2008 Draft Discussion Thread

[RammyFanny]

Tools out from BA:

http://www.baseballamerica.com/online/draft/draft-preview/2008/266266.html

 

Lawrie comes in at #2 on strike zone judgement for HS.

 

Casey Kelly-best HS defender in the draft, in front of Tim Beckham.

 

Sonny Gray (I love him but hear he's a tough sign)- best secondary pitch for HS'ers.

 

Closest to majors from HS:

 

Hosmer

Beckham

Melville

[Guest]

Last week, Sonny Gray sent out a letter asking MLB teams not to draft him.

[JeffH]

http://baseballprospectus.com/article.php?articleid=7615

 

Kevin Goldstein mock draft.

 

19. Chicago Cubs

 

Scouting director Tim Wilken loves athletes, but many of the Cubs' top targets are looking like they’ll be unavailable when the draft reaches them. So they may instead go with someone who has been a slow and steady riser, as the Cubs have been in on hard and heavy to see the last few starts by Illinois high school star Jake Odorizzi. He has the kind of velocity, command, and clean mechanics rarely seen from the cold-weather states. Odorizzi has been even better than ever down the stretch, consistently touching 95 mph with his fastball while showing a much-improved breaking ball. He’s not a hometown pick per se; Highland is actually only 35 miles from St. Louis. The Cubs passed on the best Midwest high school arm last year when they opted to take Josh Vitters over Jarrod Parker; they won’t let him go by this time.

Selection: Jake Odorizzi, RHP, Highland HS (IL)

 

He has Lowrie going at 7, Hosmer at 9, Hicks at 12, Kelly at 15, Melville at 18, Collier at 24 and Hewitt at 25.

 

In the unlikely event that Collier is on the board - if Wilken doesn't take him, I will officially start a "Fire Tim Wilken" campaign.

[Guest]

I can't wait for Callis' mock draft which will come out 3 hours before the draft (but be approximately 75% accurate).

[RammyFanny]

Isn't Collier considered the typical toolsy high risk guy or am I confusing him with another one of the prep OF'ers?

 

Not to say you don't take him, but I was under the impression that it wouldn't be a shock to see him in the backend of the 1st, JeffH.

[Bruno7481]

http://baseballprospectus.com/article.php?articleid=7615

 

Kevin Goldstein mock draft.

 

19. Chicago Cubs

 

Scouting director Tim Wilken loves athletes, but many of the Cubs' top targets are looking like they’ll be unavailable when the draft reaches them. So they may instead go with someone who has been a slow and steady riser, as the Cubs have been in on hard and heavy to see the last few starts by Illinois high school star Jake Odorizzi. He has the kind of velocity, command, and clean mechanics rarely seen from the cold-weather states. Odorizzi has been even better than ever down the stretch, consistently touching 95 mph with his fastball while showing a much-improved breaking ball. He’s not a hometown pick per se; Highland is actually only 35 miles from St. Louis. The Cubs passed on the best Midwest high school arm last year when they opted to take Josh Vitters over Jarrod Parker; they won’t let him go by this time.

Selection: Jake Odorizzi, RHP, Highland HS (IL)

 

He has Lowrie going at 7, Hosmer at 9, Hicks at 12, Kelly at 15, Melville at 18, Collier at 24 and Hewitt at 25.

 

In the unlikely event that Collier is on the board - if Wilken doesn't take him, I will officially start a "Fire Tim Wilken" campaign.

 

From reading the descriptions of Collier, he sounds like a lot of guys the Cubs have drafted in the past. Toolsy, unpolished, not a speedster, average power.

 

Why should Wilken be fired for not drafting him?

[UK1679666180]

There aren't many 1st rd. HS Of'ers that aren't toolsy. But, Zach doesn't turn 18 until Sept. and is very signable. His tools project across the board.

 

I'll reserve my opinion on who I want them to take until the draft is over. :)

[Guest]

Lefthanded all the way, Collier has an athletic and projectable 6-foot-2, 195-pound outfielder's frame. His above-average speed makes him a threat as a baserunner and permits him to patrol center field for now. As he slows down and matures physically, he'll play an outfield corner, and his average arm makes right field a possibility. Collier had a surgical procedure to improve blood flow to his heart, performed in May 2006, which may be a concern for some clubs, but he's been medically cleared for two years and has had no problems. Collier's hitting ability and solid all-around game had him moving up boards, possibly in the middle of the first round.

[Bruno7481]

Lefthanded all the way, Collier has an athletic and projectable 6-foot-2, 195-pound outfielder's frame. His above-average speed makes him a threat as a baserunner and permits him to patrol center field for now. As he slows down and matures physically, he'll play an outfield corner, and his average arm makes right field a possibility. Collier had a surgical procedure to improve blood flow to his heart, performed in May 2006, which may be a concern for some clubs, but he's been medically cleared for two years and has had no problems. Collier's hitting ability and solid all-around game had him moving up boards, possibly in the middle of the first round.

 

Seems to be a couple conflicting reports on him. Some that I have read act like his speed isn't all that superior.

[RammyFanny]

So much for the Hosmer hope, BA says that KC has him on the top of their board and that if he slips by them, SF also has him on the top of their board at 5.

[badnews]

If Wilken takes Collier I will start a fire Wilken campaign. This guy is not as much the standard Cubs failure pick as Hewitt, but still. Where was this guy even three weeks ago? No way. Pass.

[RammyFanny]

Wow, scout.com's top 100 said there have been some Jay Bruce comp's for Collier :shock:

[Guest]

Meanwhile, Casey Kelly is asking for so much money that teams are assuming he already has a deal in place, with the Cubs and (of course) the Yankees as two suspects. - Keith Law

:(

[Transmogrified Tiger]

I looked through last year's thread a little bit to see what time the Cubs would likely be making their pick, and decided to see how some of the early picks are doing.

 

Aumont, Parker, and Bumgarner are all doing really well. Sean Doolittle, the last minute riser who no one wanted(and went 7 picks before the Cubs sandwich pick anyway) is hitting .330/.418/.632/1.050 in A+ as a 21 year old. Moustakas has a .706 OPS in Low A with a ton of errors at SS. LaPorta is raking at AA, and Heyward has a .900+ OPS in Low A. Wieters is pushing a 1.000 OPS at A+.

[badnews]

Wow, scout.com's top 100 said there have been some Jay Bruce comp's for Collier :shock:

 

I don't buy. Those comparisons are usually inaccurate/wildly overoptimistic. Two weeks ago he wasn't Jay Bruce. Kyler Burke was another real later riser in the draft that got a lot of gaudy comps.

[Guest]

http://chicagosports.chicagotribune.com/sports/baseball/whitesox/cs-080604-phil-rogers-mock-draft-baseball-mlb,1,3525989.story

 

Sweet, Phil Rogers with a mock draft.

[Guest]

http://www.baseballprospectus.com/unfiltered/?p=893

 

Rays leaning towards Beckam.

[badnews]

I don't understand why the Cubs are so high on all of these raw, toolsy, awesomely athletic players - you'd think they've successfully developed a ton of them, instead of zero. In half of these athletes you don't even see what assets this athleticism brings. It's like we draft players in order to beat the other team in a pick-up game of some other sport.

 

It's this stubborn failure to learn from mistakes that makes it even more irritating.

 

24. Phillies

Salisbury (Conn.) H.S. SS-OF Anthony Hewitt: Hewitt has tools and could be the Cubs' choice if Kelly is off the board.

 

Son of a... seriously, did anyone else see what Callis had to say about this guy? "Most overrated player in the draft?" "Bat highly questionable?"

 

Why am I cursed being a fan of this organization? We'd rather have Corey Patterson, Jacque Jones, and Felix Pie than Manny Ramirez and Miguel Cabrera. Make it end, make it end.

 

I'm not sure how Brett Wallace got so high either.

 

Back to the complaining. The Cubs make me hate athletic toolsy guys. They really do. And why do they only draft the Wily Mo Pena/Corey Patterson/Chad Hermansen type athletes and never the Carl Crawford/Matt Kemp type athletes?

[TruffleShuffle]

i don't want casey kelly, but anthony hewitt will make me vomit in rage.

[badnews]

The Cub fondness seems to be for useless athleticism. For example, Anthony Hewitt is one of the best athletes in the draft, but he's going to be a 3b they say. Come on. If he's that damn athletic shouldn't there be more hope for him playing a more useful position? This reminds me of Soriano. Soriano is an incredible athlete. He's an amazing athlete who plays center field worse than Moneyball Nick Swisher, Soriano's a phenomenal athlete who, this year, plays left field about as well as Adam Dunn and Carlos Lee.

 

Maybe get some athletes whose athleticism actually translates into something useful in the game of BASEBALL.

 

I probably shouldn't open this can of worms, but how did Jim Hendry pass up an ATHLETE like Josh Hamilton in the Rule 5? There's more badass athleticism and tools up the wazoo there than in all the Samardzijas, Guyers, Hewitts, Pies, Colvins, etc. combined. Seriously, if Hendry can love these athletes who don't know which way to hold the bat, how could he pass up a guy with ATHLETICISM off the charts just because he has a drug problem?

[badnews]

The Cubs are required by law to draft someone from Virginia early, I wonder who it'll be. The top Virginia guys seem to be David Adams, a 2b, and pitcher Jacob Thompson.

[TysonCBulls423]

Hewitt is a stud though. His high school coach is a former big league scout who's helped his swing tremendously. He has power to all fields and much better plate discipline from last year at this time. I'm on the draft Hewitt bandwagon.

[badnews]

Hewitt is a stud though. His high school coach is a former big league scout who's helped his swing tremendously. He has power to all fields and much better plate discipline from last year at this time. I'm on the draft Hewitt bandwagon

 

You've got to be kidding. Hewitt is the prototype of the type of clown the Cubs can't do *anything* with.

 

The Baseball Prospectus mock draft said:

 

"Some think he’s the next Bo Jackson, and some think he’ll never get out of A-ball, but he offers more to dream on than anyone in a draft that offers few players with elite-level upside."

 

Okay, problem with that - we've seen the guys who never get out of A-ball, and Bo Jackson wasn't that great even. This is where the Cubs get really dumb, they spend their time chasing windmills a la Don Quixote. Enough with going after all the tools, just get the bat at this point, I'm so fed up.

 

Jim Callis from Baseball America:

 

"Q: Chet from Chimney Sweep, Nebraska asks:

Who is the most over-hyped player in the draft?

 

A: Jim Callis: I think it's Anthony Hewitt right now. I think he'd be a nice fit for a team with extra picks but I just don't see him as a true first-rounder."

 

Somewhere else Callis said that Hewitt might be the most athletic guy in the draft but his bat was highly questionable, and he made reference there to another column he wrote about first rounders with questionable bats rarely working out.

 

This guy sounds like the worst possible fit for the Cubs.

[imb]

our drafts are always terrible, so i'm hoping for hewitt, honestly.

[badnews]

I'd rather have Josh Fields than Hewitt. At least Fields will most likely make the majors, whereas Hewitt it's going to be nothing but that butt-ugly Ryan Harvey career path.