Will Cedeno be good?

[soccer10k]

Why is that people start wondering about Murton and Cedeno. Are they supposed to be slump-proof? Actually Murton and Cedeno are two of the best things about the Cubs this year. I think they both have shown that they can be productive players in the majors for quite a few years.

 

have seen this before. choi, jerome walton....

it's a legit question. not trying to knock the kid.

 

The Marlins are really the only team that has allowed Choi to play regularly, and when given that opportunity, he produced. Then they traded him to the Dodgers who let him rot on the bench.

 

perhaps i'm wrong, but didn't a bunch of teams have a chance to claim choi off waivers recently??

 

I believe the Red Sox have him stashed at AAA now. Doesn't change the fact that when give a chance to actually play regularly, he played well.

 

if the guy could produce, he wouldn't be stashed in AAA.

 

:roll:

 

Whatever you say. I guess the fact that he actually has produced when given the chance to play regularly doesn't mean anything.

 

No one is saying he's a star player. However, there are some AL teams that could use him as a DH, and probably a handful of teams around the majors that could use him at first base. He just happens to be in an organization that has productive players at 1B and DH already.

 

Didn't he play regularly with the Cubs before he got his concussion? I don't remember him doing anything for us. Choi is just as bad, if not worse, as Jacque is against left handed pitchers. I think it's unanimous on this board that Jacque should have a platoon partner. So why should Choi get the chance to play when he can't hit lefties? He doesn't deserve it.

[fromthestretch]

That doesn't make a lot of sense. If he is as good as you say; was on waivers, meaning anyone could have gotten him; and there are several teams that could use him at DH or 1B, then why didn't one of those teams pick him up?

 

I agree Choi has a good eye and decent approach, but I always thought he had a pretty slow bat. May be that's the rap on him now.

 

Poor management? Bad decision making? It's not like the Cubs have the market cornered on those two things.

[brinoch]

Why is that people start wondering about Murton and Cedeno. Are they supposed to be slump-proof? Actually Murton and Cedeno are two of the best things about the Cubs this year. I think they both have shown that they can be productive players in the majors for quite a few years.

 

have seen this before. choi, jerome walton....

it's a legit question. not trying to knock the kid.

 

The Marlins are really the only team that has allowed Choi to play regularly, and when given that opportunity, he produced. Then they traded him to the Dodgers who let him rot on the bench.

 

perhaps i'm wrong, but didn't a bunch of teams have a chance to claim choi off waivers recently??

 

I believe the Red Sox have him stashed at AAA now. Doesn't change the fact that when give a chance to actually play regularly, he played well.

 

if the guy could produce, he wouldn't be stashed in AAA.

 

:roll:

 

Whatever you say. I guess the fact that he actually has produced when given the chance to play regularly doesn't mean anything.

 

No one is saying he's a star player. However, there are some AL teams that could use him as a DH, and probably a handful of teams around the majors that could use him at first base. He just happens to be in an organization that has productive players at 1B and DH already.

 

Didn't he play regularly with the Cubs before he got his concussion? I don't remember him doing anything for us. Choi is just as bad, if not worse, as Jacque is against left handed pitchers. I think it's unanimous on this board that Jacque should have a platoon partner. So why should Choi get the chance to play when he can't hit lefties? He doesn't deserve it.

 

Your eyes and your memory have misled you. Choi had an OBP of .389 and an SLG of .496 (OPS of .885) when he was injured.

[TB_11]

Can Give Cedeno more of a chance than 2 months. He's 23, it's his first real shot in the majors. Let's not question his abilities when he hits his first slump.

[brinoch]

Why is that people start wondering about Murton and Cedeno. Are they supposed to be slump-proof? Actually Murton and Cedeno are two of the best things about the Cubs this year. I think they both have shown that they can be productive players in the majors for quite a few years.

 

have seen this before. choi, jerome walton....

it's a legit question. not trying to knock the kid.

 

The Marlins are really the only team that has allowed Choi to play regularly, and when given that opportunity, he produced. Then they traded him to the Dodgers who let him rot on the bench.

 

perhaps i'm wrong, but didn't a bunch of teams have a chance to claim choi off waivers recently??

 

I believe the Red Sox have him stashed at AAA now. Doesn't change the fact that when give a chance to actually play regularly, he played well.

 

if the guy could produce, he wouldn't be stashed in AAA.

 

He also just came off the DL. But, whatever, don't let your disdain for Choi get in the way of your analysis.

 

it's an objective opinion. i actually watched the dodger play.

 

i change when the information changes. unfortunately, there are those who never budge an inch.

 

Really? As far as I can tell, you've never budged from being a contrarian who makes it his mission to be go against the grain. I've also never seen you admit that anyone else might possibly be correct.

 

In case you were curious, when Choi gets an opportunity to play he produces at a decent clip. I know this is hard, but rather than trusting your eyes, why don't you check out his stats? They don't bite.

 

He's not an All-Star. Probably won't be an All-Star. But for the right side of the infield, would you rather have Walker and Perez/Hairston or Choi and Walker? Plus, when Lee is back, Choi can be sent to AAA, be a PH, DH for interleague, be traded, or whatever. He's certainly a better option than Clark or Durazo and the other retreads that have been proposed recently.

[RynoRules]

That doesn't make a lot of sense. If he is as good as you say; was on waivers, meaning anyone could have gotten him; and there are several teams that could use him at DH or 1B, then why didn't one of those teams pick him up?

 

I agree Choi has a good eye and decent approach, but I always thought he had a pretty slow bat. May be that's the rap on him now.

 

Poor management? Bad decision making? It's not like the Cubs have the market cornered on those two things.

 

I am not saying that's not a possibility, but I think its less likely than my theory. I don't want to hijack this thread, but your argument implies that the majority of the trained pros making personnel decisions are "poor managers" and "bad decision makers". While I agree they exist, I have a hard time believing that this is true of 50% or more of them.

[soccer10k]

Didn't he play regularly with the Cubs before he got his concussion? I don't remember him doing anything for us. Choi is just as bad, if not worse, as Jacque is against left handed pitchers. I think it's unanimous on this board that Jacque should have a platoon partner. So why should Choi get the chance to play when he can't hit lefties? He doesn't deserve it.

 

Your eyes and your memory have misled you. Choi had an OBP of .389 and an SLG of .496 (OPS of .885) when he was injured.

 

But he still can't hit lefties. He never has been able to. That's a fact. And the key is those were his stats BEFORE he was injured. What has he done since then. You can state your case based on that but he's not that same player.

 

I could make the argument that Sammy was still hitting well before he got beaned in the head and that should warrant a contract. But Sammy changed after that, teams know that, and that's why he isn't playing this year. Choi never could hit lefties, and after he suffered the concussion, he changed. And that right there is reason enough that Choi shouldn't play everyday.

 

The guy at best is a platoon player.

[CubfaninCA]

Why is that people start wondering about Murton and Cedeno. Are they supposed to be slump-proof? Actually Murton and Cedeno are two of the best things about the Cubs this year. I think they both have shown that they can be productive players in the majors for quite a few years.

 

have seen this before. choi, jerome walton....

it's a legit question. not trying to knock the kid.

 

The Marlins are really the only team that has allowed Choi to play regularly, and when given that opportunity, he produced. Then they traded him to the Dodgers who let him rot on the bench.

 

perhaps i'm wrong, but didn't a bunch of teams have a chance to claim choi off waivers recently??

 

I believe the Red Sox have him stashed at AAA now. Doesn't change the fact that when give a chance to actually play regularly, he played well.

 

if the guy could produce, he wouldn't be stashed in AAA.

 

He also just came off the DL. But, whatever, don't let your disdain for Choi get in the way of your analysis.

 

it's an objective opinion. i actually watched the dodger play.

 

i change when the information changes. unfortunately, there are those who never budge an inch.

 

Really? As far as I can tell, you've never budged from being a contrarian who makes it his mission to be go against the grain. I've also never seen you admit that anyone else might possibly be correct.

 

In case you were curious, when Choi gets an opportunity to play he produces at a decent clip. I know this is hard, but rather than trusting your eyes, why don't you check out his stats? They don't bite.

 

He's not an All-Star. Probably won't be an All-Star. But for the right side of the infield, would you rather have Walker and Perez/Hairston or Choi and Walker? Plus, when Lee is back, Choi can be sent to AAA, be a PH, DH for interleague, be traded, or whatever. He's certainly a better option than Clark or Durazo and the other retreads that have been proposed recently.

 

lol @ the "contrarian" label. seems i'm in agreement with almost everyone else in baseball, but nice try.

 

just recently i've changed my opinion on pierre & rusch. some people called it, so what, i'm wrong.

[brinoch]

Didn't he play regularly with the Cubs before he got his concussion? I don't remember him doing anything for us. Choi is just as bad, if not worse, as Jacque is against left handed pitchers. I think it's unanimous on this board that Jacque should have a platoon partner. So why should Choi get the chance to play when he can't hit lefties? He doesn't deserve it.

 

Your eyes and your memory have misled you. Choi had an OBP of .389 and an SLG of .496 (OPS of .885) when he was injured.

 

But he still can't hit lefties. He never has been able to. That's a fact. And the key is those were his stats BEFORE he was injured. What has he done since then. You can state your case based on that but he's not that same player.

 

I could make the argument that Sammy was still hitting well before he got beaned in the head and that should warrant a contract. But Sammy changed after that, teams know that, and that's why he isn't playing this year. Choi never could hit lefties, and after he suffered the concussion, he changed. And that right there is reason enough that Choi shouldn't play everyday.

 

The guy at best is a platoon player.

 

Really? Wow, he sucked as a Marlin in 2004. Only had a .388 OBP and a .495 SLG (.883 OPS). That's just awful, I say. Definitely took a dip to Neifi-esque suckitude with a .331 OBP and a .453 SLG (.789 OPS) as a Dodger in 2005.

 

In the minors, Choi faced lefties everyday and wasn't platooned. He did fine against them. TT, post the numbers.

[soccer10k]

Didn't he play regularly with the Cubs before he got his concussion? I don't remember him doing anything for us. Choi is just as bad, if not worse, as Jacque is against left handed pitchers. I think it's unanimous on this board that Jacque should have a platoon partner. So why should Choi get the chance to play when he can't hit lefties? He doesn't deserve it.

 

Your eyes and your memory have misled you. Choi had an OBP of .389 and an SLG of .496 (OPS of .885) when he was injured.

 

But he still can't hit lefties. He never has been able to. That's a fact. And the key is those were his stats BEFORE he was injured. What has he done since then. You can state your case based on that but he's not that same player.

 

I could make the argument that Sammy was still hitting well before he got beaned in the head and that should warrant a contract. But Sammy changed after that, teams know that, and that's why he isn't playing this year. Choi never could hit lefties, and after he suffered the concussion, he changed. And that right there is reason enough that Choi shouldn't play everyday.

 

The guy at best is a platoon player.

 

Really? Wow, he sucked as a Marlin in 2004. Only had a .388 OBP and a .495 SLG (.883 OPS). That's just awful, I say. Definitely took a dip to Neifi-esque suckitude with a .331 OBP and a .453 SLG (.789 OPS) as a Dodger in 2005.

 

In the minors, Choi faced lefties everyday and wasn't platooned. He did fine against them. TT, post the numbers.

 

2003 to 2005:

Lefties: .159/.317/.280/.597

Righties: .253/.357/.461/.818

 

Using your example of 2004:

Lefties: .167/.268/.278/.546

Righties: .261/.381/.469/.850

 

Also from 2003 to 2005 he hit 38 HR's and 36 of those were against righties. The guy can't hit lefties. Face it and admit it. I'm not debating that he can sometimes hit righties, but he can't hit lefties to save his life.

[Transmogrified Tiger]

Didn't he play regularly with the Cubs before he got his concussion? I don't remember him doing anything for us. Choi is just as bad, if not worse, as Jacque is against left handed pitchers. I think it's unanimous on this board that Jacque should have a platoon partner. So why should Choi get the chance to play when he can't hit lefties? He doesn't deserve it.

 

Your eyes and your memory have misled you. Choi had an OBP of .389 and an SLG of .496 (OPS of .885) when he was injured.

 

But he still can't hit lefties. He never has been able to. That's a fact. And the key is those were his stats BEFORE he was injured. What has he done since then. You can state your case based on that but he's not that same player.

 

I could make the argument that Sammy was still hitting well before he got beaned in the head and that should warrant a contract. But Sammy changed after that, teams know that, and that's why he isn't playing this year. Choi never could hit lefties, and after he suffered the concussion, he changed. And that right there is reason enough that Choi shouldn't play everyday.

 

The guy at best is a platoon player.

 

Really? Wow, he sucked as a Marlin in 2004. Only had a .388 OBP and a .495 SLG (.883 OPS). That's just awful, I say. Definitely took a dip to Neifi-esque suckitude with a .331 OBP and a .453 SLG (.789 OPS) as a Dodger in 2005.

 

In the minors, Choi faced lefties everyday and wasn't platooned. He did fine against them. TT, post the numbers.

 

Stat monkey, the numbers please. Thank you.

 

Choi in the minors(all at age appropriate levels): .285/.387/.532/.919

 

While Minor League splits are hard to find, it was noted around 2003 that Choi had done fine against LHP. Of course, it's very difficult to put up a .920 OPS and be bad against them.

[fromthestretch]

That doesn't make a lot of sense. If he is as good as you say; was on waivers, meaning anyone could have gotten him; and there are several teams that could use him at DH or 1B, then why didn't one of those teams pick him up?

 

I agree Choi has a good eye and decent approach, but I always thought he had a pretty slow bat. May be that's the rap on him now.

 

Poor management? Bad decision making? It's not like the Cubs have the market cornered on those two things.

 

I am not saying that's not a possibility, but I think its less likely than my theory. I don't want to hijack this thread, but your argument implies that the majority of the trained pros making personnel decisions are "poor managers" and "bad decision makers". While I agree they exist, I have a hard time believing that this is true of 50% or more of them.

 

My argument doesn't imply that at all. I said there are some teams that he could be starting for. A lot of teams already had players in place that were as good, if not better. Other teams have rookies that deserved a shot. There are plenty of reasons. But there are teams that he could be starting for. He also would have been a good insurance policy for some teams that were opening the season with rookies starting at 1B or DH.

 

Florida, Tampa Bay, and Kansas City could use him. He certainly couldn't do any worse than Johnson has so far at first base for Oakland, although I think Johnson should be able to turn it around. LaRoche in Atlanta isn't exactly an All-Star.

 

I honestly think he'd be good in a platoon at first base with Niekro in San Francisco.

[Mark_R]

Who'da thunk another stupid Choi argument would break out?

 

In a thread concerning Cedeno, nonetheless.

[brinoch]

lol @ the "contrarian" label. seems i'm in agreement with almost everyone else in baseball, but nice try.

 

just recently i've changed my opinion on pierre & rusch. some people called it, so what, i'm wrong.

 

Holy dear lord, you've changed your opinion. It's magic, I say, magic.

 

Nice try, my foot. You are a contrarian, CubsfaninCA, and you regularly skirt the line of trollish behavior pretty regularly. You've been a dropping into threads in such a fashion almost since you joined the board.

 

I'm all for different opinions and I like a good debate. I don't like when people reiterate the same opinions time again without sufficient support for the argument. Additionally, it's pretty clear that "almost everyone else in baseball" doesn't mean much of anything since we don't have access to their thoughts. I would add the argument, too, that it's pretty clear that there are a lot of baseball clubs that really don't know how to maximize their winning potential.

 

The Cubs are, and have been, a great example of how not to assemble a baseball team.

[BigbadB]

Who'da thunk another stupid Choi argument would break out?

 

In a thread concerning Cedeno, nonetheless.

 

Probably because Cedeno and Choi look like twins. Look at that, their last names even start with a "C". :D

[Transmogrified Tiger]

2003 to 2005:

Lefties: .159/.317/.280/.597

Righties: .253/.357/.461/.818

 

Using your example of 2004:

Lefties: .167/.268/.278/.546

Righties: .261/.381/.469/.850

 

Also from 2003 to 2005 he hit 38 HR's and 36 of those were against righties. The guy can't hit lefties. Face it and admit it. I'm not debating that he can sometimes hit righties, but he can't hit lefties to save his life.

 

He barely has 100 PA's against LHP in 3 years. That's what's called a self fulfilling prophecy. A guy gets labeled as someone who can't hit LHP(even though in Choi's case he hit them fine and never got a chance to prove it at the MLB level), and then sees so few of them after that he never gets a chance to show his abilities.

[fromthestretch]

2003 to 2005:

Lefties: .159/.317/.280/.597

Righties: .253/.357/.461/.818

 

Using your example of 2004:

Lefties: .167/.268/.278/.546

Righties: .261/.381/.469/.850

 

Also from 2003 to 2005 he hit 38 HR's and 36 of those were against righties. The guy can't hit lefties. Face it and admit it. I'm not debating that he can sometimes hit righties, but he can't hit lefties to save his life.

 

Don't suppose you care to post the number of plate appearances he was given against lefties? I'm sure that has nothing to do with the difference in home runs. Hard to hit lefties when you rarely, if ever, are given an opportunity to face them.

 

Even if he does have trouble with them, platoon him. Start him against right-handers and use him off the bench to pinch hit against righties. You can do that and get him 400+ at-bats easily.

 

I'm not saying that the Cubs should do this. When Lee is back, they have a star player at that position. But there are teams that don't have someone locked into that position.

[CubfaninCA]

lol @ the "contrarian" label. seems i'm in agreement with almost everyone else in baseball, but nice try.

 

just recently i've changed my opinion on pierre & rusch. some people called it, so what, i'm wrong.

 

Holy dear lord, you've changed your opinion. It's magic, I say, magic.

 

Nice try, my foot. You are a contrarian, CubsfaninCA, and you regularly skirt the line of trollish behavior pretty regularly. You've been a dropping into threads in such a fashion almost since you joined the board.

 

I'm all for different opinions and I like a good debate. I don't like when people reiterate the same opinions time again without sufficient support for the argument. Additionally, it's pretty clear that "almost everyone else in baseball" doesn't mean much of anything since we don't have access to their thoughts. I would add the argument, too, that it's pretty clear that there are a lot of baseball clubs that really don't know how to maximize their winning potential.

 

The Cubs are, and have been, a great example of how not to assemble a baseball team.

 

that's really rich.

 

when the information doesn't back one's opinion go personal.

 

take the next lecture to pm.

[soccer10k]

2003 to 2005:

Lefties: .159/.317/.280/.597

Righties: .253/.357/.461/.818

 

Using your example of 2004:

Lefties: .167/.268/.278/.546

Righties: .261/.381/.469/.850

 

Also from 2003 to 2005 he hit 38 HR's and 36 of those were against righties. The guy can't hit lefties. Face it and admit it. I'm not debating that he can sometimes hit righties, but he can't hit lefties to save his life.

 

He barely has 100 PA's against LHP in 3 years. That's what's called a self fulfilling prophecy. A guy gets labeled as someone who can't hit LHP(even though in Choi's case he hit them fine and never got a chance to prove it at the MLB level), and then sees so few of them after that he never gets a chance to show his abilities.

 

And does it ever occur to you that there may be a reason for that? There is a big difference between minor league pitchers and major league pitchers. You and brinoch can spout out all of the minor league stats you want, but the fact remains that at the major league level, Choi has not been able to hit left handed pitching. He just can't. He's like Jacque Jones. Both would be good platoon players but neither should be everyday players.

[goonys evil twin]

2003 to 2005:

Lefties: .159/.317/.280/.597

Righties: .253/.357/.461/.818

 

Using your example of 2004:

Lefties: .167/.268/.278/.546

Righties: .261/.381/.469/.850

 

Also from 2003 to 2005 he hit 38 HR's and 36 of those were against righties. The guy can't hit lefties. Face it and admit it. I'm not debating that he can sometimes hit righties, but he can't hit lefties to save his life.

 

He barely has 100 PA's against LHP in 3 years. That's what's called a self fulfilling prophecy. A guy gets labeled as someone who can't hit LHP(even though in Choi's case he hit them fine and never got a chance to prove it at the MLB level), and then sees so few of them after that he never gets a chance to show his abilities.

 

Wow, I didn't know he still had that few chances against LHP. It amazes me how unimaginitive baseball people can be. They hear something about a player once and it sticks with him for his career.

[soccer10k]

2003 to 2005:

Lefties: .159/.317/.280/.597

Righties: .253/.357/.461/.818

 

Using your example of 2004:

Lefties: .167/.268/.278/.546

Righties: .261/.381/.469/.850

 

Also from 2003 to 2005 he hit 38 HR's and 36 of those were against righties. The guy can't hit lefties. Face it and admit it. I'm not debating that he can sometimes hit righties, but he can't hit lefties to save his life.

 

Don't suppose you care to post the number of plate appearances he was given against lefties? I'm sure that has nothing to do with the difference in home runs. Hard to hit lefties when you rarely, if ever, are given an opportunity to face them.

 

Even if he does have trouble with them, platoon him. Start him against right-handers and use him off the bench to pinch hit against righties. You can do that and get him 400+ at-bats easily.

 

I'm not saying that the Cubs should do this. When Lee is back, they have a star player at that position. But there are teams that don't have someone locked into that position.

 

Have you read everything I've written? I said the exact same thing. I'm not debating whether or not he's a decent hitter against right handed pitching. I even suggested to platoon him. But he shouldn't face lefties all the time. He just shouldn't.

[fromthestretch]

Have you read everything I've written? I said the exact same thing. I'm not debating whether or not he's a decent hitter against right handed pitching. I even suggested to platoon him. But he shouldn't face lefties all the time. He just shouldn't.

 

Yes, and I'm obviously not arguing that point.

 

However, I fail to see where anyone said he should face lefties all the time.

 

Considering he bats left-handed and a majority of pitchers are right-handed, I'd consider a straight platoon regular playing time for him.

 

That being said, I don't think there's substantial proof that he's as bad against lefties as you make him out to be.

[brinoch]

2003 to 2005:

Lefties: .159/.317/.280/.597

Righties: .253/.357/.461/.818

 

Using your example of 2004:

Lefties: .167/.268/.278/.546

Righties: .261/.381/.469/.850

 

Also from 2003 to 2005 he hit 38 HR's and 36 of those were against righties. The guy can't hit lefties. Face it and admit it. I'm not debating that he can sometimes hit righties, but he can't hit lefties to save his life.

 

AB's against lefties:

 

2003: 17 AB

2004: 36 AB

2005: 29 AB

 

82 AB's total vs. lefties

783 AB's total vs. righties

 

Wow. He just can't hit lefties. It's been proven. In three years, with 82 AB's, he did squat.

 

Hmm... let's do some numbers here on those HR's. 36 HR's in 783 AB's... is 1 HR every 21.75 AB's. 2 HR's in 82 AB's... that's 1 HR every 41 AB's. That's the worst split ever. Okay, not really. It's not even all that surprising. Of course, given the size of, dare I say it, the sample, I find it hard to draw any such conclusion that Choi cannot hit lefties. Indeed, I surmise that if the Cubs had not acquired Karros in 2003, Choi would have had a greater chance against lefties and perhaps, as his minor league career indicated, he would have hit just fine against them.

[CubfaninCA]

Didn't he play regularly with the Cubs before he got his concussion? I don't remember him doing anything for us. Choi is just as bad, if not worse, as Jacque is against left handed pitchers. I think it's unanimous on this board that Jacque should have a platoon partner. So why should Choi get the chance to play when he can't hit lefties? He doesn't deserve it.

 

Your eyes and your memory have misled you. Choi had an OBP of .389 and an SLG of .496 (OPS of .885) when he was injured.

 

But he still can't hit lefties. He never has been able to. That's a fact. And the key is those were his stats BEFORE he was injured. What has he done since then. You can state your case based on that but he's not that same player.

 

I could make the argument that Sammy was still hitting well before he got beaned in the head and that should warrant a contract. But Sammy changed after that, teams know that, and that's why he isn't playing this year. Choi never could hit lefties, and after he suffered the concussion, he changed. And that right there is reason enough that Choi shouldn't play everyday.

 

The guy at best is a platoon player.

 

Really? Wow, he sucked as a Marlin in 2004. Only had a .388 OBP and a .495 SLG (.883 OPS). That's just awful, I say. Definitely took a dip to Neifi-esque suckitude with a .331 OBP and a .453 SLG (.789 OPS) as a Dodger in 2005.

 

In the minors, Choi faced lefties everyday and wasn't platooned. He did fine against them. TT, post the numbers.

 

2003 to 2005:

Lefties: .159/.317/.280/.597

Righties: .253/.357/.461/.818

 

Using your example of 2004:

Lefties: .167/.268/.278/.546

Righties: .261/.381/.469/.850

 

Also from 2003 to 2005 he hit 38 HR's and 36 of those were against righties. The guy can't hit lefties. Face it and admit it. I'm not debating that he can sometimes hit righties, but he can't hit lefties to save his life.

 

34 k's in 82 abs. but what does jim tracy know.

[brinoch]

lol @ the "contrarian" label. seems i'm in agreement with almost everyone else in baseball, but nice try.

 

just recently i've changed my opinion on pierre & rusch. some people called it, so what, i'm wrong.

 

Holy dear lord, you've changed your opinion. It's magic, I say, magic.

 

Nice try, my foot. You are a contrarian, CubsfaninCA, and you regularly skirt the line of trollish behavior pretty regularly. You've been a dropping into threads in such a fashion almost since you joined the board.

 

I'm all for different opinions and I like a good debate. I don't like when people reiterate the same opinions time again without sufficient support for the argument. Additionally, it's pretty clear that "almost everyone else in baseball" doesn't mean much of anything since we don't have access to their thoughts. I would add the argument, too, that it's pretty clear that there are a lot of baseball clubs that really don't know how to maximize their winning potential.

 

The Cubs are, and have been, a great example of how not to assemble a baseball team.

 

that's really rich.

 

when the information doesn't back one's opinion go personal.

 

take the next lecture to pm.

 

Keep dodging, ducking, dipping, diving and dodging. You may not like it, but you are contrarian. It's not personal and it's not an attack. You take pride in fighting the conventional wisdom of the board. You like pointing out how stats can't do this, and stats can't do that, and how your eyes told you that Choi sucked as a Dodger.

 

Oh, and by the way, since you never read the last PM I sent you, why would I bother sending you any more?

 

If you don't like what I have to say, in what forum I say it, how I behave as a Mod, how and when I moderate, or if you have a problem with me personally, please feel free to contact Tim or 1908.