Cubs Acquire Ascanio from ATL for Ohman and Infante

[Balsa]

Me likee.

 

Good deal for overpaid small cogs.

[vance_the_cubs_fan]

Ascanio has a lively arm. He worked some as the Mississippi Braves closer after Devine was promoted. I think he will be useful as power right-hander out of the pen. His stuff isn't as good as Marmol, but he could be a nice arm.

[Keener98]

S any idea where Ascanio would probably rank in our farm system? Top 10?

[vance_the_cubs_fan]

S any idea where Ascanio would probably rank in our farm system? Top 10?

 

I doubt that high, I'd probably rank him in the 12-15 range.

[Keener98]

S any idea where Ascanio would probably rank in our farm system? Top 10?

 

I doubt that high, I'd probably rank him in the 12-15 range.

 

 

Still not a bad get for 2 very replaceable guys, and we save money. Seems like a pretty good deal

[vance_the_cubs_fan]

S any idea where Ascanio would probably rank in our farm system? Top 10?

 

I doubt that high, I'd probably rank him in the 12-15 range.

 

 

Still not a bad get for 2 very replaceable guys, and we save money. Seems like a pretty good deal

 

I'm excited as well. He looked good when I saw him at Mississippi.

[Lefty]

Second coming of that guy we got for Farnsworth. Can't even remember his name. Desert fever guy.

[JeffH]

Second coming of that guy we got for Farnsworth. Can't even remember his name. Desert fever guy.

 

Bobby Novoa.

 

Actually, Novoa and Ascanio had remarkably similar lines as 22 year olds in AA.

 

Ascanio had slightly better K/IP and HR/IP ratios.

[Keener98]

Second coming of that guy we got for Farnsworth. Can't even remember his name. Desert fever guy.

 

Novoa?

[Omar]

Thank god.

 

No more 30-40 foot curveballs (to boot.)

[Sweet Swinging Billy]

Nice deal by Hendry. I think that this kid had a pretty high ceiling.

[Guest]

Ascanio, 22, made his big league debut with the Braves in 2007, posting a 5.06 ERA with 13-6 K-BB in 16 relief innings. His callup came on the heels of a fine season with Double-A Mississippi: 2-2, 2.54 with 71-18 K-BB in 78 innings. Ascanio signed out of the Dominican Republic in 2001 and has been brought along slowly because of durability concerns (he's 6-feet, 170 pounds) and because he suffered a lower back fracture in 2005. His arm is electric, though, and he pitches at 95 mph and touches 97. His 84-88 mph slider is a plus pitch. In five minor league seasons, Ascanio has posted a 3.57 ERA to go with 224-84 K-BB in 260 innings.

 

- BA trade analysis

[badnews]

You forgot this part of the Baseball America trade analysis:

 

The Braves did well in acquiring two quality complementary players to fill their 2008 roster at the expense of a live-armed, but unproven, relief prospect.

 

I kind of get annoyed when everyone gushes in perfect harmony. It usually means people are getting wrapped up in sheep mentality. Couldn't someone at least have played Devil's Advocate? Have things sunk so low we're patting Hendry on the back and gushing for freeing up $3 million? What does $3 million buy in this day and age? Other teams celebrate great moves. We throw a party when Jim Hendry frees up $3 million! Give me a break. Put a mark in the "against" column - freeing up a paltry $3 million is part of an annoying reminder to me that this team doesn't spend what it should.

 

What was Jeremy Affeldt's contract demand, I don't remember, if someone else could supply it - something like 4 years, $17 million? With demands like that on the free agent market, don't you think Ohman is worth more? He had a rough stretch where he got beat on by the Phils and Mets in a series where pretty much everyone did, but aside from that he was okay. Wrigley's a tough park to pitch in and Ohman's away numbers were a 1.45 ERA and an 0.70 WHIP.

 

Infante looked okay for a utility guy. I thought his numbers away from Detroit were intriguing. But what angers me is the Jacque Jones trade. Why did we have to kick in money for the Jones trade? Guys like .773 career OPS Jose Guillen, one of the worst right field defenders in baseball last year, are getting 12 million a year for 3 years, and we have to kick in money for Jacque? Why, is Jones less than half the player Guillen is? Look at his seasonal averages. Oh but we "saved money" that may not mean anything, and if it does it could just get flushed down the toilet anyway.

 

It's one thing to have a wait-and-see attitude on what precludes what. Okay. But now it seems like the board is reduced to crowing and mooning over any move that "saves money."

 

I don't think it often makes a lot of sense to save money when the guys on the market are getting paid many times over more ridiculously than the guys you're cutting line of to save money.

 

I reserve judgment until I see who these fantastic savings are spent on, and as for the Jones trade, I think as usual we sold too low.

[SCCubbieFAN]

You forgot this part of the Baseball America trade analysis:

 

The Braves did well in acquiring two quality complementary players to fill their 2008 roster at the expense of a live-armed, but unproven, relief prospect.

 

I kind of get annoyed when everyone gushes in perfect harmony. It usually means people are getting wrapped up in sheep mentality. Couldn't someone at least have played Devil's Advocate? Have things sunk so low we're patting Hendry on the back and gushing for freeing up $3 million? What does $3 million buy in this day and age? Other teams celebrate great moves. We throw a party when Jim Hendry frees up $3 million! Give me a break. Put a mark in the "against" column - freeing up a paltry $3 million is part of an annoying reminder to me that this team doesn't spend what it should.

 

What was Jeremy Affeldt's contract demand, I don't remember, if someone else could supply it - something like 4 years, $17 million? With demands like that on the free agent market, don't you think Ohman is worth more? He had a rough stretch where he got beat on by the Phils and Mets in a series where pretty much everyone did, but aside from that he was okay. Wrigley's a tough park to pitch in and Ohman's away numbers were a 1.45 ERA and an 0.70 WHIP.

 

Infante looked okay for a utility guy. I thought his numbers away from Detroit were intriguing. But what angers me is the Jacque Jones trade. Why did we have to kick in money for the Jones trade? Guys like .773 career OPS Jose Guillen, one of the worst right field defenders in baseball last year, are getting 12 million a year for 3 years, and we have to kick in money for Jacque? Why, is Jones less than half the player Guillen is? Look at his seasonal averages. Oh but we "saved money" that may not mean anything, and if it does it could just get flushed down the toilet anyway.

 

It's one thing to have a wait-and-see attitude on what precludes what. Okay. But now it seems like the board is reduced to crowing and mooning over any move that "saves money."

 

I don't think it often makes a lot of sense to save money when the guys on the market are getting paid many times over more ridiculously than the guys you're cutting line of to save money.

 

I reserve judgment until I see who these fantastic savings are spent on, and as for the Jones trade, I think as usual we sold too low.

 

IIRC, the $$ sent in the Jones deal was for the remainder of his signing bonus, not any of his 08 salary which I believe is $5.5mil. Now that the Cubs won't have to pay anything to Infante in 08, the savings is greater than the $3mil originally thought to be the savings. didn't these moves also clear 2 spots on the 40 man?

 

 

I agree tho that the Cubs sold too low on Jones.

[Guest]

You forgot this part of the Baseball America trade analysis:

 

The Braves did well in acquiring two quality complementary players to fill their 2008 roster at the expense of a live-armed, but unproven, relief prospect.

 

I kind of get annoyed when everyone gushes in perfect harmony. It usually means people are getting wrapped up in sheep mentality. Couldn't someone at least have played Devil's Advocate? Have things sunk so low we're patting Hendry on the back and gushing for freeing up $3 million? What does $3 million buy in this day and age? Other teams celebrate great moves. We throw a party when Jim Hendry frees up $3 million! Give me a break. Put a mark in the "against" column - freeing up a paltry $3 million is part of an annoying reminder to me that this team doesn't spend what it should.

 

What was Jeremy Affeldt's contract demand, I don't remember, if someone else could supply it - something like 4 years, $17 million? With demands like that on the free agent market, don't you think Ohman is worth more? He had a rough stretch where he got beat on by the Phils and Mets in a series where pretty much everyone did, but aside from that he was okay. Wrigley's a tough park to pitch in and Ohman's away numbers were a 1.45 ERA and an 0.70 WHIP.

 

Infante looked okay for a utility guy. I thought his numbers away from Detroit were intriguing. But what angers me is the Jacque Jones trade. Why did we have to kick in money for the Jones trade? Guys like .773 career OPS Jose Guillen, one of the worst right field defenders in baseball last year, are getting 12 million a year for 3 years, and we have to kick in money for Jacque? Why, is Jones less than half the player Guillen is? Look at his seasonal averages. Oh but we "saved money" that may not mean anything, and if it does it could just get flushed down the toilet anyway.

 

It's one thing to have a wait-and-see attitude on what precludes what. Okay. But now it seems like the board is reduced to crowing and mooning over any move that "saves money."

 

I don't think it often makes a lot of sense to save money when the guys on the market are getting paid many times over more ridiculously than the guys you're cutting line of to save money.

 

I reserve judgment until I see who these fantastic savings are spent on, and as for the Jones trade, I think as usual we sold too low.

You either didn't read the entire thread or glossed over any post that didn't fit your perception. I know there were more than one negative comments here as I made at least two myself.

[badnews]

Maybe that is the case. I don't think it's inaccurate to say that trading Jacque Jones, cash, and Will Ohman for a minor league reliever that has solid but unimpressive career numbers has generated an overwhelmingly (and to me, surprisingly) positive reaction. It edges upon gung-ho in some of the comments.

 

Someone compared him to Marmol. Unlike Marmol there's no expected bump to get from turning him from a starter to a reliever - he's pretty much been a reliever all of his career.

[CUBZ99]

Found this on CS this morning:

 

http://chicagosports.chicagotribune.com/sports/baseball/cubs/cs-071204cubs,1,1825969.story?coll=cs-home-headlines

 

Infante was a player the Braves originally tried to acquire from Detroit, but lost out when the Cubs sent Jones and cash to the Tigers.

 

In effect, the Cubs acquired Ascanio for Jones and Ohman, while paying about half of Jones' 2008 salary.

 

Is Sullivan's math really bad, or did the Cubs pick up more of Jones' salary than was originally reported?

[Ding Dong Johnson]

Found this on CS this morning:

 

http://chicagosports.chicagotribune.com/sports/baseball/cubs/cs-071204cubs,1,1825969.story?coll=cs-home-headlines

 

Infante was a player the Braves originally tried to acquire from Detroit, but lost out when the Cubs sent Jones and cash to the Tigers.

 

In effect, the Cubs acquired Ascanio for Jones and Ohman, while paying about half of Jones' 2008 salary.

 

Is Sullivan's math really bad, or did the Cubs pick up more of Jones' salary than was originally reported?

Jones is due $5M, and the Cubs sent $2M in the deal

[JeffH]

Found this on CS this morning:

 

http://chicagosports.chicagotribune.com/sports/baseball/cubs/cs-071204cubs,1,1825969.story?coll=cs-home-headlines

 

Infante was a player the Braves originally tried to acquire from Detroit, but lost out when the Cubs sent Jones and cash to the Tigers.

 

In effect, the Cubs acquired Ascanio for Jones and Ohman, while paying about half of Jones' 2008 salary.

 

Is Sullivan's math really bad, or did the Cubs pick up more of Jones' salary than was originally reported?

Jones is due $5M, and the Cubs sent $2M in the deal

 

Jones is due $5 in salary, plus some portion of his $4 signing bonus.

 

If the signing bonus is paid in equal installments, Jones is due $6.33 in 2008.

 

There were reports that Jones' "salary" for next season is $5.5. That could be a mistake, or it could be evidence that the portion of his signing bonus due this coming January is $0.5.

 

It seems safe to say that the Cubs saved somewhere between $4.33 ($6.33-$2) and $3.5 ($5.5-$2) by trading Jones.

[Post Count Padder]

Bump. Looks like Infante will start the year on the DL for the Braves:

 

The Atlanta Journal Constitution reports that Omar Infante suffered a broken hand when he was hit by a pitch while playing in the Venezuelan winter league.

 

The newspaper reports that the injury may require surgery and could sideline Infante into mid-March, making it possible that he'll begin the year on the disabled list. If that happens, Martin Prado or Brett Lillibridge could win an Opening Day bench job following Thursday's trade of Willy Aybar.

Source: Atlanta Journal-Constitution

[illiniguy]

So...

 

Jacque + Part of his salary + Ohman = minor league middle reliever.

 

 

That's gotta be a blow to the pride.

 

 

I wonder what Jacque is thinking when he hears Hendry talking about needing a lefty OF bat.

"I guess I should have hit 20 HR last year..."

I guess I will have to settle for being on the best team in baseball.

[Illini Iceman]

So...

 

Jacque + Part of his salary + Ohman = minor league middle reliever.

 

 

That's gotta be a blow to the pride.

 

 

I wonder what Jacque is thinking when he hears Hendry talking about needing a lefty OF bat.

"I guess I should have hit 20 HR last year..."

I guess I will have to settle for being on the best team in baseball.

 

You got traded to the Boston Red Sox?

[Roast]

So...

 

Jacque + Part of his salary + Ohman = minor league middle reliever.

 

 

That's gotta be a blow to the pride.

 

 

I wonder what Jacque is thinking when he hears Hendry talking about needing a lefty OF bat.

"I guess I should have hit 20 HR last year..."

I guess I will have to settle for being on the best team in baseball.

 

You got traded to the Boston Red Sox?

 

Well with the addition of Cabrera and Willis they make a legitimate case.

 

Well actually just Cabrera - Willis will probably get hammered in the AL, but whatever.

[badnews]

Questions...

 

Why is Jose Guillen worth $12 million a year, but we had to kick in money to lower Jacque Jones's salary down to $4 million and he still didn't fetch anything in return?

 

Why was Mark Kotsay worth a real prospect when all we got for Jones was a can of magic beans? I'll be interested to hear the Hendry-friendly spin on this one. When Jones has an off year, it counts, but when Kotsay has a bad year (actually 2, his 2006 was as bad as Jones's) it doesn't count? And his crippled back doesn't factor in.

 

I'm still irritated people actually praised this trade.

[CubinNY]

 

I'm still irritated people actually praised this trade.

This too shall pass.