Week 15: Saints (7-6) @ Bears (7-6) 7:15 PM NFLN/WPWR LOCAL

[Banedon]

2 things that bothered me:

 

-That fake punt call. Winning with 9 minutes left not even quite at midfield and you try a fake punt? You never want your biggest pass in the game to that point thrown by your punter. That said, I could only see the scoreboard replay but I completely thought he caught it and the ground caused the fumble. I guess my friend said he didn't get a second foot down with control or something?

 

-The defense should have ADJUSTED (I know, not a word the Bears staff uses) and used more man coverage on third and long situations instead of letting the Saints go over the middle for 15 yards EVERY TIME. Frustrating to know exactly whats coming and not see them stop it. If I knew it was coming, they had to have right?

 

I only saw the highlights, but that actually looked like a nice touch pass by Maynard. I agree that it was a poor decision, but it's failure sure wasn't because of Maynard failing to execute.

[Derwood]

unfortunately for the Bears, the Vikings have a lot more to play for this weekend than the Cardinals

[Hairyducked Idiot]

2 things that bothered me:

 

-That fake punt call. Winning with 9 minutes left not even quite at midfield and you try a fake punt? You never want your biggest pass in the game to that point thrown by your punter. That said, I could only see the scoreboard replay but I completely thought he caught it and the ground caused the fumble. I guess my friend said he didn't get a second foot down with control or something?

 

Here's the rule as explained by the TV guys (so no guarantees):

 

He caught the ball and had one foot down. Then he was hit before the second foot came down, so from the point he's hit he's in the process of going to the ground. His second foot then hits, but that's irrelevant now because we're in the "going to ground" stage. He's got to maintain control all the way through falling, hitting the ground and coming to a stop, which he didn't.

 

Stupidly written rule, but correctly called.

[Soul]

"Enough Ced: Cedric Benson believes he could have gained 1,800 yards if he had the holes to run through that Forte has had this season, the former Bears running back told NFL.com."

 

Oh go die.

 

 

 

 

http://www.nfl.com/news/story?id=09000d5d80d35e44&template=with-video-with-comments&confirm=true

 

"He is having a great year, but when I see the highlights, I see holes. I see them using him in the slot, something they didn't do with me. If I was there right now with the holes I see, I'd probably have 1,800 yards right now. I definitely would have 1,500 by now. I congratulate him on all of his success. He is taking advantage."

 

wow, SportsNite and the Tribune made it sound a lot worse.

 

How could it be much worse? The man is a fool. He didn't get the opportunities Forte gets because he was one dimensional and slow off the snap. We couldn't use him in many situations because he wouldn't learn to block and wasn't very good catching the football. Defenses knew when he was in there that it was very likely not a pass, so they crunched up on the run -- hence fewer holes.

 

It's his own fault. And the fact that he can't see that is truly hilarious. Add to that the fact that he's a self-centered cancer of a teammate, and you have one big, fat bust of a 1st round pick.

[RynoRules]

2 things that bothered me:

 

-That fake punt call. Winning with 9 minutes left not even quite at midfield and you try a fake punt? You never want your biggest pass in the game to that point thrown by your punter. That said, I could only see the scoreboard replay but I completely thought he caught it and the ground caused the fumble. I guess my friend said he didn't get a second foot down with control or something?

 

-The defense should have ADJUSTED (I know, not a word the Bears staff uses) and used more man coverage on third and long situations instead of letting the Saints go over the middle for 15 yards EVERY TIME. Frustrating to know exactly whats coming and not see them stop it. If I knew it was coming, they had to have right?

 

With respect to your later point, I think the issue is less about the type of coverage (man vs zone) and more about the amount of fruitless blitzing they do.

[Soul]

2 things that bothered me:

 

-That fake punt call. Winning with 9 minutes left not even quite at midfield and you try a fake punt? You never want your biggest pass in the game to that point thrown by your punter. That said, I could only see the scoreboard replay but I completely thought he caught it and the ground caused the fumble. I guess my friend said he didn't get a second foot down with control or something?

 

-The defense should have ADJUSTED (I know, not a word the Bears staff uses) and used more man coverage on third and long situations instead of letting the Saints go over the middle for 15 yards EVERY TIME. Frustrating to know exactly whats coming and not see them stop it. If I knew it was coming, they had to have right?

 

With respect to your later point, I think the issue is less about the type of coverage (man vs zone) and more about the amount of fruitless blitzing they do.

But they were pulling the blitzers out and dropping them into coverage on those plays. And they still left gaping holes in the middle.

[jersey cubs fan]

2 things that bothered me:

 

-That fake punt call. Winning with 9 minutes left not even quite at midfield and you try a fake punt? You never want your biggest pass in the game to that point thrown by your punter. That said, I could only see the scoreboard replay but I completely thought he caught it and the ground caused the fumble. I guess my friend said he didn't get a second foot down with control or something?

 

-The defense should have ADJUSTED (I know, not a word the Bears staff uses) and used more man coverage on third and long situations instead of letting the Saints go over the middle for 15 yards EVERY TIME. Frustrating to know exactly whats coming and not see them stop it. If I knew it was coming, they had to have right?

 

With respect to your later point, I think the issue is less about the type of coverage (man vs zone) and more about the amount of fruitless blitzing they do.

But they were pulling the blitzers out and dropping them into coverage on those plays. And they still left gaping holes in the middle.

 

More man coverage wouldn't help. The Bears defense handled that situation perfectly fine. They were willing to give the Saints short passes, but shut down any semblence of a deep attack. The Bears did send plenty of fruitless blitzes. On one big 3rd down play Wale almost got to Brees as he looped around inside while a blitzer, I think Briggs, took up 2 blockers up the middle. The blitzing just doesn't work. They'd be better off mixing up all out pass rushes and trying to get in passing lanes and knock down passes.

[jersey cubs fan]

Rashied Davis needs to be cut, and Olin Kreutz needs to be replaced as soon as possible. He continues to be the focal point of fumbled snaps, and all he did was get in the way of the running back while trying to block. At the bare minimum they need to find a new captain next year. Seniority should not be the sole determinant of leadership, that's how organizations like the UAW continually shoot themselves in the foot.

 

 

The fake punt was shocking, but that's probably why I don't think it was a bad idea. Nobody expected it and it should have been completed. It was very un-Bear-like and very much against what Lovie is known for, which is conservative field position football.

 

 

Oh, and please take Hester off of punt returns. He's been fine as a receiver this year and will probably keep getting better. He's done as a return man.

[rchap24]

Rashied Davis needs to be cut, and Olin Kreutz needs to be replaced as soon as possible. He continues to be the focal point of fumbled snaps, and all he did was get in the way of the running back while trying to block. At the bare minimum they need to find a new captain next year. Seniority should not be the sole determinant of leadership, that's how organizations like the UAW continually shoot themselves in the foot.

 

 

The fake punt was shocking, but that's probably why I don't think it was a bad idea. Nobody expected it and it should have been completed. It was very un-Bear-like and very much against what Lovie is known for, which is conservative field position football.

 

 

Oh, and please take Hester off of punt returns. He's been fine as a receiver this year and will probably keep getting better. He's done as a return man.

 

I couldn't agree with you more with all of your ideas. Kreutz is the reason that Orton and even Grossman yes Grossman fumbled. Rasheed Davis needs to be benched he drops like at least one ball out of every three thrown to him. They definitly need a new captain over Kreutz he's easily the most overrated center in football. Also Hester has actually gone nuts and went from running sideline to sideline which is horrible to do as is, and started running backwards like 5 yards yesterday. I don't think he's done with it, but please don't use him for the rest of the season back there. Next year if he looks better in training camps give him another shot, but he's done for this year

[Soul]

2 things that bothered me:

 

-That fake punt call. Winning with 9 minutes left not even quite at midfield and you try a fake punt? You never want your biggest pass in the game to that point thrown by your punter. That said, I could only see the scoreboard replay but I completely thought he caught it and the ground caused the fumble. I guess my friend said he didn't get a second foot down with control or something?

 

-The defense should have ADJUSTED (I know, not a word the Bears staff uses) and used more man coverage on third and long situations instead of letting the Saints go over the middle for 15 yards EVERY TIME. Frustrating to know exactly whats coming and not see them stop it. If I knew it was coming, they had to have right?

 

With respect to your later point, I think the issue is less about the type of coverage (man vs zone) and more about the amount of fruitless blitzing they do.

But they were pulling the blitzers out and dropping them into coverage on those plays. And they still left gaping holes in the middle.

 

More man coverage wouldn't help. The Bears defense handled that situation perfectly fine. They were willing to give the Saints short passes, but shut down any semblence of a deep attack. The Bears did send plenty of fruitless blitzes. On one big 3rd down play Wale almost got to Brees as he looped around inside while a blitzer, I think Briggs, took up 2 blockers up the middle. The blitzing just doesn't work. They'd be better off mixing up all out pass rushes and trying to get in passing lanes and knock down passes.

 

Sorry goony, but consistently giving up 3rd and 10+ plus will never be "handling the situation perfectly fine" for me.

[jersey cubs fan]

Sorry goony, but consistently giving up 3rd and 10+ plus will never be "handling the situation perfectly fine" for me.

 

So you'd rather see man-to-man with DBs who can't cover man-to-man so they give up huge plays? The fact is this is a bend but don't break defense. They give up shorter plays. It wasn't the coverage that was a problem, it was the complete lack of pass rush on too many plays. But the Bears played the best offense in football and the defense did a very good job, and won the game.

[Soul]

Sorry goony, but consistently giving up 3rd and 10+ plus will never be "handling the situation perfectly fine" for me.

 

So you'd rather see man-to-man with DBs who can't cover man-to-man so they give up huge plays? The fact is this is a bend but don't break defense. They give up shorter plays. It wasn't the coverage that was a problem, it was the complete lack of pass rush on too many plays. But the Bears played the best offense in football and the defense did a very good job, and won the game.

 

Maybe they just don't do their "soft zone" coverage very well on 3rd and long. How do you figure a pass completion of 18 yards on 3rd and 16 to be a shorter play? It's not. It's a long completion -- exactly what the defense was supposed to be designed to stop.

 

Nobody's arguing that they ultimately got the job done last night. But that doesn't speak to the larger issue of not being a very good defense overall. Part of that is not being able to get off the field on 3rd and long.

[UMFan83]

Yeah, I wasn't saying go man on every play. But when they are consistently getting 15-20 yards on third and long right up the middle with no adjustments all night, its bothersome. They had obviously exposed a hole in the zone and were hitting it all night. Try man for one play, and if it doesn't work go back to zone if you have to. Obviously if we got any damn pressure on the QB in those situations then its a non issue, but we weren't.

[Guest]

I'm of the thinking Olin has been having a much better season this year than last but those fumbled snaps are so freaking annoying. He's definitely getting up there in age and I would love to replace him sooner rather than later, especially at his current price tag.

[brinoch]

Actually, we're all correct with our analysis. As Goony says, the Bears were pretty good on defense. Soul's right, too -- the Bears weren't great at stopping drives when they held them at third and long. I think if you take away the awful fumble by Kreutz and the gimme interception caused by Davis's drop, the defense really looked stellar. The Saints did move the ball -- to an extent -- but the Bears D didn't give them a whole heck of a lot. They need to stop those drives on third down, but the simple fact is that the poor pass rush is enormously costly.

 

As for the reason why the Bears defense fades in the second half... I really think the onus is on the offense. The offense, you say? Well, the simple fact is the offense needs to hold the ball longer and develop more sustained drives. The longer an offense sees a defense, particularly the Bears defense, the more they pick up on their tendencies and they begin to wear them down. And a huge part of this is Turner. He really needs to stop going conservative and, simultaneously stupid, with his play-calling. An couple examples were the final two drives by the Bears... 5 passes, a failed fake punt, and an interception. The last "drive" was particularly egregious. There were five minutes left in the game, and you're leading by 4. Run the ball, control possession. Instead, we get the usual crap...

[brinoch]

Yeah, I wasn't saying go man on every play. But when they are consistently getting 15-20 yards on third and long right up the middle with no adjustments all night, its bothersome. They had obviously exposed a hole in the zone and were hitting it all night. Try man for one play, and if it doesn't work go back to zone if you have to. Obviously if we got any damn pressure on the QB in those situations then its a non issue, but we weren't.

 

We really need to re-tool the D-line.

[BigbadB]

Rashied Davis needs to be cut, and Olin Kreutz needs to be replaced as soon as possible. He continues to be the focal point of fumbled snaps, and all he did was get in the way of the running back while trying to block. At the bare minimum they need to find a new captain next year. Seniority should not be the sole determinant of leadership, that's how organizations like the UAW continually shoot themselves in the foot.

 

 

The fake punt was shocking, but that's probably why I don't think it was a bad idea. Nobody expected it and it should have been completed. It was very un-Bear-like and very much against what Lovie is known for, which is conservative field position football.

 

 

Oh, and please take Hester off of punt returns. He's been fine as a receiver this year and will probably keep getting better. He's done as a return man.

 

Agreed on everything above. Personally, I would include getting rid of Turner. The short sideline routes at the line of scrimmage on 1st down don't fool anyone, and there were way too many in this game, especially with 5 minutes left in the game and a really good chance to eat up a lot of clock. The Bears drive in overtime further pointed that out when Forte ran the ball for a first down on just two carries.

 

Short sideline pass for an incompletion equals about 3 seconds off the clock. A Matt Forte run up the middle for 5 yards equals 40 seconds. If you don't get the first down, you eat up more than 2 minutes of clock and trap NO deep in their own territory.

 

Just horrible play calling in this game.

[jersey cubs fan]

As for the reason why the Bears defense fades in the second half... I really think the onus is on the offense. The offense, you say? Well, the simple fact is the offense needs to hold the ball longer and develop more sustained drives. The longer an offense sees a defense, particularly the Bears defense, the more they pick up on their tendencies and they begin to wear them down. And a huge part of this is Turner. He really needs to stop going conservative and, simultaneously stupid, with his play-calling. An couple examples were the final two drives by the Bears... 5 passes, a failed fake punt, and an interception. The last "drive" was particularly egregious. There were five minutes left in the game, and you're leading by 4. Run the ball, control possession. Instead, we get the usual crap...

 

You're calling for running the ball, possession football and lamenting too many passes and at the same time a conservative game plan.

 

You are right that the offense is a big reason why the defense wears down. They need to have more sustained drives.

[BigbadB]

Oh, and I probably wouldn't cut Rashied Davis until the season is over. But, it would be a cold day in hell before I let him see an offensive play call again.

 

He seems to have a little bit of worth on special teams, and that's the only reason I wouldn't cut him now.

[UMFan83]

I think the TOP for the game was 36-26 in favor of the Saints.

[jersey cubs fan]

Oh, and I probably wouldn't cut Rashied Davis until the season is over. But, it would be a cold day in hell before I let him see an offensive play call again.

 

He seems to have a little bit of worth on special teams, and that's the only reason I wouldn't cut him now.

 

I guess, but I'd cut him the second the team is eliminated from playoff contention then.

[BigbadB]

Oh, and I probably wouldn't cut Rashied Davis until the season is over. But, it would be a cold day in hell before I let him see an offensive play call again.

 

He seems to have a little bit of worth on special teams, and that's the only reason I wouldn't cut him now.

 

I guess, but I'd cut him the second the team is eliminated from playoff contention then.

 

Fair enough. At that point, there would be no reason to waste a roster spot or playing time for someone who isn't going to be on the team the following year.

[Hairyducked Idiot]

I'd cut him now and sign Micah Rucker off the NYG practice squad.

 

But then, I'd cut Devin Hester if it meant I could sign Rucker to the Bears.

[rawaction]

What did NO convert two 3rd and longs? I don't think it was that big of a deal.

[SpongeWorthy]

The sentiment that Hester is done as a return man is mind boggling. He's turning into an effective receiver based almost solely on his athleticism and speed (because god knows his route running is WAYYYYYY under developed for this level and his hands aren't great either). He has an incredible lack of experience for a #1 receiver in the NFL, he doesn't understand much in coverages, and he needs a ton more seasoning. The fact that he's still effective as a receiver tells me he's not "done" as a return man. He clearly still has the athletic chops for it.