Santana's been traded to a team in the northeast

[David]

Kevin Mulvey = Back of the rotation kind of guy.

Deolis Guerra = good fast/change combo. #3 more than likely, possible #2.

Carlos Gomez = defensive CF with tools but can't hit.

Philip Humber = Plus curve, average other offerings. Back of the rotation guy.

 

Guerra does have the ceiling to be a #1 if he ever got that curveball.

 

I can't believe the Twins didn't get Fernando Martinez out of this trade at least. Awful, it sounded like the Red Sox were offering more a few months ago in those rumored trades.

 

How would Veal, Gallagher, Pie, and Ceda compare to that package?

 

Just for the sake of speculation. I know it wasn't likely the Cubs could afford to pay him, given the situation.

 

The Mets will have to extend Santana at something close to full market value. If you look at all the young talent they traded plus the money involved it amounts to a huge price tag. The Cubs couldn't have afforded it.

 

Isn't that what I said?

[Clem Fandango]

The Twins got hosed. They could've done much better.

[SouthSideRyan]

The DH has nothing to do with the AL being better lately. It's because the AL has teams that will spend money, the NL has teams that won't. The Cubs, Dodgers, and Mets have to spend big money and establish themselves such to force other teams to try and truly improve themselves to make themselves or become the Pirates.

 

It's shortsighted to say that the DH has nothing to do with it. The ability to store impact hitters who may get hurt/rehurt in that spot has allowed many AL teams to be more aggressive in getting FA hitters. Magglio Ordonez is the prime example of this.

 

Ordonez is the prime example because he didn't get hurt. If he did get hurt/rehurt, he would be an albatross. Fielding a DH means you have to pay 9 starting caliber hitters. That 9th spot in the NL is taken by a Daryle Ward type, saving money, allowing that money to be allocated to a smaller amount of players.

[Sweet Swinging Billy]

Cub fans should be ticked off. We should have gotten Santana. I'm furious. I know I wont get any sleep tonight. I'm going to call Hendry's office tomorrow and go balistic.

[Mephistopheles]

Cub fans should be ticked off. We should have gotten Santana. I'm furious. I know I wont get any sleep tonight. I'm going to call Hendry's office tomorrow and go balistic.

 

And a lot of fans of other teams are thinking the same thing. Fortunately for your sanity our offers would not have been able to hang with offers from the Sox and Yanks.

[Sweet Swinging Billy]

Cub fans should be ticked off. We should have gotten Santana. I'm furious. I know I wont get any sleep tonight. I'm going to call Hendry's office tomorrow and go balistic.

 

And a lot of fans of other teams are thinking the same thing. Fortunately for your sanity our offers would not have been able to hang with offers from the Sox and Yanks.

 

---Yeah I agree with that Meph but (although I don't know much about the players that the Mets gave up), I think we could have offered Minnesota more. I hope Santana hates New York and asks it get out of his contract, and eventually files for free agency.

[CoolHandLuke]

Cub fans should be ticked off. We should have gotten Santana. I'm furious. I know I wont get any sleep tonight. I'm going to call Hendry's office tomorrow and go balistic.

 

And a lot of fans of other teams are thinking the same thing. Fortunately for your sanity our offers would not have been able to hang with offers from the Sox and Yanks.

 

---Yeah I agree with that Meph but (although I don't know much about the players that the Mets gave up), I think we could have offered Minnesota more. I hope Santana hates New York and asks it get out of his contract, and eventually files for free agency.

 

I am pretty sure this trade is contingent on the Mets signing him long term.

[Sweet Swinging Billy]

Cub fans should be ticked off. We should have gotten Santana. I'm furious. I know I wont get any sleep tonight. I'm going to call Hendry's office tomorrow and go balistic.

 

And a lot of fans of other teams are thinking the same thing. Fortunately for your sanity our offers would not have been able to hang with offers from the Sox and Yanks.

 

---Yeah I agree with that Meph but (although I don't know much about the players that the Mets gave up), I think we could have offered Minnesota more. I hope Santana hates New York and asks it get out of his contract, and eventually files for free agency.

 

I am pretty sure this trade is contingent on the Mets signing him long term.

 

Yeah I know. I hope the deal falls through.

[AlwaysaCub]

I think the more relevant question is this: Can the Cubs as currently constructed beat the Mets in the NLCS after this trade?

[SouthSideRyan]

I think the more relevant question is this: Can the Cubs as currently constructed beat the Mets in the NLCS after this trade?

 

Of course they can. It'd be a 7 game series.

[RedFlash]

I think the more relevant question is this: Can the Cubs as currently constructed beat the Mets in the NLCS after this trade?

 

This Mets team is still basically the same team that lost to a VASTLY INFERIOR Cardinals team in 2006. (With notable differences, ie Santana, Schneider, and Church). So course the Cubs can beat the Mets.

[sneakypower]

Santana's career inter-league stats: 182.2 IP, 16-4, 191 K, 2.27 ERA, 0.91 WHIP.

[Mephistopheles]

his era does not really matchup to his periphs

[sneakypower]

imagine that.

[Mephistopheles]

Santana's career inter-league stats: 182.2 IP, 16-4, 191 K, 2.27 ERA, 0.91 WHIP.

 

but to keep in the spirit of the thread

 

Bedards career inter-league stats: 1.93 ERA, 11.2 K/9

[SABR Gamer]

As long as anyone is going to talk about how much of a grind the NLCS is gonna be, why the hell would it be any better than the Yanks or Sox, if they had gotten him then the only difference is that were playing him on series later.

 

Cubs VS. Mets

 

GM 1 Zambrano VS/@ Santana

GM 2 Lilly VS/@ Martinez

GM 3 Hill VS/@ Maine

GM 4 Burnett* VS/@ Perez

GM 5 Zambrano VS/@ Santana

GM 6 Lilly VS/@ Martinez

GM 7 Hill/Zambrano VS/@ Maine/Santana

 

 

We know AL will have home field because of Bud's idiotic home field advantage ASG BS. Can we please get rid of this rule?

 

Cubs VS. Yankees

 

GM 1 Zambrano VS/@ Santana

GM 2 Lilly VS/@ Wang

GM 3 Hill VS/@ Hughes

GM 4 Burnett* VS/@ Chamberlain

GM 5 Zambrano VS/@ Santana

GM 6 Lilly VS/@ Wang

GM 7 Hill/Zambrano VS/@ Hughes/Chamberlain

 

 

Cubs VS. Red Sox

 

GM 1 Zambrano VS/@ Beckett/Santana

GM 2 Lilly VS/@ Santana/Beckett

GM 3 Hill VS/@ Schilling

GM 4 Burnett* VS/@ Matsuzaka

GM 5 Zambrano VS/@ Beckett/Santana

GM 6 Lilly VS/@ Santana/Beckett

GM 7 Hill/Zambrano VS/@ Beckett/Santana/Schilling

 

I'm not saying Beckett > Santana, its just what the BoSox would probably do.

 

 

Jesus Christ, these series would all have superb pitching.

 

So pretty much no matter where he went, that team owns. Not really anything significant changes for the Cubs if hes in the AL instead of the NL, so I think that people getting worked up about that is silly. You tell me though....Meph? Ping? Bruce? Anyone of our many baseball gurus?

 

* I can dream right? Insert Gallagher/Marquis/Lieber/Marshall/anyone

[RedFlash]

The Twins got hosed. They could've done much better.

 

The Twins didn't get "hosed", the simply didn't get as much as they should have. The Twins should have demanded that any trades would START OFF with Martinez, and not Gomez. Otherwise, I think it's a solid deal, just not "spectular" as Bill Smith should had gotten.

 

But what is being forgotten, is that the Twins do get three pretty solid arms to go with Lirano/Bonser/Slowery, plus a RH version of Felix Pie. So again, the deal is not all bad, just not "spectular" as some wanted.

[David]

As long as anyone is going to talk about how much of a grind the NLCS is gonna be, why the hell would it be any better than the Yanks or Sox, if they had gotten him then the only difference is that were playing him on series later.

 

Cubs VS. Mets

 

GM 1 Zambrano VS/@ Santana

GM 2 Lilly VS/@ Martinez

GM 3 Hill VS/@ Maine

GM 4 Burnett* VS/@ Perez

GM 5 Zambrano VS/@ Santana

GM 6 Lilly VS/@ Martinez

GM 7 Hill/Zambrano VS/@ Maine/Santana

 

 

We know AL will have home field because of Bud's idiotic home field advantage ASG BS. Can we please get rid of this rule?

 

Cubs VS. Yankees

 

GM 1 Zambrano VS/@ Santana

GM 2 Lilly VS/@ Wang

GM 3 Hill VS/@ Hughes

GM 4 Burnett* VS/@ Chamberlain

GM 5 Zambrano VS/@ Santana

GM 6 Lilly VS/@ Wang

GM 7 Hill/Zambrano VS/@ Hughes/Chamberlain

 

 

Cubs VS. Red Sox

 

GM 1 Zambrano VS/@ Beckett/Santana

GM 2 Lilly VS/@ Santana/Beckett

GM 3 Hill VS/@ Schilling

GM 4 Burnett* VS/@ Matsuzaka

GM 5 Zambrano VS/@ Beckett/Santana

GM 6 Lilly VS/@ Santana/Beckett

GM 7 Hill/Zambrano VS/@ Beckett/Santana/Schilling

 

I'm not saying Beckett > Santana, its just what the BoSox would probably do.

 

 

Jesus Christ, these series would all have superb pitching.

 

So pretty much no matter where he went, that team owns. Not really anything significant changes for the Cubs if hes in the AL instead of the NL, so I think that people getting worked up about that is silly. You tell me though....Meph? Ping? Bruce? Anyone of our many baseball gurus?

 

* I can dream right? Insert Gallagher/Marquis/Lieber/Marshall/anyone

 

Well... If he's in the AL, that's one more round he has to get through before we'd face him, and thus one more chance for his team to get knocked out. Plus, if we do face him and manage to get lucky enough to win when we face him, at least it'd be for the Series and not just the pennant, but I digress.

[SABR Gamer]

As long as anyone is going to talk about how much of a grind the NLCS is gonna be, why the hell would it be any better than the Yanks or Sox, if they had gotten him then the only difference is that were playing him on series later.

 

Cubs VS. Mets

 

GM 1 Zambrano VS/@ Santana

GM 2 Lilly VS/@ Martinez

GM 3 Hill VS/@ Maine

GM 4 Burnett* VS/@ Perez

GM 5 Zambrano VS/@ Santana

GM 6 Lilly VS/@ Martinez

GM 7 Hill/Zambrano VS/@ Maine/Santana

 

 

We know AL will have home field because of Bud's idiotic home field advantage ASG BS. Can we please get rid of this rule?

 

Cubs VS. Yankees

 

GM 1 Zambrano VS/@ Santana

GM 2 Lilly VS/@ Wang

GM 3 Hill VS/@ Hughes

GM 4 Burnett* VS/@ Chamberlain

GM 5 Zambrano VS/@ Santana

GM 6 Lilly VS/@ Wang

GM 7 Hill/Zambrano VS/@ Hughes/Chamberlain

 

 

Cubs VS. Red Sox

 

GM 1 Zambrano VS/@ Beckett/Santana

GM 2 Lilly VS/@ Santana/Beckett

GM 3 Hill VS/@ Schilling

GM 4 Burnett* VS/@ Matsuzaka

GM 5 Zambrano VS/@ Beckett/Santana

GM 6 Lilly VS/@ Santana/Beckett

GM 7 Hill/Zambrano VS/@ Beckett/Santana/Schilling

 

I'm not saying Beckett > Santana, its just what the BoSox would probably do.

 

 

Jesus Christ, these series would all have superb pitching.

 

So pretty much no matter where he went, that team owns. Not really anything significant changes for the Cubs if hes in the AL instead of the NL, so I think that people getting worked up about that is silly. You tell me though....Meph? Ping? Bruce? Anyone of our many baseball gurus?

 

* I can dream right? Insert Gallagher/Marquis/Lieber/Marshall/anyone

 

Well... If he's in the AL, that's one more round he has to get through before we'd face him, and thus one more chance for his team to get knocked out. Plus, if we do face him and manage to get lucky enough to win when we face him, at least it'd be for the Series and not just the pennant, but I digress.

 

Yeah, that's a reason but it still seems like people are making it a bigger deal than I would have imagined. Plus I would be surprised if whichever of those two AL teams had him didn't make the World Series. I think the Mets are more beatable than the other two even with Santana, ehhh maybe not if Pedro goes back to how he used to be (but he still is injury prone), but if you added Santana to one of the Yanks or Sox, then I would not be very optimistic about my chances.

[Little Slide Rooter]

The New York Mets need to change their name to the New York:

 

a)Salsa

b)Chupacabras

c)Plethora

 

The Dominican Republic Mets of New York has a better ring to it.

[RammyFanny]

The Twins got hosed. They could've done much better.

 

The Twins didn't get "hosed", the simply didn't get as much as they should have. The Twins should have demanded that any trades would START OFF with Martinez, and not Gomez. Otherwise, I think it's a solid deal, just not "spectular" as Bill Smith should had gotten.

 

But what is being forgotten, is that the Twins do get three pretty solid arms to go with Lirano/Bonser/Slowery, plus a RH version of Felix Pie. So again, the deal is not all bad, just not "spectular" as some wanted.

 

Pie's still shown more with the bat than him in the minors.

[ThePenguin11]

Cub fans should be ticked off. We should have gotten Santana. I'm furious. I know I wont get any sleep tonight. I'm going to call Hendry's office tomorrow and go balistic.

 

And a lot of fans of other teams are thinking the same thing. Fortunately for your sanity our offers would not have been able to hang with offers from the Sox and Yanks.

 

---Yeah I agree with that Meph but (although I don't know much about the players that the Mets gave up), I think we could have offered Minnesota more. I hope Santana hates New York and asks it get out of his contract, and eventually files for free agency.

 

If you don't know anything about the players involved, how can you possibly say we could have offered more? Those four players could be better than our top four prospects for all you know. I didn't think any Cubs fans seriously thought we were contenders for Santana's services. I was pretty sure we were not getting him when I heard we weren't a team on the list he wished to be traded to. That might preclude ol' Jim from trading for him. You might want to wait and think about it before you make that call to his office.

[UMFan83]

The difference between the Mets having Santana and the Yankees/Red Sox is that its been 5 years since we've reached the NLCS and a mere 63 years since we've reached a World Series. I know most people have the all or nothing line of thinking, but I'd kinda like to see the Cubs at least reach one in my lifetime...

[Pushfrog98]

Mulvey

DELORIS!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[RynoRules]

When I saw this last night I was wondering if Terry Ryan "had a brain tumor for breakfast". The only thing I can think of is that the Yanks, Sox and whoever else were being very stubborn about the package of prospects they were offering b/c Santana has only a yr left on his deal.

 

The Cubs could easily have matched this deal, IMO. Veal, Hart, Murton and Pie come to mind as at least an equivalent package. However, I understand that we had no chance b/c of the ownership issue. I also would prefer future payroll flexibility to giving 6-7 years and 150-odd million dollars to a pitcher on the wrong side of 30 (sort of like what we did with Alfonoso; one of those contracts is enough), even though he's probably the best picther in baseball for now.

 

I am not going to worry about how this affects the Cubs yet - let's just win the division first. We can worry about the playoffs when we get there.