Cubs trade Scott Williamson to the Padres...

[Illini Iceman]

Hendry sure loves to sell low, doesn't he?

 

Since the Cubs picked him up off the junk heap for nothing and he would have walked after this year for nothing I would say getting two prospects (neither of which needs to be put on the 40 man roster) is an overall net gain for Hendry.

 

I never saw anything in Williamson that was very impressive this year so I don't see why anyone would think any contenders would give up value for him.

 

He is an average middle reliever that will probably bounce around teams for the next few years as bullpen filler.

[oldcubsfan]

How do you trade a Major League reliever for two minor leaguers that can't throw strikes, can't strike anyone out, and give up a lot of hits? I mean, this isn't even a great year for the Peoria rotation and they are all still better than these two guys. You shouldn't expect a fortune for Williamson, but he's still a big league pitcher and should command someone with even a glimmer of hope for a major league future.

 

EDIT: Those guys are both Top 30? No wonder BA ranked San Diego the 3rd worst system in the Majors.

 

Please tell me what Williamson ever did for us? He's just not good, what did you expect other than minor leaguers? If you're upset now, what until you see how little we'll get for Walker.

 

I'd expect a minor leaguer that has done anything remotely successful as a pro. Aren't you the one who goes on about how prospects aren't sure things, and therefore aren't as good as those who've made it to the major league level?

 

Williamson is a right hander who gives up a mediocre amount of baserunners and strikes out a ton of guys. He's worth more than two guys who become a couple of the worst pitchers at our Low A affiliate.

No, he really isn't. He has not struck out a ton of guys since his arm injury and his control is mediocre at best. Do you get to see him much when he pitches? I know it's hard when the Cubs aren't on ch. 9 for people living out of the broadcast area, but he has basically sucked most of the year.

[YearofDaCubs]

How do you trade a Major League reliever for two minor leaguers that can't throw strikes, can't strike anyone out, and give up a lot of hits? I mean, this isn't even a great year for the Peoria rotation and they are all still better than these two guys. You shouldn't expect a fortune for Williamson, but he's still a big league pitcher and should command someone with even a glimmer of hope for a major league future.

 

EDIT: Those guys are both Top 30? No wonder BA ranked San Diego the 3rd worst system in the Majors.

Typical Hendry move.

[abuck1220]

welp, they're no kearns and lopez.

 

maybe now wuertz can come up and sit in the pen for weeks on end while novoa sees if he can get his whip up over 2.

[UMFan83]

The Cubs get 19-year old lefty Fabian Jimenez Angulo and 22-year old righty Joel Santo from Class A Fort Wayne. Angulo is 5-7 with a 4.43 ERA. Santo is 5-6 with a 5.51 ERA.

 

Doesn't look like much.

 

Is Joel related to Ron Santo?

 

 

We didn't give up much. He didn't pitch well and will be a free agent at the end of the year. Not going to get much for him.

 

Hendry said Williamson was highly sought after and he was not going to give away players without getting quality in return. :lol:

 

Plus you saw what the Reds gave up for relief help. The contenders should be DESPERATE for help. The Cubs had all the leverage in this situation and they didnt get crap for him. Good job Jimbo

[Tracer Bullet]

Hard to comment without seeing who the prospects are.

 

But I can't wait to hear Williamson's comments regarding Baker now that he is on his way out the door.

 

After watching him pitch this year, he ought to just keep quiet.

 

There's no requirement that you be talented, or be playing at a particularly high level, in order to express an opinion.

[CardsFanInChiTown]

The Cubs get 19-year old lefty Fabian Jimenez Angulo and 22-year old righty Joel Santo from Class A Fort Wayne. Angulo is 5-7 with a 4.43 ERA. Santo is 5-6 with a 5.51 ERA.

 

Doesn't look like much.

 

Is Joel related to Ron Santo?

 

 

We didn't give up much. He didn't pitch well and will be a free agent at the end of the year. Not going to get much for him.

 

Hendry said Williamson was highly sought after and he was not going to give away players without getting quality in return. :lol:

 

Plus you saw what the Reds gave up for relief help. The contenders should be DESPERATE for help. The Cubs had all the leverage in this situation and they didnt get crap for him. Good job Jimbo

 

I think you have it turned around. The Reds badly misjudged the market. Remember, the Braves didn't give up much for Wickman.

[Transmogrified Tiger]

How do you trade a Major League reliever for two minor leaguers that can't throw strikes, can't strike anyone out, and give up a lot of hits? I mean, this isn't even a great year for the Peoria rotation and they are all still better than these two guys. You shouldn't expect a fortune for Williamson, but he's still a big league pitcher and should command someone with even a glimmer of hope for a major league future.

 

EDIT: Those guys are both Top 30? No wonder BA ranked San Diego the 3rd worst system in the Majors.

 

Please tell me what Williamson ever did for us? He's just not good, what did you expect other than minor leaguers? If you're upset now, what until you see how little we'll get for Walker.

 

I'd expect a minor leaguer that has done anything remotely successful as a pro. Aren't you the one who goes on about how prospects aren't sure things, and therefore aren't as good as those who've made it to the major league level?

 

Williamson is a right hander who gives up a mediocre amount of baserunners and strikes out a ton of guys. He's worth more than two guys who become a couple of the worst pitchers at our Low A affiliate.

No, he really isn't. He has not struck out a ton of guys since his arm injury and his control is mediocre at best. Do you get to see him much when he pitches? I know it's hard when the Cubs aren't on ch. 9 for people living out of the broadcast area, but he has basically sucked most of the year.

 

Even if we buy that Williamson is terrible(he's not), something is wrong with that logic. Either the Padres wanted him(and they consider him better than terrible) or Hendry gave him away(which would explain the terrible return). So either Hendry is stupid for giving him away for nothing a week and a half before the deadline, or the Padres thought Williamson was worth something and Hendry got hosed by getting nothing in return.

 

We didnt see Jimenez this year in the 8 games we played against Ft. Wayne....but Santo was 2-0 with a 0.00 ERA in two starts against the Chiefs....12 innings, 8 hits and 4 K's....

 

Nathan Baliva

Peoria Chiefs Broadcaster

 

Thanks. I appreciate someone who has seen the prospects comments. They are far more meaningful than the speculation.

 

And this is what people are talking about when they talk about side-swiping other posters. Anyone who can find this page could say the exact same thing.

[oldcubsfan]

You act like we gave up Howry. This should open a slot for a young pitcher. williamson was not doing anything. How do you know the prospects won't help down the road?

[Illini Iceman]

The Cubs get 19-year old lefty Fabian Jimenez Angulo and 22-year old righty Joel Santo from Class A Fort Wayne. Angulo is 5-7 with a 4.43 ERA. Santo is 5-6 with a 5.51 ERA.

 

Doesn't look like much.

 

Is Joel related to Ron Santo?

 

 

We didn't give up much. He didn't pitch well and will be a free agent at the end of the year. Not going to get much for him.

 

Hendry said Williamson was highly sought after and he was not going to give away players without getting quality in return. :lol:

 

Plus you saw what the Reds gave up for relief help. The contenders should be DESPERATE for help. The Cubs had all the leverage in this situation and they didnt get crap for him. Good job Jimbo

 

I think you have it turned around. The Reds badly misjudged the market. Remember, the Braves didn't give up much for Wickman.

 

Also, to even compare Majewski and Williamson and imply the Cubs should have gotten anywhere close to the value the Nats did is illogical. Majewski has had ERA's of 2.93 in 2005 and 3.58 this year at the time of the trade. Williamson had 5.65 last year and 5.08 this year. Williamson is a free agent at the end of this year, Majewski is still under team control. Williamson has a history of injuries, Majewski does not.

 

Williamson only gets any trade interest because of his name and what he did before he blew out his elbow. He is not going to put any contender over the edge and the market reflects that.

[Transmogrified Tiger]

You act like we gave up Howry. This should open a slot for a young pitcher. williamson was not doing anything. How do you know the prospects won't help down the road?

 

Because they are terrible, like I explained in the original post. I'm not expecting top flight stuff for Williamson, just not the garbage we ended up getting.

[oldcubsfan]

How do you trade a Major League reliever for two minor leaguers that can't throw strikes, can't strike anyone out, and give up a lot of hits? I mean, this isn't even a great year for the Peoria rotation and they are all still better than these two guys. You shouldn't expect a fortune for Williamson, but he's still a big league pitcher and should command someone with even a glimmer of hope for a major league future.

 

EDIT: Those guys are both Top 30? No wonder BA ranked San Diego the 3rd worst system in the Majors.

 

Please tell me what Williamson ever did for us? He's just not good, what did you expect other than minor leaguers? If you're upset now, what until you see how little we'll get for Walker.

 

I'd expect a minor leaguer that has done anything remotely successful as a pro. Aren't you the one who goes on about how prospects aren't sure things, and therefore aren't as good as those who've made it to the major league level?

 

Williamson is a right hander who gives up a mediocre amount of baserunners and strikes out a ton of guys. He's worth more than two guys who become a couple of the worst pitchers at our Low A affiliate.

No, he really isn't. He has not struck out a ton of guys since his arm injury and his control is mediocre at best. Do you get to see him much when he pitches? I know it's hard when the Cubs aren't on ch. 9 for people living out of the broadcast area, but he has basically sucked most of the year.

 

Even if we buy that Williamson is terrible(he's not), something is wrong with that logic. Either the Padres wanted him(and they consider him better than terrible) or Hendry gave him away(which would explain the terrible return). So either Hendry is stupid for giving him away for nothing a week and a half before the deadline, or the Padres thought Williamson was worth something and Hendry got hosed by getting nothing in return.

 

We didnt see Jimenez this year in the 8 games we played against Ft. Wayne....but Santo was 2-0 with a 0.00 ERA in two starts against the Chiefs....12 innings, 8 hits and 4 K's....

 

Nathan Baliva

Peoria Chiefs Broadcaster

 

Thanks. I appreciate someone who has seen the prospects comments. They are far more meaningful than the speculation.

 

And this is what people are talking about when they talk about side-swiping other posters. Anyone who can find this page could say the exact same thing.

I'm sorry if you are offended, but I would much rather read Nathan's comments, someone who has at least seen the guy.

[Transmogrified Tiger]

We didnt see Jimenez this year in the 8 games we played against Ft. Wayne....but Santo was 2-0 with a 0.00 ERA in two starts against the Chiefs....12 innings, 8 hits and 4 K's....

 

Nathan Baliva

Peoria Chiefs Broadcaster

 

Thanks. I appreciate someone who has seen the prospects comments. They are far more meaningful than the speculation.

 

And this is what people are talking about when they talk about side-swiping other posters. Anyone who can find this page could say the exact same thing.

I'm sorry if you are offended, but I would much rather read Nathan's comments, someone who has at least seen the guy.

 

Then let him say something that would be based on watching him. It's not like it was "Santo has a pretty good fastball from what I saw, or "his delivery fooled our hitters", he just quoted a pretty meaningless statistic that anyone can find.

[Illini Iceman]

You act like we gave up Howry. This should open a slot for a young pitcher. williamson was not doing anything. How do you know the prospects won't help down the road?

 

Because they are terrible, like I explained in the original post. I'm not expecting top flight stuff for Williamson, just not the garbage we ended up getting.

 

If the roles were reversed and the Cubs were in contention and had just given up 2 of their top 20 prospects for a pitcher with equivalent numbers to Williamson people would be ripping Hendry.

 

Hendry has been shopping Williamson for a while now and if there was a better deal out there I am sure he would have taken it. To assume a strong market exists for a middle reliever that has an era over 5.00 and a questionable elbow is quite a reach.

[Transmogrified Tiger]

You act like we gave up Howry. This should open a slot for a young pitcher. williamson was not doing anything. How do you know the prospects won't help down the road?

 

Because they are terrible, like I explained in the original post. I'm not expecting top flight stuff for Williamson, just not the garbage we ended up getting.

 

If the roles were reversed and the Cubs were in contention and had just given up 2 of their top 20 prospects for a pitcher with equivalent numbers to Williamson people would be ripping Hendry.

 

Hendry has been shopping Williamson for a while now and if there was a better deal out there I am sure he would have taken it. To assume a strong market exists for a middle reliever that has an era over 5.00 and a questionable elbow is quite a reach.

 

Those guys are top 30 prospects because San Diego's system is a joke. They're terrible, and if we had given up players with their numbers and their careers to get a reliever for a pennant chase, everyone would've been plenty fine with it because no one would miss Todd Blackford and Carlos Perez.

[abuck1220]

wuertz was called up.

[CheeseHead Cubs Fan]

I was never impressed with Williamson, good luck in SD.

[davearm]

You act like we gave up Howry. This should open a slot for a young pitcher. williamson was not doing anything. How do you know the prospects won't help down the road?

 

Because they are terrible, like I explained in the original post. I'm not expecting top flight stuff for Williamson, just not the garbage we ended up getting.

To rip Hendry for getting "garbage" for Williamson suggests you have firsthand knowledge that Hendry could have made a better trade, and gotten better than "garbage".

 

If that is indeed the case, then by all means, enlighten us with what other deals were available.

[Illini Iceman]

You act like we gave up Howry. This should open a slot for a young pitcher. williamson was not doing anything. How do you know the prospects won't help down the road?

 

Because they are terrible, like I explained in the original post. I'm not expecting top flight stuff for Williamson, just not the garbage we ended up getting.

 

If the roles were reversed and the Cubs were in contention and had just given up 2 of their top 20 prospects for a pitcher with equivalent numbers to Williamson people would be ripping Hendry.

 

Hendry has been shopping Williamson for a while now and if there was a better deal out there I am sure he would have taken it. To assume a strong market exists for a middle reliever that has an era over 5.00 and a questionable elbow is quite a reach.

 

Those guys are top 30 prospects because San Diego's system is a joke. They're terrible, and if we had given up players with their numbers and their careers to get a reliever for a pennant chase, everyone would've been plenty fine with it because no one would miss Todd Blackford and Carlos Perez.

 

These guys are terrible, huh? Nothing like rushing to judgement on two guys you have never seen and I am sure never heard of before about 1 hour ago. Then you rip on a guy that has actually seen them pitch because he dares to try to make a postive comment that might slow down the momentum on your latest Hendry roast. Nice.

[Outshined_One]

While I would have loved some one highly-rated like Kottaras from the Padres, that would have been rather unreasonable. Williamson showed himself the door this year, the Cubs simply gave him a push out.

 

The Cubs got two guys whose performances have been substandard up to now. However, both could have decent ceilings. Given proper adjustments and coaching, this trade could turn out reasonably well for the Cubs. If not, I doubt Williamson would have fetched much better from other teams.

[CUBZ99]

You act like we gave up Howry. This should open a slot for a young pitcher. williamson was not doing anything. How do you know the prospects won't help down the road?

 

Because they are terrible, like I explained in the original post. I'm not expecting top flight stuff for Williamson, just not the garbage we ended up getting.

 

If the roles were reversed and the Cubs were in contention and had just given up 2 of their top 20 prospects for a pitcher with equivalent numbers to Williamson people would be ripping Hendry.

 

Hendry has been shopping Williamson for a while now and if there was a better deal out there I am sure he would have taken it. To assume a strong market exists for a middle reliever that has an era over 5.00 and a questionable elbow is quite a reach.

 

Those guys are top 30 prospects because San Diego's system is a joke. They're terrible, and if we had given up players with their numbers and their careers to get a reliever for a pennant chase, everyone would've been plenty fine with it because no one would miss Todd Blackford and Carlos Perez.

 

Hendry has been on the record stating that Williamson was heavily sought after. If that is the case, why give up the guy a week before the trade deadline for a couple of pitchers who can't throw strikes? Its not like the Cubs need to save money by making the deal. That could have just as well kept Williamson for the remainder of the season or held fast until the trade deadline, when teams get more desperate for help.

[Transmogrified Tiger]

You act like we gave up Howry. This should open a slot for a young pitcher. williamson was not doing anything. How do you know the prospects won't help down the road?

 

Because they are terrible, like I explained in the original post. I'm not expecting top flight stuff for Williamson, just not the garbage we ended up getting.

To rip Hendry for getting "garbage" for Williamson suggests you have firsthand knowledge that Hendry could have made a better trade, and gotten better than "garbage".

 

If that is indeed the case, then by all means, enlighten us with what other deals were available.

 

Obviously I don't have knowledge of specific players that were available, but it would be pretty difficult to find a package worse than the one we got.

 

These guys will be two of, if not the two worst pitchers in Peoria. Think about that for a second.

[CUBZ99]

These guys are terrible, huh? Nothing like rushing to judgement on two guys you have never seen and I am sure never heard of before about 1 hour ago. Then you rip on a guy that has actually seen them pitch because he dares to try to make a postive comment that might slow down the momentum on your latest Hendry roast. Nice.

 

I'm not a roast Hendry for everything poster. I think the other side of the coin is those who continuously back Hendry regardless of how horrible his moves are.

 

As far as you comment about rushing to judgment, perhaps you should take a look at their statistics. It is not even close to a stretch to say that up until this point in their career they have been horrible.

 

I respect Nathan's opinion regarding Santo and that may be the only thing that makes me think maybe the trade is not as bad as it looks on paper. But I would be interested to hear him give more info than just his W-L stats, hits, Ks, vs. Peoria.

[CP_414]

wuertz was called up.

 

Good News!

[Transmogrified Tiger]

You act like we gave up Howry. This should open a slot for a young pitcher. williamson was not doing anything. How do you know the prospects won't help down the road?

 

Because they are terrible, like I explained in the original post. I'm not expecting top flight stuff for Williamson, just not the garbage we ended up getting.

 

If the roles were reversed and the Cubs were in contention and had just given up 2 of their top 20 prospects for a pitcher with equivalent numbers to Williamson people would be ripping Hendry.

 

Hendry has been shopping Williamson for a while now and if there was a better deal out there I am sure he would have taken it. To assume a strong market exists for a middle reliever that has an era over 5.00 and a questionable elbow is quite a reach.

 

Those guys are top 30 prospects because San Diego's system is a joke. They're terrible, and if we had given up players with their numbers and their careers to get a reliever for a pennant chase, everyone would've been plenty fine with it because no one would miss Todd Blackford and Carlos Perez.

 

These guys are terrible, huh? Nothing like rushing to judgement on two guys you have never seen and I am sure never heard of before about 1 hour ago. Then you rip on a guy that has actually seen them pitch because he dares to try to make a postive comment that might slow down the momentum on your latest Hendry roast. Nice.

 

Are you kidding me? Rushing to judgement? Give me a break. These guys are classic Hendry good tools/no performance players. They have horrible, horrible track records and are continuing them this season.

 

And can people please stop with the "someone who has seen him" thing? I'd love to hear what Nathan thought of Santo when he saw him pitch, but he didn't say anything about that. For the third time, he merely quoted a statistic any one of us could find(I linked to it earlier), and one that doesn't particularly mean much either(Santo's two starts against Peoria?). It doesn't "slow down the momentum" or whatever you might want to call it, it doesn't tell you anything about him other than the fact that he's had two good starts this year.