What Makes 2 Pitch Pitchers So Effective? (Cubs Related)

[Ski]

Harden and Marmol are both mainly two pitch pitchers. Harden throws fastball-changeup, Marmol throws fastball-slider. What makes them so effective? If you only throw two pitches, doesn't that give the batter a greater chance of guessing the pitch right?

[Transmogrified Tiger]

Harden throws essentially the same pitch at every different speed imaginable. Someone can show you the Pitch f/x graph cause I don't know where it is, but Harden does an amazing job of keeping all his pitches from the same release point, and the trajectory doesn't change until it's halfway to the plate. In other words, hitters can't tell if a pitch is a fastball or changeup until after they need to decide to swing.

 

Marmol's fastball/slider works so well because of the slider. He throws it so hard and it has such late movement that hitters start reacting to the fastball(they need to early because Marmol has great velocity), but the ball falls off the table and they've already started their swing.

[Shilzzz]

Couldn't Rich Hill be considered in this group? He basically threw a mild fastball and that nasty curve. Was the curveball just so nasty that the hitters could never find a balance in the box?

[NCCubFan]

Couldn't Rich Hill be considered in this group?

Not really (at least for now), since this is about EFFECTIVE 2-pitch pitchers.

[Shilzzz]

When he was on though... Hitters were all :scratch:

[CubbieBum]

Harden and Marmol are both mainly two pitch pitchers. Harden throws fastball-changeup, Marmol throws fastball-slider. What makes them so effective? If you only throw two pitches, doesn't that give the batter a greater chance of guessing the pitch right?

 

Well you are talking about two people who have some of the best pitches in baseball and can control it consistently. Kerry Wood has a nasty curveball but he can't get it to go for strikes consistently. Also Marmol can do it because he is a RP and guys don't get to see him more than once a game.

[CubInOK]

Couldn't Rich Hill be considered in this group?

Not really (at least for now), since this is about EFFECTIVE 2-pitch pitchers.

I thought he had that stretch of good outings after he developed a changeup or something.

[BCVM22]

Harden also gets some wicked movement on his changeup when he wants to, so much that it can act as a splitter or some other good breaking pitch at times. That, combined with his consistent release point and ability to dial up the fastball to the mid-90s, is a big part of what makes him effective.

[series65cubsfan]

Harden and Marmol are both mainly two pitch pitchers. Harden throws fastball-changeup, Marmol throws fastball-slider. What makes them so effective? If you only throw two pitches, doesn't that give the batter a greater chance of guessing the pitch right?

 

Well you are talking about two people who have some of the best pitches in baseball and can control it consistently. Kerry Wood has a nasty curveball but he can't get it to go for strikes consistently. Also Marmol can do it because he is a RP and guys don't get to see him more than once a game.

 

Cubbie, are you saying that you prefer having Marmol on the team as opposed to Wood? Or because it would be better because of salary constrictions?

[Hairyducked Idiot]

Harden and Marmol are both mainly two pitch pitchers. Harden throws fastball-changeup, Marmol throws fastball-slider. What makes them so effective? If you only throw two pitches, doesn't that give the batter a greater chance of guessing the pitch right?

 

Well you are talking about two people who have some of the best pitches in baseball and can control it consistently. Kerry Wood has a nasty curveball but he can't get it to go for strikes consistently. Also Marmol can do it because he is a RP and guys don't get to see him more than once a game.

 

Cubbie, are you saying that you prefer having Marmol on the team as opposed to Wood? Or because it would be better because of salary constrictions?

 

Marmol is a much, much better pitcher than Wood.

[Cubswin11]

Like it was said Harden throws a Fastball/Changeup, but he can make his changeup break 2-3 different ways. He can make it move like a change/split/slurve-type pitch. Most relief pitchers just throw 2 pitches since they are in for just 1 inning mostly. So it's not odd that Marmol only throws 2 pitches and he is so effective because his slider is nasty he could tell hitters that it's coming before he throws it and they still wouldn't do much to it.