BP Tidbit on Reds, Griffey, and Cubs

[Banedon]

Why do people keep wanting to trade Marshall? I don't understand how subtracting from our starting staff makes us a better team.

 

Because a everyday player (if you can call Griffey that) that can help on a daily basis, not once every 5 days...

 

OK, I'll play along.

 

So you get Marshall for one of our starting five - who replaces him?

 

Exactly, and it's not like we have a huge need for most of these players. We're doing quite well with what we have. I would love to make a big splashy move as much as the next guy, but not at the risk of screwing up what we have. I just don't see trading away one of our starters at this point.

[tinkerstoeverstochance]

Why do people keep wanting to trade Marshall? I don't understand how subtracting from our starting staff makes us a better team.

 

Because a everyday player (if you can call Griffey that) that can help on a daily basis, not once every 5 days...

 

OK, I'll play along.

 

So you get Marshall for one of our starting five - who replaces him?

 

My take would be Gallagher or Maybe even Petrick unless we make the deal with KC to get Zack Greinke. Just my 2 cents worth

[Pushfrog98]

Why do people keep wanting to trade Marshall? I don't understand how subtracting from our starting staff makes us a better team.

 

Because a everyday player (if you can call Griffey that) that can help on a daily basis, not once every 5 days...

 

OK, I'll play along.

 

So you get Marshall for one of our starting five - who replaces him?

 

Exactly, and it's not like we have a huge need for most of these players. We're doing quite well with what we have. I would love to make a big splashy move as much as the next guy, but not at the risk of screwing up what we have. I just don't see trading away one of our starters at this point.

Maybe the Reds will throw in Jose Rijo or Tom Browning.

[davearm]

Why do people keep wanting to trade Marshall? I don't understand how subtracting from our starting staff makes us a better team.

 

Because a everyday player (if you can call Griffey that) that can help on a daily basis, not once every 5 days...

Jimmy Rollins has logged the most PAs of any position player in MLB so far this year -- 480.

 

Four Cub starters have pitched to more than 480 batters so far this year.

Z: 599

Lilly: 536

Marquis: 506

Hill: 482

 

The notion that an everyday player has a larger impact on a season than a starting pitcher is dubious, at best.

[Magnetic Curses]

no way i trade marshall, no way. we're going to need him down the stretch. i might trade gallagher, but if z doesn't re-sign, they're down another promising starting arm.

[Banedon]

Cubs CF: .247/.305/.409/.714

Cubs RF: .285/.354/.365/.720

Griffey: .271/.380/.521/.901

 

He'd definitely be an upgrade...but so much of an upgrade that he'd be worth losing a starting pitcher?

[Exile on Waveland]

Cubs CF: .247/.305/.409/.714

Cubs RF: .285/.354/.365/.720

Griffey: .271/.380/.521/.901

 

He'd definitely be an upgrade...but so much of an upgrade that he'd be worth losing a starting pitcher?

 

I really don't think so. Especially when factoring in the unfortunate possibility of losing Zambrano in the offseason. I would love to add Griffey, Jr., but not at the expense of a young starter (with no clear cut replacement this year or next). As much as a I hope it could, I don't know if a deal can be made without Marshall or Hill. If not, I'd pass.

[NCCubFan]

it would pretty much have to be gallagher right?

Wade Miller.

:lmao:

[David]

Cubs CF: .247/.305/.409/.714

Cubs RF: .285/.354/.365/.720

Griffey: .271/.380/.521/.901

 

He'd definitely be an upgrade...but so much of an upgrade that he'd be worth losing a starting pitcher?

 

Depends on how well you think Gallagher could do in Marshall's spot.

 

Almost .200 OPS points is a MASSIVE improvement. We can't just look past that fact.

[RynoRules]

Cubs CF: .247/.305/.409/.714

Cubs RF: .285/.354/.365/.720

Griffey: .271/.380/.521/.901

 

He'd definitely be an upgrade...but so much of an upgrade that he'd be worth losing a starting pitcher?

 

Depends on how well you think Gallagher could do in Marshall's spot.

 

Almost .200 OPS points is a MASSIVE improvement. We can't just look past that fact.

 

Look, I would LOVE to have Griff and his 900 OPS in our lineup, but at what cost? If the deal were Gallagher, Petrick and EPatt I'd do it without a second thought, but I'd guess they'd want more back than that.

 

Then again, what is the real difference between Marshall and Gallagher? I know - Marshall has a ton more ML level experience. But doesn't Gallagher project as a better pitcher overall?

[Banedon]

Cubs CF: .247/.305/.409/.714

Cubs RF: .285/.354/.365/.720

Griffey: .271/.380/.521/.901

 

He'd definitely be an upgrade...but so much of an upgrade that he'd be worth losing a starting pitcher?

 

Depends on how well you think Gallagher could do in Marshall's spot.

 

Almost .200 OPS points is a MASSIVE improvement. We can't just look past that fact.

 

I understand that...but is it worth the gamble that you'd be taking in putting a completely untested rookie pitcher into the rotation? I say no. But I understand both sides.

[David]

Cubs CF: .247/.305/.409/.714

Cubs RF: .285/.354/.365/.720

Griffey: .271/.380/.521/.901

 

He'd definitely be an upgrade...but so much of an upgrade that he'd be worth losing a starting pitcher?

 

Depends on how well you think Gallagher could do in Marshall's spot.

 

Almost .200 OPS points is a MASSIVE improvement. We can't just look past that fact.

 

I understand that...but is it worth the gamble that you'd be taking in putting a completely untested rookie pitcher into the rotation? I say no. But I understand both sides.

 

Assuming you think the Cubs still have a good shot at the playoffs with a Gallagher starting the rest of the way, you also have to take into account that in the playoffs, Marshall probably doesn't see much, if any, time, while Griffey can very well have a significant impact.

[gerby23]

Why do people keep wanting to trade Marshall? I don't understand how subtracting from our starting staff makes us a better team.

 

Because a everyday player (if you can call Griffey that) that can help on a daily basis, not once every 5 days...

 

OK, I'll play along.

 

So you get Marshall for one of our starting five - who replaces him?

Not my desire, but...

Demp to the rotation, Marmol/Howry close, the other sets up, and Woody is back mid-August.

[Banedon]

Cubs CF: .247/.305/.409/.714

Cubs RF: .285/.354/.365/.720

Griffey: .271/.380/.521/.901

 

He'd definitely be an upgrade...but so much of an upgrade that he'd be worth losing a starting pitcher?

 

Depends on how well you think Gallagher could do in Marshall's spot.

 

Almost .200 OPS points is a MASSIVE improvement. We can't just look past that fact.

 

I understand that...but is it worth the gamble that you'd be taking in putting a completely untested rookie pitcher into the rotation? I say no. But I understand both sides.

 

Assuming you think the Cubs still have a good shot at the playoffs with a Gallagher starting the rest of the way, you also have to take into account that in the playoffs, Marshall probably doesn't see much, if any, time, while Griffey can very well have a significant impact.

 

If he's healthy...and you can't ignore Griffey's injury history either. I can see the argument either way.

[TruffleShuffle]

Cubs CF: .247/.305/.409/.714

Cubs RF: .285/.354/.365/.720

Griffey: .271/.380/.521/.901

 

He'd definitely be an upgrade...but so much of an upgrade that he'd be worth losing a starting pitcher?

 

Depends on how well you think Gallagher could do in Marshall's spot.

 

Almost .200 OPS points is a MASSIVE improvement. We can't just look past that fact.

 

Look, I would LOVE to have Griff and his 900 OPS in our lineup, but at what cost? If the deal were Gallagher, Petrick and EPatt I'd do it without a second thought, but I'd guess they'd want more back than that.

 

Then again, what is the real difference between Marshall and Gallagher? I know - Marshall has a ton more ML level experience. But doesn't Gallagher project as a better pitcher overall?

 

Everybody in the minors seemingly "projects" as a better player than a major leaguer they'd be replacing, because they haven't had the chance to fail yet. But as far as their ceilings, they're pretty similar... both could be around a #3/4 starter. As far as this year, it looks like Marshall is easily the better pitcher, because his command is better. Trading Marshall would definitely downgrade the Cubs starting rotation, and the bigger worry is that the Cubs have no good option to replace Gallagher if he bombed in his first try at starting for the big club.

[CyHawk_Cub]

Cubs CF: .247/.305/.409/.714

Cubs RF: .285/.354/.365/.720

Griffey: .271/.380/.521/.901

 

He'd definitely be an upgrade...but so much of an upgrade that he'd be worth losing a starting pitcher?

 

Depends on how well you think Gallagher could do in Marshall's spot.

 

Almost .200 OPS points is a MASSIVE improvement. We can't just look past that fact.

 

I understand that...but is it worth the gamble that you'd be taking in putting a completely untested rookie pitcher into the rotation? I say no. But I understand both sides.

 

Assuming you think the Cubs still have a good shot at the playoffs with a Gallagher starting the rest of the way, you also have to take into account that in the playoffs, Marshall probably doesn't see much, if any, time, while Griffey can very well have a significant impact.

 

If he's healthy...and you can't ignore Griffey's injury history either. I can see the argument either way.

 

I know I'm assuming a lot here, but given how tight both the divisional & WC races look to be, we also can't afford a black hole in the 5th rotation spot either (Wade Miller anyone?). I agree w/ the consensus that there will NOT be any kind of "high impact" move made by Hendry this year.

[rawaction]

I'd trade Marshall for Griffey or Dunn if it was a dealbreaker. I think the Cubs could get by with the extra offense and by mixing and matching in the 5th starter's role. Plus, I think getting a league average starter wouldn't be very hard. Sure, you take a hit in the rotation, but as has been mentioned, you boost everyday production while losing some every 5th day.

[Transmogrified Tiger]

Cubs CF: .247/.305/.409/.714

Cubs RF: .285/.354/.365/.720

Griffey: .271/.380/.521/.901

 

He'd definitely be an upgrade...but so much of an upgrade that he'd be worth losing a starting pitcher?

 

Depends on how well you think Gallagher could do in Marshall's spot.

 

Almost .200 OPS points is a MASSIVE improvement. We can't just look past that fact.

 

I understand that...but is it worth the gamble that you'd be taking in putting a completely untested rookie pitcher into the rotation? I say no. But I understand both sides.

 

Assuming you think the Cubs still have a good shot at the playoffs with a Gallagher starting the rest of the way, you also have to take into account that in the playoffs, Marshall probably doesn't see much, if any, time, while Griffey can very well have a significant impact.

 

This is a good point on trading from the rotation to upgrade the offense, but in that case I'd like to see someone with a good long term future brought in return(i.e. Dunn, Teixeira instead of Griffey or Dye).

[rawaction]

Cubs CF: .247/.305/.409/.714

Cubs RF: .285/.354/.365/.720

Griffey: .271/.380/.521/.901

 

He'd definitely be an upgrade...but so much of an upgrade that he'd be worth losing a starting pitcher?

 

Depends on how well you think Gallagher could do in Marshall's spot.

 

Almost .200 OPS points is a MASSIVE improvement. We can't just look past that fact.

 

I understand that...but is it worth the gamble that you'd be taking in putting a completely untested rookie pitcher into the rotation? I say no. But I understand both sides.

 

Assuming you think the Cubs still have a good shot at the playoffs with a Gallagher starting the rest of the way, you also have to take into account that in the playoffs, Marshall probably doesn't see much, if any, time, while Griffey can very well have a significant impact.

 

This is a good point on trading from the rotation to upgrade the offense, but in that case I'd like to see someone with a good long term future brought in return(i.e. Dunn, Teixeira instead of Griffey or Dye).

 

I wouldn't give up much of anything for Dye. Cedeno (since they have been looking for a SS since Ozzie retired from playing), Murton, and Veal is about the extent of my offer.

[davearm]

I'd trade Marshall for Griffey or Dunn if it was a dealbreaker. I think the Cubs could get by with the extra offense and by mixing and matching in the 5th starter's role. Plus, I think getting a league average starter wouldn't be very hard. Sure, you take a hit in the rotation, but as has been mentioned, you boost everyday production while losing some every 5th day.

Try telling that to the half dozen or so contending teams that are trying to add a league average starter this week, and (so far) having no luck.

[rawaction]

I'd trade Marshall for Griffey or Dunn if it was a dealbreaker. I think the Cubs could get by with the extra offense and by mixing and matching in the 5th starter's role. Plus, I think getting a league average starter wouldn't be very hard. Sure, you take a hit in the rotation, but as has been mentioned, you boost everyday production while losing some every 5th day.

Try telling that to the half dozen or so contending teams that are trying to add a league average starter this week, and (so far) having no luck.

 

I think teams are looking for a huge upgrade. If the Cubs would be replacing Marshall, I think they could get similar production (not what Sean has done, but what he is likely to do the rest of the year) after the deadline. I'd think a guy like Noah Lowry could be had pretty cheaply.

[Banedon]

I'd trade Marshall for Griffey or Dunn if it was a dealbreaker. I think the Cubs could get by with the extra offense and by mixing and matching in the 5th starter's role. Plus, I think getting a league average starter wouldn't be very hard. Sure, you take a hit in the rotation, but as has been mentioned, you boost everyday production while losing some every 5th day.

Try telling that to the half dozen or so contending teams that are trying to add a league average starter this week, and (so far) having no luck.

 

Exactly...I think this is a stingy market this year, and I'm honestly not thinking there's going to be much in the way of big name trades. I think Kendall and Linebrink might about as big as it gets.

[davearm]

I'd trade Marshall for Griffey or Dunn if it was a dealbreaker. I think the Cubs could get by with the extra offense and by mixing and matching in the 5th starter's role. Plus, I think getting a league average starter wouldn't be very hard. Sure, you take a hit in the rotation, but as has been mentioned, you boost everyday production while losing some every 5th day.

Try telling that to the half dozen or so contending teams that are trying to add a league average starter this week, and (so far) having no luck.

 

Exactly...I think this is a stingy market this year, and I'm honestly not thinking there's going to be much in the way of big name trades. I think Kendall and Linebrink might about as big as it gets.

I think the odds are high that Teixeira ends up someplace new, and he'll certainly be the biggest name, akin to Carlos Beltran in 2004.

 

Beyond that, I'd guess the Sox make at least one significant trade involving Dye or a pitcher.

 

At least one of the many relievers on the rumor circuit will change hands.

[soccer10k]

I'd trade Marshall for Griffey or Dunn if it was a dealbreaker. I think the Cubs could get by with the extra offense and by mixing and matching in the 5th starter's role. Plus, I think getting a league average starter wouldn't be very hard. Sure, you take a hit in the rotation, but as has been mentioned, you boost everyday production while losing some every 5th day.

Try telling that to the half dozen or so contending teams that are trying to add a league average starter this week, and (so far) having no luck.

 

I think teams are looking for a huge upgrade. If the Cubs would be replacing Marshall, I think they could get similar production (not what Sean has done, but what he is likely to do the rest of the year) after the deadline. I'd think a guy like Noah Lowry could be had pretty cheaply.

 

Lowry's not going anywhere. He's 26 and the Giants will and should be looking to the future. He's in that future.

[rawaction]

I'd trade Marshall for Griffey or Dunn if it was a dealbreaker. I think the Cubs could get by with the extra offense and by mixing and matching in the 5th starter's role. Plus, I think getting a league average starter wouldn't be very hard. Sure, you take a hit in the rotation, but as has been mentioned, you boost everyday production while losing some every 5th day.

Try telling that to the half dozen or so contending teams that are trying to add a league average starter this week, and (so far) having no luck.

 

I think teams are looking for a huge upgrade. If the Cubs would be replacing Marshall, I think they could get similar production (not what Sean has done, but what he is likely to do the rest of the year) after the deadline. I'd think a guy like Noah Lowry could be had pretty cheaply.

 

Lowry's not going anywhere. He's 26 and the Giants will and should be looking to the future. He's in that future.

 

I know he's young, but that rotation will be built around Lincecum and Cain. Plus, they are stuck with Zito. Jonathan Sanchez (another LHP) is in the pen now, but a solid SP prospect. And I believe Lowry should be arbitration eligible this year. If they want to save a few more bucks and get younger in the process, they will listen. They don't have a lot of youth coming up the pipe as far as position players go. I think Lowry could be had for a couple decent IF/OF prospects.