GM Rankings

[daske17]

This is a stupid list. Hendry is terrible, but not near Jim Bowden terrible. Dayton Moore shouldn't even be ranked-has he been on the job for a full season yet?

 

bowden fleeced both the rangers (for soriano...was he the gm then?) and the reds (for lopez and kearns). his team was operating with a significantly lower payroll than the cubs (and playing in a tougher division), and the nats won more games than the cubs.

 

i'd probably rather have hendry than bowden, but it's not unthinkable that someone would rank him ahead of hendry.

 

 

i don't know why hendry gets any kind of credit from anyone. since he's taken over the losses have increased each year (despite an increasing payroll) and the farm system has gone in the toilet. so he traded for ramirez and lee...what's that gotten him?

 

Two words: Christian Guzman. Anyone GM who gives that player a four-year contract ranks towards the bottom. All things being equal, at least Hendry only gave Neifi a two-year contract.

[Jehrico]

ESPN ranked their top five yesterday.

 

which is actually a top 7

which was actually written by Phil Rogers, which actually means the article wasn't worth reading.

[cheapseats]

This is a stupid list. Hendry is terrible, but not near Jim Bowden terrible. Dayton Moore shouldn't even be ranked-has he been on the job for a full season yet?

 

bowden fleeced both the rangers (for soriano...was he the gm then?) and the reds (for lopez and kearns). his team was operating with a significantly lower payroll than the cubs (and playing in a tougher division), and the nats won more games than the cubs.

 

i'd probably rather have hendry than bowden, but it's not unthinkable that someone would rank him ahead of hendry.

 

 

i don't know why hendry gets any kind of credit from anyone. since he's taken over the losses have increased each year (despite an increasing payroll) and the farm system has gone in the toilet. so he traded for ramirez and lee...what's that gotten him?

 

Two words: Christian Guzman. Anyone GM who gives that player a four-year contract ranks towards the bottom. All things being equal, at least Hendry only gave Neifi a two-year contract.

 

Cesar Izturis.

[Monco]

This is a stupid list. Hendry is terrible, but not near Jim Bowden terrible. Dayton Moore shouldn't even be ranked-has he been on the job for a full season yet?

 

bowden fleeced both the rangers (for soriano...was he the gm then?) and the reds (for lopez and kearns). his team was operating with a significantly lower payroll than the cubs (and playing in a tougher division), and the nats won more games than the cubs.

 

i'd probably rather have hendry than bowden, but it's not unthinkable that someone would rank him ahead of hendry.

 

 

i don't know why hendry gets any kind of credit from anyone. since he's taken over the losses have increased each year (despite an increasing payroll) and the farm system has gone in the toilet. so he traded for ramirez and lee...what's that gotten him?

 

Two words: Christian Guzman. Anyone GM who gives that player a four-year contract ranks towards the bottom. All things being equal, at least Hendry only gave Neifi a two-year contract.

 

Cesar Izturis.

 

Jason Marquis

[Electron Blue]

 

Whether you think its a fluke or not, I dont know how you judge Hendry without at least mentioning Lee, Barrett and, here's the big one, RAMIREZ.

 

i judge hendry by wins. and in that regard, he's bad.

 

and if you judge him by win per dollar, he's the worst.

 

Fair enough.

 

really? so dusty was a good manager in '03 and '04, a below average one in '05 and, finally, a bad one in '06?

 

Jim Hendry makes the moves. These moves should be evaluated separately from the wins/losses that result. Whether or not he is a good GM is based on his decision-making BEFORE the fact, not after. So why judge what happens after?

[Transmogrified Tiger]

 

Whether you think its a fluke or not, I dont know how you judge Hendry without at least mentioning Lee, Barrett and, here's the big one, RAMIREZ.

 

i judge hendry by wins. and in that regard, he's bad.

 

and if you judge him by win per dollar, he's the worst.

 

Fair enough.

 

really? so dusty was a good manager in '03 and '04, a below average one in '05 and, finally, a bad one in '06?

 

Jim Hendry makes the moves. These moves should be evaluated separately from the wins/losses that result. Whether or not he is a good GM is based on his decision-making BEFORE the fact, not after. So why judge what happens after?

 

Who's responsible for the Manager? Everything aside from the size of the payroll is under the umbrella of the GM. That certainly hasn't been an issue, so therefore all the failures of the team are his responsibility.

[Electron Blue]

 

Whether you think its a fluke or not, I dont know how you judge Hendry without at least mentioning Lee, Barrett and, here's the big one, RAMIREZ.

 

i judge hendry by wins. and in that regard, he's bad.

 

and if you judge him by win per dollar, he's the worst.

 

Fair enough.

 

really? so dusty was a good manager in '03 and '04, a below average one in '05 and, finally, a bad one in '06?

 

Jim Hendry makes the moves. These moves should be evaluated separately from the wins/losses that result. Whether or not he is a good GM is based on his decision-making BEFORE the fact, not after. So why judge what happens after?

 

Who's responsible for the Manager? Everything aside from the size of the payroll is under the umbrella of the GM. That certainly hasn't been an issue, so therefore all the failures of the team are his responsibility.

 

I didn't make my dusty comment clear enough.

 

Was dusty actually a more compentent, smarter manager in the years the team won more games? Even then he had the same flaws we all complained about the last couple years.

 

But dusty aside, my point was that in evaluating Hendry you must look at the deals he made separate from how they worked out. The Nomar trade was very well orchestrated, especially given that we didn't give up much. I give him that credit without mentioning that Nomar tore a hamstring (or whatever) and the team floundered amidst other injuries.

[Guest]

Sometimes the deals you don't make are the ones that will kill you, too.

[Amazing_Grace]

You have to judge a GM by how a team performs throughout his tenure. What else speaks louder or more accurately than results? During Hendry's tenure, the team had its best year during his first season and has gotten worse every year since.

 

Like every GM, Hendry has had some successes. Lee, Ramirez, Barrett, Murton, and Zambrano have worked OK. The Nomar trade was good. The Ramirez trade was great. The Cubs farm system has developed and drafted some good and some great pitchers.

 

However, he's also had some failures. Nomar in 2005, CPatt, Juan Pierre, Dusty Baker. He failed to recognize and have backup plans for a lot of injury prone guys, Wood, Prior, Nomar. Moreover, just about every single Cubs position prospect brought up in the past 8 years has been a bust. Almost all were drafted and/or developed with Hendry as either GM or director of scouting. That's a pretty scathing indictment. The farm system has gotten markedly worse under Jim's tenure, partially because of prospects given up in trades and some notable draft failures (Brownlie, Harvey).

 

It all boils down to the organization gets better or worse. Under Hendry, the Cubs have gotten worse overall from top to bottom, period. I don't know if Hendry deserves to be below Bowden or Friedman (Tampa Bay has developed good players and still managed to suck mightily and get very little in trades), but he is in the bottom 1/3 of baseball GM's in my book, no doubt.

[cheapseats]

Was dusty actually a more compentent, smarter manager in the years the team won more games? Even then he had the same flaws we all complained about the last couple years.

 

Apples to oranges.

 

General managers are far more important to a team's win/loss record than managers.

 

Teams with good players can win despite a stupid manager, and teams with bad players can lose with a great manager.

 

Finishing last in the NL is an indictment of the GM.

[BigbadB]

I really thought Hendry was going to whip this club into shape. I gave him a lot of praise early on. However, those days are long gone.

 

If I had my way, he'd already be gone. He would have been gone during the 2005 campaign right along with Dusty and the rest of the coaching staff.

 

The offseason prior to 2006 was brutal. The Juan Pierre trade.....

 

well, I really don't want to talk about it.

 

Personally, I think they were awful friendly giving Hendry the 25 spot. It takes a really bad GM to increase payroll every year and consistently be a worse team.

 

Chaos reigned with this team for several years. The Sosa ordeal, the issues in the clubhouse, the issues on the planes, the issues in the broadcast booth, the deterioration of the farm, the lack of development of major league talent on the farm, , the inability to understand the importance of not giving up walks on the mound and the inability to understand the importance of drawing walks at the plate, the lack of fundamentals on the field, etc... While many of these things were not Hendry's doing, the spotlight is on him.

 

The distractions and circus side shows should not be part of the game plan.

 

2006 is a chance to redeem himself, but it will take more than just throwing money at a bunch of free agents to turn this team around. Hopefully, Piniella and Hendry can create some direction. Because they definitely didn't have that last year.

[KingCubsFan]

Moreover, just about every single Cubs position prospect brought up in the past 8 years has been a bust. Almost all were drafted and/or developed with Hendry as either GM or director of scouting. That's a pretty scathing indictment. The farm system has gotten markedly worse under Jim's tenure, partially because of prospects given up in trades and some notable draft failures (Brownlie, Harvey).

The recent failure of the farm system can be blamed on John Stocksill. Hendry hasn't been a very good GM, but he built one of the best farm systems in the game, and was clearly a terrific scouting director.

[frostwyrm]

I think that trade with the Reds pushed Bowden a little ahead of Hendry. Hendry hasn't made a really good move in a long time and he's made plenty of bad ones. He's made some upgrades to his team for 2007 but he's paid top dollar for them. Any idiot can do that.

[Guest]

I am not really a fan of Hendry, but he isn't a "bad GM". He's not a "great GM", but he is far from being a "bad GM". There has been alot of bad mojo during his tenure as GM, both his fault, and some pretty nasty bad luck. He has put together one of the most talented Cubs teams, in recent memories, it's bad luck, and shaky business decisions that has proven to be Hendry's downfall.

 

I am going to stick with Hendry, and I believe he can get the job done, but he can't do it himself. The players have produce, the and manager has to get the players to produce.

[CubinNY]

I am not really a fan of Hendry, but he isn't a "bad GM". He's not a "great GM", but he is far from being a "bad GM". There has been alot of bad mojo during his tenure as GM, both his fault, and some pretty nasty bad luck. He has put together one of the most talented Cubs teams, in recent memories, it's bad luck, and shaky business decisions that has proven to be Hendry's downfall.

 

I am going to stick with Hendry, and I believe he can get the job done, but he can't do it himself. The players have produce, the and manager has to get the players to produce.

 

But when players haven't produced in the past instead of getting rid of them, he's signed them to more than they are worth.

 

I'm looking at you Glendon and Neifi.

[CubColtPacer]

I am not really a fan of Hendry, but he isn't a "bad GM". He's not a "great GM", but he is far from being a "bad GM". There has been alot of bad mojo during his tenure as GM, both his fault, and some pretty nasty bad luck. He has put together one of the most talented Cubs teams, in recent memories, it's bad luck, and shaky business decisions that has proven to be Hendry's downfall.

 

I am going to stick with Hendry, and I believe he can get the job done, but he can't do it himself. The players have produce, the and manager has to get the players to produce.

 

But when players haven't produced in the past instead of getting rid of them, he's signed them to more than they are worth.

 

I'm looking at you Glendon and Neifi.

 

Neifi yes-I would argue with you about Glendon. Do you know how much money Glendon would have signed for if he had his 04 and 05 seasons before this offseason? It's almost scary to think about what 1 good year, and 1 league average year can make for you in the majors now. Of course, right after Hendry signed him Rusch finished falling apart entirely, but that's a different story for a different day.

[Soriano12]

http://msn.foxsports.com/mlb/story/6392576

Not sure if Epstein should be that high...

Epstein has been pretty good. Got them a WS ring, and he signed all the available FA's this year that I wanted the Cubs to sign. Hendry is where he deserves. Those bottom tier GMs are pretty bad.

 

I don't know about all that now. Hendry may be bad, but is he worse that Jim Bowden or J.P. Ricciardi? I'd put him somewhere between 15-17 personally.

Hendry is bad, very bad. Any monkey can sign players through FA if they have the available funds to do so, and Soriano didn't come cheap either.

 

Whether you think its a fluke or not, I dont know how you judge Hendry without at least mentioning Lee, Barrett and, here's the big one, RAMIREZ.

 

i judge hendry by wins. and in that regard, he's bad.

 

and if you judge him by win per dollar, he's the worst.

 

I agree 100%. He is just lucky he got bailed out by ownership and an increase payroll. Could you imagine how bad this team would be without that increase? They would have had $$$ for Soriono, but that is about it.

[Amazing_Grace]

Moreover, just about every single Cubs position prospect brought up in the past 8 years has been a bust. Almost all were drafted and/or developed with Hendry as either GM or director of scouting. That's a pretty scathing indictment. The farm system has gotten markedly worse under Jim's tenure, partially because of prospects given up in trades and some notable draft failures (Brownlie, Harvey).

The recent failure of the farm system can be blamed on John Stocksill. Hendry hasn't been a very good GM, but he built one of the best farm systems in the game, and was clearly a terrific scouting director.

 

There's plenty of blame to go around either way. GMs are responsible for the big league club and the farm system. If they hire the wrong people at either level, they have to take some of the blame. Hendry didn't overwork Prior and Wood himself, but he hired the man that did. Also, Hendry only took over as GM in 2002 but the best farm system in the game he had built ended up producing good pitchers and nobody worth a dip anywhere else. It's a mixed bag. The pitching talent in the system has been very good, and is still OK as we have some legit prospects in Veal, Gallagher and several B-prospects like Marshall, Mateo, Marmol, Guzman, Ryu. The position player talent has been average at best and is terrible at the moment. In hindsight, it seems what Hendry looks for in pitchers works pretty well, but what he looks for in hitters is betraying him, and it's not really changed since he was scouting director. I'll give him credit for taking a god-awful minor league system in the mid-90's and making it respectable, but let's step back and realize that very few Cub non-pitchers have actually stuck in the bigs since then.

[KingCubsFan]

Moreover, just about every single Cubs position prospect brought up in the past 8 years has been a bust. Almost all were drafted and/or developed with Hendry as either GM or director of scouting. That's a pretty scathing indictment. The farm system has gotten markedly worse under Jim's tenure, partially because of prospects given up in trades and some notable draft failures (Brownlie, Harvey).

The recent failure of the farm system can be blamed on John Stocksill. Hendry hasn't been a very good GM, but he built one of the best farm systems in the game, and was clearly a terrific scouting director.

 

There's plenty of blame to go around either way. GMs are responsible for the big league club and the farm system. If they hire the wrong people at either level, they have to take some of the blame. Hendry didn't overwork Prior and Wood himself, but he hired the man that did. Also, Hendry only took over as GM in 2002 but the best farm system in the game he had built ended up producing good pitchers and nobody worth a dip anywhere else. It's a mixed bag. The pitching talent in the system has been very good, and is still OK as we have some legit prospects in Veal, Gallagher and several B-prospects like Marshall, Mateo, Marmol, Guzman, Ryu. The position player talent has been average at best and is terrible at the moment. In hindsight, it seems what Hendry looks for in pitchers works pretty well, but what he looks for in hitters is betraying him, and it's not really changed since he was scouting director. I'll give him credit for taking a god-awful minor league system in the mid-90's and making it respectable, but let's step back and realize that very few Cub non-pitchers have actually stuck in the bigs since then.

It's hard to blame Hendry for the farm system's fall after he became GM. When you hire a scouting director, you need to give him at least 3-4 years before you can make a determination as to whether his drafts/signings have been successful. Stocksill got about 4 years, and it turned out he sucked.

[illiniguy]

Moreover, just about every single Cubs position prospect brought up in the past 8 years has been a bust. Almost all were drafted and/or developed with Hendry as either GM or director of scouting. That's a pretty scathing indictment. The farm system has gotten markedly worse under Jim's tenure, partially because of prospects given up in trades and some notable draft failures (Brownlie, Harvey).

The recent failure of the farm system can be blamed on John Stocksill. Hendry hasn't been a very good GM, but he built one of the best farm systems in the game, and was clearly a terrific scouting director.

 

There's plenty of blame to go around either way. GMs are responsible for the big league club and the farm system. If they hire the wrong people at either level, they have to take some of the blame. Hendry didn't overwork Prior and Wood himself, but he hired the man that did. Also, Hendry only took over as GM in 2002 but the best farm system in the game he had built ended up producing good pitchers and nobody worth a dip anywhere else. It's a mixed bag. The pitching talent in the system has been very good, and is still OK as we have some legit prospects in Veal, Gallagher and several B-prospects like Marshall, Mateo, Marmol, Guzman, Ryu. The position player talent has been average at best and is terrible at the moment. In hindsight, it seems what Hendry looks for in pitchers works pretty well, but what he looks for in hitters is betraying him, and it's not really changed since he was scouting director. I'll give him credit for taking a god-awful minor league system in the mid-90's and making it respectable, but let's step back and realize that very few Cub non-pitchers have actually stuck in the bigs since then.

It's hard to blame Hendry for the farm system's fall after he became GM. When you hire a scouting director, you need to give him at least 3-4 years before you can make a determination as to whether his drafts/signings have been successful. Stocksill got about 4 years, and it turned out he sucked.

Didn't Stocksill draft Prior and Willis? With some more talented pitchers on the way?? To give him all of the blame is silly. This list is foolish. Lets say that Albert Pujols doesn't end up being the most overachieving player of all time. The Cardinals would have been downright Cub bad the last few yers and not nearly as many would have been as high on Jocketty.

[Soriano12]

I really can't give him credit for drafting Mark Prior, after the Twins took Mauer, Prior at 2 was a no brainer. Anyone could have made that call.

[KingCubsFan]

Didn't Stocksill draft Prior and Willis? With some more talented pitchers on the way?? To give him all of the blame is silly. This list is foolish. Lets say that Albert Pujols doesn't end up being the most overachieving player of all time. The Cardinals would have been downright Cub bad the last few yers and not nearly as many would have been as high on Jocketty.

Not quite sure how Pujols is "overachieving." He was drafted low mostly because no one had seen him and he had just arrived in the US. Maybe he wasn't expected to be one of the greatest hitters of all time, but he always had talent and was projected as a middle of the order hitter.

Prior shouldn't really count as a good pick: Terry Ryan essentially made that pick for him. Willis was a pretty good pick, but one good pick doesn't make a good scouting director. Since Stocksill came over, we've had one good position prospect (signed out of Latin America) and some OK pitching prospects with average ceilings. The only one with a high ceiling (Guzman), was signed as FA by Hendry after KC released him. Rich Hill might have been drafted by Hendry too

[illiniguy]

Didn't Stocksill draft Prior and Willis? With some more talented pitchers on the way?? To give him all of the blame is silly. This list is foolish. Lets say that Albert Pujols doesn't end up being the most overachieving player of all time. The Cardinals would have been downright Cub bad the last few yers and not nearly as many would have been as high on Jocketty.

Not quite sure how Pujols is "overachieving." He was drafted low mostly because no one had seen him and he had just arrived in the US. Maybe he wasn't expected to be one of the greatest hitters of all time, but he always had talent and was projected as a middle of the order hitter.

Prior shouldn't really count as a good pick: Terry Ryan essentially made that pick for him. Willis was a pretty good pick, but one good pick doesn't make a good scouting director. Since Stocksill came over, we've had one good position prospect (signed out of Latin America) and some OK pitching prospects with average ceilings. The only one with a high ceiling (Guzman), was signed as FA by Hendry after KC released him. Rich Hill might have been drafted by Hendry too

Oh I don't know he was on no ones top prospect lists and then goes on to be the best hitter in the history of baseball(or at least in the argument). I can see where someone wouldn't consider that as an overachiever

[KingCubsFan]

Didn't Stocksill draft Prior and Willis? With some more talented pitchers on the way?? To give him all of the blame is silly. This list is foolish. Lets say that Albert Pujols doesn't end up being the most overachieving player of all time. The Cardinals would have been downright Cub bad the last few yers and not nearly as many would have been as high on Jocketty.

Not quite sure how Pujols is "overachieving." He was drafted low mostly because no one had seen him and he had just arrived in the US. Maybe he wasn't expected to be one of the greatest hitters of all time, but he always had talent and was projected as a middle of the order hitter.

Prior shouldn't really count as a good pick: Terry Ryan essentially made that pick for him. Willis was a pretty good pick, but one good pick doesn't make a good scouting director. Since Stocksill came over, we've had one good position prospect (signed out of Latin America) and some OK pitching prospects with average ceilings. The only one with a high ceiling (Guzman), was signed as FA by Hendry after KC released him. Rich Hill might have been drafted by Hendry too

Oh I don't know he was on no ones top prospect lists and then goes on to be the best hitter in the history of baseball(or at least in the argument). I can see where someone wouldn't consider that as an overachiever

Well he was in the Cardinals' system for one full year before going to Majors, and he made the Cardinal's top prospect list for Baseball America. Maybe you didn't hear about him for years like other top prospects because he made the Cardinals out of A ball. Usually, players without talent don't make their major league team out of Class A. In fact, only special players do.

[illiniguy]

Didn't Stocksill draft Prior and Willis? With some more talented pitchers on the way?? To give him all of the blame is silly. This list is foolish. Lets say that Albert Pujols doesn't end up being the most overachieving player of all time. The Cardinals would have been downright Cub bad the last few yers and not nearly as many would have been as high on Jocketty.

Not quite sure how Pujols is "overachieving." He was drafted low mostly because no one had seen him and he had just arrived in the US. Maybe he wasn't expected to be one of the greatest hitters of all time, but he always had talent and was projected as a middle of the order hitter.

Prior shouldn't really count as a good pick: Terry Ryan essentially made that pick for him. Willis was a pretty good pick, but one good pick doesn't make a good scouting director. Since Stocksill came over, we've had one good position prospect (signed out of Latin America) and some OK pitching prospects with average ceilings. The only one with a high ceiling (Guzman), was signed as FA by Hendry after KC released him. Rich Hill might have been drafted by Hendry too

Oh I don't know he was on no ones top prospect lists and then goes on to be the best hitter in the history of baseball(or at least in the argument). I can see where someone wouldn't consider that as an overachiever

Well he was in the Cardinals' system for one full year before going to Majors, and he made the Cardinal's top prospect list for Baseball America. Maybe you didn't hear about him for years like other top prospects because he made the Cardinals out of A ball. Usually, players without talent don't make their major league team out of Class A. In fact, only special players do.

Right I know he made a heck of a jump, but who could have predicted any young guytogo onto to immediately do what Albert has done? Without that the Astros have a lot of NL Pennants.