What's wrong with Lou?

[pete the dog]

I'm no huge fan of Piniella, but I don't understand the extreme animosity toward him on this board.

 

I mean, at least his tantrums are entertaining.

 

Can someone please summarize for me why Lou is the devil?

 

Thanks!

[CP_414]

Dusty Baker is a passive Lou Piniella. That's what is wrong with Lou. He freely admitted a few weeks ago to not caring about OBP and not even knowing what WHIP is. He's too old school for the Saber minds here, including myself. He would be the worst possible choice.

[David]

I'm no huge fan of Piniella, but I don't understand the extreme animosity toward him on this board.

 

I mean, at least his tantrums are entertaining.

 

Can someone please summarize for me why Lou is the devil?

 

Thanks!

 

He's Dusty without the entertaining quotes.

[Sammy Sofa]

He loves crusty veterans at least as much as Dusty, if not moreso.

 

Seems to loathe playing rookies/younger players.

 

Has no problem working pitchers into the ground.

 

Can't manage a team to season victory unless he was a WS-ready team dumped in his lap.

 

Comes from the "old skool" of baseball managers that think the game stopped in 1974 and hasn't changed since.

[soapy]

Anyone remember when he tried to make Alex Gonzalez a 3B a few years ago? hahahahahahaha.... Something to look forward to.

[b_wiggy_66]

Dusty Baker is a passive Lou Piniella. That's what is wrong with Lou. He freely admitted a few weeks ago to not caring about OBP and not even knowing what WHIP is. He's too old school for the Saber minds here, including myself. He would be the worst possible choice.

 

I couldn't agree more. He also has a history of riding pitchers to much and burning their arms up just like Dusty.

[bhogg]

think of the butt whippins and crazy antics he and Z could put on a team.

 

it would be high comedy at it's finest.

[CUBZ99]

He loves crusty veterans at least as much as Dusty, if not moreso.

 

Seems to loathe playing rookies/younger players.

 

Has no problem working pitchers into the ground.

 

Can't manage a team to season victory unless he was a WS-ready team dumped in his lap.

 

Comes from the "old skool" of baseball managers that think the game stopped in 1974 and hasn't changed since.

 

Yes, you wouldn't want to give the new manager a WS-ready team. That would be unthinkable. :lol:

[Radar3454]

I am not a fan of Lou either but I remember being suprised when he was announcing a game this year and talking about how the Cubs have to value OBP more - I think he said he doesn't know what OPS is which as long as he values OBP and Slugging is not that important.

[Sammy Sofa]

He loves crusty veterans at least as much as Dusty, if not moreso.

 

Seems to loathe playing rookies/younger players.

 

Has no problem working pitchers into the ground.

 

Can't manage a team to season victory unless he was a WS-ready team dumped in his lap.

 

Comes from the "old skool" of baseball managers that think the game stopped in 1974 and hasn't changed since.

 

Yes, you wouldn't want to give the new manager a WS-ready team. That would be unthinkable. :lol:

 

Let's be realistic here...this is the Cubs we're talking about. Piniella needs a team like the Yankees have now to get anywhere. The Cubs aren't getting that.

[KurtEvans]

He's everything that they said, PLUS he once kicked my dog!

 

...not really.

[erik316wttn]

Dusty Baker is a passive Lou Piniella. That's what is wrong with Lou. He freely admitted a few weeks ago to not caring about OBP and not even knowing what WHIP is. He's too old school for the Saber minds here, including myself. He would be the worst possible choice.

 

Which means you can put money on him being the next manager.

[USSoccer]

think of the butt whippins and crazy antics he and Z could put on a team.

 

it would be high comedy at it's finest.

 

I'd rather have a good manager than comedy.

[Master Shake]

 

I'd rather have a good manager than comedy.

 

If bad managers were stand up comedians, Wrigley would be the Improv.

[Pinktermite]

Who is a manager all the geniuses on here would like to see? All I see is people cutting to shreds all the choices that are out there. All this stuff on here people say about all the badness of Dusty's managing, he had a piss poor team to deal with in the first place. It always amazes me how Dusty goes from hero in 2003 to navel lint three years later. There are not many managers that wouldn't have rode Prior and Wood like a bad horse during that stretch. And the Cubs chances are far more dependent on the players they have than the guy that's managing them.

 

I'm entertained by all the negativity on here actually.

[vance_the_cubs_fan]

You want some choices, I've made plenty.

 

1. Larry Dierker. See my thread on Dierker if you want reasons. Or better yet, buy his book, This Ain't Brain Surgery. You can get if for under 10 bucks on Amazon.

 

2. Davey Johnson. He's currently employed by the Nats as a consultant. He may be done managing. I don't know. If he desires a spot and can be released from his contract with the Nationals, I'd take him second.

 

3. Bobby Valentine.

 

I'd be interested to hear some of what Ron Washington has to say about the game. If I liked what I heard, he could be a good choice.

 

I'm not opposed to Brenly. I'd hope that he had learned some since his stint in Arizona.

 

There's probably some other guys that I'd liketo have as well. Since I want a manager who understands run expectancy, there's just not an abundance of those in the managerial pool.

[Sammy Sofa]

Who is a manager all the geniuses on here would like to see? All I see is people cutting to shreds all the choices that are out there. All this stuff on here people say about all the badness of Dusty's managing, he had a piss poor team to deal with in the first place. It always amazes me how Dusty goes from hero in 2003 to navel lint three years later. There are not many managers that wouldn't have rode Prior and Wood like a bad horse during that stretch. And the Cubs chances are far more dependent on the players they have than the guy that's managing them.

 

I'm entertained by all the negativity on here actually.

 

Actually, there was a lot of criticism of Dusty from the moment he was hired, especially here. His mistakes and bad managerial choices didn't come out of nowhere.

[CaliforniaRaisin]

Terry Francona.

Brad Mills.

 

Hitting Coach: Ron Jackson (so probably not Francona)

[cubweiser03]

He loves crusty veterans at least as much as Dusty, if not moreso.

 

Seems to loathe playing rookies/younger players.

 

Has no problem working pitchers into the ground.

 

Can't manage a team to season victory unless he was a WS-ready team dumped in his lap.

 

Comes from the "old skool" of baseball managers that think the game stopped in 1974 and hasn't changed since.

 

Yes, you wouldn't want to give the new manager a WS-ready team. That would be unthinkable. :lol:

 

Let's be realistic here...this is the Cubs we're talking about. Piniella needs a team like the Yankees have now to get anywhere. The Cubs aren't getting that.

 

Oh Really. Case Study 1: The 1990 WC Cincinnati Reds. Lets have a look at this 'veteran' roster. Payroll of $14M

 

Barry Larkin-26

Chris Sabo-28

Billy Hatcher-29

Paul Oneal-27

Eric Davis-26

Mariano Duncan-27

Todd Benzinger-27

Joe Oliver-25

Hal Morris-25

Glen Brags-27

Jeff Reed-27

 

Tom Browning-30

Jose Rijo-25

Jack Armstrong-25

Danny Jackson-28

Rick Mahler-37

 

Nasty Boys:

Rob Dibble-26

Randy Myers-27

Norm Charlton-27

Tim Layana-26

 

Ancient i say, ancient. The man needs crusty veterans to win. Yeah right.

[Wilson A2000]

Bobby Valentine? No way.

[Bluescale]

Where does Joe Girardi fall in the Sabr hierarchy?

[vance_the_cubs_fan]

Where does Joe Girardi fall in the Sabr hierarchy?

 

He appears to be very old school and sold to the conventional ways of thinking. He gives away too many outs.

[CubinNY]

Where does Joe Girardi fall in the Sabr hierarchy?

 

It's hard to tell.

 

I'd say he doesn't mind giving up outs so I'd put him somewhere like this:

 

 

Earl Weaver

 

 

Terry Francona

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Joe Girardi

Lou Piniella

Dusty Baker

[Bluescale]

Where does Joe Girardi fall in the Sabr hierarchy?

 

He appears to be very old school and sold to the conventional ways of thinking. He gives away too many outs.

 

Bah...That's disappointing.

[Rerisen]

What's wrong with Lou? Only that he might be coaching the Yanks.

 

http://sports.espn.go.com/mlb/news/story?id=2617224

 

Does that open the door for Torre to the Cubs? :shock: