Walker's Nonstop Mouth

[Transmogrified Tiger]

That's not profanity; it's barnyard language.

 

Thanks for repating the standard reposne about clutch hitting; I've seen it before. Thanks for not pointing out the hits Walker has had that have put the Cubs ahead or won games for us. And for not addressing the Grudz thing.

 

Finally, when I think of Walker and his great numbers I think of a guy like Eckstein as the opposite. Who would you have rather had this year in your lineup and then let's see their respective hitting numbers. Again, Walker's are probably better. And if you say that you would rather have had Walker this year you are incredible or lying.

 

Whatever(about the language), just giving you a heads up.

 

Yeah, the standard response has basically been proven true. That's why I'm not going to waste time searching game logs to prove some meaningless point.

 

I also apologize for not taking your bait with regards to Grudz. If I say that I'd rather have Grudz, it somehow justifies your point that Walker is worthless. If I pick Walker, then I'm just a stat-hugging loony. But for the record, I'd probably take Walker, but they aren't incredibly far apart.

 

And yes, I'd rather have Walker than Eckstein, I prefer the most productive player.

 

What are your feelings on Scott Podsednik?

 

I don't think much of Podesednik. He hurt the Cubs his first year but he is basically a slap .270 hitter who seems to steal an awful lot of bases for a team that struggles to score. Not much of an arm in the outfield. Didn't belong on the All-Star team.

 

I love the reponse about game logs and my meaningless point. Baseball is a numbers game but not totally and metrics guys just can't accept that. Numbers give you some material, probably a lot of material. with which to analyze the game. But if you think that numbers give you everything you need you are way off. Why even play the game. Let's just turn baseball into a board game.

 

Do you think Walker has done more to help his team win than Eckstein has this year? And while I am asking maybe you can answer me this: does the best or better "metric" team win a championship every year. If not how do you explain that?

 

Yes, Walker has done more to help his team than Eckstein. There are several reasons why the best team statistically doesn't win it all. First of all, the differences in numbers between teams in the playoffs isn't that great, there's very rarely a clear cut team that SHOULD win it all. Also, the nature of the playoffs is a crapshoot. The best team won't always win in a short series, it's why the hottest team wins the majority of the time.

[brfahey]

That's not profanity; it's barnyard language.

 

Thanks for repating the standard reposne about clutch hitting; I've seen it before. Thanks for not pointing out the hits Walker has had that have put the Cubs ahead or won games for us. And for not addressing the Grudz thing.

 

Finally, when I think of Walker and his great numbers I think of a guy like Eckstein as the opposite. Who would you have rather had this year in your lineup and then let's see their respective hitting numbers. Again, Walker's are probably better. And if you say that you would rather have had Walker this year you are incredible or lying.

 

Whatever(about the language), just giving you a heads up.

 

Yeah, the standard response has basically been proven true. That's why I'm not going to waste time searching game logs to prove some meaningless point.

 

I also apologize for not taking your bait with regards to Grudz. If I say that I'd rather have Grudz, it somehow justifies your point that Walker is worthless. If I pick Walker, then I'm just a stat-hugging loony. But for the record, I'd probably take Walker, but they aren't incredibly far apart.

 

And yes, I'd rather have Walker than Eckstein, I prefer the most productive player.

 

What are your feelings on Scott Podsednik?

 

I don't think much of Podesednik. He hurt the Cubs his first year but he is basically a slap .270 hitter who seems to steal an awful lot of bases for a team that struggles to score. Not much of an arm in the outfield. Didn't belong on the All-Star team.

 

I love the reponse about game logs and my meaningless point. Baseball is a numbers game but not totally and metrics guys just can't accept that. Numbers give you some material, probably a lot of material. with which to analyze the game. But if you think that numbers give you everything you need you are way off. Why even play the game. Let's just turn baseball into a board game.

 

Do you think Walker has done more to help his team win than Eckstein has this year? And while I am asking maybe you can answer me this: does the best or better "metric" team win a championship every year. If not how do you explain that?

 

Yes, Walker has done more to help his team than Eckstein. There are several reasons why the best team statistically doesn't win it all. First of all, the differences in numbers between teams in the playoffs isn't that great, there's very rarely a clear cut team that SHOULD win it all. Also, the nature of the playoffs is a crapshoot. The best team won't always win in a short series, it's why the hottest team wins the majority of the time.

 

Forget about post-season. Does the best statistical team win its division all the time?

[vance_the_cubs_fan]

So, let me get this straight....

 

You don't like Walker because it doesn't seem like he gets any clutch hits, you believe his defense is sub-par, and he talks too much.

 

:roll:

 

Lots of baseball acumen there, let me tell ya.

 

And for the record...I'd take Walker over Grudzielanek every day of the week and twice on Sundays, and probably three times on Memorial Day and the Fourth of July.

[brfahey]

So, let me get this straight....

 

You don't like Walker because it doesn't seem like he gets any clutch hits, you believe his defense is sub-par, and he talks too much.

 

:roll:

 

Lots of baseball acumen there, let me tell ya.

 

And for the record...I'd take Walker over Grudzielanek every day of the week and twice on Sundays, and probably three times on Memorial Day and the Fourth of July.

 

I said seems and no one has pointed out all the games he's won with his bat. His defense is sub-par. Have you watched him try to turn double plays?

 

I will never figure you guys out. I am convinced you don't watch/understand much baseball. You pillory Perez all year and the guy, while admittedly streaky and too anxiuos at the plate, has played well all year. I think if you asked knowledgebale people who has had the better year -- based on watching the game, rather than based on reviewing box scores-- perez would be an overwhelming choice over walker. The point here is not to praise Perez-- he's far from great-- it's that stats-- at least in walker and perez's cases-- have blinded stats-livers to their actual contributions.

 

I know I am not going to change the metric minds but maybe you guys should start watching more and crunching numbers less. You might get an actual line on players that way.

[vance_the_cubs_fan]

And this thread is the perfect occasion for all to re-read this thread.

[rocket]

So, let me get this straight....

 

You don't like Walker because it doesn't seem like he gets any clutch hits, you believe his defense is sub-par, and he talks too much.

 

:roll:

 

Lots of baseball acumen there, let me tell ya.

 

And for the record...I'd take Walker over Grudzielanek every day of the week and twice on Sundays, and probably three times on Memorial Day and the Fourth of July.

 

I said seems and no one has pointed out all the games he's won with his bat. His defense is sub-par. Have you watched him try to turn double plays?

 

I will never figure you guys out. I am convinced you don't watch/understand much baseball. You pillory Perez all year and the guy, while admittedly streaky and too anxiuos at the plate, has played well all year. I think if you asked knowledgebale people who has had the better year -- based on watching the game, rather than based on reviewing box scores-- perez would be an overwhelming choice over walker. The point here is not to praise Perez-- he's far from great-- it's that stats-- at least in walker and perez's cases-- have blinded stats-livers to their actual contributions.

 

I know I am not going to change the metric minds but maybe you guys should start watching more and crunching numbers less. You might get an actual line on players that way.

 

agreed i trust your interpretation of the game instead of unbiased numbers.

 

and try not to act like a huge jerk in your posts. actually, keep it up so you can get banned.

[J.R.]

"Metric Minds"

 

You're grouping posters, a major no-no here.

 

GOTCHA

[nilodnayr]

So, let me get this straight....

 

You don't like Walker because it doesn't seem like he gets any clutch hits, you believe his defense is sub-par, and he talks too much.

 

:roll:

 

Lots of baseball acumen there, let me tell ya.

 

And for the record...I'd take Walker over Grudzielanek every day of the week and twice on Sundays, and probably three times on Memorial Day and the Fourth of July.

 

I said seems and no one has pointed out all the games he's won with his bat. His defense is sub-par. Have you watched him try to turn double plays?

 

I will never figure you guys out. I am convinced you don't watch/understand much baseball. You pillory Perez all year and the guy, while admittedly streaky and too anxiuos at the plate, has played well all year. I think if you asked knowledgebale people who has had the better year -- based on watching the game, rather than based on reviewing box scores-- perez would be an overwhelming choice over walker. The point here is not to praise Perez-- he's far from great-- it's that stats-- at least in walker and perez's cases-- have blinded stats-livers to their actual contributions.

 

I know I am not going to change the metric minds but maybe you guys should start watching more and crunching numbers less. You might get an actual line on players that way.

 

Dusty, is that you?!?!? Fact of the matter is these metric minds that are countering your points actually DO watch the games, they wouldnt have thousands of posts on this board if they didnt watch the cubs at any chance they had. And I keep hearing from people who hate Walkers defense that he sucks turning the DP, and Jeez I watch on average about 100 games a year and just cant figure it out, I dont see it at all.

[brfahey]

So, let me get this straight....

 

You don't like Walker because it doesn't seem like he gets any clutch hits, you believe his defense is sub-par, and he talks too much.

 

:roll:

 

Lots of baseball acumen there, let me tell ya.

 

And for the record...I'd take Walker over Grudzielanek every day of the week and twice on Sundays, and probably three times on Memorial Day and the Fourth of July.

 

I said seems and no one has pointed out all the games he's won with his bat. His defense is sub-par. Have you watched him try to turn double plays?

 

I will never figure you guys out. I am convinced you don't watch/understand much baseball. You pillory Perez all year and the guy, while admittedly streaky and too anxiuos at the plate, has played well all year. I think if you asked knowledgebale people who has had the better year -- based on watching the game, rather than based on reviewing box scores-- perez would be an overwhelming choice over walker. The point here is not to praise Perez-- he's far from great-- it's that stats-- at least in walker and perez's cases-- have blinded stats-livers to their actual contributions.

 

I know I am not going to change the metric minds but maybe you guys should start watching more and crunching numbers less. You might get an actual line on players that way.

 

agreed i trust your interpretation of the game instead of unbiased numbers.

 

and try not to act like a huge jerk in your posts. actually, keep it up so you can get banned.

 

I guess I'm acting like a jerk because I disagree philosophically with many on this board. I'll try to be be better and only ridicule--like you did in your post-- other's viewpoints.

[CaliforniaRaisin]

So, let me get this straight....

 

You don't like Walker because it doesn't seem like he gets any clutch hits, you believe his defense is sub-par, and he talks too much.

 

:roll:

 

Lots of baseball acumen there, let me tell ya.

 

And for the record...I'd take Walker over Grudzielanek every day of the week and twice on Sundays, and probably three times on Memorial Day and the Fourth of July.

 

I said seems and no one has pointed out all the games he's won with his bat. His defense is sub-par. Have you watched him try to turn double plays?

 

I will never figure you guys out. I am convinced you don't watch/understand much baseball. You pillory Perez all year and the guy, while admittedly streaky and too anxiuos at the plate, has played well all year. I think if you asked knowledgebale people who has had the better year -- based on watching the game, rather than based on reviewing box scores-- perez would be an overwhelming choice over walker. The point here is not to praise Perez-- he's far from great-- it's that stats-- at least in walker and perez's cases-- have blinded stats-livers to their actual contributions.

 

I know I am not going to change the metric minds but maybe you guys should start watching more and crunching numbers less. You might get an actual line on players that way.

 

agreed i trust your interpretation of the game instead of unbiased numbers.

 

and try not to act like a huge jerk in your posts. actually, keep it up so you can get banned.

 

I guess I'm acting like a jerk because I disagree philosophically with many on this board. I'll try to be be better and only ridicule--like you did in your post-- other's viewpoints.

 

You just said people with other viewpoints on Todd Walker must not watch or understand Cubs games and you don't think you're being a jerk/ridicule others?

Edited September 26, 2005 by CaliforniaRaisin

[vance_the_cubs_fan]

Can you make your point without comments like:

Have you watched him try to turn double plays?

 

Yes, I've watched him. What specifically about his ability is bothering you?

 

or maybe comments like this:

 

I will never figure you guys out. I am convinced you don't watch/understand much baseball.

 

I've probably watched more games than you have, and not just of the Cubs. Assuming I don't watch baseball because I disagree with you is arrogant and just plain stupid. Can I assume you can't perform basic math skills since you don't understand stats?

 

 

I know I am not going to change the metric minds but maybe you guys should start watching more and crunching numbers less. You might get an actual line on players that way.

 

I think we watch plenty of games. I think maybe it's time you got a clue about how to evaluate player performance and you might could actually figure out which players have contributed to the poor state of this team.

 

Let me give you a hint...it's not Walker.

 

(Another hint: Perez is part of the problem)

[adamb0719]

said seems and no one has pointed out all the games he's won with his bat. His defense is sub-par. Have you watched him try to turn double plays?

 

I will never figure you guys out. I am convinced you don't watch/understand much baseball. You pillory Perez all year and the guy, while admittedly streaky and too anxiuos at the plate, has played well all year. I think if you asked knowledgebale people who has had the better year -- based on watching the game, rather than based on reviewing box scores-- perez would be an overwhelming choice over walker. The point here is not to praise Perez-- he's far from great-- it's that stats-- at least in walker and perez's cases-- have blinded stats-livers to their actual contributions.

 

I know I am not going to change the metric minds but maybe you guys should start watching more and crunching numbers less. You might get an actual line on players that way.

 

So instead of looking at a players numbers to get a feel for what type of player they are, you are suggesting we should watch every game they play and then make a decision? Lets see, 162 games, 30 teams...I knew there was a reason I got TIVO.

 

PS to answer the original thread I think that when Walker says things that may bother some, he is for the most part, right. Didn't he speak up about Macias-Perez at the top of the order, among other things that were resulting in their lackluster performance this season? And he has been consistant at the plate, and I don't consider his defense to be so bad that it is costing us any games. For the price I think finding someone better than Walker will be next to impossible.

[MeatampPotatoesMan]

No offense, but "i see something you don't" isn't a very valid argument.

 

I've seen walker butcher a couple plays at 2B, but the problem with that is your (and my) POV is subjective, and is subject to a person's interpretation of the situation. Two different people can watch the same thing and have completely different opinions.

[abuck1220]

So, let me get this straight....

 

You don't like Walker because it doesn't seem like he gets any clutch hits, you believe his defense is sub-par, and he talks too much.

 

:roll:

 

Lots of baseball acumen there, let me tell ya.

 

And for the record...I'd take Walker over Grudzielanek every day of the week and twice on Sundays, and probably three times on Memorial Day and the Fourth of July.

 

I said seems and no one has pointed out all the games he's won with his bat. His defense is sub-par. Have you watched him try to turn double plays?

 

I will never figure you guys out. I am convinced you don't watch/understand much baseball. You pillory Perez all year and the guy, while admittedly streaky and too anxiuos at the plate, has played well all year. I think if you asked knowledgebale people who has had the better year -- based on watching the game, rather than based on reviewing box scores-- perez would be an overwhelming choice over walker. The point here is not to praise Perez-- he's far from great-- it's that stats-- at least in walker and perez's cases-- have blinded stats-livers to their actual contributions.

 

I know I am not going to change the metric minds but maybe you guys should start watching more and crunching numbers less. You might get an actual line on players that way.

 

agreed i trust your interpretation of the game instead of unbiased numbers.

 

and try not to act like a huge jerk in your posts. actually, keep it up so you can get banned.

 

I guess I'm acting like a jerk because I disagree philosophically with many on this board. I'll try to be be better and only ridicule--like you did in your post-- other's viewpoints.

 

this has got to be some kind of record for someone acting like this to not get banned.

 

of course, i wouldn't believe any numbers you have to back this claim up, i'm just basing it one what i remember/have seen about trolls being banned in the past.

[VVMattVV]

(Another hint: Perez is part of the problem)

 

No way man, at least his .276 BA isn't a soft one.

[vance_the_cubs_fan]

(Another hint: Perez is part of the problem)

 

No way man, at least his .276 BA isn't a soft one.

 

:lmao:

[imb]

Obviously these are just more worthless metrics from a person that doesnt even watch the games, but...

 

Win Shares

Walker-13 (430 PA)

Neifi!-11 (581 PA)

 

Try to name 5 big hits that Aramis has had all season. I can't, and it doesn't mean anything, other than my memory is bad.

[CubfaninCA]

Wouldn't mind seeing Walker gone. He's getting older, which makes him more prone to injury and the Cubs could use a chemistry shake-up.

[rocket]

Wouldn't mind seeing Walker gone. He's getting older, which makes him more prone to injury and the Cubs could use a chemistry shake-up.

 

god knows it worked so well last offseason

[abuck1220]

Wouldn't mind seeing Walker gone. He's getting older, which makes him more prone to injury and the Cubs could use a chemistry shake-up.

 

yeah, that's the problem.

[CubfaninCA]

Wouldn't mind seeing Walker gone. He's getting older, which makes him more prone to injury and the Cubs could use a chemistry shake-up.

 

god knows it worked so well last offseason

 

They should have shaken it up more.

[vance_the_cubs_fan]

Wouldn't mind seeing Walker gone. He's getting older, which makes him more prone to injury and the Cubs could use a chemistry shake-up.

 

Yeah, let's get rid of a secondbaseman that hit 302/355/475 at 2.5 million for the sake of chemistry. :roll:

[CaliforniaRaisin]

Wouldn't mind seeing Walker gone. He's getting older, which makes him more prone to injury and the Cubs could use a chemistry shake-up.

 

You're right. Let's get rid of Dusty.

[CubfaninCA]

Wouldn't mind seeing Walker gone. He's getting older, which makes him more prone to injury and the Cubs could use a chemistry shake-up.

 

yeah, that's the problem.

 

He's missed quite a few games this year.

[CubfaninCA]

Wouldn't mind seeing Walker gone. He's getting older, which makes him more prone to injury and the Cubs could use a chemistry shake-up.

 

You're right. Let's get rid of Dusty.

 

Agree and Nomar and Wood.