A strong endorsement of Pierre by . .

[UK1679666180]

Proctor is a soon to be 29yo very poor man's version of Farnsworth as far as stuff. Proctor has a straight mid 90s FB and a below avg. slider.

 

Henn (24 yo) projects as a 4-5 starter as a LH'er, low 90s FB, decent slider, and needs to improve his change. Doesn't have the deception that most LH'ers have.

[Magnetic Curses]

i think replacing corey makes the most sense because CF is the most glaring OBP hole in the lineup, even burnitz's .320-something is an improvement compared to corey's sub .300.

 

Corey himself could easily make up a huge chunk of that improved OBP. He was at .329 and .320 the two years prior to 2005. Making upgrades from 2005 to 2006 is more than just trying to get better numbers than what you got in 2005. Making changes has to be about getting better numbers than what you can expect from the guys you already have in 2006.

 

I don't think Corey will have a .254 OPB in 2006. I would not be at all surprised to see him with a career high .330 in 2006. Not that I expect him to be that high, or that I wouldn't trade him for Bradley, but keeping Corey should not be forgotten as an option.

 

if we're keeping corey in center, it better mean that we have dunn and furcal.

[The Voice of Reason]

Terence Moore of the AJC and Jack McKeon.

 

Evidently Pierre's "weak arm" doesn't bother two people who've seen him play a lot of ball. I say get him - especially if the Furcal deal falls thru.

 

Pursuing Pierre would behoove Braves|

 

By Terence Moore Wednesday November 30, 2005

The Atlanta Journal-Constitution

 

Juan Pierre. He’s exceptional. He’s available. He’s exactly what the Braves need to push their consecutive streak of division titles to 15. Not only that, he’s capable of doing enough with his bat, glove, legs and heart to end their annoying habit of vanishing each October.

 

(Edited by moderator for copyrighted content--posting of entire article is prohibited)

 

Sorry, it was a blog not really an article.

 

 

Yes, Pierre slumped to .276 last season, but that still was just eight points lower than Furcal’s batting average during what was considered a superlative year for the Braves’ catalyst. And Pierre’s lifetime mark is .305 as the leadoff guy. He steals bases, and he rarely is caught (267 out of 363 attempts). He makes contact more often than not (never more than 52 strikeouts in a season).

 

Since Pierre’s first full year in the majors with the Colorado Rockies in 2001, he hasn’t played less than 152 games in a season. He has spent each of his three seasons with the Marlins playing every game, including every inning during the 2004 season.

 

“In all of the decades I’ve been in the game, I’ve only had two workaholics — Tony Gwynn and Juan Pierre,” said McKeon, still employed by the Marlins.

 

It.'s hard to call Furcal's 2005 "superlative" considering his very poor (.254/.310) first half, in which he was fighting an injury. In the second half, Furcal put up a .322/.394/.474 line. Saying Pierre is rarely caught is just flat out wrong, and Furcal's success rate is considerably higher. And AVG isn't the issue, OBP is.

 

Whoever wrote that was really fluffing Pierre.

rarely caught. interesting. 73.5% is not a good percentage and actually has a negative effect on his team's ability to score runs. it makes pierre a poor baserunner, despite his speed. we don't need another poor baserunning, non-walking, slap-hitting leadoff hitter.

 

and the idea of jacque jones makes me want to puke.

 

Disagree. Percentage caught can be misleading i.,e., maybe he was just following McKeon's ill-timed orders, pitchouts, unlucky with high % of fastballs, etc.

 

Bottom line -It would be nice for once to have a Cub with speed who could steal a lot of bases considering the last time a Cub led the league in stolen bases was when Stan Hack did it 1939 with all of 17. Also, just maybe his work ethic would rub off on one Aramis Ramirez.

[fromthestretch]

Disagree. Percentage caught can be misleading i.,e., maybe he was just following McKeon's ill-timed orders, pitchouts, unlucky with high % of fastballs, etc.

 

Bottom line -It would be nice for once to have a Cub with speed who could steal a lot of bases considering the last time a Cub led the league in stolen bases was when Stan Hack did it 1939 with all of 17.

 

Eric Young stole 54 bases as the Cubs' leadoff hitter in 2000 and 31 the following year. Brian McRae stole 37 as the Cubs' leadoff hitter in 1996.

[Transmogrified Tiger]

Disagree. Percentage caught can be misleading i.,e., maybe he was just following McKeon's ill-timed orders, pitchouts, unlucky with high % of fastballs, etc.

 

Bottom line -It would be nice for once to have a Cub with speed who could steal a lot of bases considering the last time a Cub led the league in stolen bases was when Stan Hack did it 1939 with all of 17. Also, just maybe his work ethic would rub off on one Aramis Ramirez.

 

Considering that his SB% is over 363 attempts, I doubt it can be attributed to non-Pierre factors.

 

It would be nice to have a guy who steals bases, but I'd prefer that he do them at a rate that helps the team. And how do we know that Pierre has this fantastic work ethic?

[Magnetic Curses]

Disagree. Percentage caught can be misleading i.,e., maybe he was just following McKeon's ill-timed orders, pitchouts, unlucky with high % of fastballs, etc.

 

he's getting "unlucky" a disproportionate amount of time, most good baserunners don't get so "unlucky". and when does someone cross that line and cease being "unlucky" and start being a poor baserunner?

 

it would seem that pierre is consistently unlucky, and i don't want someone so eager to run himself into an out on my team.

[The Voice of Reason]

Disagree. Percentage caught can be misleading i.,e., maybe he was just following McKeon's ill-timed orders, pitchouts, unlucky with high % of fastballs, etc.

 

Bottom line -It would be nice for once to have a Cub with speed who could steal a lot of bases considering the last time a Cub led the league in stolen bases was when Stan Hack did it 1939 with all of 17. Also, just maybe his work ethic would rub off on one Aramis Ramirez.

 

Considering that his SB% is over 363 attempts, I doubt it can be attributed to non-Pierre factors.

 

It would be nice to have a guy who steals bases, but I'd prefer that he do them at a rate that helps the team. And how do we know that Pierre has this fantastic work ethic?[/quote]

 

 

 

"In all of the decades I’ve been in the game, I’ve only had two workaholics — Tony Gwynn and Juan Pierre,” Jack McKeon to the AJC 12/1/05

 

 

McKeon's known as a straight shooter, been managing forever and has a World Series ring. I'd say he's a pretty competent source.

 

There's a lot more to the game than just stats.

[Transmogrified Tiger]

Disagree. Percentage caught can be misleading i.,e., maybe he was just following McKeon's ill-timed orders, pitchouts, unlucky with high % of fastballs, etc.

 

Bottom line -It would be nice for once to have a Cub with speed who could steal a lot of bases considering the last time a Cub led the league in stolen bases was when Stan Hack did it 1939 with all of 17. Also, just maybe his work ethic would rub off on one Aramis Ramirez.

 

Considering that his SB% is over 363 attempts, I doubt it can be attributed to non-Pierre factors.

 

It would be nice to have a guy who steals bases, but I'd prefer that he do them at a rate that helps the team. And how do we know that Pierre has this fantastic work ethic?

 

 

 

"In all of the decades I’ve been in the game, I’ve only had two workaholics — Tony Gwynn and Juan Pierre,” Jack McKeon to the AJC 12/1/05

 

 

McKeon's known as a straight shooter, been managing forever and has a World Series ring. I'd say he's a pretty competent source.

 

There's a lot more to the game than just stats.

 

That's fine, I was wondering where the thought that Pierre was a hard worker came from.

 

And I never said that stats were all there is to the game. This seems to be a common refrain when people try and discredit the numbers used, then receive a rebuttal.

[Magnetic Curses]

That's fine, I was wondering where the thought that Pierre was a hard worker came from.

 

And I never said that stats were all there is to the game. This seems to be a common refrain when people try and discredit the numbers used, then receive a rebuttal.

 

i think it's an ironic thought, personally. as for so long nobody knew that there was more to the game than "conventional wisdom".

 

i think there are many who mourn the passing of certain mythologies, and i can understand the anger. i wasn't happy when i discovered that there was no santa claus, for instance.

 

in the world of scientific understanding, and baseball is as much a science as it is a sport, you must have clear, measurable variables and results. there may be more to the game than statistics, but looking at subjective variables is what muddles the water and causes expensive teams to go 79-83.

[The Voice of Reason]

That's fine, I was wondering where the thought that Pierre was a hard worker came from.

 

And I never said that stats were all there is to the game. This seems to be a common refrain when people try and discredit the numbers used, then receive a rebuttal.

 

i think it's an ironic thought, personally. as for so long nobody knew that there was more to the game than "conventional wisdom".

 

i think there are many who mourn the passing of certain mythologies, and i can understand the anger. i wasn't happy when i discovered that there was no santa claus, for instance.

 

in the world of scientific understanding, and baseball is as much a science as it is a sport, you must have clear, measurable variables and results. there may be more to the game than statistics, but looking at subjective variables is what muddles the water and causes expensive teams to go 79-83.

 

I think injuries, Sosa's ridiculous contract, bad execution and Dusty had a little to do with going 79 - 83 as well as "subjective variables."

 

 

The minute a statistician steps into the position of the executive who must make decisions and defend them, the statistician ceases to be a statistician. - W.E.Deming

 

 

There are lies, damned lies, and statistics! - B.Disraeli

 

It has long recognized by public men of all kinds ... that statistics come under the head of lying, and that no lie is so false or inconclusive as that which is based on statistics. - H.Belloc

 

Like dreams, statistics are a form of wish fulfillment. - J.Baudrillard

 

Where is the knowledge that is lost in information? Where is the wisdom that is lost in knowledge? - T.S.Eliot

 

 

There's no Santa Claus? :o :lol: