MacPhail: Deal is dead (p. 297), stop posting, go outside

[17 Seconds]

The Cubs finished dead last in offense from the shortstop position in the NL in 2007. So what is Jim Hendry's fabulous plan? Declare that Theriot is fantastic and do nothing to address the situation but spend 3+ months getting jerked around in pursuit of another 2b. Instead of, you know, actually getting a sack and telling the Orioles at some point "This is my best offer. Take it or leave it."

 

Gutless. Absolutely gutless. After 3 months there should be nothing left to discuss. **** or get off the pot.

 

Yeah, I think Hendry keeps forgetting that he no longer works for MacPhail....

Link to where he did or didn't say this? We don't really know what the negotiations have sounded like. All we know is that the Orioles take forever to complete a trade, and that Angelos is probably meddling in some way. The Roberts trade isn't any different than anything else the Orioles have ever done.

 

 

Thank you!!! I believe Bruce said it best. It takes two teams to make a trade. Quit bashing Hendry when no one here knows what is being discussed.

 

Huh? Have the Cubs and Orioles not been talking for 3 months? That's not speculation, that's reality. It's pretty obvious what is going on.

 

You know what is going on? Please fill me in. I don't have any connections. Thanks

 

Do you really think there is any other explanation for what is taking so long? Hendry wants Roberts, that's obvious. MacPhail is willing to trade Roberts, but is asking for too much. This is extremely obvious. What the other poster said was right. You need to eventually pay the price or move on. This has been dragged out for 3 months.

[Ding Dong Johnson]

It's pretty obvious what is going on.

no, it's really not

[17 Seconds]

It's pretty obvious what is going on.

no, it's really not

 

How is it not? After 3 months, name other possible scenarios. Hendry wants him, Macphail is asking for more than hendry currently wants to give. Whether or not somebody else on the O's side (PGA) is holding it up and wanting more doesn't matter. Hendry needs to decide one way or another, because it's just a distraction.

[UBlink]

How is it not? After 3 months, name other possible scenarios. Hendry wants him, Macphail is asking for more than hendry currently wants to give. Whether or not somebody else on the O's side (PGA) is holding it up and wanting more doesn't matter. Hendry needs to decide one way or another, because it's just a distraction.

 

It's clearly not distracting Roberts, so who is it distracting?

[CubbieSouthpaw II]

It's pretty obvious what is going on.

no, it's really not

 

How is it not? After 3 months, name other possible scenarios. Hendry wants him, Macphail is asking for more than hendry currently wants to give. Whether or not somebody else on the O's side (PGA) is holding it up and wanting more doesn't matter. Hendry needs to decide one way or another, because it's just a distraction.

 

I'm not in total disagreement with you at all. But I'm sure the M's are glad they waited for the O's to decide so they could get Bedard. Hopefully (withfingers crossed) that Roberts will be worth the wait.

[17 Seconds]

How is it not? After 3 months, name other possible scenarios. Hendry wants him, Macphail is asking for more than hendry currently wants to give. Whether or not somebody else on the O's side (PGA) is holding it up and wanting more doesn't matter. Hendry needs to decide one way or another, because it's just a distraction.

 

It's clearly not distracting Roberts, so who is it distracting?

 

I'm not saying it's going to kill the team or anything, but of course is a distraction to some extent. I mean, when the team is talking about it with reporters it can't be a good thing, especially with Derosa. Even Aramis was quoted as saying he thinks trades will be made before the season started and that he's anxious to see what the roster looks like on opening day. Again, I'm not saying it's a huge deal or anything, but disctractions like these aren't exactly what you want in the middle of March.

[17 Seconds]

It's pretty obvious what is going on.

no, it's really not

 

How is it not? After 3 months, name other possible scenarios. Hendry wants him, Macphail is asking for more than hendry currently wants to give. Whether or not somebody else on the O's side (PGA) is holding it up and wanting more doesn't matter. Hendry needs to decide one way or another, because it's just a distraction.

 

I'm not in total disagreement with you at all. But I'm sure the M's are glad they waited for the O's to decide so they could get Bedard. Hopefully (withfingers crossed) that Roberts will be worth the wait.

 

Almost every Mariners fan I've talked to was furious with that trade. Bavasi is a pretty crappy GM too. And even that trade didn't drag out as long as this did, not even close. Not to mention the M's ended up overpaying in the end.

[Ding Dong Johnson]

It's pretty obvious what is going on.

no, it's really not

 

How is it not? After 3 months, name other possible scenarios. Hendry wants him, Macphail is asking for more than hendry currently wants to give. Whether or not somebody else on the O's side (PGA) is holding it up and wanting more doesn't matter. Hendry needs to decide one way or another, because it's just a distraction.

you have failed to show anything but anecdotal evidence to suggest that it is perhaps what you view it to be. that, by the very definition of the word, is not obvious. and who is distracted? most players in the league know that they can be replaced at any given time, a trade rumor now is no different than trade rumors through August

[17 Seconds]

It's pretty obvious what is going on.

no, it's really not

 

How is it not? After 3 months, name other possible scenarios. Hendry wants him, Macphail is asking for more than hendry currently wants to give. Whether or not somebody else on the O's side (PGA) is holding it up and wanting more doesn't matter. Hendry needs to decide one way or another, because it's just a distraction.

you have failed to show anything but anecdotal evidence to suggest that it is perhaps what you view it to be. that, by the very definition of the word, is not obvious. and who is distracted? most players in the league know that they can be replaced at any given time, a trade rumor now is no different than trade rumors through August

 

Wait, why are you crossing up my words? I never said it was obivous that it's a distraction, I said it was obvious what was going on with trade talks. You're confusing 2 seperate topics. Go read the post you originally quoted because that was before the distraction stuff (which I've already said was hypothetical) even strted being discussed.

[badnews]

For KingCub:

 

Link to where he did or didn't say this? We don't really know what the negotiations have sounded like.

 

What do you mean, link to where he didn't he say this? Can I link to where he "didn't say this?" Yeah, I can. What does that prove though? What direct quote did I attribute to Hendry that you're asking for a link? Personally, to me, it looks like you're trying to bail Hendry out so you're pedantically asking for documentation when it isn't necessary. Do you honestly need a link to show that the Cubs have been talking about Roberts for 3 or more months?

 

All we know is that the Orioles take forever to complete a trade, and that Angelos is probably meddling in some way. The Roberts trade isn't any different than anything else the Orioles have ever done.

 

Wrong. The Orioles did not take 3 months to trade for Jaret Wright, they did not take 3 months to trade for Kris Benson, and so forth. Whenever the Orioles try to play this game with GMs who actually own a pair, they don't get anywhere. It's only in the desperate weaklings who tip their hands that they can get away with this. So it's not like every other Orioles trade really.

 

For Wrigley23:

 

Oh...and brian roberts just got his 7th steal to lead the spring trainers.

 

Okay, I'm convinced now... Spring Training numbers? Remember when Garciaparra was among the leaders in ST in 2005 in everything and started out the season horribly? If he had 0 steals it would mean as much as leading everyone on Spring Training.

 

Thank you!!! I believe Bruce said it best. It takes two teams to make a trade. Quit bashing Hendry when no one here knows what is being discussed.

 

To CubbieSouthpaw:

 

I will not quit bashing Hendry. Any GM with self-respect would've called for a curtailing of the discussion by now.

 

I'm not in total disagreement with you at all. But I'm sure the M's are glad they waited for the O's to decide so they could get Bedard. Hopefully (withfingers crossed) that Roberts will be worth the wait.

 

I don't think the Mariners even talked about Bedard for over three months. Furthermore, it's Bill Bavasi we're talking about, the guy who overpays for mediocrity even worse than Hendry. Bill "Hey, Asdrubal Cabrera for Eduardo Perez seems like a fair deal" Bavasi. The point is, no good GMs let their chain get yanked by a crackpot organization for this long.

 

There is no reason not to table talks with a "I'll make my best offer, you take it or leave it" demand after all of this time. But Hendry has been too weak to do that.

[Ding Dong Johnson]

It's pretty obvious what is going on.

no, it's really not

 

How is it not? After 3 months, name other possible scenarios. Hendry wants him, Macphail is asking for more than hendry currently wants to give. Whether or not somebody else on the O's side (PGA) is holding it up and wanting more doesn't matter. Hendry needs to decide one way or another, because it's just a distraction.

you have failed to show anything but anecdotal evidence to suggest that it is perhaps what you view it to be. that, by the very definition of the word, is not obvious. and who is distracted? most players in the league know that they can be replaced at any given time, a trade rumor now is no different than trade rumors through August

 

Wait, why are you crossing up my words? I never said it was obivous that it's a distraction, I said it was obvious what was going on with trade talks. You're confusing 2 seperate topics. Go read the post you originally quoted because that was before the distraction stuff (which I've already said was hypothetical) even strted being discussed.

I believe you just crossed my words, there's no confusion here

[17 Seconds]

It's pretty obvious what is going on.

no, it's really not

 

How is it not? After 3 months, name other possible scenarios. Hendry wants him, Macphail is asking for more than hendry currently wants to give. Whether or not somebody else on the O's side (PGA) is holding it up and wanting more doesn't matter. Hendry needs to decide one way or another, because it's just a distraction.

you have failed to show anything but anecdotal evidence to suggest that it is perhaps what you view it to be. that, by the very definition of the word, is not obvious. and who is distracted? most players in the league know that they can be replaced at any given time, a trade rumor now is no different than trade rumors through August

 

Wait, why are you crossing up my words? I never said it was obivous that it's a distraction, I said it was obvious what was going on with trade talks. You're confusing 2 seperate topics. Go read the post you originally quoted because that was before the distraction stuff (which I've already said was hypothetical) even strted being discussed.

I believe you just crossed my words, there's no confusion here

 

You're right, I read it wrong.

 

Anyways, my point still stands. I think it's very obvious what is going on. I really don't see how it could not be what's going on. If you could give me an example of what might be going on, I'd love to hear it.

 

We know that Hendry wants Roberts.

 

We know that MacPhail is willing to deal Roberts to the Cubs if they meet his demands.

 

How is it NOT obvious to anybody what is going on here? I mean, even if you didn't pay attention to the hundreds of reports that have come out in the media which confirm what's going on, it's still pretty obvious. They're negotiatng, like all trades. The pnly difference is that negotiations don't usually last 3 months.

 

Seriously, what else could possibly be going on? A trade has been done for 2 months but MacPhail lost PGA's cell number and hasn't been able to get ahold of him? I'd love to hear a a reasonable example of something that could possibly be happening other than 2 teams negotiating. Please, enlighten me.

[Bote McBoteface]

It's not just O.H. getting into the rumor fabricating business:

 

Found this on another board:

 

Ugh. So my comma keys don't work, I'll say it as best as I can.

 

At my old High School in Northwest, Indiana they had some youth baseball meeting, and apparently some member of DeRosa's family was on hand talking to the kids etc etc. The Principal asked how his son was etc, I think they know their family or what not. Eventually someone mentioned him playing Second Base, because DeRosa said on the local radio he didn't want to play right field but would do whatever the cubs wanted but really preferred not to play it. Eventually said they were supposed to sign Brian Roberts by tomorrow evening.

 

Guys names in the school paper too from the rally. Should be somewhere online, I'll look it up. Scan it etc.

 

But yeah, tomorrow he'll be on the Cubs by tomorrow evening. Of course it could not happen but I doubt they'd just lie about it. Who knows just keep an eye out for ESPN or cubs.com or something.

 

:lol:

[BCVM22]

It's not just O.H. getting into the rumor fabricating business:

 

Found this on another board:

 

Ugh. So my comma keys don't work, I'll say it as best as I can.

 

At my old High School in Northwest, Indiana they had some youth baseball meeting, and apparently some member of DeRosa's family was on hand talking to the kids etc etc. The Principal asked how his son was etc, I think they know their family or what not. Eventually someone mentioned him playing Second Base, because DeRosa said on the local radio he didn't want to play right field but would do whatever the cubs wanted but really preferred not to play it. Eventually said they were supposed to sign Brian Roberts by tomorrow evening.

 

Guys names in the school paper too from the rally. Should be somewhere online, I'll look it up. Scan it etc.

 

But yeah, tomorrow he'll be on the Cubs by tomorrow evening. Of course it could not happen but I doubt they'd just lie about it. Who knows just keep an eye out for ESPN or cubs.com or something.

 

:lol:

 

My goodness, the rumor mongering is simply getting out of hand now.

[17 Seconds]

It's not just O.H. getting into the rumor fabricating business:

 

Found this on another board:

 

Ugh. So my comma keys don't work, I'll say it as best as I can.

 

At my old High School in Northwest, Indiana they had some youth baseball meeting, and apparently some member of DeRosa's family was on hand talking to the kids etc etc. The Principal asked how his son was etc, I think they know their family or what not. Eventually someone mentioned him playing Second Base, because DeRosa said on the local radio he didn't want to play right field but would do whatever the cubs wanted but really preferred not to play it. Eventually said they were supposed to sign Brian Roberts by tomorrow evening.

 

Guys names in the school paper too from the rally. Should be somewhere online, I'll look it up. Scan it etc.

 

But yeah, tomorrow he'll be on the Cubs by tomorrow evening. Of course it could not happen but I doubt they'd just lie about it. Who knows just keep an eye out for ESPN or cubs.com or something.

 

:lol:

 

I think the part where he said we'd be "signing" Brian Roberts just proves that this guy has a very trustworthy source.

[Ding Dong Johnson]

Ugh. So my comma keys don't work, I'll say it as best as I can.

 

um...

[Wheelimus]

Ugh. So my comma keys don't work, I'll say it as best as I can.

 

um...

 

When I think of inside sources, I think of someone too lazy to unstick their comma keys. :^o

[TheDude]

It's pretty obvious what is going on.

no, it's really not

 

How is it not? After 3 months, name other possible scenarios. Hendry wants him, Macphail is asking for more than hendry currently wants to give. Whether or not somebody else on the O's side (PGA) is holding it up and wanting more doesn't matter. Hendry needs to decide one way or another, because it's just a distraction.

 

So you'd rather Hendry give up more than he needs to in the trade?

[CubColtPacer]

They may have been lightly dicussing this for 3 months, but there really haven't been firm negotiations for nearly that long. Bruce said that that after the initial discussions, the Orioles wanted to wait until after the Bedard trade was done, so that tabled the discussions for quite a while. Even when the discussions have continued now from media reports they have been somewhat sporadic, and there have been numerous reports that the delay has been largely based on that the Orioles want to do some further scouting of the Cubs minor leagues before coming to a decision.

 

Now, I would agree that the discussions should be tabled for a while if we hit Opening Day with no deal. I just don't really care if there's a small distraction over the team in Spring Training.

[Moonshot]

Now, I would agree that the discussions should be tabled for a while if we hit Opening Day with no deal. I just don't really care if there's a small distraction over the team in Spring Training.

 

You should have stopped after "tabled". You would have had me on board. These discussions need to stop, period. No more talking, it's time for MacPhail to put up or shut up. If some of these "insiders" information is correct, and Hendry has offered some of the names being mentioned, then he has offered a more than fair deal in my eyes.

 

Roberts is a good player, he's not a superstar, just because he's got sentimental value to PGA doesn't make him worth a king's ransom to another team, contrary to what Orioles fans seem to think.

 

If MacPhail isn't happy with the offer from Hendry, then it's time for Hendry to walk away....not for a while, but for good. Period.

[Ding Dong Johnson]

Now, I would agree that the discussions should be tabled for a while if we hit Opening Day with no deal. I just don't really care if there's a small distraction over the team in Spring Training.

 

You should have stopped after "tabled". You would have had me on board. These discussions need to stop, period. No more talking, it's time for MacPhail to put up or shut up. If some of these "insiders" information is correct, and Hendry has offered some of the names being mentioned, then he has offered a more than fair deal in my eyes.

 

Roberts is a good player, he's not a superstar, just because he's got sentimental value to PGA doesn't make him worth a king's ransom to another team, contrary to what Orioles fans seem to think.

 

If MacPhail isn't happy with the offer from Hendry, then it's time for Hendry to walk away....not for a while, but for good. Period.

has Hendry offered or has MacPhail requested?

[KingCubsFan]

For KingCub:

 

Link to where he did or didn't say this? We don't really know what the negotiations have sounded like.

 

What do you mean, link to where he didn't he say this? Can I link to where he "didn't say this?" Yeah, I can. What does that prove though? What direct quote did I attribute to Hendry that you're asking for a link? Personally, to me, it looks like you're trying to bail Hendry out so you're pedantically asking for documentation when it isn't necessary. Do you honestly need a link to show that the Cubs have been talking about Roberts for 3 or more months?

It's very simple. You accused Hendry for a certain behavior, and there's absolutely no evidence to show that he's acting in that way. The Orioles have always acted like this when trading a player, yet you think this time it's Hendry's fault. I'm not trying to bail out Hendry, I'm just asking for some sort of proof as to your statement. People do that all the time on this board, and justifiably so.

 

All we know is that the Orioles take forever to complete a trade, and that Angelos is probably meddling in some way. The Roberts trade isn't any different than anything else the Orioles have ever done.

 

Wrong. The Orioles did not take 3 months to trade for Jaret Wright, they did not take 3 months to trade for Kris Benson, and so forth. Whenever the Orioles try to play this game with GMs who actually own a pair, they don't get anywhere. It's only in the desperate weaklings who tip their hands that they can get away with this. So it's not like every other Orioles trade really.

Those are times when the Orioles traded FOR a player, so it's not necessarily on their timetable. Find me a time over the past few years when they traded an important player or signed an important player and it didn't get delayed somehow.

[mul21]

Those are times when the Orioles traded FOR a player, so it's not necessarily on their timetable. Find me a time over the past few years when they traded an important player or signed an important player and it didn't get delayed somehow.

 

Pretty sure the Trachsel deal last year didn't go on for very long and also the Tejada deal this year didn't drag on and on. It was rumored for a couple of weeks but went down pretty quickly. Not nearly as fast as the Renteria trade went down, but it certainly didn't drag on like "every deal the O's make" like you are saying.

[UMFan83]

Those are times when the Orioles traded FOR a player, so it's not necessarily on their timetable. Find me a time over the past few years when they traded an important player or signed an important player and it didn't get delayed somehow.

 

Pretty sure the Trachsel deal last year didn't go on for very long and also the Tejada deal this year didn't drag on and on. It was rumored for a couple of weeks but went down pretty quickly. Not nearly as fast as the Renteria trade went down, but it certainly didn't drag on like "every deal the O's make" like you are saying.

 

The Trachsel trade was a minor one, although they got a great return for him. Tejada dragged on for a couple of weeks with false reports, but they wanted to hurry and trade him before the Mitchell Report came out so they had a deadline in mind. The Bedard and Roberts trades will shape the face of the franchise for years, so they are taking their time with it. Understandable, but its getting a bit ridiculous at this point.

[bring stone back]

How is it not? After 3 months, name other possible scenarios. Hendry wants him, Macphail is asking for more than hendry currently wants to give. Whether or not somebody else on the O's side (PGA) is holding it up and wanting more doesn't matter. Hendry needs to decide one way or another, because it's just a distraction.

 

It's clearly not distracting Roberts, so who is it distracting?

 

Me - I spend at least 2 minutes a day checking SI.com to see of any announcement or the latest Roberts/Cubs rumor.

 

(I'm sorry, I just really wanted to join the club of those who were a part of this legendary thread).