Cubs sign Soriano

[EastonBlues22]

Just heard Hendry on ESPN1000, Sorianos here to lead off. Cubs offered that as a guarantee in a deal. It was so important to him that was one of the major reasons he signed here.........to go with the other $138million reasons he had............ 8)

 

Whys he love leading off so much is what I dont get?? I want him batting lower so he can drive in sum runs and do some damage

Comfort?

 

Ego possibly?

 

His production is outstanding for a 2B, or a leadoff hitter...it's a lot less impressive for a corner OF in the middle of the order...

[RyCubsFan]

Hitting first, Soriano will have a significant more number at bats than if he hit 5th. Line up contstruction really only matters for the first time through the batting order. What does matter, is getting your best hitters the most amount of at bats. This happens if you hit your best hitters at the top. Heck, if we signed Drew, you could start the lineup: Soriano, Drew, Lee, Ramirez.

[KingKongvs.Godzilla]

No doubt Soriano is an upgrade over Pierre.

 

My problem is we payed GREAT money to a GOOD player.

 

The [expletive] logic people like to use is that the Cubs can afford to do that. So what? It's still a TERRIBLE way to spend your money. If you had 100 dollars to spend would you overpay for a lesser product simply because its an upgrade over what you have? What you if you could find a better product for cheaper?

 

Thats what Soriano is to me. We overpaid "because we can," and got ourselves a big name who does really the following things well:

 

A. Hits for alot of power.

 

Thats it. He sucks at stealing bases, he K's a ton, plays crappy D, and he's allergic to walking.

 

It's a ridiculously [expletive] deal. I'm not going to sit here praising the fact that the Cubs paid a big name big money. He's not a great player, and he gets paid like one. Wow, cool we showed we can pay money to guys. We flexed our financial muscles. SO WHAT? They key to having that money is spending it wisely.

 

We just signed a big risk, big reward player to a franchise record deal. How [expletive] is that?

 

I don't care that the Cubs showed they can spend money. I always knew they could. Its HOW THEY SPEND THAT MONEY thats the key.

 

Put it this way, at the highest Drew was rumored for 4/52. He plays better defense, gets on base, also has power, can run the bases, and is left handed.

 

Soriano gets EIGHT YEARS and 136 million for one really good season? At age 30?

 

Yes, praise the Cubs for spending money. But anyone can throw a [expletive] of money at a good player and get him. That doesn't make a great or even good move.

 

Sure, we MIGHT get close to the .277/.351/.560 line, but I'm willing to bet it ends up around .280/.330/.550. Thats good, but 17 million dollars great? Not really.

 

The fact is this money could have been thrown at Beltran 2 years ago. Or we could have saved a boatload and gotten a more consistently productive player in Drew.

 

But OMG WE MADE A SPLASH!!

 

For less money, and less years this move is OK. I'd be pretty meh on it, even a little bit excited. But the contract is [expletive] at best, and Soriano is an OK player only because of his power and athleticism, not great.

 

Reading the post it seems random. Sorry for that. I just absolutely hate this move.

Edited November 20, 2006 by KingKongvs.Godzilla

[FergieJ31]

Hitting first, Soriano will have a significant more number at bats than if he hit 5th. Line up contstruction really only matters for the first time through the batting order. ...

 

I've heard this assertion made before and I don't get it. The issue isn't that Fonzie leads off the game or gets more AB's; rather, it's that he follows the low-OBP 7-8-9 slots in the lineup so his RBI potential is wasted.

[goonys evil twin]

You like the word "[expletive]"?

[KingKongvs.Godzilla]

You like the word "[expletive]"?

 

Love the word.

[fibro]

Of all the articles I have read, the Keith Law piece was the most surprising. He assumes the Cubs purpose in signing Soriano is strictly to replace Murton - which hasn't been reported by anyone.

 

He then goes on to build an entire article around why this is bad idea, which is rather silly, considering the basic premise is flawed. I kind of expect strawman arguments in a message board community, but from a respected writer and baseball man like Law?

 

He also says Murton is a good defensive left fielder which shows he hasn't really been paying attention. I love Murton but he struggled defensively last year.

[goonys evil twin]

Hitting first, Soriano will have a significant more number at bats than if he hit 5th. Line up contstruction really only matters for the first time through the batting order. ...

 

I've heard this assertion made before and I don't get it. The issue isn't that Fonzie leads off the game or gets more AB's; rather, it's that he follows the low-OBP 7-8-9 slots in the lineup so his RBI potential is wasted.

 

I think the theory is that order doesn't affect the teams total runs, all that much. It would affect any one players' R and RBI, but the team total would stay more or less the same.

[FergieJ31]

No doubt Soriano is an upgrade over Pierre.

 

My problem is we payed GREAT money to a GOOD player.

... Sorry for that. I just absolutely hate this move.

 

Exactly - I agree 100%. I don't need to wait to see what else Hendry has in the works to come out and say I hate this deal.

[Electron Blue]

You like the word "[expletive]"?

 

Love the word.

 

And I love the word "colloquialism" . . . 'course it doesn't offend anyone . . .

[Transmogrified Tiger]

Of all the articles I have read, the Keith Law piece was the most surprising. He assumes the Cubs purpose in signing Soriano is strictly to replace Murton - which hasn't been reported by anyone.

 

He then goes on to build an entire article around why this is bad idea, which is rather silly, considering the basic premise is flawed. I kind of expect strawman arguments in a message board community, but from a respected writer and baseball man like Law?

 

He also says Murton is a good defensive left fielder which shows he hasn't really been paying attention. I love Murton but he struggled defensively last year.

 

By most defensive metrics Murton was an above average defender, and in my watching I don't see what's so outrageous about the claim.

[UK1679666180]

No doubt Soriano is an upgrade over Pierre.

 

My problem is we payed GREAT money to a GOOD player.

... Sorry for that. I just absolutely hate this move.

 

Exactly - I agree 100%. I don't need to wait to see what else Hendry has in the works to come out and say I hate this deal.

 

It's more of a flaw of win now, with plenty of money to spend on little to spend it on.

 

Moves like this will always separate the Cubs from the Pirates, but more has to be done as far as getting players on the cheap as well as players thru the farm system to go beyond on a talented team of all FAs.

 

They had to do it though, IMO.

 

The Cubs won't win it all by trying outspend everyone at every junction.

[sweetpeteman]

You like the word "[expletive]"?

 

Love the word.

 

And I love the word "colloquialism" . . . 'course it doesn't offend anyone . . .

 

I'm offended.

[KingKongvs.Godzilla]

You like the word "[expletive]"?

 

Love the word.

 

And I love the word "colloquialism" . . . 'course it doesn't offend anyone . . .

 

I'm offended.

 

Fine, I consider the move a simple minded one.

[goonys evil twin]

Fine, I consider the move a simple minded one.

 

I agree with the sentiment. Unfortunately, Hendry put himself in a position where he almost had to do it.

 

This contract wasn't nearly as bad as all the moves Hendry made that led up to it, over the years.

[Electron Blue]

You like the word "[expletive]"?

 

Love the word.

 

And I love the word "colloquialism" . . . 'course it doesn't offend anyone . . .

 

I'm offended.

 

Well, colloq YOU!

[kroth1342]

Don't know if this has been announced/posted already, but it is 8 years guaranteed?

[NewUserName]

After a day to let this sink in I have decided that only 2 outcomes can come from this signing.

 

1. Cubs win the World Series in the next couple of years with Soriano being a plus 9 OPS guy. Great signing

 

or

 

2. Cubs not win the WS in the next couple of years and Soriano is putting up Jacque Jones type numbers in 2010. Horrendous signing

 

 

I pray its 1 but would be more inclined to beat on 2.

[erik316wttn]

Don't know if this has been announced/posted already, but it is 8 years guaranteed?

 

I think there are option years somewhere in there that haven't been announced yet.

[Guest]

After a day to let this sink in I have decided that only 2 outcomes can come from this signing.

 

1. Cubs win the World Series in the next couple of years with Soriano being a plus 9 OPS guy. Great signing

 

or

 

2. Cubs not win the WS in the next couple of years and Soriano is putting up Jacque Jones type numbers in 2010. Horrendous signing

 

 

I pray its 1 but would be more inclined to beat on 2.

How about:

 

1) Aramis eats himself off third base, but we can't move him to 1B because Derrek is already there

2) The pitching doesn't come through

3) We don't win the WS even though Soriano breaks through to a 1.00+ level of OPS

[Butterscup1679666578]

After a day to let this sink in I have decided that only 2 outcomes can come from this signing.

 

1. Cubs win the World Series in the next couple of years with Soriano being a plus 9 OPS guy. Great signing

 

or

 

2. Cubs not win the WS in the next couple of years and Soriano is putting up Jacque Jones type numbers in 2010. Horrendous signing

 

 

I pray its 1 but would be more inclined to beat on 2.

How about:

 

1) Aramis eats himself off third base, but we can't move him to 1B because Derrek is already there

2) The pitching doesn't come through

3) We don't win the WS even though Soriano breaks through to a 1.00+ level of OPS

 

Or, Hendry isn't able to add any other starters and the rotation is Z/Hill/Miller/Marshall/Prior, hardly WS-bound.

[LeftCoastCubFan]

By most defensive metrics Murton was an above average defender, and in my watching I don't see what's so outrageous about the claim.

If you are referring to zone ratings and such, they and $3.50 will get you a venti Latte at Starbucks. There are no worthwhile defensive metrics. It's like comparing the number of hits Pierre has last year and comparing it to all the other centerfielders; concluding he is the best hitting player of the bunch.

[Jazz]

Let me take this thread into a new direction.

 

In 5 years, what will the Cubs payroll look like?

 

Undoubtedly there will be new ownership, so you can rule out the Tribune and their investor friendly strategies. If you get one of the NBA owners, you might see an even higher payroll, going into luxury tax territory.

 

All this hypothetical thinking though is making my head hurt, but it is very possible that near the end of Soriano's deal, even in the option years, that it will be less of a chunk of our payroll than it is now.

[goonys evil twin]

Let me take this thread into a new direction.

 

In 5 years, what will the Cubs payroll look like?

 

Undoubtedly there will be new ownership, so you can rule out the Tribune and their investor friendly strategies. If you get one of the NBA owners, you might see an even higher payroll, going into luxury tax territory.

 

All this hypothetical thinking though is making my head hurt, but it is very possible that near the end of Soriano's deal, even in the option years, that it will be less of a chunk of our payroll than it is now.

 

And he'll probably account for a smaller chunk of the production as well.

[Deeg]

Bottom line, folks, is the Trib don't care about the payroll in five years because they won't own the team. Hendry doesn't care because he must win NOW or lose his job. Result? Spend it, baby! Eight years? No problem. Six years for Schmidt? No problem. $8 million for Meche? Where's my pen?