure bosh gets in an american city will more than trump whatever toronto can give him. he's a very marketable personality, perhaps even more interesting than lebron.

 

I don't get what you are saying. Either he's possibly more marketable than Lebron, which isn't true, or that he's more interesting than Lebron, which is meaningless since there's nothing interesting about Lebron's personality.

[SpongeWorthy]

The most marketable thing about Chris Bosh is that he actually looks like a Raptor.

 

http://lookliker.com/wp-content/uploads/2008/08/chris-bosh-velociraptor.jpg

[Magnetic Curses]

i think the exposure bosh gets in an american city will more than trump whatever toronto can give him. he's a very marketable personality, perhaps even more interesting than lebron.

 

I don't get what you are saying. Either he's possibly more marketable than Lebron, which isn't true, or that he's more interesting than Lebron, which is meaningless since there's nothing interesting about Lebron's personality.

 

lebron hosted the [expletive] espy's, i think he's got a pretty marketable personality.