Your Realistic RF for 2006 will be:

[professahesse]

I say keep CPAT. CPAT is just as likely to hit .275+ next year as Cedeno, or even Murton for that matter, and we're most of us willing to let both of them start and get 500+ ABs next year. I get this feeling CPAT is going to rebound fairly well this year. Bat him 7th or 8th. With a team of Pierre, CPAT, Cedeno, Murton? and Lee we've got quite a bit of speed. And I think both Cedeno and Murton WILL hit .275+ next year too so they won't hurt us.

 

Pierre

Walker

Lee

Ramirez

Murton

Barret

Cedeno

CPAT

 

Cedono, CPAT, pitcher and Pierre. Thats a pretty fast run scoring 4 ABs. Think about it.

[goonys evil twin]

I say keep CPAT. CPAT is just as likely to hit .275+ next year as Cedeno, or even Murton for that matter, and we're most of us willing to let both of them start and get 500+ ABs next year. I get this feeling CPAT is going to rebound fairly well this year. Bat him 7th or 8th. With a team of Pierre, CPAT, Cedeno, Murton? and Lee we've got quite a bit of speed. And I think both Cedeno and Murton WILL hit .275+ next year too so they won't hurt us.

 

Pierre

Walker

Lee

Ramirez

Murton

Barret

Cedeno

CPAT

 

Cedono, CPAT, pitcher and Pierre. Thats a pretty fast run scoring 4 ABs. Think about it.

 

Murton has a good chance to produce enough to justify his spot in LF. Cedeno has a good chance to produce enough to justifty his position at SS. Corey has almost no chance to produce enough to justify his spot in RF. I'm fine with keeping Corey, as a 4th OF (giving Murton and Pierre the occasional day off). But the lineup you listed is so incredibly weak and completely unjustified given a $100 million payroll.

[YearofDaCubs]

I think it's ridiculous we still do not have a RF and the options right now are terrible. Sorry, but Hendry looks to be doing enough just to get by.

[frostwyrm]

He could be ordered to platoon him at worst. And when neifi gets hurt (it has to happen, the dude's too small) Cedeno will take over and post large numbers.

 

 

Too small? Neifi's built like a brick s$&% house. He has to be from haulin that gargantuan cranium about.

 

Neifi's body is weird. He has a fat belly, a big ass, and toothpick legs.

[Magnetic Curses]

He could be ordered to platoon him at worst. And when neifi gets hurt (it has to happen, the dude's too small) Cedeno will take over and post large numbers.

 

 

Too small? Neifi's built like a brick s$&% house. He has to be from haulin that gargantuan cranium about.

 

Neifi's body is weird. He has a fat belly, a big ass, and toothpick legs.

 

babe perez?

[CuseCubFan69]

I think the Cubs should just let the grass grow in right field and hope no one thinks to put a player out there.

[jmajew]

I say keep CPAT. CPAT is just as likely to hit .275+ next year as Cedeno, or even Murton for that matter, and we're most of us willing to let both of them start and get 500+ ABs next year. I get this feeling CPAT is going to rebound fairly well this year. Bat him 7th or 8th. With a team of Pierre, CPAT, Cedeno, Murton? and Lee we've got quite a bit of speed. And I think both Cedeno and Murton WILL hit .275+ next year too so they won't hurt us.

 

Pierre

Walker

Lee

Ramirez

Murton

Barret

Cedeno

CPAT

 

Cedono, CPAT, pitcher and Pierre. Thats a pretty fast run scoring 4 ABs. Think about it.

 

Murton has a good chance to produce enough to justify his spot in LF. Cedeno has a good chance to produce enough to justifty his position at SS. Corey has almost no chance to produce enough to justify his spot in RF. I'm fine with keeping Corey, as a 4th OF (giving Murton and Pierre the occasional day off). But the lineup you listed is so incredibly weak and completely unjustified given a $100 million payroll.

 

I don't think any other availbe Free Agents justify a spot in RF either. Of all the players left for RF I feel Patterson has the most potential. None of those other guys will put us over the top, but if Patterson somehow reverts back to his 2003 form he could put us over the top, and if he goes back to his 2004 form he is just as good any of the other guys we could sign. I'd prefer us to trade for a big bat but at this rate it seems like Hendry is just going to sign one of Jones, Encarnacion, or Sanders. Those guys just don't do it for me.

[Gunned]

I say keep CPAT. CPAT is just as likely to hit .275+ next year as Cedeno, or even Murton for that matter, and we're most of us willing to let both of them start and get 500+ ABs next year. I get this feeling CPAT is going to rebound fairly well this year. Bat him 7th or 8th. With a team of Pierre, CPAT, Cedeno, Murton? and Lee we've got quite a bit of speed. And I think both Cedeno and Murton WILL hit .275+ next year too so they won't hurt us.

 

Pierre

Walker

Lee

Ramirez

Murton

Barret

Cedeno

CPAT

 

Cedono, CPAT, pitcher and Pierre. Thats a pretty fast run scoring 4 ABs. Think about it.

 

Murton has a good chance to produce enough to justify his spot in LF. Cedeno has a good chance to produce enough to justifty his position at SS. Corey has almost no chance to produce enough to justify his spot in RF. I'm fine with keeping Corey, as a 4th OF (giving Murton and Pierre the occasional day off). But the lineup you listed is so incredibly weak and completely unjustified given a $100 million payroll.

 

I don't think any other availbe Free Agents justify a spot in RF either. Of all the players left for RF I feel Patterson has the most potential. None of those other guys will put us over the top, but if Patterson somehow reverts back to his 2003 form he could put us over the top, and if he goes back to his 2004 form he is just as good any of the other guys we could sign. I'd prefer us to trade for a big bat but at this rate it seems like Hendry is just going to sign one of Jones, Encarnacion, or Sanders. Those guys just don't do it for me.

 

But at least none of those guys have ever put up a cosmically, historically bad season like Patterson did in '05.

[Coach.]

I know the numbers and logic currently don't support it, but I have a feeling that should Austin Kearns be our starting RF, he would blossom into a stud player Cub fans would adore for years.

[jmajew]

I say keep CPAT. CPAT is just as likely to hit .275+ next year as Cedeno, or even Murton for that matter, and we're most of us willing to let both of them start and get 500+ ABs next year. I get this feeling CPAT is going to rebound fairly well this year. Bat him 7th or 8th. With a team of Pierre, CPAT, Cedeno, Murton? and Lee we've got quite a bit of speed. And I think both Cedeno and Murton WILL hit .275+ next year too so they won't hurt us.

 

Pierre

Walker

Lee

Ramirez

Murton

Barret

Cedeno

CPAT

 

Cedono, CPAT, pitcher and Pierre. Thats a pretty fast run scoring 4 ABs. Think about it.

 

Murton has a good chance to produce enough to justify his spot in LF. Cedeno has a good chance to produce enough to justifty his position at SS. Corey has almost no chance to produce enough to justify his spot in RF. I'm fine with keeping Corey, as a 4th OF (giving Murton and Pierre the occasional day off). But the lineup you listed is so incredibly weak and completely unjustified given a $100 million payroll.

 

I don't think any other availbe Free Agents justify a spot in RF either. Of all the players left for RF I feel Patterson has the most potential. None of those other guys will put us over the top, but if Patterson somehow reverts back to his 2003 form he could put us over the top, and if he goes back to his 2004 form he is just as good any of the other guys we could sign. I'd prefer us to trade for a big bat but at this rate it seems like Hendry is just going to sign one of Jones, Encarnacion, or Sanders. Those guys just don't do it for me.

 

But at least none of those guys have ever put up a cosmically, historically bad season like Patterson did in '05.

 

Yeah Corey had a bad year, but he still has more potential then the rest of the FAs available. One bad season doesn't ruin a career.

[Uncle Jim]

This angle may have been suggested...

 

Fast forward 2 months...after several months of trying to trade for a right fielder the Cubs have settled on Corey Patterson. Jim Hendry will be quoted as saying, "We are pleased to see the progress that Corey has made this offseason and besides we want to keep some available millions for our inevitable trading deadline deal." :lol:

 

Go Cubs!!!

[JeffH]

But at least none of those guys have ever put up a cosmically, historically bad season like Patterson did in '05.

 

You put an extra 's' in there by mistake.

[CardinalKiller]

What about Ben Grieve??? Give him the AB's and over time he will have a .280 BA 20 to 25 HR's and 85 to 100 RBI's.

 

I'd much rather have him in RF than Patterson.

[Gunned]

I say keep CPAT. CPAT is just as likely to hit .275+ next year as Cedeno, or even Murton for that matter, and we're most of us willing to let both of them start and get 500+ ABs next year. I get this feeling CPAT is going to rebound fairly well this year. Bat him 7th or 8th. With a team of Pierre, CPAT, Cedeno, Murton? and Lee we've got quite a bit of speed. And I think both Cedeno and Murton WILL hit .275+ next year too so they won't hurt us.

 

Pierre

Walker

Lee

Ramirez

Murton

Barret

Cedeno

CPAT

 

Cedono, CPAT, pitcher and Pierre. Thats a pretty fast run scoring 4 ABs. Think about it.

 

Murton has a good chance to produce enough to justify his spot in LF. Cedeno has a good chance to produce enough to justifty his position at SS. Corey has almost no chance to produce enough to justify his spot in RF. I'm fine with keeping Corey, as a 4th OF (giving Murton and Pierre the occasional day off). But the lineup you listed is so incredibly weak and completely unjustified given a $100 million payroll.

 

I don't think any other availbe Free Agents justify a spot in RF either. Of all the players left for RF I feel Patterson has the most potential. None of those other guys will put us over the top, but if Patterson somehow reverts back to his 2003 form he could put us over the top, and if he goes back to his 2004 form he is just as good any of the other guys we could sign. I'd prefer us to trade for a big bat but at this rate it seems like Hendry is just going to sign one of Jones, Encarnacion, or Sanders. Those guys just don't do it for me.

 

But at least none of those guys have ever put up a cosmically, historically bad season like Patterson did in '05.

 

Yeah Corey had a bad year, but he still has more potential then the rest of the FAs available. One bad season doesn't ruin a career.

 

Potential? What potential? He had the worst season of any Cub in the last 44 years. Do you know how many bad baseball players have been on the Cubs during that time?

 

By potential, do you mean that he runs fast? Because that's really about it. He doesn't know the strike zone, he hasn't learned to bunt, his power is spotty, he misjudges fly balls in the outfield and he struggles to make contact.

 

He's a bad baseball player. That's all there is to it. Yet because of "potential" and "upside," fans get jaded into thinking he can actually produce. It's the same reason that NBA teams take high school projects over established college stars -- they like the excitement and mystery of upside.

[Backtobanks]

I've heard all the rumors that Patterson won't take instruction, but I wonder if Walt Hriniak could get through to him. It might be worth a few bucks spent by the Cubs to check it out. Even the Patterson haters have to admit that there is that "potential" that would be amazing if it ever came to be.

[vance_the_cubs_fan]

Right now there are no decent options for RF.

 

If the Cubs can get Tejada and keep Walker, they may be able to gamble in RF with a reclamation guy like Richard Hidalgo or someone like that.

 

What's even worse, if Hendry trades Walker without bringing in a quality bat for right, we could end up with Cedeno, Neifi, and a sub-standard bat for a RF all in the same line-up. That is what really, really concerns me at this point.

 

No player available is certain to produce. Are there some that could produce well enough? Certainly. The probabilities just are too good.

[jmajew]

I say keep CPAT. CPAT is just as likely to hit .275+ next year as Cedeno, or even Murton for that matter, and we're most of us willing to let both of them start and get 500+ ABs next year. I get this feeling CPAT is going to rebound fairly well this year. Bat him 7th or 8th. With a team of Pierre, CPAT, Cedeno, Murton? and Lee we've got quite a bit of speed. And I think both Cedeno and Murton WILL hit .275+ next year too so they won't hurt us.

 

Pierre

Walker

Lee

Ramirez

Murton

Barret

Cedeno

CPAT

 

Cedono, CPAT, pitcher and Pierre. Thats a pretty fast run scoring 4 ABs. Think about it.

 

Murton has a good chance to produce enough to justify his spot in LF. Cedeno has a good chance to produce enough to justifty his position at SS. Corey has almost no chance to produce enough to justify his spot in RF. I'm fine with keeping Corey, as a 4th OF (giving Murton and Pierre the occasional day off). But the lineup you listed is so incredibly weak and completely unjustified given a $100 million payroll.

 

I don't think any other availbe Free Agents justify a spot in RF either. Of all the players left for RF I feel Patterson has the most potential. None of those other guys will put us over the top, but if Patterson somehow reverts back to his 2003 form he could put us over the top, and if he goes back to his 2004 form he is just as good any of the other guys we could sign. I'd prefer us to trade for a big bat but at this rate it seems like Hendry is just going to sign one of Jones, Encarnacion, or Sanders. Those guys just don't do it for me.

 

But at least none of those guys have ever put up a cosmically, historically bad season like Patterson did in '05.

 

Yeah Corey had a bad year, but he still has more potential then the rest of the FAs available. One bad season doesn't ruin a career.

 

Potential? What potential? He had the worst season of any Cub in the last 44 years. Do you know how many bad baseball players have been on the Cubs during that time?

 

By potential, do you mean that he runs fast? Because that's really about it. He doesn't know the strike zone, he hasn't learned to bunt, his power is spotty, he misjudges fly balls in the outfield and he struggles to make contact.

 

He's a bad baseball player. That's all there is to it. Yet because of "potential" and "upside," fans get jaded into thinking he can actually produce. It's the same reason that NBA teams take high school projects over established college stars -- they like the excitement and mystery of upside.

 

I've said this numerous times in this thread I believe. None of the guys who are Free Agents will put us over the top. Which means I really so no reason to sign them. If Patterson somehow figures it out and produces like he did in 2003 we will have a chance to make the playoffs. I'd rather take the risk of Patterson figures out how to lay of high fastballs than sign a mediocore player at best to play RF for 7 million bucks a year.

 

If the Cubs invest 7 mil a year on Jones you know for a fact that they will not try to trade for a new RF during the season. If they have Patterson out there and he struggles they will be willing to trade for a Difference maker to play in Right. During the season it is very possible that players like Floyd, Abreu, JD Drew, Pat Burrell, Adam Dunn, or Geoff Jenkins could become available.

[Elrhino]

I've heard all the rumors that Patterson won't take instruction, but I wonder if Walt Hriniak could get through to him. It might be worth a few bucks spent by the Cubs to check it out. Even the Patterson haters have to admit that there is that "potential" that would be amazing if it ever came to be.

 

Corey can take the all the instruction in the world, it still wont change the fact that he's just not a natural baseball player. He's the classic toolsy athletic player who doesn't have any natural feel for the game. There have been thousands of these guys that have gone through the MLB through the years, and there will be thousands more. The only difference is that instead of calling them the next Odibe McDowell, we'll call them the next Corey Patterson.

 

And this wasn't just one bad year, he's had these problems since day 1. He's always been a highly rated prospect more due to his tools than his production, dating all the way back to the minors. They are the epitome of what the Sabermetrics disciples are supposed disciplined and objective enough to discern, yet somehow when its your prospect on your team people even the most skeptical get star-struck by what could be. Let's face it, I don't care how atheltically gifted he is, if Hendry were to trade even the most throwaway pieces for a player on another team with Corey's numbers and salary and gave him a spot on the roster (much less dibs on the corner outfield spot) we would all be flipping out. The server would blow into tiny smithereens. Its because he came through the Cubs minor leagues and we've been tracking him for the last 5 years and reading all of his articles and dreaming about what could be that we have invested too much in him emotionally to face reality. With this many AB's in this bad of numbers ... if Corey were to turn his career around it would be the anamoly of all anamolies.

[don_kessinger_was_good]

Blow the whole thing up for prospects. Cubs suck. We are doomed. Backpedalling for three straight years. Lovely.

[jmajew]

Blow the whole thing up for prospects. Cubs suck. We are doomed. Backpedalling for three straight years. Lovely.

 

I hope that is sarcasm....

 

If I were the Cubs i'd just play the rookies, Cedeno, Pie, and Murton. If they put up the numbers Bill Jame projected i think we have a very good chance of making the playoffs. If not by 2007 they should all be ready for a big years.

 

I got this from Gammons...Cubs CF Felix Pie to hit 21 HR and an .874 OPS; Cubs INF Ronnie Cedeno .310 with an .800 OPS; Murton .318 with an .859 OPS.

[BigbadB]

Blow the whole thing up for prospects. Cubs suck. We are doomed. Backpedalling for three straight years. Lovely.

 

I hope that is sarcasm....

 

If I were the Cubs i'd just play the rookies, Cedeno, Pie, and Murton. If they put up the numbers Bill Jame projected i think we have a very good chance of making the playoffs. If not by 2007 they should all be ready for a big years.

 

I got this from Gammons...Cubs CF Felix Pie to hit 21 HR and an .874 OPS; Cubs INF Ronnie Cedeno .310 with an .800 OPS; Murton .318 with an .859 OPS.

 

I'm going to take a wild stab and say Gammons has probably never seen Pie play.

 

If Pie has an .874 OPS, I'll assume that he will have to hit somewhere between .330-.350 to have that high of an OPS considering he has a walk rate that hovers right around where Corey's is, and he has yet to develop the power Corey had in 2003 when Corey's OPS was .840.

 

Basically 3 rookies that will all hit .310 or better? I want some of what he's smoking.

[jmajew]

Blow the whole thing up for prospects. Cubs suck. We are doomed. Backpedalling for three straight years. Lovely.

 

I hope that is sarcasm....

 

If I were the Cubs i'd just play the rookies, Cedeno, Pie, and Murton. If they put up the numbers Bill Jame projected i think we have a very good chance of making the playoffs. If not by 2007 they should all be ready for a big years.

 

I got this from Gammons...Cubs CF Felix Pie to hit 21 HR and an .874 OPS; Cubs INF Ronnie Cedeno .310 with an .800 OPS; Murton .318 with an .859 OPS.

 

I'm going to take a wild stab and say Gammons has probably never seen Pie play.

 

If Pie has an .874 OPS, I'll assume that he will have to hit somewhere between .330-.350 to have that high of an OPS considering he has a walk rate that hovers right around where Corey's is, and he has yet to develop the power Corey had in 2003 when Corey's OPS was .840.

 

Basically 3 rookies that will all hit .310 or better? I want some of what he's smoking.

 

Those were Bill James's projections...I just got them from off an old Gammons article.

[professahesse]

I've heard all the rumors that Patterson won't take instruction, but I wonder if Walt Hriniak could get through to him. It might be worth a few bucks spent by the Cubs to check it out. Even the Patterson haters have to admit that there is that "potential" that would be amazing if it ever came to be.

 

Corey can take the all the instruction in the world, it still wont change the fact that he's just not a natural baseball player. He's the classic toolsy athletic player who doesn't have any natural feel for the game. There have been thousands of these guys that have gone through the MLB through the years, and there will be thousands more. The only difference is that instead of calling them the next Odibe McDowell, we'll call them the next Corey Patterson.

 

And this wasn't just one bad year, he's had these problems since day 1. He's always been a highly rated prospect more due to his tools than his production, dating all the way back to the minors. They are the epitome of what the Sabermetrics disciples are supposed disciplined and objective enough to discern, yet somehow when its your prospect on your team people even the most skeptical get star-struck by what could be. Let's face it, I don't care how atheltically gifted he is, if Hendry were to trade even the most throwaway pieces for a player on another team with Corey's numbers and salary and gave him a spot on the roster (much less dibs on the corner outfield spot) we would all be flipping out. The server would blow into tiny smithereens. Its because he came through the Cubs minor leagues and we've been tracking him for the last 5 years and reading all of his articles and dreaming about what could be that we have invested too much in him emotionally to face reality. With this many AB's in this bad of numbers ... if Corey were to turn his career around it would be the anamoly of all anamolies.

 

You don't KNOW that Patterson won't produce next year. I'm not saying he is Lou Brock. All I'm saying is he DOES HAVE potential. And if he hits .270+ (or even .250 for that matter), hits 20+ HRs and has 60-75 RBIs and 25+SBs he'll likely equal or out produce all the RFs left out there except Abreu or Manny. YOU are the one who is looking through your own pre-conceived notions about Patterson, NOT ME.

[imb]

Blow the whole thing up for prospects. Cubs suck. We are doomed. Backpedalling for three straight years. Lovely.

 

I hope that is sarcasm....

 

If I were the Cubs i'd just play the rookies, Cedeno, Pie, and Murton. If they put up the numbers Bill Jame projected i think we have a very good chance of making the playoffs. If not by 2007 they should all be ready for a big years.

 

I got this from Gammons...Cubs CF Felix Pie to hit 21 HR and an .874 OPS; Cubs INF Ronnie Cedeno .310 with an .800 OPS; Murton .318 with an .859 OPS.

 

I'm going to take a wild stab and say Gammons has probably never seen Pie play.

 

If Pie has an .874 OPS, I'll assume that he will have to hit somewhere between .330-.350 to have that high of an OPS considering he has a walk rate that hovers right around where Corey's is, and he has yet to develop the power Corey had in 2003 when Corey's OPS was .840.

 

Basically 3 rookies that will all hit .310 or better? I want some of what he's smoking.

 

Yeah, there is no way Cedeno has an 800 ops. Is he really going to slug over .450 ihis first year n the majors? He'll be lucky to do that, like, ever.

[MeatampPotatoesMan]

Blow the whole thing up for prospects. Cubs suck. We are doomed. Backpedalling for three straight years. Lovely.

 

I hope that is sarcasm....

 

If I were the Cubs i'd just play the rookies, Cedeno, Pie, and Murton. If they put up the numbers Bill Jame projected i think we have a very good chance of making the playoffs. If not by 2007 they should all be ready for a big years.

 

I got this from Gammons...Cubs CF Felix Pie to hit 21 HR and an .874 OPS; Cubs INF Ronnie Cedeno .310 with an .800 OPS; Murton .318 with an .859 OPS.

 

I'm going to take a wild stab and say Gammons has probably never seen Pie play.

 

If Pie has an .874 OPS, I'll assume that he will have to hit somewhere between .330-.350 to have that high of an OPS considering he has a walk rate that hovers right around where Corey's is, and he has yet to develop the power Corey had in 2003 when Corey's OPS was .840.

 

Basically 3 rookies that will all hit .310 or better? I want some of what he's smoking.

 

Yeah, there is no way Cedeno has an 800 ops. Is he really going to slug over .450 ihis first year n the majors? He'll be lucky to do that, like, ever.

 

to put this in perspective, Rafael Furcal, the guy we were jumping to pay 9M+/year for 5 years has never put up an 800+ OPS in a full season. that includes rookie ball to the present day.