7/17 Cubs (Darvish) vs Reds (Gray) 1:20CDT NBC Chicago

[itisallpartoftheplan]

[Deeg]

Darvish: 1 BB and 21 Ks in 18.2 IP in July (12 hits). 9 walks and 53 Ks in 48 IP since June 1.

[We Got The Whole 9]

If hes cured his dong woes we have a TORP

[itisallpartoftheplan]

Just realized Votto didn’t get on base today.

 

That ends a pretty long on base streak at Wrigley

[GaryWoods]

He's never been good offensively, ever. He likely won't ever be good. I know some fans who keep thinking he'll have some magical breakout. The same idiots razzed me all the time for bristling at the idea of trading Javy. I mean, seriously, WTF?

 

Almora is pretty much Corey Patterson except without the upside potential.

[squally1313]

He's never been good offensively, ever. He likely won't ever be good. I know some fans who keep thinking he'll have some magical breakout. The same idiots razzed me all the time for bristling at the idea of trading Javy. I mean, seriously, WTF?

 

Almora is pretty much Corey Patterson except without the upside potential.

 

That is being exceedingly harsh to Corey Patterson, who put up a 2.5 WAR in half a season followed by a 5 WAR season, and then another 3.8 WAR season for the Orioles. The odds of Almora ever reaching Patterson's 10.9 career WAR is like 100 to 1.

[UMFan83]

He's never been good offensively, ever. He likely won't ever be good. I know some fans who keep thinking he'll have some magical breakout. The same idiots razzed me all the time for bristling at the idea of trading Javy. I mean, seriously, WTF?

 

Almora is pretty much Corey Patterson except without the upside potential.

 

That is being exceedingly harsh to Corey Patterson, who put up a 2.5 WAR in half a season followed by a 5 WAR season, and then another 3.8 WAR season for the Orioles. The odds of Almora ever reaching Patterson's 10.9 career WAR is like 100 to 1.

 

100 to 1 seems like a bit of an over-exaggeration considering Almora has produced more WAR on a per PA basis so far in his career (3.0 in 1203 PA) than Patterson did in his (10.9 in 4499 PA). Not to say that he will keep up that pace for his entire career or even that he will get enough playing time in the majors to eclipse his WAR but its not unreasonable.

[We Got The Whole 9]

 

Almora is pretty much Corey Patterson except without the upside potential.

 

That is being exceedingly harsh to Corey Patterson, who put up a 2.5 WAR in half a season followed by a 5 WAR season, and then another 3.8 WAR season for the Orioles. The odds of Almora ever reaching Patterson's 10.9 career WAR is like 100 to 1.

 

100 to 1 seems like a bit of an over-exaggeration considering Almora has produced more WAR on a per PA basis so far in his career (3.0 in 1203 PA) than Patterson did in his (10.9 in 4499 PA). Not to say that he will keep up that pace for his entire career or even that he will get enough playing time in the majors to eclipse his WAR but its not unreasonable.

His 2 best fwar seasons were like Kiermaier seasons. Below average offensively but insane defensive and base running value. I mean 11.3 bsr in 2006, holy horsefeathers. But defensively those appear to be quite fluky as well.

 

Also he was a major pull hitter so it would be interesting to see how he would fare in this day of defensive positioning. He never had a full season with an above average bat. Obviously we recall how heartbroken we were in 2003 when he was really breaking out.

 

Still love me some CPatt.

[Bull]

 

Almora is pretty much Corey Patterson except without the upside potential.

 

That is being exceedingly harsh to Corey Patterson, who put up a 2.5 WAR in half a season followed by a 5 WAR season, and then another 3.8 WAR season for the Orioles. The odds of Almora ever reaching Patterson's 10.9 career WAR is like 100 to 1.

 

100 to 1 seems like a bit of an over-exaggeration considering Almora has produced more WAR on a per PA basis so far in his career (3.0 in 1203 PA) than Patterson did in his (10.9 in 4499 PA). Not to say that he will keep up that pace for his entire career or even that he will get enough playing time in the majors to eclipse his WAR but its not unreasonable.

 

How did I not realize that Patterson had nearly 2500 PA after the Cubs traded him?

[GaryWoods]

He's never been good offensively, ever. He likely won't ever be good. I know some fans who keep thinking he'll have some magical breakout. The same idiots razzed me all the time for bristling at the idea of trading Javy. I mean, seriously, WTF?

 

Almora is pretty much Corey Patterson except without the upside potential.

 

That is being exceedingly harsh to Corey Patterson, who put up a 2.5 WAR in half a season followed by a 5 WAR season, and then another 3.8 WAR season for the Orioles. The odds of Almora ever reaching Patterson's 10.9 career WAR is like 100 to 1.

 

I think that's being exceedingly harsh to Almora, given that his WAR through his first three seasons was a little higher than Patterson's at the same point. There's probably a reasonably good chance that his career WAR will be higher if he sticks around awhile, not by having a few big years but by consistently posting WARS in the .7-1 range for a dozen years or so.

 

But that's all really beside the point. I wasn't comparing the talent of the players - please note the "without the upside potential" part of my comment - but rather comparing the situations. We spent six years waiting for Patterson to develop into a consistently valuable player, and now we're doing the same with Almora.

[Cubswin11]

 

Almora is pretty much Corey Patterson except without the upside potential.

 

That is being exceedingly harsh to Corey Patterson, who put up a 2.5 WAR in half a season followed by a 5 WAR season, and then another 3.8 WAR season for the Orioles. The odds of Almora ever reaching Patterson's 10.9 career WAR is like 100 to 1.

 

I think that's being exceedingly harsh to Almora, given that his WAR through his first three seasons was a little higher than Patterson's at the same point. There's probably a reasonably good chance that his career WAR will be higher if he sticks around awhile, not by having a few big years but by consistently posting WARS in the .7-1 range for a dozen years or so.

 

But that's all really beside the point. I wasn't comparing the talent of the players - please note the "without the upside potential" part of my comment - but rather comparing the situations. We spent six years waiting for Patterson to develop into a consistently valuable player, and now we're doing the same with Almora.

Patterson did develop in to that player, then he got Dusty’d and also had a catastrophic/career altering knee injury. Almora doesn’t have a chance. Patterson also had some decent minor league numbers to fall back on, Almora does not.

[CyHawk_Cub]

^^and that's kinda my point about Almora. WTF has he done as a pro to earn him all this rope some fans want to give him? Outside a hot 2 months at Peoria and maybe 6 weeks at AA, he's done nothing to earn this.

[squally1313]

^^and that's kinda my point about Almora. WTF has he done as a pro to earn him all this rope some fans want to give him? Outside a hot 2 months at Peoria and maybe 6 weeks at AA, he's done nothing to earn this.

Have you SEEN all the times his helmet has fallen off running the bases?

[Transmogrified Tiger]

^^and that's kinda my point about Almora. WTF has he done as a pro to earn him all this rope some fans want to give him? Outside a hot 2 months at Peoria and maybe 6 weeks at AA, he's done nothing to earn this.

 

He had 1000 PA as roughly a league average hitter prior to this season. I know a lot of people are predisposed to dislike Almora because he swings too much and therefore doesn't walk or hit for a ton of power, but he was a perfectly fine role player for multiple years until his struggles this year. That could be a blip and it could be him finally getting figured out for good, but scoffing at the idea that he's ever been useful is silly.

[squally1313]

^^and that's kinda my point about Almora. WTF has he done as a pro to earn him all this rope some fans want to give him? Outside a hot 2 months at Peoria and maybe 6 weeks at AA, he's done nothing to earn this.

 

He had 1000 PA as roughly a league average hitter prior to this season. I know a lot of people are predisposed to dislike Almora because he swings too much and therefore doesn't walk or hit for a ton of power, but he was a perfectly fine role player for multiple years until his struggles this year. That could be a blip and it could be him finally getting figured out for good, but scoffing at the idea that he's ever been useful is silly.

 

It's at least party just SSS noise, but his collapse against LHP this year is really mystifying. Before that, my general frustration was how he was used (too high in the order, against too many RHPs) and how he was perceived by Cubs fans in general (lead off hitter, gold glove center fielder). A career 103 wRC+ against LHP with above average defense has a spot on any roster. Now I don't really know what you do with him besides send him to wherever Schwarber went before the WS to have him see endless LHP.

[Cubswin11]

^^and that's kinda my point about Almora. WTF has he done as a pro to earn him all this rope some fans want to give him? Outside a hot 2 months at Peoria and maybe 6 weeks at AA, he's done nothing to earn this.

 

He had 1000 PA as roughly a league average hitter prior to this season. I know a lot of people are predisposed to dislike Almora because he swings too much and therefore doesn't walk or hit for a ton of power, but he was a perfectly fine role player for multiple years until his struggles this year. That could be a blip and it could be him finally getting figured out for good, but scoffing at the idea that he's ever been useful is silly.

He hasn’t been a good hitter, and anything resembling one, going back to last year around mid-June or so to date.

Edited July 18, 2019 by Cubswin11

[CyHawk_Cub]

I'm dumb, so I don't know how to look at the batted ball splits, but wasn't his 2018 entirely propped-up by unsustainable BABIP the first 2 months of the season?

 

With his glove, I get he's useful. I merely don't understand this feeling some fans seem to have that he's done anything to make us credibly think he's gonna have a break-out with the bat.

 

I also will never get why "lineup doesn't matter" is somehow an argument for having him bat leadoff. Not saying that is being argued here at all, just disputes I've had with some fans.

[Cubswin11]

I'm dumb, so I don't know how to look at the batted ball splits, but wasn't his 2018 entirely propped-up by unsustainable BABIP the first 2 months of the season?

 

With his glove, I get he's useful. I merely don't understand this feeling some fans seem to have that he's done anything to make us credibly think he's gonna have a break-out with the bat.

 

I also will never get why "lineup doesn't matter" is somehow an argument for having him bat leadoff. Not saying that is being argued here at all, just disputes I've had with some fans.

Yeah his early 2018 was very BABIP driven and not sustainable. Tons of GB, little hard contact and he’s obviously slow. You can find the splits easily on fangraphs. Just literally go to Splits tab and hit 2018 and scroll down, it has batted ball data by month.