Corey Patterson: time to call it quits?

[Soul]

I can personally vouch for Corey being a really nice guy -- at least on a fan level. I was at ST once, and he stood at a fence signing autograhps for an hour, in the Arizona heat. Other players were walking by urging him to leave, too.

 

I don't expect a player to always sign for everyone, they have work to do. CPatt didn't have to do that. I thought it was very nice of him.

[hardcorecubfan]

The wunderkind so many wanted up here with his "five tools." I just hope one of them is a framing hammer or a college degree

From most all reports, Corey is a genuinely nice guy. But feel free to be bitter and trash him for a joke.

 

 

I do not doubt that he is a nice guy, an so are the most MLB players. I am sure Bob Howery is a nice guy to and gave this team a better stretch of performance than Corey but some seem to like to abuse his name.

 

My criticism is from the people that instantly lift a 17/18 year old kid up onto a pedestal and crown him the next Willie Mays before he even plays a game, many did that on our site as well as Cub's scouting system. He is one of my arguments that there should be a minimum and maximum wage for all drafted players

 

Oh ya, wasn't a joke I was serious I am hoping that he did use his money wisely to get an education so we don't see him on ESPN E60 with a segment entitled "How the mighty have Fallen." I wish him the best in life

[soapy]

Did he blow out his knee in 03?

 

Yeah, I think it was July '03. He'd just been chosen to be on the all-star team and then blew out the knee at 1B.

[Banedon]

I still think Don Baylor is largely to blame. He wasn't ready for the major leagues in 2001, but since the Cubs were unexpected contenders that year Baylor pushed for him to be called up so he could be used as a pinch runner instead of continuing his development. MacPhail is equally to blame, because he could have said no to Baylor.

 

That and he was drafted and developed to be a bit of a slugger, but then when he reached the majors coaches said he should turn into a bunting/slapping leadoff hitter. There probably couldn't have been a worse team for him to enter the majors on than the late 90s/early 00s Cubs. There was never a chance they were ever going to fix his most glaring weakness.

 

Same thing happened with Pie.

[dew1679666265]

Did he blow out his knee in 03?

 

Yeah, I think it was July '03. He'd just been chosen to be on the all-star team and then blew out the knee at 1B.

 

That was the reason we acquired Kenny Lofton in the Aramis deal at the '03 deadline. Corey was having a great year in CF, but blew out his knee and was basically done for the year - necessitating an upgrade in center as well as third.

[Tarver]

It's a shame. He just never panned out. His K/BB ratio never helped.

He would have been useful if he had just learned to lay off of those eyes-high fastballs.

 

Considering all of the guys that find ways to stick in the league he should be able to as well at least as a defensive replacement/pinch runner type of role.

 

No team can afford to carry an outfielder with a sub .600 OPS, no matter how outstanding his defense may be. Escpecially one who's slowing down (9 CS in 23 attempts for '08).

 

Considering that guys like Milledge, Pie, and possibly Maybin could be had, it makes even less sense.

[jersey cubs fan]

The wunderkind so many wanted up here with his "five tools." I just hope one of them is a framing hammer or a college degree

From most all reports, Corey is a genuinely nice guy. But feel free to be bitter and trash him for a joke.

 

 

I do not doubt that he is a nice guy, an so are the most MLB players. I am sure Bob Howery is a nice guy to and gave this team a better stretch of performance than Corey but some seem to like to abuse his name.

 

My criticism is from the people that instantly lift a 17/18 year old kid up onto a pedestal and crown him the next Willie Mays before he even plays a game, many did that on our site as well as Cub's scouting system. He is one of my arguments that there should be a minimum and maximum wage for all drafted players

 

Oh ya, wasn't a joke I was serious I am hoping that he did use his money wisely to get an education so we don't see him on ESPN E60 with a segment entitled "How the mighty have Fallen." I wish him the best in life

 

Nobody did that, it's a stupid accusation.

[cbbryan]

I still love CPat. It's a shame he hasn't had much success, but I'll always have a soft spot for him.

[hardcorecubfan]

The wunderkind so many wanted up here with his "five tools." I just hope one of them is a framing hammer or a college degree

From most all reports, Corey is a genuinely nice guy. But feel free to be bitter and trash him for a joke.

 

 

I do not doubt that he is a nice guy, an so are the most MLB players. I am sure Bob Howery is a nice guy to and gave this team a better stretch of performance than Corey but some seem to like to abuse his name.

 

My criticism is from the people that instantly lift a 17/18 year old kid up onto a pedestal and crown him the next Willie Mays before he even plays a game, many did that on our site as well as Cub's scouting system. He is one of my arguments that there should be a minimum and maximum wage for all drafted players

 

Oh ya, wasn't a joke I was serious I am hoping that he did use his money wisely to get an education so we don't see him on ESPN E60 with a segment entitled "How the mighty have Fallen." I wish him the best in life

 

Nobody did that, it's a stupid accusation.

 

Member 2007, maybe need to float back to the post of 2003

[SouthSideRyan]

The wunderkind so many wanted up here with his "five tools." I just hope one of them is a framing hammer or a college degree

From most all reports, Corey is a genuinely nice guy. But feel free to be bitter and trash him for a joke.

 

 

I do not doubt that he is a nice guy, an so are the most MLB players. I am sure Bob Howery is a nice guy to and gave this team a better stretch of performance than Corey but some seem to like to abuse his name.

 

My criticism is from the people that instantly lift a 17/18 year old kid up onto a pedestal and crown him the next Willie Mays before he even plays a game, many did that on our site as well as Cub's scouting system. He is one of my arguments that there should be a minimum and maximum wage for all drafted players

 

Oh ya, wasn't a joke I was serious I am hoping that he did use his money wisely to get an education so we don't see him on ESPN E60 with a segment entitled "How the mighty have Fallen." I wish him the best in life

 

Nobody did that, it's a stupid accusation.

 

Member 2007, maybe need to float back to the post of 2003

 

When he was a near-all star level CF?

[soapy]

 

Nobody did that, it's a stupid accusation.

 

Member 2007, maybe need to float back to the post of 2003

 

hahahaha...yeah, what a noob.

[jersey cubs fan]

The wunderkind so many wanted up here with his "five tools." I just hope one of them is a framing hammer or a college degree

From most all reports, Corey is a genuinely nice guy. But feel free to be bitter and trash him for a joke.

 

 

I do not doubt that he is a nice guy, an so are the most MLB players. I am sure Bob Howery is a nice guy to and gave this team a better stretch of performance than Corey but some seem to like to abuse his name.

 

My criticism is from the people that instantly lift a 17/18 year old kid up onto a pedestal and crown him the next Willie Mays before he even plays a game, many did that on our site as well as Cub's scouting system. He is one of my arguments that there should be a minimum and maximum wage for all drafted players

 

Oh ya, wasn't a joke I was serious I am hoping that he did use his money wisely to get an education so we don't see him on ESPN E60 with a segment entitled "How the mighty have Fallen." I wish him the best in life

 

Nobody did that, it's a stupid accusation.

 

Member 2007, maybe need to float back to the post of 2003

 

A) I posted under a different name before 2007

 

B) People liking the guy and hoping for the best is not "instantly lift a 17/18 year old kid up onto a pedestal and crown him the next Willie Mays before he even plays a game".

[fromthestretch]

The wunderkind so many wanted up here with his "five tools." I just hope one of them is a framing hammer or a college degree

From most all reports, Corey is a genuinely nice guy. But feel free to be bitter and trash him for a joke.

 

 

I do not doubt that he is a nice guy, an so are the most MLB players. I am sure Bob Howery is a nice guy to and gave this team a better stretch of performance than Corey but some seem to like to abuse his name.

 

My criticism is from the people that instantly lift a 17/18 year old kid up onto a pedestal and crown him the next Willie Mays before he even plays a game, many did that on our site as well as Cub's scouting system. He is one of my arguments that there should be a minimum and maximum wage for all drafted players

 

Oh ya, wasn't a joke I was serious I am hoping that he did use his money wisely to get an education so we don't see him on ESPN E60 with a segment entitled "How the mighty have Fallen." I wish him the best in life

 

Nobody did that, it's a stupid accusation.

 

Member 2007, maybe need to float back to the post of 2003

 

You mean 2003, when Patterson put up an .839 OPS before blowing out his knee? When he was 23 (NOT 17/18)?

 

I'd really like for you to find a post on here from when Patterson was "a 17/18 year old kid". That would have been back in the 1997-98 range.

[Banedon]

I'd really like for you to find a post on here from when Patterson was "a 17/18 year old kid". That would have been back in the 1997-98 range.

 

Pre 2005 posts are archived due to site issues a few years back.

[fromthestretch]

I'd really like for you to find a post on here from when Patterson was "a 17/18 year old kid". That would have been back in the 1997-98 range.

 

Pre 2005 posts are archived due to site issues a few years back.

 

Was this site even around in 1997-98?

[Fred Hornkohl]

I'd really like for you to find a post on here from when Patterson was "a 17/18 year old kid". That would have been back in the 1997-98 range.

 

Pre 2005 posts are archived due to site issues a few years back.

 

Was this site even around in 1997-98?

 

No.

[Banedon]

I'd really like for you to find a post on here from when Patterson was "a 17/18 year old kid". That would have been back in the 1997-98 range.

 

Pre 2005 posts are archived due to site issues a few years back.

 

Was this site even around in 1997-98?

 

April 2003 I believe.

[fromthestretch]

Was this site even around in 1997-98?

No.

 

That's my point.

 

Here's what hccf wrote:

My criticism is from the people that instantly lift a 17/18 year old kid up onto a pedestal and crown him the next Willie Mays before he even plays a game, many did that on our site as well as Cub's scouting system.

 

So based on hccf's claims, I'm to believe that not only were people ready to put Patterson in the Hall of Fame prior to his 19th birthday, but they were posting about how great he is on what was at the time a non-existent website?

[Fred Hornkohl]

Was this site even around in 1997-98?

No.

 

That's my point.

 

Here's what hccf wrote:

My criticism is from the people that instantly lift a 17/18 year old kid up onto a pedestal and crown him the next Willie Mays before he even plays a game, many did that on our site as well as Cub's scouting system.

 

So based on hccf's claims, I'm to believe that not only were people ready to put Patterson in the Hall of Fame prior to his 19th birthday, but they were posting about how great he is on what was at the time a non-existent website?

 

.... or would it make more sense to conclude that hccf was simply in error about Corey's age at the time he was referring to ??

[fromthestretch]

Was this site even around in 1997-98?

No.

 

That's my point.

 

Here's what hccf wrote:

My criticism is from the people that instantly lift a 17/18 year old kid up onto a pedestal and crown him the next Willie Mays before he even plays a game, many did that on our site as well as Cub's scouting system.

 

So based on hccf's claims, I'm to believe that not only were people ready to put Patterson in the Hall of Fame prior to his 19th birthday, but they were posting about how great he is on what was at the time a non-existent website?

 

.... or would it make more sense to conclude that hccf was simply in error about Corey's age at the time he was referring to ??

 

I'm not sure that's a safe assumption, considering he was complaining about people crowning Patterson "the next Willie Mays before he even plays a game". Patterson's minor league career began in 1999 when his seasonal age was 19.

 

I guess I'm just sick of the hyperbole. People are intrigued (dare I say "excited") by the potential of a prospect, so apparently that means they think he's the greatest player in the world.

 

Even if he was referring to 2003, then his criticism is unwarranted. Why wouldn't people get excited about a 23-year old, highly-touted prospect showing signs of realizing his potential at the major league level?

[Fred Hornkohl]

Was this site even around in 1997-98?

No.

 

That's my point.

 

Here's what hccf wrote:

My criticism is from the people that instantly lift a 17/18 year old kid up onto a pedestal and crown him the next Willie Mays before he even plays a game, many did that on our site as well as Cub's scouting system.

 

So based on hccf's claims, I'm to believe that not only were people ready to put Patterson in the Hall of Fame prior to his 19th birthday, but they were posting about how great he is on what was at the time a non-existent website?

 

.... or would it make more sense to conclude that hccf was simply in error about Corey's age at the time he was referring to ??

 

I'm not sure that's a safe assumption, considering he was complaining about people crowning Patterson "the next Willie Mays before he even plays a game". Patterson's minor league career began in 1999 when his seasonal age was 19.

 

I guess I'm just sick of the hyperbole. People are intrigued (dare I say "excited") by the potential of a prospect, so apparently that means they think he's the greatest player in the world.

 

Even if he was referring to 2003, then his criticism is unwarranted. Why wouldn't people get excited about a 23-year old, highly-touted prospect showing signs of realizing his potential at the major league level?

 

Be that as it may, in spite of hccf's fuzzy memory with dates, ages, times, etc..... it's certainly not a stretch of the imagination to recall that some people here had unrealistically high expectations of Corey Patterson. The one truism in all of this..... is that hyperbole runs both ways around here, eh?

[jersey cubs fan]

Be that as it may, in spite of hccf's fuzzy memory with dates, ages, times, etc..... it's certainly not a stretch of the imagination to recall that some people here had unrealistically high expectations of Corey Patterson. The one truism in all of this..... is that hyperbole runs both ways around here, eh?

 

I don't think that is the case here at all. HCCF made a stupid comment, and that's the beginning and end of it.

 

People thought Corey could be really good if things worked out. There's no hyperbole involved, they thought he could be really good. And it was not at all unrealistic to think that way, given his obvious skills and his immediate transition to the pro game. People debated the merits of how quickly he was called up and how he was utilized once he was called up, and some people held onto the hopes for far longer than others. But there was nothing wrong with any of that. It's just ridiculous to come on here years after the fact and claim people on this site that "instantly lift a 17/18 year old kid up onto a pedestal and crown him the next Willie Mays before he even plays a game." It's an unnecessary and completely inaccurate criticism of fans who thought and hoped a highly touted prospect could come up and perform well.

 

 

Everytime a prospect fails people come out of the woodworks to make fun of or criticize those who had hopes for that prospect. Critique the paid professionals whose job it is to acquire and develop these prospects, but there's no good reason to heap scorn on fans who hoped the kid would succeed.

Edited May 12, 2009 by jersey cubs fan

[fromthestretch]

Be that as it may, in spite of hccf's fuzzy memory with dates, ages, times, etc..... it's certainly not a stretch of the imagination to recall that some people here had unrealistically high expectations of Corey Patterson. The one truism in all of this..... is that hyperbole runs both ways around here, eh?

 

There's a difference between high expectations and thinking someone is the next Willie Mays. A big difference actually.

 

Based on his posts earlier in the thread, it's fairly obvious he's not a fan of Patterson...which is perfectly fine. However, it certainly appears to be clouding his memory a bit.

[Fred Hornkohl]

Be that as it may, in spite of hccf's fuzzy memory with dates, ages, times, etc..... it's certainly not a stretch of the imagination to recall that some people here had unrealistically high expectations of Corey Patterson. The one truism in all of this..... is that hyperbole runs both ways around here, eh?

 

I don't think that is the case here at all. HCCF made a stupid comment, and that's the beginning and end of it.

 

People thought Corey could be really good if things worked out. There's no hyperbole involved, they thought he could be really good. And it was not at all unrealistic to think that way, given his obvious skills and his immediate transition to the pro game. People debated the merits of how quickly he was called up and how he was utilized once he was called up, and some people held onto the hopes for far longer than others. But there was nothing wrong with any of that. It's just ridiculous to come on here years after the fact and claim people on this site that "instantly lift a 17/18 year old kid up onto a pedestal and crown him the next Willie Mays before he even plays a game." It's an unnecessary and completely inaccurate criticism of fans who thought and hoped a highly touted prospect could come up and perform well.

 

 

Everytime a prospect fails people come out of the woodworks to make fun of or criticize those who had hopes for that prospect. Critique the paid professionals whose job it is to acquire and develop these prospects, but there's no good reason to heap scorn on fans who hoped the kid would succeed.

 

Gooney, are you asserting that nobody on this board ever expressed any higher expectations of Corey Patterson than....

 

A. "could be really good if things worked out"

B. "he could be really good"

C. "could come up and perform well"

 

.... because if that's your argument, then it's really you with the fuzzy memory, not hccf. That's about as disengenous an understatement of the facts as one can imagine. Do those sound like the expectations of a "highly touted prospect" !!! It's unfortunate that the posts from that period are all archived so we'll have to agree to disagree. I stand by my assertion that "some people here had unrealistically high expectations of Corey Patterson." While I don't believe anybody ever made the exact statement that hccf brought up (the next Willie Mays), I surely saw some posts back in the day that were every bit as outrageous as that one..... and yes, that is hyperbole.

[NCCubFan]

Did he blow out his knee in 03?

 

Yeah, I think it was July '03. He'd just been chosen to be on the all-star team and then blew out the knee at 1B.

That year was the first year that the fans got to vote for the last player on each team after the rest of the All-Stars were announced. He had either won the voting or else was leading at the time (one detail I forget is whether he was injurde after the voting was over or while it was still in progress).