College Basketball 2007-2008

[illiniguy]

I personally am suprised that Butler isn't getting more love than they are. You are probably right about the Big Ten being down hurting Wisky, but I still think they will be a very tough out.

 

I think an interesting discussion would be: who is the best Indiana tournament team? IU, Purdue, Notre Dame, Butler? They're practically interchangeable.

Good luck with that one. I like Butler the best because guards usually win in the tournament. Purdue is either going to do pretty well or get beat out right away. IU has the talent to go pretty far, but have struggled with bad teams while beating good teams. Notre Dame is a solid bet for the sweet 16.

[fromthestretch]

I personally am suprised that Butler isn't getting more love than they are. You are probably right about the Big Ten being down hurting Wisky, but I still think they will be a very tough out.

 

I think an interesting discussion would be: who is the best Indiana tournament team? IU, Purdue, Notre Dame, Butler? They're practically interchangeable.

Good luck with that one. I like Butler the best because guards usually win in the tournament. Purdue is either going to do pretty well or get beat out right away. IU has the talent to go pretty far, but have struggled with bad teams while beating good teams. Notre Dame is a solid bet for the sweet 16.

 

Just don't count out Purdue in the first round. They always seem to win their first game. After that, however...

[illiniguy]

I personally am suprised that Butler isn't getting more love than they are. You are probably right about the Big Ten being down hurting Wisky, but I still think they will be a very tough out.

 

I think an interesting discussion would be: who is the best Indiana tournament team? IU, Purdue, Notre Dame, Butler? They're practically interchangeable.

Good luck with that one. I like Butler the best because guards usually win in the tournament. Purdue is either going to do pretty well or get beat out right away. IU has the talent to go pretty far, but have struggled with bad teams while beating good teams. Notre Dame is a solid bet for the sweet 16.

 

Just don't count out Purdue in the first round. They always seem to win their first game. After that, however...

Oh I know, they gave Florida their best game last year. I just think with having all underclassmen, they could be very rone for an upset.

[Flames24Rulz]

I think Xavier gets a 3 seed, and no Big Ten team ends up higher than a 4. Still plenty of games to play, though.

 

I'll start an NCAA tournament mock selection/discussion thread soon. Probably Monday.

I hope you are wrong on the second part. Wisky went in and won at Texas, who might end up with a 1. They also swept IU. Just because they don't have any names, doesn't mean they aren't very good. If they win out they should be a 2.

 

Wisconsin is the best of the lot, but the Big Ten is way down this year, non-conference RPI worse than the MVC, and there's been no "clear" best team. If Wisconsin had gone, say, 17-1 or 18-0 in the Big Ten, a 2 would have been a possibility, but the flaws in the other BT tourney teams (Indiana beat down by UConn, Purdue's bad early losses, Michigan State looking awful in conference) are going to end up reflecting on the quality of Wisconsin's team, IMO.

 

If I had to seed 1-4 today, I'd probably go

 

1. Memphis, North Carolina, UCLA, Tennessee

2. Texas, Kansas, Louisville, Duke

3. Georgetown, Vandy, Xavier, Stanford

4. Connecticut, Wisconsin, Drake, Pick an Indiana Team/Marquette

I personally am suprised that Butler isn't getting more love than they are. You are probably right about the Big Ten being down hurting Wisky, but I still think they will be a very tough out.

 

I know Drake just beat Butler, but they're playing themselves out of a 4 seed...possibly even a 5 seed. Since they lost to us, they're 2-3 in their last 5 games including a home loss to Bradley and a road loss to Missouri State. Not a particularly good time to be playing inconsistantly.

[illiniguy]

I think Xavier gets a 3 seed, and no Big Ten team ends up higher than a 4. Still plenty of games to play, though.

 

I'll start an NCAA tournament mock selection/discussion thread soon. Probably Monday.

I hope you are wrong on the second part. Wisky went in and won at Texas, who might end up with a 1. They also swept IU. Just because they don't have any names, doesn't mean they aren't very good. If they win out they should be a 2.

 

Wisconsin is the best of the lot, but the Big Ten is way down this year, non-conference RPI worse than the MVC, and there's been no "clear" best team. If Wisconsin had gone, say, 17-1 or 18-0 in the Big Ten, a 2 would have been a possibility, but the flaws in the other BT tourney teams (Indiana beat down by UConn, Purdue's bad early losses, Michigan State looking awful in conference) are going to end up reflecting on the quality of Wisconsin's team, IMO.

 

If I had to seed 1-4 today, I'd probably go

 

1. Memphis, North Carolina, UCLA, Tennessee

2. Texas, Kansas, Louisville, Duke

3. Georgetown, Vandy, Xavier, Stanford

4. Connecticut, Wisconsin, Drake, Pick an Indiana Team/Marquette

I personally am suprised that Butler isn't getting more love than they are. You are probably right about the Big Ten being down hurting Wisky, but I still think they will be a very tough out.

 

I know Drake just beat Butler, but they're playing themselves out of a 4 seed...possibly even a 5 seed. Since they lost to us, they're 2-3 in their last 5 games including a home loss to Bradley and a road loss to Missouri State. Not a particularly good time to be playing inconsistantly.

Really though aren't the law of averages catching up to them? They have played way over their heads all year long and finally are losing some of the close games?

[Flames24Rulz]

Latest Bracketology: http://sports.espn.go.com/ncb/bracketology

 

Moved up from the last team on the "Next Four Out" column to the last team on the "Last Four Out" column. With a win over ISU tomorrow night and some help, we could crack Lunardi's bracket on Monday. Unreal.

[Andy]

Whoever wins the Big 10 tourney probably gets a 3, whoever that team beats probably gets a 4, and whoever of the big three doesn't make the final gets a 4 or a 5.

 

Just my .02.

 

I think L-Ville is a 2 as long as they make the Big East final, G-Town is a 3, and UConn and ND both deserve a 4, but I think one of them (and it'll probably be us) gets shuttled to 5.

 

As for Indiana teams, I'd be surprised if any are still standing in the Elite 8, but all of them are Sweet 16 caliber. Of the teams I'd say IU has the best chance to win three games because they have the best pair of players of any of the teams.

[illiniguy]

Whoever wins the Big 10 tourney probably gets a 3, whoever that team beats probably gets a 4, and whoever of the big three doesn't make the final gets a 4 or a 5.

 

Just my .02.

 

I think L-Ville is a 2 as long as they make the Big East final, G-Town is a 3, and UConn and ND both deserve a 4, but I think one of them (and it'll probably be us) gets shuttled to 5.

 

As for Indiana teams, I'd be surprised if any are still standing in the Elite 8, but all of them are Sweet 16 caliber. Of the teams I'd say IU has the best chance to win three games because they have the best pair of players of any of the teams.

Remember the Big ten tourny final is played after the bracket is set.

Edited February 29, 2008 by illiniguy

[brinoch]

Illinois could beat IU if they match up with them. We could have twice this year. We get up for them. The other teams we can't even hang with.

 

Anyone can beat anyone, in theory.

 

I have no doubt that Illinois would get up for IU, but I think their "up" would be a little less now since Sampson's gone and they've already played twice... it's hard to hold that intensity for three games. Plus, IU's already in the NCAA tournament, so there's little get up for other than pride -- and perhaps sneaking an automatic bid.

 

I don't think IU and UI will get another chance to play. It looks like Illinois will be the #10 seed, almost certainly, putting them on track to play against the #2 seed (should Illinois win their first game). I really think that'll be Purdue.

[illiniguy]

Illinois could beat IU if they match up with them. We could have twice this year. We get up for them. The other teams we can't even hang with.

 

Anyone can beat anyone, in theory.

 

I have no doubt that Illinois would get up for IU, but I think their "up" would be a little less now since Sampson's gone and they've already played twice... it's hard to hold that intensity for three games. Plus, IU's already in the NCAA tournament, so there's little get up for other than pride -- and perhaps sneaking an automatic bid.

 

I don't think IU and UI will get another chance to play. It looks like Illinois will be the #10 seed, almost certainly, putting them on track to play against the #2 seed (should Illinois win their first game). I really think that'll be Purdue.

Gordon is reason enough for us to get up. But, yeah we probably won't play.

[Flames24Rulz]

I think Xavier gets a 3 seed, and no Big Ten team ends up higher than a 4. Still plenty of games to play, though.

 

I'll start an NCAA tournament mock selection/discussion thread soon. Probably Monday.

I hope you are wrong on the second part. Wisky went in and won at Texas, who might end up with a 1. They also swept IU. Just because they don't have any names, doesn't mean they aren't very good. If they win out they should be a 2.

 

Wisconsin is the best of the lot, but the Big Ten is way down this year, non-conference RPI worse than the MVC, and there's been no "clear" best team. If Wisconsin had gone, say, 17-1 or 18-0 in the Big Ten, a 2 would have been a possibility, but the flaws in the other BT tourney teams (Indiana beat down by UConn, Purdue's bad early losses, Michigan State looking awful in conference) are going to end up reflecting on the quality of Wisconsin's team, IMO.

 

If I had to seed 1-4 today, I'd probably go

 

1. Memphis, North Carolina, UCLA, Tennessee

2. Texas, Kansas, Louisville, Duke

3. Georgetown, Vandy, Xavier, Stanford

4. Connecticut, Wisconsin, Drake, Pick an Indiana Team/Marquette

I personally am suprised that Butler isn't getting more love than they are. You are probably right about the Big Ten being down hurting Wisky, but I still think they will be a very tough out.

 

I know Drake just beat Butler, but they're playing themselves out of a 4 seed...possibly even a 5 seed. Since they lost to us, they're 2-3 in their last 5 games including a home loss to Bradley and a road loss to Missouri State. Not a particularly good time to be playing inconsistantly.

Really though aren't the law of averages catching up to them? They have played way over their heads all year long and finally are losing some of the close games?

 

More than anything, I think it's a lack of an option off the bench. They have a great starting 5, but that's literally it. When they played us, I think they had 9 guys play, but only 7 guys received playing time of more than 4 minutes and only 5 guys played more than 8-9 minutes.

 

They've flirted with danger all year long, so it's not really a surprise to see them losing some games right now. Depending on how the draw goes, I could see them really struggling against the 8/9 seed on Quarterfinal Friday. For our sake, I hope they make the conference title game, but I don't really see it happening.

[TruffleShuffle]

I personally am suprised that Butler isn't getting more love than they are. You are probably right about the Big Ten being down hurting Wisky, but I still think they will be a very tough out.

 

I think an interesting discussion would be: who is the best Indiana tournament team? IU, Purdue, Notre Dame, Butler? They're practically interchangeable.

Good luck with that one. I like Butler the best because guards usually win in the tournament. Purdue is either going to do pretty well or get beat out right away. IU has the talent to go pretty far, but have struggled with bad teams while beating good teams. Notre Dame is a solid bet for the sweet 16.

 

is this really true? everyone says it, but i don't necessarily know that i believe it.

 

2007/2006: best players on the team were a center (noah) and power forward (horford)

2005: unc won the game because of sean may

2004: uconn had good guards, but okafor was easily their mvp

2003: carmelo anthony was tourney mvp, averaged about 10 rebounds per game that year

2002: juan dixon was the terps' mvp, but lonnie baxter and chris wilcox were two of the better big men that year.

2001: battier was tourney mvp; dunleavy and boozer also played huge roles.

[illiniguy]

I personally am suprised that Butler isn't getting more love than they are. You are probably right about the Big Ten being down hurting Wisky, but I still think they will be a very tough out.

 

I think an interesting discussion would be: who is the best Indiana tournament team? IU, Purdue, Notre Dame, Butler? They're practically interchangeable.

Good luck with that one. I like Butler the best because guards usually win in the tournament. Purdue is either going to do pretty well or get beat out right away. IU has the talent to go pretty far, but have struggled with bad teams while beating good teams. Notre Dame is a solid bet for the sweet 16.

 

is this really true? everyone says it, but i don't necessarily know that i believe it.

 

2007/2006: best players on the team were a center (noah) and power forward (horford)

2005: unc won the game because of sean may

2004: uconn had good guards, but okafor was easily their mvp

2003: carmelo anthony was tourney mvp, averaged about 10 rebounds per game that year

2002: juan dixon was the terps' mvp, but lonnie baxter and chris wilcox were two of the better big men that year.

2001: battier was tourney mvp; dunleavy and boozer also played huge roles.

I would argue UNC won because of Felton. We had fought back to tie late and he hit a crushing three with two guys in his face. McCants was a decent college guy too. But, I do wonder how much of a factor it really is.

[bukie]

I would argue UNC won because Illinois' only decent big man played 9 minutes before fouling out against Sean May.

[illiniguy]

I would argue UNC won because Illinois' only decent big man played 9 minutes before fouling out against Sean May.

Jack Ingrem was decent. As was Roger Powell.

[bukie]

I would argue UNC won because Illinois' only decent big man played 9 minutes before fouling out against Sean May.

Jack Ingrem was decent. As was Roger Powell.

 

Powell was undersized, if I remember correctly. Ingram was surprisingly decent, yeah, but Augustine really needed to be a factor in that game. Even then, it always felt like they were one made 3 away at the end there.

[illiniguy]

I would argue UNC won because Illinois' only decent big man played 9 minutes before fouling out against Sean May.

Jack Ingrem was decent. As was Roger Powell.

 

Powell was undersized, if I remember correctly. Ingram was surprisingly decent, yeah, but Augustine really needed to be a factor in that game. Even then, it always felt like they were one made 3 away at the end there.

We were. Had we made one of the three threes we shot when were tied, I think we win that game. Carolina was shook, but then Felton hit that dagger with our guard all over him.

[fromthestretch]

I personally am suprised that Butler isn't getting more love than they are. You are probably right about the Big Ten being down hurting Wisky, but I still think they will be a very tough out.

 

I think an interesting discussion would be: who is the best Indiana tournament team? IU, Purdue, Notre Dame, Butler? They're practically interchangeable.

Good luck with that one. I like Butler the best because guards usually win in the tournament. Purdue is either going to do pretty well or get beat out right away. IU has the talent to go pretty far, but have struggled with bad teams while beating good teams. Notre Dame is a solid bet for the sweet 16.

 

Just don't count out Purdue in the first round. They always seem to win their first game. After that, however...

Oh I know, they gave Florida their best game last year. I just think with having all underclassmen, they could be very rone for an upset.

 

Agreed. I'm cautiously optimistic, since this team has done better on the road/at neutral sites than previous Purdue teams. However, even though they've been playing extremely well in conference season, they do still make some mistakes that could be attributed to youth. Hopefully, they'll keep those to a minimum in the tournament.

[TruffleShuffle]

I would argue UNC won because Illinois' only decent big man played 9 minutes before fouling out against Sean May.

 

yeah that helped, but may was 10-11 and hauled down 10 rebounds. illinois couldn't stop him.

 

anyway, i wasn't saying that guards aren't important, i just never understood where the whole "guards win in the tourney" thing came from. to me, it's a lot harder to find dominant big men than it is to find guards who can score a lot. the past several years, i generally pick teams that do have a big post presence to win it all, and i avoid picking teams that rely heavily on the three. 2002 my picks were ridiculous (had maryland winning, but also had kent st to the elite 8 and southern illinois and missouri to the sweet 16... finished in the top 1000 out of 2 million on espn) and then won in 2004 (okafor) and 2005 (may). last year i didn't want florida to win so i went against my theory and picked ucla, but it has paid pretty big money for me in the past.

 

this year is tough, because i really like tennessee, but they don't have a really great big man, and rely pretty heavily on the trey. the years i won the pools i was in, i knew who i was picking from pretty much the start of the season. this year i don't have a strong feeling at all. might end up being unc though.

[Vanilla Ice]

As much as I hate to admit it, at this point, I think I am taking UNC to win the tournament. The close wins in the ACC are a thing of the past, they are starting to finally play up to their potential. They found a good backup point guard in Quentin Thomas. Ty Lawson is coming back soon. Everybody is coming into form at the right time.

[Flames24Rulz]

As much as I hate to admit it, at this point, I think I am taking UNC to win the tournament. The close wins in the ACC are a thing of the past, they are starting to finally play up to their potential. They found a good backup point guard in Quentin Thomas. Ty Lawson is coming back soon. Everybody is coming into form at the right time.

 

They still can't play defense.

[bukie]

As much as I hate to admit it, at this point, I think I am taking UNC to win the tournament. The close wins in the ACC are a thing of the past, they are starting to finally play up to their potential. They found a good backup point guard in Quentin Thomas. Ty Lawson is coming back soon. Everybody is coming into form at the right time.

 

They still can't play defense.

 

Actually, they're quite efficient defensively, they just play at a high pace.

http://www.kenpom.com/sr.php?team=North%20Carolina

[Guest]

I'm with Truffle on the big man thing. They're so damn important on offense and the good teams with good big men really take advantage of them.

[Exile on Waveland]

I think Xavier gets a 3 seed, and no Big Ten team ends up higher than a 4. Still plenty of games to play, though.

 

I'll start an NCAA tournament mock selection/discussion thread soon. Probably Monday.

I hope you are wrong on the second part. Wisky went in and won at Texas, who might end up with a 1. They also swept IU. Just because they don't have any names, doesn't mean they aren't very good. If they win out they should be a 2.

 

Wisconsin is the best of the lot, but the Big Ten is way down this year, non-conference RPI worse than the MVC, and there's been no "clear" best team. If Wisconsin had gone, say, 17-1 or 18-0 in the Big Ten, a 2 would have been a possibility, but the flaws in the other BT tourney teams (Indiana beat down by UConn, Purdue's bad early losses, Michigan State looking awful in conference) are going to end up reflecting on the quality of Wisconsin's team, IMO.

 

If I had to seed 1-4 today, I'd probably go

 

1. Memphis, North Carolina, UCLA, Tennessee

2. Texas, Kansas, Louisville, Duke

3. Georgetown, Vandy, Xavier, Stanford

4. Connecticut, Wisconsin, Drake, Pick an Indiana Team/Marquette

 

Indiana lost by five to UConn, the #14 RPI team that has won 11 of 12. UConn was clearly better, but it wasn't a "beat down." Indiana doesn't have a great resume (lacking in big wins) but their losses are to #6 (neutral), #11, at #11 and #14. A loss at #16 is likely forthcoming.

 

As for which Indiana team advances deepest, it's a tough question. IU has the potential to advance deeper than any of the others, but I don't think they're a safe bet at all. The safe bet would be Notre Dame, or, perhaps even moreso, Butler. Purdue may be playing the best ball of all, but is green.

 

I should be around, if so, I'll gladly help the selection process.

[Guest]

who is the most consistently bad team in the pac 10 in basketball? it can't be either of the washingtons, i don't think. not oregon. not ucla, usc, cal, stanford or arizona. i seem to recall arizona st occasionally not being terrible. so is it oregon st?

 

Without a doubt, Washington State.

 

CONFERENCE, 1979-PRESENT (Since Pac-8 became Pac-10):

1. UCLA: 360-162 .690, 9 conference titles

2. Arizona: 357-165 .684, 11 titles (2 shared)

3. Stanford: 287-235 .550, 4 titles (1 shared)

4. Oregon State: 245-277 .469, 5 titles (2 shared)

5. California: 242-280 .464, 0 titles

6. Washington: 241-281 .462, 2 titles (2 shared)

7. USC: 236-286 .452, 1 title (1 shared)

8. Arizona State: 229-293 .439, 0 titles

9. Oregon: 221-301 .423, 1 title

10. Washington State:192-330 .368, 0 titles

 

ALL GAMES, ALL-TIME:

1. UCLA: 1611-713 .693

2. Arizona: 1528-829 .648

3. Washington: 1548-1021 .603

4. USC: 1414-1017 .582

5. Oregon State: 1570-1137 .580

6. California: 1354-1032 .567

7. Stanford: 1296-988 .567

8. Oregon: 1392-1213 .534

9. Arizona State: 1161-1057 .523

10. Washington State: 1414-1316 .518