Thoughts on Carlos Lee

[CP_414]

Brewers GM Doug Melvin was on Milwaukee radio today and he said he has had no recent conversations with Carlos Lee's agent, and their plans with him could depend on if they are in contention at the All-Star break. Listening to all of the recent talk from both the Brewers and Lee, I assume he will indeed hit the free agent market.

 

Lee is reportedly looking for 4-5 years in the 12-14 million dollar range. Should the Cubs give him a 4/$50M deal in the offseason?

 

He isn't really an OPS monster at all, and his AVG/OBP is ok, but not great. However he is good for 35+HR's/100+RBI's and would be a solid power bat between D Lee and Aramis.

 

Is he worth the money?

[Ding Dong Johnson]

I don't think he's worth it. That's an awful lot of money for an 830 OPS guy with below average defense. Plus, he'll be 30 in a couple of weeks so any long-term deal becomes a much bigger risk.

[goonys evil twin]

However he is good for 35+HR's/100+RBI's and would be a solid power bat between D Lee and Aramis.

 

Is he worth the money?

 

In a word, no. Carlos Lee has never in his career had 35+ HR and 100+ RBI. He's terribly overrated, especially by Cubs fans who think his success vs the Cubs makes him something special. Career OPS+ of 111, high of 123 at 28. He turns 30 this year and a 4-5 year contract will take him well past his prime, which wasn't all that special to begin with.

 

He'll be a classic case of getting overpaid for a team stat (RBI, which he doesn't have a good track record with anyway - only 2 seasons of 100) and long past his best days.

[CubfaninCA]

give him aram money. cubs need a power hitting 5 hitter and c. lee fits the bill.

 

heck trade rich hill and some prospects for him now. milwaukee needs pitching.

[PrimeTime]

i wouldnt mind having him in left over murton if the price is right, the guy we really missed out on is Alfonso Soriano, whats he have now 22 HR's?? I dont care if his defense is below average. Hes a monster with that bat, he is one step to gettin to the playoffs...Hendry didnt want to sign him because of his defense... I will take a below average defender with his bat anyday.. Soriano,Lee,Ramierz,Jones that would look reallly nice

[CubfaninCA]

i wouldnt mind having him in left over murton if the price is right, the guy we really missed out on is Alfonso Soriano, whats he have now 22 HR's?? I dont care if his defense is below average. Hes a monster with that bat, he is one step to gettin to the playoffs...Hendry didnt want to sign him because of his defense... I will take a below average defender with his bat anyday.. Soriano,Lee,Ramierz,Jones that would look reallly nice

 

soriano was never a free agent. hendry probably didn't have the right package of players for texas, but rumor was that washington was interested in swapping murton for soriano. washington probably wanted a little more. too bad murton & Hill weren't packaged for soriano. the cubs would still be in the playoff race.

 

jmo, soriano will be the guy hendry really goes after in free agency, but they'll end up short just like they did w/ furcal & beltran. but hey at least they tried. typical cub offseason bullcrap :roll:

[frostwyrm]

Lee will be a grossly overpaid salary burden for whoever gets him, so I hope he goes to the Cards.

[PrimeTime]

I think we could get soriano for murton and hill, and sum other no name prospect, I think Hendry is scared to give up his prospects because of what happend to garland and willis, or he just thinks maybe one day in like the year 2016 theyll be called up and be good... He dosent get it,...Were all not waiting for the future... its been 98 years.. the time is NOW...Weve gone through..and after seein the sox win it..I cant beleive he didnt do anything big... If im GM, bam.. id trade for soriano, and try to get Carlos Lee, or a big power hitting left fielder, We would gurantee make it to the playoffs, prolly even the world series...Imagine seein this lineup Pie or Pierre,Cendeno, Soriano, Lee, Rameriez, Lee, and Jones that would be probably be the sickest lineup in all baseball.. We have the 5th most money in baseball and a really deep farm system....But itll never happen Hendry use to be the man when he use to pick up stars.. now he just looks like a bum..and kenny williams is over there picking up stars and about to pick up another star center fielder to make their linep even more potent than it already is... and we have hendry over here sititng iwth his thumb in his mouth

[Neuby]

Carlos Lee and Soranio would do a long ways to making the Cubs a true contender next season

 

Soranio

Lee

Lee

Ramirez

Barrett

Cedeno

Jones

Is a nice offensive unit and maybe Pie steps in next year and plays well. Trouble with that team is who would leadoff?

[Drew Doughty]

Probably Jones if Dusty's still around. I'd try for some combination of barrett/cedeno in 1-2 if we get those players. I'd say let's get the players first and worry about the lineup later.

[Flames24Rulz]

I don't think he's worth 14-15 million, but he's still a guy I'd definitely want to take a look at. He'd definitely help the power threat that our current OF's don't really have much of, with maybe the exception of Jones. His defense isn't great, but we've seen this year with the "great defenders" that Hendry prided himself on in the offseason. Wasn't he also pretty receptive to making a return to Chicago as well?

[goonys evil twin]

Carlos Lee and Soranio would do a long ways to making the Cubs a true contender next season

 

Soranio

Lee

Lee

Ramirez

Barrett

Cedeno

Jones

Is a nice offensive unit and maybe Pie steps in next year and plays well. Trouble with that team is who would leadoff?

 

Two $12+ million free agent signings? I doubt it. That would be a SLG team with no OBP, and the Cubs would be back to the problem of lots of solo homeruns. You'd have to slot Jones over to center and Murton into right to keep at least 2 reasonably priced players on the roster to offset all the big ticket items. In that case Murton is the only realistic leadoff option as everybody but DLee would be a threat for a sub .330 OBP.

[CubfaninCA]

Carlos Lee and Soranio would do a long ways to making the Cubs a true contender next season

 

Soranio

Lee

Lee

Ramirez

Barrett

Cedeno

Jones

Is a nice offensive unit and maybe Pie steps in next year and plays well. Trouble with that team is who would leadoff?

 

Two $12+ million free agent signings? I doubt it. That would be a SLG team with no OBP, and the Cubs would be back to the problem of lots of solo homeruns. You'd have to slot Jones over to center and Murton into right to keep at least 2 reasonably priced players on the roster to offset all the big ticket items. In that case Murton is the only realistic leadoff option as everybody but DLee would be a threat for a sub .330 OBP.

 

no way the cubs sign 2 guys for $12 mil a piece, but lee and aram are big time opb threats. problem is the cubs don't have a big time slugging 5th hitter to drive them in frequently. they waste too much of lee's .400+ obp.

[Andy]

Lee will be a grossly overpaid salary burden for whoever gets him, so I hope he goes to the Cards.

In the same lineup with Pujols + Cardinal magic = Carlos Lee becoming best NL OF for the next 5 years if he joins STL

[katway]

Carlos Lee is not worth that much (4 for $50M), but if we can get him for market value (around 4 for $38 ) it would be a good signing. Like D Lee, his numbers probably improve playing in Wrigley.

 

As for Soriano, why would the Cubs want him at this point. He has made it clear that he doesn't want to be in the NL, will be a free agent after this year, and the Cubs aren't a Soriano away from contention. In essence, the Cubs would trade prospects for a guy going to the Yankees next year.

[Neuby]

Carlos Lee and Soranio would do a long ways to making the Cubs a true contender next season

 

Soranio

Lee

Lee

Ramirez

Barrett

Cedeno

Jones

Is a nice offensive unit and maybe Pie steps in next year and plays well. Trouble with that team is who would leadoff?

 

Two $12+ million free agent signings? I doubt it. That would be a SLG team with no OBP, and the Cubs would be back to the problem of lots of solo homeruns. You'd have to slot Jones over to center and Murton into right to keep at least 2 reasonably priced players on the roster to offset all the big ticket items. In that case Murton is the only realistic leadoff option as everybody but DLee would be a threat for a sub .330 OBP.

There will be lot of money coming off the books with Wood either departing or coming back at a reduced rate along with Maddux possibly not returning. The Cubs will have guys like Marshall, Guzman, Hill, Marmol, Gallegher competing for spots in the rotation next season. The Cubs are always pumping new revenue streams into the Cubs and raising ticket prices the money is there and after the Subpar play on the field this year they hopefully will be spending it. Barrett, Lee,Soranio, all get on base at a decent clip and Cedeno should improve with time. The team would feature a lot of power, Speed with a few OBP guys in the lineup. Not every guy on your team needs to be a huge OBP threat.

[CubsBullsBears]

Lee will be a grossly overpaid salary burden for whoever gets him, so I hope he goes to the Cards.

In the same lineup with Pujols + Cardinal magic = Carlos Lee becoming best NL OF for the next 5 years if he joins STL

^^^^^^^^^^^^^

And w/ Edmonds and Rolen, the Cardinals become the modern-day version of Murderer's row

[CubsBullsBears]

Lee has said he wants to play for the Cubs just so he can stick it to the White Sox. He also still has a home in Chicago. Do you think we could get him at a reduced rate? And why would an inter-divison trade be made by either side??

[CP_414]

Carlos Lee and Soranio would do a long ways to making the Cubs a true contender next season

 

Soranio

Lee

Lee

Ramirez

Barrett

Cedeno

Jones

Is a nice offensive unit and maybe Pie steps in next year and plays well. Trouble with that team is who would leadoff?

 

Two $12+ million free agent signings? I doubt it. That would be a SLG team with no OBP, and the Cubs would be back to the problem of lots of solo homeruns. You'd have to slot Jones over to center and Murton into right to keep at least 2 reasonably priced players on the roster to offset all the big ticket items. In that case Murton is the only realistic leadoff option as everybody but DLee would be a threat for a sub .330 OBP.

There will be lot of money coming off the books with Wood either departing or coming back at a reduced rate along with Maddux possibly not returning. The Cubs will have guys like Marshall, Guzman, Hill, Marmol, Gallegher competing for spots in the rotation next season. The Cubs are always pumping new revenue streams into the Cubs and raising ticket prices the money is there and after the Subpar play on the field this year they hopefully will be spending it. Barrett, Lee,Soranio, all get on base at a decent clip and Cedeno should improve with time. The team would feature a lot of power, Speed with a few OBP guys in the lineup. Not every guy on your team needs to be a huge OBP threat.

 

If we are going to sign 2 $12M free agents I would like to see one of them as a starting pitcher. Speaking only in terms of free agent players I would rather give Lee $12M, Mulder $10M, and use the other $2M towards a 1-year contract for Todd Walker to play 2B.

 

Without Pie:

Walker

Murton

D-Lee

C-Lee

Aramis

Barrett

Jones

Cedeno

 

With Pie:

Walker

Cedeno

D-Lee

C-Lee

Aramis

Barrett

Jones/Murton

Pie

 

Rotation: Zambrano, Prior, Mulder, Marshall and for the 5th spot either make Guzman, Hill, Marmol, or Gallagher earn it or sing a Wade Miller/Tomo Ohka type guy.

 

If Pie is on the roster the bench is also improved because either Murton or Jones would be off the bench everyday. Nevin could stick around another season to add right handed pop off the bench, Theirot could back up Walker, Pagan as the 5th outfielder/backup CF, and let Soto and Fox fight for Blanco's job.

 

Again this is speaking only in terms of free agents, things change if Abreu, Cabrera, Tejada, Dunn, etc are available in a trade.

[CP_414]

Lee has said he wants to play for the Cubs just so he can stick it to the White Sox. He also still has a home in Chicago. Do you think we could get him at a reduced rate? And why would an inter-divison trade be made by either side??

 

Lee has also said he wants to stay in Milwaukee, but he does indeed still live in Chicago and make the daily commute. I don't see the Cubs acquiring him in a trade as they have no shot at the playoffs this year. I would be he will be a free agent target though if/when he hits the market. Inter-divison trades happen all the time. Teams make deals for the best players back in return regardless of who they are trading with.

 

Off the top of my head:

Cubs-Pirates Aramis Deal

Casey from Pitt to Reds

Shawn Green from LA to Arizona

Delgado from Marlins to Mets

[Transmogrified Tiger]

Lee has said he wants to play for the Cubs just so he can stick it to the White Sox. He also still has a home in Chicago. Do you think we could get him at a reduced rate? And why would an inter-divison trade be made by either side??

 

Lee has also said he wants to stay in Milwaukee, but he does indeed still live in Chicago and make the daily commute. I don't see the Cubs acquiring him in a trade as they have no shot at the playoffs this year. I would be he will be a free agent target though if/when he hits the market. Inter-divison trades happen all the time. Teams make deals for the best players back in return regardless of who they are trading with.

 

Off the top of my head:

Cubs-Pirates Aramis Deal

Casey from Pitt to Reds

Shawn Green from LA to Arizona

Delgado from Marlins to Mets

 

What do all of those deals have in common besides being inter-division trades?

[Sammy Sofa]

The estimated price and years are a bit steep, but if he can be had for 4 or less years and under $50 million, rock on. What are his Wrigley numbers?

 

And like it was said, trades within a divison ain't no thang if one of the teams involved has almost zero chance of competing at the time...ie- the Cubs. If the trade benefits the Beer Boys and helps them get out of stalled, they're potentially in a spot to push for the WC. C. Lee to the Cubs this year would be cool, but let's be honest...it ain't nearly enough to push THIS team anywhere near being a threat to anyone except the Pirates.

[Andy]

Lee has said he wants to play for the Cubs just so he can stick it to the White Sox. He also still has a home in Chicago. Do you think we could get him at a reduced rate? And why would an inter-divison trade be made by either side??

 

Lee has also said he wants to stay in Milwaukee, but he does indeed still live in Chicago and make the daily commute. I don't see the Cubs acquiring him in a trade as they have no shot at the playoffs this year. I would be he will be a free agent target though if/when he hits the market. Inter-divison trades happen all the time. Teams make deals for the best players back in return regardless of who they are trading with.

 

Off the top of my head:

Cubs-Pirates Aramis Deal

Casey from Pitt to Reds

Shawn Green from LA to Arizona

Delgado from Marlins to Mets

 

What do all of those deals have in common besides being inter-division trades?

Ooooh, I know, I know!!! *raises hand and yelps* SALARY DUMPS!

[abuck1220]

 

That would be a SLG team with no OBP, and the Cubs would be back to the problem of lots of solo homeruns.

 

i've accepted the fact that the cubs are going to completely ignore OBP, so if they get a team full of moderately low OBP/really high SLG guys (ie lee, soriano), i'll be as content as i can be. better than the really low OBP/really low SLG guys they have now.

 

i don't know if the cubs can score enough runs w/ an outfield of jones, pie, and murton in '07. they may as well trade murton, hill, whatever to get a big bat for a corner OF slugger if they're not going to sign lee.

[Fro]

2B Walkah

SS Cedeno

1B Lee

3B Aram

LF Lee

RF Jock/Craig Wilson platoon of DOOM

C Barrett

CF Pie